Author fral945 Posted March 22, 2009 Author Posted March 22, 2009 Thanks for all the responses. I think I'm going to continue doing what I've been doing on this one and use it for special occasions or when it happens to be convenient. I did it on my date yesterday once (right at the start) because I happened to be on her side of the car loading things in the backseat. She was appreciative but didn't make a big deal about it. The rest of the time I didn't do it. The date was a great success, but I don't think it had much to do with me opening her car door (though it probably didn't hurt).
Sam Spade Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I would personally hate to play up to the weak little woman image and somehow just be dependent on a man for help. It frustrates me when I see women asking men to help them carry out some physical task when I know that I am more than capable of it and that they should be too. I am 5ft and my height is the only thing that I regularly have to concede means I need the help of a man (or tall woman ) where for example I need something reaching from a shelf in the supermarket. :rolleyes::rolleyes: I can make my own breakfast. So, should I get pissed if a woman makes me one ?
runner Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 -walk on the streetside when escorting your woman on any sidewalk -never walk in front of your woman unless you're going to open a door or assist finding your way through a thick crowd -never sit at a table until after all the females at the table have been seated excellent. and yes, hats come off indoors.
anne1707 Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 :rolleyes::rolleyes: I can make my own breakfast. So, should I get pissed if a woman makes me one ? Not at all! The importance of caring for each other and showing consideration for others cannot be emphasised enough. As with your example, my H and I take turns to make breakfast in bed for each other at the weekend My frustration is when people can do something for themselves but expect others to do it for them or maybe exaggerate their inability to do it and will wait for someone else to do it for them. That to me is taking advantage of others and taking their good nature for granted.
runner Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I know, right? so long as i'm alive, chivalry isn't dead it is pitiful that chivalry is being confused for sexism or disingenuousness because that's exactly what it's not. has the world really become so cynical ?
Trialbyfire Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I'm honestly surprised at some of the responses. Don't you ladies at minimum, enjoy and appreciate it when someone is being courteous? For that matter, don't you get a little silly in the head, when a man shows his physical strength, while doing something sweet and courteous for you? I mean sure, we ladies can do it on our own but if someone wants to help you out, why not? I'll openly, openly admit that the combination of strength and courtesy makes me swoon, just a little and sometimes A LOT! Let men be men. I recall my ex-H. Even he, a narcissist, was always willing and able to help women. One type of incident that comes to mind was when we would be walking along and if I was wearing a pair of shoes that weren't conducive to tromping through deep puddles, he would always pick me up with little to no effort, and put me on the other side of the puddle. I never asked him to do it. It was one of those innate courtesies he did, like opening doors, etc. My fiancé's like that too. Incredibly appealing!
anne1707 Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I'm honestly surprised at some of the responses. Don't you ladies at minimum, enjoy and appreciate it when someone is being courteous? For that matter, don't you get a little silly in the head, when a man shows his physical strength, while doing something sweet and courteous for you? Speaking for myself, yes I do appreciate gestures such as opening doors, walking on the kerbside of the pavement, etc. However I do not expect it to happen as some women seem to and have referred to it being a dealbreaker. To me, it is all part of showing consideration for each other, regardless of gender. Those little gestures really do add up to something at the end of the day. Where I have the problem is when there is an automatic expectation or feeling of "right" to be treated a certain way. How can I put this better? I don't like other peoples' kindness being taken for granted. It should be appreciated and not seen as something that they are obligated to do.
allina Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I think men should ALWAYS open doors for women. It's not just a date thing. It's called being proper and having manners.
