carhill Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 But to answer your question, why is there a difference? Pride, ego, territoriality and possessiveness. It's healthy to understand one's motivations. How is that working out in today's dating and relationship world? Do you find women saying they want one thing (the word equality is used here a lot) and then defaulting to responding to the age-old call of the possessor? Do they like being possessed? Fought over? I'm interested in their actions, rather than words. A lot has changed since I last dated
Dexter Morgan Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 I'm curious as to why you might see dating/romance as a competition I don't see it as a competition. Thats why I won't date a multi-dater. Its the multi-dater that sees it as a competition. and, adjunct to that, why you would eschew a typical male behavior (competing) in this one area? Competing for someone that should want you for YOU is a load of crap. It is much different than competing for a job where you NEED money to live. Or competing for a trophy that doesn't have an emotional attachment to you. Competing for a woman is something I'll never do. Either she is into me, or she isn't. Expecting me to bend over backwards for her so she doesn't pick another man is narcississtic at best. The others can knock themselves out over that and in the end, get someone that will turn coat the minute the effort calms down a bit after the courtship. Specifically, when a woman is dating other men (presumably with no intimate sexual contact for the purposes of this example) why do you see them as "competition"? She spends time with them and enjoys their company, presumably. Because she is weighing her options. I am not an option to be weighed or played with. I'm not a sample bite of bacon on the end of a toothpick at the local grocery store. She likely also spends time with her male and female friends and her family and enjoys those contacts as well. What's different? we are talking about "dating", not merely spending time with friends.
Dexter Morgan Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 If that is not an option, playing is no fun for me. And with a woman who multi-dates, it's the same thing. She is no longer appealing. To warrant an all-out effort, the (perceived) value of the prize needs to be worth the effort. Exactly! And if a woman is into many guys at once, she isn't worth my effort. Hence, sometimes the only winning move is not to play. How about a nice game of chess? (love that line from Wargames)
Dexter Morgan Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 What's interesting about this is that some people might consider the competition itself as increasing the perceived value of the prize. If a trophy is mad out of dog crap, then after a huge competition is over....it still dog crap. you can't polish a turd. Anyway, maybe it just works best when multidaters date each other, and non-multidaters date each other. That way, everyone's on the same page. I'm going to go out on a limb here, but I'm willing to bet multi-daters, no offense, aren't probably the most trustworthy people. Seems that they will always want their options "open".
clv0116 Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 Do you find women saying they want one thing (the word equality is used here a lot) and then defaulting to responding to the age-old call of the possessor? Do they like being possessed? Fought over? Yes, yes and yes.
clv0116 Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 I'm going to go out on a limb here, but I'm willing to bet multi-daters, no offense, aren't probably the most trustworthy people. Seems that they will always want their options "open". Not true, I think multi-daters that are honest about it are probably just as trustworthy, but clearly a liar in any context is gonna be hard to trust.
clv0116 Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 I'm curious about this also. I mean, when you're in the mere "dating" stage you are still getting to know each other to see if you even want to begin exploring the idea of a relationship. I don't know any men who begin to date a woman as if she's "the one." There's no such thing as the one. The one is an artificial construct we create in our own hearts, if that one went away there is a good chance we would find another 'the one' eventually.
carhill Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 There's no such thing as the one. The one is an artificial construct we create in our own hearts, if that one went away there is a good chance we would find another 'the one' eventually. I certainly hope to. Thanks for the refresher course on the modern dating world. I've been out of circulation for a decade or so... To be clear, I'm not advocating a POV, but rather seeking alternative opinions to match up with my real world observations. So far, what I'm hearing from the non-competing possessors is matching up with what I observe. It's just something I'll need to be mindful of. Question: Does the type/severity of pain experienced in prior relationships drive some of the perception? The classic "I gave her everything and she spat on me so no woman is ever going to get me that way again" type response..... I ask this because, even though I experienced unhealthiness and pain in my M, it's not to the level where I see women in such specific ways as shown here, even in light of my past failures with women. I guess it's hard to kill an optimist, or something like that... in any event, thanks for the insight.
