All This Talk About Women Aging....

March 20, 2009

SOME research does show infidelity rates increase where there's an extremely high difference (15+ years), particularly when the woman is the older one.

So is it the man who looks for something fresher or the woman who gets bored with her out of date boy-toy in those studies?

March 20, 2009

So is it the man who looks for something fresher or the woman who gets bored with her out of date boy-toy in those studies?

That's neither here nor there. My point is that large age differences are prone to sexual incompatibilities, where partners either have different sex drives or want something different sexually (ie a younger partner).

Of course lots of age gap marriages work out, but LARGE age differences are never a good thing in and of themselves.

March 20, 2009

Well AOL had an article this morning about men and their aging.

Who has the last laugh? God.

JS,

You seem like an argumentative and somewhat bitter person. Sorry - you do deserve a loving relationship, but stop chasing bad guys.

And in my limited opinion, women can look good as long as they take good care of themselves - eat healthy, workout, manage their stress etc.

March 20, 2009

It's not a low opinion of women, she's right. There is absolutely no reason for a young woman to marry a much older man, there is no greater benefit to her life she cannot have with a man close to her own age other than financial stability.

No reason? What about love, respect, companionship?

There are people IRL who actually DO fall in love when there is a big age gap. I grew up with it. My parents were 22 years apart, my Dad adored my mother and she loved him deeply as well. I have never witnessed such deep love since then, TBH.

I love the sweeping generalizations on this board. It's easy to become bitter and jaded reading all the crap on this board.

I was blessed to have a much older father. My Dad never ONCE raised his voice or got angry with me. He explained things, was patient, understanding, loving, emotionally available. We had the most fantastic philosophical conversations. I don't think most younger fathers would be capable of the type of fathering my Dad did. He had a half a century of the most amazing life experiences to draw from.

March 20, 2009

No reason? What about love, respect, companionship?

I understand that but my thought process was that there is no greater benefit to someone significantly older, not that "it's impossible to fall in love" with someone older. I understand that it's very possible but my question was what does an older man offer of benefit that a man your own age does not?

There are people IRL who actually DO fall in love when there is a big age gap. I grew up with it. My parents were 22 years apart, my Dad adored my mother and she loved him deeply as well. I have never witnessed such deep love since then, TBH.

It's my personal opinion basing it on how the world is today, that a relationship of that much age difference was less suspicious back in the day of our parents and grandparents than it is today but of course love can happen I am not going to dispute that. Also keep in mind that a man or woman for that matter, 22 yrs older than their partner is also 22 yrs closer to death. We live in a very superficial culture I just don't see how true love with no strings attached can prevail in this climate of materialism and superficialities. It's hard to see true unconditional spiritual love amongst people of same age and equal footing in life let alone when there is a significant inequality in age and physical appearance unless there is substantial financial stability to be had. It's just a fact.

I love the sweeping generalizations on this board. It's easy to become bitter and jaded reading all the crap on this board.

I was blessed to have a much older father. My Dad never ONCE raised his voice or got angry with me. He explained things, was patient, understanding, loving, emotionally available. We had the most fantastic philosophical conversations. I don't think most younger fathers would be capable of the type of fathering my Dad did. He had a half a century of the most amazing life experiences to draw from.

Well for someone who hates sweeping generalizations you seem quite adamant in assuming that a man who is younger cannot offer any sort of quality fathering skills as an older man would. Seems a little ironic to me for you to make those two comments both in the same breath.

Everyone makes generalizations everyone has ideas and ideals of concepts based on general views. You even have your own, you just made them here. There are always exceptions to the rules. I think your case was an exception not the norm. I am not saying love doesn't happen between people of significant age difference, love happens at any age, just saying that there is no real benefit to being with someone significantly older. If you have a choice of being loved equally the same by someone around your own age as someone significantly older it just makes more sense to pick someome who is at the same stage as you in life, it's just another level of compatibility.

March 20, 2009

What I find particularly hilarious is that CLV went on and on about how now that he's making loads of money, he can find a young woman, and then he claims to consider it a "low opinion" when THAT VERY TYPE OF WOMAN is being spoken of.