Trialbyfire Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 Rudeness is a dealbreaker. I expect that anyone I'm in a relationship will provide certain courtesies and will respond with my own courtesies. Each to their own level of expectations.
anne1707 Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 Rudeness is a dealbreaker. I expect that anyone I'm in a relationship will provide certain courtesies and will respond with my own courtesies. Each to their own level of expectations. I totally agree with that. Kindness, respect, politeness, support, integrity - all these things are dealbreakers for me too. I was referring to the "extras" which might be additional ways of expressing the above traits when saying they should not just be expected. If a person expects or feels they have an entitlement to such "extras", are they truly going to appreciate them, especially when it might be from a complete stranger. You didn't expect a stranger to come and help you dig your car out of the snow, but you definitely appreciated it . That's the kind of behaviour I am referring to when it goes beyond a level of behaviour which would still be considered polite and courteous. I do not expect a man to open a door for me, but I appreciate it when he does. But in turn, I also open doors for men - manners go a very long way for both sexes.
pollywag Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 Thanks for all the responses. I think I'm going to continue doing what I've been doing on this one and use it for special occasions or when it happens to be convenient. What does that mean "continue to do it on special occasions and when convenient" does that mean on her birthday and if you happen to arrive at the restaurant door before she does? Does it mean on Valentine's day you will drive up to her house and wait until she comes out parked infront of her house so that you can open the car door for her? You took out a thread to ask women what we thought of this and this is what I think: I think your conclusion is the same wishy-washy passive behavior that young men are adopting these days that turn women off and continue to confuse the gender roles even more. If you don't want to open any doors for her because it is inconvenient and she doesn't mind your lack of class or manners, then you should just drop it all together. Why bother with that "special occasion" foolishness? Why even ask about it on a public forum if you are going to be whymsical about it? If you don't even want to give it any thought, why even think about it to ask? I insist, men who lack manners are a turn off. Personally I would expect a man to open the dwelling door for me and let me go in first if we are on a date if he does not he is not the man for me and I will move on, as I would be completely turned off. And yes I can expect it, and quite frankly I don't care how that is perceived by other people I decide who I date, you don't. Beyond the idea of opening the door it is about knowing that this man had positive influences in his life from his parents that taught him manners and class, to me that is very important. A good upbringing is very important. Etiquette is important to me. To all the men in this thread who gave all those great examples of what you do for women as acts of class, BRAVO! to you!!! There are still a TON of women, just like myself, who appreciate men like you so don't stop doing what you are doing. You will always be welcomed with a very feminine smile and thank you every time every time you do one of these acts for us. No man-girls over here! The lost children that want to feed into gender ambiguity and androgyny with the pretext of doing it because women are not "powerless" can date each other. Good day!
Star Gazer Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I think men should ALWAYS open doors for women. It's not just a date thing. It's called being proper and having manners. I agree completely, although my BF has slacked off on opening the car door for me. He still does it on date nights (which are often) and many other times, but not, for example, when we're in the parking lot of the grocery store and we've just finished loading the groceries.
allina Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I agree completely, although my BF has slacked off on opening the car door for me. He still does it on date nights (which are often) and many other times, but not, for example, when we're in the parking lot of the grocery store and we've just finished loading the groceries. Sometimes it isn't practical to open the door, for example when you're rushing in and loading the car with groceries, I failed to acknowledge that in my reply. I think that opening doors when walking in or out of a building is even more important than the car door.
pollywag Posted March 22, 2009 Posted March 22, 2009 I think that opening doors when walking in or out of a building is even more important than the car door. I totally agree. I think the car door thing is a cute and old school gesture that if a man wants to do that it is just extra bonus points for him to actually "open" the door. As far as I am concerned it is a very nice gesture. I don't think I have ever been out on a date and the man didn't come around to unlock my door first and open it but I would not take offense if he didn't for some reason especially since now all cars are power locks so there isn't that much of need for him to come around an open the door other than to be a gentleman. Before it was more because it looks awkward to make the woman wait out in the cold or what have you if the guy just hops into his car first. If it were winter and he just got in while I sat in the cold waiting for him to open my door from inside it would be so incredibly rude. But on the topic of dwelling doors, yes I do expect it and would be completely turned off he just walked in first and didn't try to hold the door for me. With something like that it's not something a guy turns off after the first few dates, he either does it or he does not. I hold the door open for people (men or women) when I arrive at a busy door, and I don't think twice and no it never stops. My parents taught me manners. That's what it boils down to, any women who take offense to that have so serious mental issues.
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