Owl Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 Another reason why many BS's feel that the "love between affair partners isn't 'real'". Most affairs don't include all the same aspects of a "live in" relationship like a marriage. Many, like my wife's, included very few actual aspects of a long term, close, intimate relationship. The affair partners simply didn't interact with each other enough to truly be "in love" with the other person...they were "in love" with a vague perception of what they thought the other person was. I'll agree...some relationships start out that way, and build up over time. But it's when you start comparing the two loves (which WS's inevitably do) that this comes into play. I told OM in my case that there was a huge difference between the woman he thought he knew and loved and the actual person I'd lived with for the prior 17 years. There was no way that his "love" for her encompassed the whole person. And it works the other way too...my my wife was "in love" with her perception of OM...with this ideal picture of him that she'd created in her mind and her heart...that had very, very little to do with the actual person. And convincing herself that she was 'in love' with him and that this love was greater than what we'd shared was pretty much sheer silliness. It shows how skewed her mind and heart had gotten during the affair. There was no way that the two of them knew each other to truly be "in love" with each other...they were far more infatuated with the affair and the idea of falling in love with each other. Interestingly enough, she can look back at the whole thing now and agree with me. Unsurprisingly, that didn't occur anytime during or shortly following the whole situation. So there's one more reason why BS's don't believe that the love "is real".
OWoman Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 Another reason why many BS's feel that the "love between affair partners isn't 'real'". Most affairs don't include all the same aspects of a "live in" relationship like a marriage. Many, like my wife's, included very few actual aspects of a long term, close, intimate relationship. The affair partners simply didn't interact with each other enough to truly be "in love" with the other person...they were "in love" with a vague perception of what they thought the other person was. I'll agree...some relationships start out that way, and build up over time. But it's when you start comparing the two loves (which WS's inevitably do) that this comes into play. I told OM in my case that there was a huge difference between the woman he thought he knew and loved and the actual person I'd lived with for the prior 17 years. There was no way that his "love" for her encompassed the whole person. And it works the other way too...my my wife was "in love" with her perception of OM...with this ideal picture of him that she'd created in her mind and her heart...that had very, very little to do with the actual person. And convincing herself that she was 'in love' with him and that this love was greater than what we'd shared was pretty much sheer silliness. It shows how skewed her mind and heart had gotten during the affair. There was no way that the two of them knew each other to truly be "in love" with each other...they were far more infatuated with the affair and the idea of falling in love with each other. Interestingly enough, she can look back at the whole thing now and agree with me. Unsurprisingly, that didn't occur anytime during or shortly following the whole situation. So there's one more reason why BS's don't believe that the love "is real". Owl, while I take your point and accept that this was valid in your situation, I've also seen the reverse in play - where the long-term spouse was "in love" with a vision long past of what their spouse USED TO BE way back when, so much so that they were blinded to changes and shifts over the years and would not really have recognised their spouse in their present form had they met them afresh... so that the spouse feels alienated and "misunderstood" and so when they get caught up in an A, they relish the connection with the new person because they're being seen for what they (feel they) REALLY ARE, rather than some moribund version of what they once were years back. Of course how well anyone knows anyone else depends on the individual circumstances - spouses can live in close contact but live essentially withdrawn and cut-off lives from each other; others live intimately and vibrantly. An A can be a fanstasy world or it can be an intensely real and resonant connection between two people and their respective worlds. It all depends on the individuals and their situations and their needs. Which love is the REAL love, I'd say, would depend on which love allowed you to be the best, and fullest, you you could be - the you most closest to your dreams and aspirations.
Untouchable_Fire Posted March 13, 2009 Posted March 13, 2009 Which love is the REAL love, I'd say, would depend on which love allowed you to be the best, and fullest, you you could be - the you most closest to your dreams and aspirations. If your feelings are for someone who only exists in your mind... is that really love at all? I have always felt that if you don't really know and accept the person you love... it isn't love at all.
HappyAtLast Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 Real love isn't just the fireworks or the constant itch between the legs. It is the day to day. It is crying kids, bills, broken appliances, old cars on bald tires. It is throw up, diarrhea, mud tracked on clean carpet and hair on the sink. It is the toilet lid left up in the middle of the night, garbage that should have gone out 2 days before and briefs with more band left than brief. It is flannel pj's instead of Victoria's secret. It is hugging 2 kids, a dog and a cat between you and the spouse. It is the holidays with azz-n-laws and screaming matches that end in hugs and tears. It is the grunt instead of the good morning, the "where the hell have you been" instead of "hello sweetie". I've been married for forty years and it certainly has NOT been like you describe. Is this what women really think love is?