Stockalone Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 It's healthy to understand one's motivations. How is that working out in today's dating and relationship world? Do you find women saying they want one thing (the word equality is used here a lot) and then defaulting to responding to the age-old call of the possessor? Do they like being possessed? Fought over? I'm interested in their actions, rather than words. A lot has changed since I last dated Sorry, I can't help you out there. My personal experience is outdated by a few years. I stopped dating because it wasn't working out the way I would have needed it to.
clv0116 Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 I certainly hope to. I think it's natural and healthy to eventually view someone that way, our brains seem to be wired to enable this. But it's also good to be aware that in reality if necessity demands it, a replacement is available. The process is painful and it's good that it is, but it is possible. I'm tending to think that a foreign wife might be a good way to go, but it's an idea that's just forming at the moment. Statistically, American men who marry foreign women are over 3x more likely to stay married over American men who marry home grown brides. I'd be curious to see what the causation is in that statistic. Back to topic, women are very adept at redefining their back burner boyfriends as "just friends" or "strictly platonic" when the men involved in the vast majority of cases are hoping for anything but that.
carhill Posted March 18, 2009 Posted March 18, 2009 LOL, been the back burner boyfriend and been to Lviv and Odessa looking for a "traditional woman" many years ago. Points taken and valid. Thanks
Dexter Morgan Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Not true, I think multi-daters that are honest about it are probably just as trustworthy, but clearly a liar in any context is gonna be hard to trust. I can agree with that, as long as the multi-dater admits to their dates that they want to keep their options open. I just don't think that people that like to keep alot of options open stop wanting to keep a failsafe on standby if they decide on one.
Dexter Morgan Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I'm curious about this also. I mean, when you're in the mere "dating" stage you are still getting to know each other to see if you even want to begin exploring the idea of a relationship. I don't know any men who begin to date a woman as if she's "the one." Its not about thinking that anyone we date is "the one" with regards to dating one at a time. its about respect and giving a person a fair chance and not playing with them like they are disposable.
mr.dream merchant Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 When I'm in a relationship, obviously it's 1 guy and 1 guy only...but when I am single I like to have more than 1 prospect. That way if it doesn't work out, you have others. Nothing I hate more than putting my heart, soul & energy into 1 and then it not working out and then not having someone else to work on. Lol. Some people might think this is wrong, but the beauty of being single is to be able to "see", "go on dates with" whomever and how many ever you choose. I see nothing wrong with it and yeah I think alot more women do this than you think. Does that include having sex with multiple guys as well?
lovestruck818 Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Does that include having sex with multiple guys as well? I don't have sex with people who I'm not in a relationship with...but technically I guess yeah...I mean it's gross, but someone who is single does have the right to sleep with as many or as few people as he/she chooses. I don't do that, it's not my thing and I don't know I agree with the sex aspect of it, but it's not wrong. IMO, anyway.
Jersey Shortie Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I'm tending to think that a foreign wife might be a good way to go, but it's an idea that's just forming at the moment. Statistically, American men who marry foreign women are over 3x more likely to stay married over American men who marry home grown brides. Let me be the first to wish you a nice trip.
pollywag Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 There's no such thing as the one. The one is an artificial construct we create in our own hearts, if that one went away there is a good chance we would find another 'the one' eventually. That's bananas!! Then why aren't you married yet? What are you waiting for? Statistically, American men who marry foreign women are over 3x more likely to stay married over American men who marry home grown brides. That is because a lot of foreign women have their families back home and feel alone and alienated here having their loved ones so far away so they will stick around and put up with anything, including abuse. Heck it happens to American women abroad who marry men in other countries even moreso the other way around. The sheer fundamentals of these types of relationships are based on the power of the man being exerted on a more "submissive" type of woman. Marriages lasting longer is no indication that a relationship is good or even healthy. Some marriages should have been dissolved from the get-go but lack of financial resources plays a big role and people will put up with anything. Show me happy loving couples, that's the only proof that works.
sally4sara Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I've dated more than one guy at a time. I was always up front about it. The problems I ran into is somewhere between three and five is too many to manage even with honesty and not letting them pay my way. No matter how much the guys I met said they were cool with a casual dating situation and accepting of not being the only guy I was seeing, they would get bothered after one or two dates. Too many assumption for their peace of mind: If I wasn't all hot to jump in the sack with them.....I must be screwing someone else. If I DID jump in the sack with them.....I must be screwing EVERYONE I go out with. And the general opinion is women have self esteem issues! This was a definite indication that stereotype isn't true! I also ran into men who assumed my interest in something casual meant I was in it for sex only. One showed up early and I told him to watch TV while I finished getting ready. I came downstairs and he had his pants off!