If he has gone on about now being able to have any woman he wants because he has money he is proving my point that younger women only see $$$ when going for older men. Otherwise it would not have taken him making all this money in order to have all these women. Correct?

Can you link the posts to where he said this please?

March 20, 2009

Is that considered "cross-posting" and infractable? How 'bout I PM it to ya?

I don't think so if it's on topic I don't see how that would be wrong? Is it from another thread? I don't have PM functions, if you like just tell me what thread and I will find it.

March 20, 2009

Oh, stop that

Well, it seems true. And men are obessed with porn anyway.

JS,

You seem like an argumentative and somewhat bitter person. Sorry - you do deserve a loving relationship, but stop chasing bad guys.

And in my limited opinion, women can look good as long as they take good care of themselves - eat healthy, workout, manage their stress etc.

Then I am in good company because many men here seem bitter and argumentative as well. Why don't you start pointing those out too.

March 20, 2009

Quote:
Oh, stop that

Well, it seems true. And men are obessed with porn anyway.

It may very well seem true from your perspective. I was inviting you to examine an option of thinking differently about it. IIRC, you're in your 20's (apologies if incorrect); I'm pondering, when you get to be that "older woman", what will decades of that thinking have brought you?

I'm an "older man" and see countless beautiful, worldly, articulate and sexy older women around me. I married one. Even though the M hasn't worked out, I still think she's an asset to the world and will join the ranks I speak of.

If anything, my life experience has shown me that women get better and more attractive as they age. If I was grounded in the superficial, I would have another perspective. So, anecdotally, "porn star bodies" are not required nor even prefered. Real woman bodies, minds and souls do just fine

March 20, 2009

If he has gone on about now being able to have any woman he wants because he has money he is proving my point that younger women only see $$$ when going for older men.

I've never said I can "have any woman" and on top of that, I'm not actually rich, just successful professionally. If I was rich I'd be building hospitals in Southeast Asia or something.

What I have said and still believe is that women by and large are wired to some degree to prefer the characteristics that lead to a man being able to consolidate money, power and so on. The correlation between the traits and the outcome seems so deeply ingrained that a man who possesses the result, for instance money and a respected career, is given credit as having those desirable traits by women, whether he really has them or not.[1] Some of the studies I cited in the aforementioned other thread merely attempted to quantify this effect.

It's obviously not the only trait most women look for, but it sways most of them to some degree.

Now obviously there are some women who won't give a whit about money, and some men who are relatively indifferent to beauty, but those cases are pretty rare. The majority of men who claim they don't care about beauty either qualify it, or say this out of shame, or are spewing sour grape juice. A similar rule holds for most women who claim to not care about money.

Which brings us to how it properly bears on this topic. Preference for this set of male traits is not limited to just the pretty women, however we see pretty women do tend to end up with men of means. Why would that be? Because men by and large tend to prefer youth and beauty. Simply put, the young and pretty women tend to out compete their older less attractive peers for the more desirable males, leaving the less desirable males to the less attractive females.

I don't believe gold digging behavior is limited to young or pretty women, nor do I believe the pure gold digging sociopath is a common creature. Thus, while I realistically understand that my professional success is attractive to women, I still believe my odds of ending up with a gold digging shrew are not significantly increased by choosing to date only young and pretty women.

[1] Many persuasion techniques leverage so called biological shortcuts, simply because humans have a ton of choices to make and we've developed effective shortcuts to allow us to more effectively deal with them. This is why so called 'peacocking' can work.

March 20, 2009

clv0116, men may prefer youth and beauty but if an older man requires wealth and financial superiority to obtain that youth and beauty in a woman then you are proving my point that a relationship between a man and woman of significant age is purely opportunistic.

If the same man can't pull the type of of women he would "prefer", being of average income, then my point is sealed.

Do a test. Post two fake profile ads on a dating site. One will be of a middle aged man of average looks (not bad) wearing a suit who will be a lawyer or a business owner with extravagant tastes and lifestyle the other will work in retail selling electronics for a major chain but is better looking than the other man wearing a uniform, and leads a very simple life. Then send out invites to the same young attractive women and come back and tell me what kind of response you get.