HappyAtLast Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 When you like someone so much that you are longing to live with him/her forever, you would be with him/her under any circumstances, you would stand by him/her no matter what happens, you would like them to be with you at your death bed, you would like him/her so much that if the need occurs you would die for him/her. If your feelings are so strong for person (also sexually attracted to him/her) then I think you found your true love.
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 If you need to be completed how can you be with someone when you don't know what the other half of you is. Why let someone else decide who you need to be, completion....poopoo that. And God help all of us who love on a feeling and not a choice. I know this is your opinion, I don't mean to sound harsh, it just seems so much like t.v. love. If you want to vomit by your green face you have shown here, then you are invited to get away to the street ,breathe cold air and only then you are allowed to get back to this site. If you think having posted so much that you are here any authority talking and all others listening to you ,then I have got a pity for you . If you think about my post it is alike t.v. love ,then I have a pity for you again . I always say what I sincerely feel . If you act another way , its your own problem, bent soul . If you had never been in True Love,then actually You have no rights to talk here as you were not asked to come here ,broken poster. Respect people`s feelings . So you will get more respect yourself . Work on yourself more rather than make bitter comments on others` sweet feelings,broken soul !
Trialbyfire Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 Real love isn't about lying, cheating and hiding. If something can't be exposed to the light of day, it's not real love.
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 Real love isn't about lying, cheating and hiding. If something can't be exposed to the light of day, it's not real love. So many say that they love,but cant even decide to meet hiding under the curtains so that no one sees .. Anyway Love is felt and not seen, so hiding issue here is not appropriate . Lying and cheating - depends on "whom" , it has not to be Between the Two .True .
Trialbyfire Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 So many say that they love,but cant even decide to meet hiding under the curtains so that no one sees .. Anyway Love is felt and not seen, so hiding issue here is not appropriate . Lying and cheating - depends on "whom" , it has not to be Between the Two .True . For whenst dost love be hidden, illicit in its need, Felt not remorse, for remorse or conscience, hath no meaning Beyond one moment of stolen pleasure And years of guilt and shame. To love is to give Not to steal or take When one understands One will learn what real love is.
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 For whenst dost love be hidden, illicit in its need, Felt not remorse, for remorse or conscience, hath no meaning Beyond one moment of stolen pleasure And years of guilt and shame. To love is to give Not to steal or take When one understands One will learn what real love is. and who was here talking about stealing anything ?> hiding,stealing,taking-what are these verbs meaning regarding real love ? and there is no "learning" what real love is.. real love is real ..and thats it .. without even seeing or hiding or taking or giving .. its just felt .
jwi71 Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 If you had never been in True Love,then actually You have no rights to talk here as you were not asked to come here ,broken poster. Please do not mistake this as flippant or attacking as the question is real. In that quote you imply you have know or are currently in "True Love". How did you know it was true love? What made it different from past relationships? How is "True love" different from "love"?
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 So many say that they love,but cant even decide to meet hiding under the curtains so that no one sees .. Anyway Love is felt and not seen, so hiding issue here is not appropriate . Lying and cheating - depends on "whom" , it has not to be Between the Two .True . yes,signing under my own post . even if you are in love virtually while being in a relationship in life, its already cheating on your current partner ,its already hiding from your real partner,its already lying to your real partner UNFORTUNATELY ! and when in real love then no one steals anyone .. the hearts of the two are already stolen by those two .. but stealing each other from real partners cant ever happen , as no one steals anyone, everyone has his own head on shoulders, so all decisions are made by theirs own . Those who love by real love will never afford to "steal" their beloved .
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 Please do not mistake this as flippant or attacking as the question is real. In that quote you imply you have know or are currently in "True Love". How did you know it was true love? What made it different from past relationships? How is "True love" different from "love"? True Love is Unconditional and Deeply Felt Giving All One Can Ever Give . this is what I have been feeling .. while with all others it was truly different.
Trialbyfire Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 and who was here talking about stealing anything ?> hiding,stealing,taking-what are these verbs meaning regarding real love ? and there is no "learning" what real love is.. real love is real ..and thats it .. without even seeing or hiding or taking or giving .. its just felt . To love someone is the ultimate act of giving, Conditional though it might be, If real love is all about taking, Then the bond of lovers can never last. The joy of giving, is attached to the joy of real love, To want to give pleasure, To trust and be trusted, To respect and be respected. Real love doesn't hide in a dark, dank place, Behind curtains of deceit, It bursts forth into the light, Pride evident in every wingbeat.