Dexter Morgan Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I've dated more than one guy at a time. I was always up front about it. The problems I ran into is somewhere between three and five is too many to manage even with honesty and not letting them pay my way. Thats why if I was on a 2nd or 3rd date with someone and the woman said, "I have to tell you I am seeing someone else too". I'd probably take a step back, think, "you know...thats cool.....oh, you have money for your own dinner right?"
sally4sara Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Thats why if I was on a 2nd or 3rd date with someone and the woman said, "I have to tell you I am seeing someone else too". I'd probably take a step back, think, "you know...thats cool.....oh, you have money for your own dinner right?" I never waited till even date #1 to let them know. I let anyone I exchanged contact info with that I was dating casually anyone who seemed interesting. No point in risking hard feelings over even one date. I never expected anyone to buy my meal no matter how many or how few people I am currently dating.
lovestruck818 Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Thats why if I was on a 2nd or 3rd date with someone and the woman said, "I have to tell you I am seeing someone else too". I'd probably take a step back, think, "you know...thats cool.....oh, you have money for your own dinner right?" But doesn't being single entitle one to see whomever and how many ever people of his or her choosing? I mean, really. If that wasn't the case, everyone would be in a relationship then. Some people don't enjoy being exclusive. Being single allows one to date around & keep options open.
Chicago_Guy Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Too many assumption for their peace of mind: If I wasn't all hot to jump in the sack with them.....I must be screwing someone else. If I DID jump in the sack with them.....I must be screwing EVERYONE I go out with. And the general opinion is women have self esteem issues! This was a definite indication that stereotype isn't true! I honestly don't think that those are unreasonable assumptions that those guys are making - I've heard of some women who date multiple guys they meet on Match.com and sleep with all of them right away while they are still dating the other guys. Whether you agree with it or not, discovering that a woman is dating a bunch of guys at once does raise some serious red flags.
sumdude Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 A lot has changed since I last dated Man you've got that right... been ten years for me and I'm just getting back into it after a divorce and other life events. Even in ten years it's changed and the internet has a lot to do with it. Plus being 41 puts me in a slightly different category than most of the folks I see out. Let's see, in the last year got back together a few times with the woman I dated before my ex wife, talk about a flashback. Just recently had a surprise when a friend came on to me, we ended having some fun for a couple weeks, then she waffled and I was put back into the friend category though I bet FWB is more like it. Met a couple other women and tried to see how it would go, didn't feel any fireworks and let then go.. In some ways it's been fun.. but sometimes it's hard not to get just a little jaded about relationships. I was brought up in a whole different way by immigrant parents who were a bit older than my american friends parents. So I'm having to rewrite most of my ideas about dating as I go along. Seems like most of the single people I know, both men and women, are either multi-dating or serial dating at a quick clip. the list thing is pretty prevalent to a point. One woman said I really like you and we get along great but I can't be with a man who snores.. Well I guess a good nights sleep is important but wow, seems nitpicky. Seem like the older we get the more set in our ways we get. As we date later in life it gets harder to overlook anything. I see so few marriages that last at all anymore. Most of my friends are either still single or divorced in their mid 30's - 40's.. kinda sad.
Stockalone Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 But doesn't being single entitle one to see whomever and how many ever people of his or her choosing? I mean, really. If that wasn't the case, everyone would be in a relationship then. Some people don't enjoy being exclusive. Being single allows one to date around & keep options open. Well, some people want to date exclusively to see where it goes with that person. Obviously, that is not what you want. So it would be best for all involved to know this right away. Why waste each other's time? Besides, Dexter only said that he would expect a woman to pay her share if she is also dating other man. What's wrong with that?
Dawn26 Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I can't speak for all women..... but I'm a woman, and yes that's very true. It makes things less complicated.
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