The original topic was that men that wait too long to have babies run the risk of having dumber kids. Women simply can't have babies past 45 women but can still have relationships with much younger men for more real reasons than any older man with money struggling to keep a woman interested flashing his credit cards around.

If men are all into beauty and youth explain why so many really good looking and successful young men these days are hooking up with older women?

March 20, 2009

On topic, the IQ penalty for being the child of a 50 year old man vs a 20 yo man was ... 3 IQ points. A pretty extreme age spread results in a far from crippling difference. Indeed it seems like that difference could easily be a difference in nurture or nature.

clv0116, men may prefer youth and beauty but if an older man requires wealth and financial superiority to obtain that youth and beauty in a woman then you are proving my point that a relationship between a man and woman of significant age is purely opportunistic.

I'm saying that for ANY man, having means, or the potential to have means, or the traits that tend to lead to having means, helps 'pull' a more desirable mate. It's not a phenomenon that's limited to men over 35.

If the same man can't pull the type of of women he would "prefer", being of average income, then my point is sealed.

In real life things are seldom so black & white. Looking healthy, having a respectable career, etc will all come into play. Obviously being incredibly [insert positive trait] will help a lot and this is true whether the man is 19 or 49.

Do a test. Post two fake profile ads on a dating site. One will be of a middle aged man of average looks (not bad) wearing a suit who will be a lawyer or a business owner with extravagant tastes and lifestyle the other will work in retail selling electronics for a major chain but is better looking than the other man wearing a uniform, and leads a very simple life. Then send out invites to the same young attractive women and come back and tell me what kind of response you get.

Two issues there. First you're taking it to an extreme, which is interesting as an experiment but not the actual case I'm discussing. Second, I suspect you'd get similar results for a average looking man aged 25 or 45. What conclusion shall we draw from that?

The original topic was that men that wait too long to have babies run the risk of having dumber kids. Women simply can't have babies past 45

And at 50 a man will likely produce a child only 3 IQ points less intelligent than when he was at 20. I can think of a couple non-biology related potential causes for that in about 2 seconds.

If men are all into beauty and youth explain why so many really good looking and successful young men these days are hooking up with older women?

Well young guys will always be up for some sex, so to speak. It's actually vastly less likely that a woman will marry a significantly younger man than the other way around.

March 20, 2009

I'm saying that for ANY man, having means, or the potential to have means, or the traits that tend to lead to having means, helps 'pull' a more desirable mate. It's not a phenomenon that's limited to men over 35.

Well you need to define desirable. More desirable for whom? Some men desire to be loved for who they are not for the money they can offer. There are plenty men who "desire" a lot more than just youth and beauty in a mate. That's where you seem to fall short of understanding not all men aim to have a woman half their age way over their physical league by their side in exchange for financial support. Some men like a more "real" connection.

Again, you are set on proving that a man that works hard to buy a woman has the most desrible of relationships. Still haven't answered my question why you are not married if you have so many options and having money makes you so desirable? Afraid to pick just one? Or realistically there aren't really all that many to pick from afterall?

Two issues there. First you're taking it to an extreme, which is interesting as an experiment but not the actual case I'm discussing.

I am taking it to an extreme because the case of a man with a woman half his age IS extreme, it's not the norm nor the general desire of young women by any stretch. Contrary to what you may tell yourself to feel better....most young women don't want that for themselves.

March 20, 2009

What men fantasize about having and what they actually get are two different things, same goes for women. Its not that anyone "settles" for less but just that we fantasize about something beyond what we can reach and thats why its a fantasy and its fun to have fantasies. Hence people fantasize about celebs n such like knowing that its never likely to happen but thinking about it is great!

March 20, 2009

clv0116, men may prefer youth and beauty but if an older man requires wealth and financial superiority to obtain that youth and beauty in a woman then you are proving my point that a relationship between a man and woman of significant age is purely opportunistic.

If the same man can't pull the type of of women he would "prefer", being of average income, then my point is sealed.