Owl Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 There is no such thing as "unconditional love". It's a wonderful concept propogated in Romance novels and Hollywood. Scenario: You're "unconditionally in love" with a man. Then, as you get to know him better you find out that he's a serial rapist. When you find out, he attacks and does the same to you. Would you still be in love with him afterwards? QED
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 There is no such thing as "unconditional love". It's a wonderful concept propogated in Romance novels and Hollywood. Scenario: You're "unconditionally in love" with a man. Then, as you get to know him better you find out that he's a serial rapist. When you find out, he attacks and does the same to you. Would you still be in love with him afterwards? QED Yes. As I would have feel such a warm pity for him in my heart for his disease .
jwi71 Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 True Love is Unconditional and Deeply Felt Giving All One Can Ever Give . this is what I have been feeling .. while with all others it was truly different. Can True Love die?
Trialbyfire Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 I'll just add that any man who has honestly loved me, has been more than happy to shout it out to the world.
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 To love someone is the ultimate act of giving, Conditional though it might be, If real love is all about taking, Then the bond of lovers can never last. The joy of giving, is attached to the joy of real love, To want to give pleasure, To trust and be trusted, To respect and be respected. Real love doesn't hide in a dark, dank place, Behind curtains of deceit, It bursts forth into the light, Pride evident in every wingbeat. I agree with you
HappyAtLast Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 There is no such thing as "unconditional love". It's a wonderful concept propogated in Romance novels and Hollywood. Scenario: You're "unconditionally in love" with a man. Then, as you get to know him better you find out that he's a serial rapist. When you find out, he attacks and does the same to you. Would you still be in love with him afterwards? QED Silly concept....
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 Can True Love die? No,it cant , as there is something that ****ingly holds by balls.
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 Can True Love die? I do not think, many of those who are posting here understand all the concept of True Love in real .. It is like loving your own baby .. you cant fall out of this ****ing love no matter how much it ****s you really you go on loving you go on loving you go on loving just like you love your own baby this is True Love which never dies .. I again do not think , all so mental posters will realize what my this answer indeed means ..
jwi71 Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 No,it cant , as there is something that ****ingly holds by balls. So True Love is a deep feeling felt towards regardless of how they treat you and/or others. Admirable. I do understand your point and even agree - to a point. So, should you have true love for an abusive alcoholic...the love will endure while your jaw is wired shut in the ER. This must be the case because love is something given. What is offered in return per your own posts does NOT matter. Again...there is a particular "grace" to this and I truly admire it. I am NOT capable of it. An R is two people each choosing behaviors which allow one to become invested in the other. As such, the attachment grows. A series of choices to give and TO RECEIVE such in return. However, you seem to say that what is received does NOT matter. You can give and give and give, receive nothing in return and still call it True Love. And it never dies. I hope your bf or H thinks you are his "true love". Because you are setting yourself up for failure and betrayal and abuse. And all because what you receive does NOT matter. I would be careful with true love which is why I asked my original question. If it is a deep true feeling like never before...then I think you are vulnerable. I would simply advise...what you get in return matters. That love is bi-directional and is not only given but received. And to give love and NOT receive it in return is NOT True Love. Its called taken advantage of.
Owl Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 Yes. As I would have feel such a warm pity for him in my heart for his disease . Then you are a unique individual.
Adri Ana Posted March 17, 2009 Posted March 17, 2009 So True Love is a deep feeling felt towards regardless of how they treat you and/or others. Admirable. I do understand your point and even agree - to a point. So, should you have true love for an abusive alcoholic...the love will endure while your jaw is wired shut in the ER. This must be the case because love is something given. What is offered in return per your own posts does NOT matter. Again...there is a particular "grace" to this and I truly admire it. I am NOT capable of it. An R is two people each choosing behaviors which allow one to become invested in the other. As such, the attachment grows. A series of choices to give and TO RECEIVE such in return. However, you seem to say that what is received does NOT matter. You can give and give and give, receive nothing in return and still call it True Love. And it never dies. I hope your bf or H thinks you are his "true love". Because you are setting yourself up for failure and betrayal and abuse. And all because what you receive does NOT matter. I would be careful with true love which is why I asked my original question. If it is a deep true feeling like never before...then I think you are vulnerable. I would simply advise...what you get in return matters. That love is bi-directional and is not only given but received. And to give love and NOT receive it in return is NOT True Love. Its called taken advantage of. Agreeing with u on some points
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