Do a test. Post two fake profile ads on a dating site. One will be of a middle aged man of average looks (not bad) wearing a suit who will be a lawyer or a business owner with extravagant tastes and lifestyle the other will work in retail selling electronics for a major chain but is better looking than the other man wearing a uniform, and leads a very simple life. Then send out invites to the same young attractive women and come back and tell me what kind of response you get.

The original topic was that men that wait too long to have babies run the risk of having dumber kids. Women simply can't have babies past 45 women but can still have relationships with much younger men for more real reasons than any older man with money struggling to keep a woman interested flashing his credit cards around.

If men are all into beauty and youth explain why so many really good looking and successful young men these days are hooking up with older women?

You seem to be saying its more natural for older women to be in relationships with younger men than the reverse..older men and younger women

Is this the case?

March 20, 2009

Do a test. Post two fake profile ads on a dating site. One will be of a middle aged man of average looks (not bad) wearing a suit who will be a lawyer or a business owner with extravagant tastes and lifestyle the other will work in retail selling electronics for a major chain but is better looking than the other man wearing a uniform, and leads a very simple life. Then send out invites to the same young attractive women and come back and tell me what kind of response you get.

This would be an inadequate experiment. Of course all else equal the dude with more monaaay will get more responses .

Now if you compare the responses of a hot but broke 30 year old with the responce rate of a 40 y/o well-off dude, then we can talk...

March 20, 2009

You seem to be saying its more natural for older women to be in relationships with younger men than the reverse..older men and younger women

Is this the case?

If by "natural" you mean purtiy of intent, then yes that is what I am saying. It has been said over and over again by these men that young men only seek out older women for sex, but that sex is still something that is offered from within it is not materialistic and people are on the level about that. But younger women don't seek out older men for sex they do so for financial stability and more often than not it is an underhanded desire. A 50 yr old woman hooking up with a man half her age knows exactly where she stands with that man, I don't think she kids herself into thinking he is there for anything more than sheer physical pleasure, but some of these men really believe that women would be just as happy next to them if they were poor and old and the reality is that these same women would not even entertain a chance at being with these men if the money weren't the enticing factor.

See the difference?

That is exactly my point in not only this thread but the other I mentioned as well, but it seemed so difficult to get that thought across to some folks. I find it rather pathetic that someone would resort to using their financial status to secure a mate - the person who is SUPPOSED to be the one who loves you "in sickness and health, for richer or poorer," not "for richer or richest."

Exactly!

March 20, 2009

This would be an inadequate experiment. Of course all else equal the dude with more monaaay will get more responses .

Well it seems you did not understand the example because it is not "all else equal" I specfically chose two men of the same age of different or disequal physical appearance but of different wealth and financial stability to show that young attractive women only go for older men who have money despite how much better looking a younger more attractive version is. In your example I think more women would go for the younger hot broke guy over the not as hot 40 yr old with money.

March 20, 2009

So if a guy is say...34..what is the appropriate age for his partner?

47?

March 20, 2009

Many women arer scandalous goldiggers and untrustworthy no matter what age they are. I know couple who are about the same age where the wife has tried to cash in the marriage after a certain amount of years so a man is not guaranteed a trustworthy woman as long as he sticks to his own age.

March 20, 2009

Look at Paul McCartney

Poor Sir Paul went for a woman with one leg...and he still got f*cked over

Wasnt he the one who wrote "Money Cant Buy You Love"

March 20, 2009

So if a guy is say...34..what is the appropriate age for his partner?

47?

I may be a nun my child but I am not God. That is for the guy and his heart to decide.

March 20, 2009

Look at Paul McCartney

Poor Sir Paul went for a woman with one leg...and he still got f*cked over

Wasnt he the one who wrote "Money Cant Buy You Love"

Well little did he know that when her wrote "When I'm 64" he would be royally getting screwed by a woman half his age (Warning: no kings or sexual contact of any form were used to form that statement)

March 20, 2009

No, but you much MORE guarantee yourself a "gold digger" if you're an old man with LOTS of money looking for a 20 year old.

Not really. If you are aman with money any woman is suspect except for another rich woman.

March 20, 2009

Not really. If you are aman with money any woman is suspect except for another rich woman.

I don't even think you meant to do it but you ended up making a very strong statment in terms of how important equality is in a relationship.

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