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He Realizes He Loves Me, but Doesn't Like Being Disappointed


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Posted

Ok here's my story: I've been with this guy for almost 2 years, exclusive after about 6 months. The past couple weeks we've been having some problems due to not being able to see each other much. First I was upset around V-day because he behaved in a way that brought up old issues, so that took a few days to work out. During that time I didn't want to see him and told him I needed time to stop feeling angry and think. He constantly called and texted, asking what he could do to work things thru, etc. Eventually I calmed down, we talked and had a wonderful few days together.

 

But then some family members unexpectedly came into town, at the same time I had car problems. So this all interfered with our being able to get together much for 4 or 5 days, and he was really disappointed. Then they left and we were fine again... until we started talking about LOVE.

 

We've said it to each other, and all that, it was a general conversation but all of a sudden he said he wasn't sure if he loved me (WTF?), I got emotional so I asked him to leave before things were said that shouldn't be. That was the night before he left for a long weekend camping. I tried calling him a few times, but he wouldn't take my calls. He finally called from the road and told me he thinks he loves me but he's not sure, mixed up with all this stuff about how great we are together, but then throwing in more wishy-washy stuff about his feelings.

 

On his way back from his trip he texted me a couple times and I didn't respond because it was late and I thought he might want to come over just to smooth things over and not deal with them, as he tends to do. The next day we text a bit, then he turns off his phone until about midnight, answers one text saying something about "tit-for tat, see how you like being ignored."

 

Then the next day we were both more calm, texting all day, he was getting a little flirty while I kept keeping it more serious. Then he says he realized last night (while his phone was off) that he really does love me and looks up to me, although we've had some ups and downs lately. From then on it's been all mixed signals -- he wanted to come over to talk about his career (he's soon to be laid off), when I said I can't and don't want to be just friends he started getting flirty and sexual. Talked about why he loved me. When I responded in kind he said he just wants to be friends, talked about how "we've disappointed each other"... back and forth, confusing me to death. He asked if I'd kick him out again if he came over.

 

So finally our last convo was about him being too tired to talk or come over that night. I told him that's too bad, I miss him, want to see him etc. He agreed he missed me and we said goodnight. Half hour later he sends an inside joke text, I assume to make sure I'm not mad and to alleviate guilt, so I responded light-heartedly. That's it.

 

What is up with all this?

 

I'm sure this is all unclear to read and reflects my confusion. I appreciate any and all responses, questions, etc. Thanks!

Posted

What is up with all this?

 

What I'm reading is that he has some seriously distorted views of Life -- as if it is NEVER supposed to throw him any curve balls and unexpected events and circumstances with which to deal.

 

And then, when Life does treat him exactly the way it treats the rest of us, he unreasonably and unrealistically expects YOU to "fix things and make it better" (kind of how kids expect their parents to do -- which is age-appropriate ONLY when we are kids.)

 

And, failing your ability to make everything exactly how he wants it, he is going to blame you and "feel disappointed" by you (kind of how kids react when they don't get what they want, when they want it.) Are you sure you want and need that on your shoulders?

 

That thing where he is "looking up to you" -- putting you on a pedestal -- again, is what little boys and girls do with their mommies and daddies. And "tit for tat" is also from kindergarten, as is trying to control and manipulate your reactions by just always giving you the opposite message of what you're giving him. (Mommy says, "wash your hands", little boy says, "no" or goes to brush his teeth, instead.)

 

What seems to be missing is his understanding that you two are equals, and he ought to be contributing equally to the mental and emotional health, stability and well-being of your relationship. He does not appear to see that, in reality, you are his peer not his parent.

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Posted

Wow Ronni, I'm amazed at your insight and how you could pick up on the parent/child dynamic so quickly in my garbled post!

 

He often reacts to others as a child would, when he feels slighted. He wants to cut them out of his life, doesn't need them, needs a better class of friends, etc. But he calms down and forgets about it (until the next perceived slight). He is kind of buddies outside of work with his boss, and loved being the one in his office going to lunch with him, getting inside info and all that. But when he notices his boss going to lunch with others he gets all down about him, how he's not a good boss, not a good friend, etc -- it always rubbed me the wrong way, noticing how sensitive he is and up and down about his relationships. And like a child, he would "forget" to finish projects or whatever on time to "get back" at his boss.

 

He doesn't take responsibility for much but is quick to blame, that's for sure.

 

I'm so confused about why he's throwing all this at me, that he really loves me blah blah then being flirty, then bringing up disappointment, then being sexual, then something else negative.... Why is he doing all this? How does he expect me to react?

Posted

Your post wasn't "garbled" enough, I guess :) -- you already knew the Parent-Child dynamics so that is what you communicated very clearly and succinctly!

 

I wouldn't see it as him "throwing stuff at you". It's just his under-developed (maladaptive) ways of dealing with the world at large...not directed at a single person...he just doesn't yet know any better ways of doing his life and relationships. YOU just so happen to appear to be quite willing to stand in his 'crosshair' and make yourself an easy target for his crap.

 

He isn't, IMO, acting "sensitively" but age-inappropriately (dysfunctionally.) I'd guess he expects you to react like any loving parent would -- with huge globs of understanding, forgiveness and patience.

 

I'd also say that yes, he does love you -- the same way (on the same level) that a 2-year old loves his parents, pets and stuffed animals. It is a "taking" kind of love with very little awareness that adult love is also about giving.

 

To bring everything back to you, perhaps your more realistic and permanent solutions lie in a question that goes something like, "What is compelling you to ALLOW all this to be present in your life and experiences?"

EDIT: Well, actually...lie in your answers to that type of question.

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Posted

He isn't, IMO, acting "sensitively" but age-inappropriately (dysfunctionally.) I'd guess he expects you to react like any loving parent would -- with huge globs of understanding, forgiveness and patience.

 

I'd also say that yes, he does love you -- the same way (on the same level) that a 2-year old loves his parents, pets and stuffed animals. It is a "taking" kind of love with very little awareness that adult love is also about giving.

 

Wow again Ronni! How you described how he might be expecting me to react made me immediately think of his exgf... she's been basically "waiting" for him for years to come back to her. She contacts him every couple months asking about seeing him, how his relationship is, making it clear she'd like him back. He always says no, but does nothing to let her heal and move on completely.

 

And about his "taking" kind of love, I've actually thought of him at times as a giant pet -- one that takes my love and affection but certainly not one I can expect much empathy from.

 

Anyway, why am I willing to stand in his cross-hairs? Good question. To start, this thing that happened around V-Day was the first time I really put my foot down and wouldn't let him take me for granted, wouldn't let him charm his way back to me, and took some time for myself to think. And he freaked out. He called and texted relentlessly -- I still have 35 unread texts of his from that period because I was becoming exhausted trying to keep up with them all.

 

We worked thru that, but then I wasn't able to give him as much attention as he wanted. Right when I could give him attention, he was confused about his love and all this ensued. So why am I in his cross-hairs once again? I don't know.

Posted

I've actually thought of him at times as a giant pet -- one that takes my love and affection but certainly not one I can expect much empathy from.

 

What I have found with pets ("giant" or Lilliputian :p), though, is that they take what we can and want to give them...no major expectations on their part -- they just accept and love us for exactly who we are and what we do. And they certainly don't exhaust and deplete us, and make us feel crappy about ourselves! (Well, we actually do that to ourselves, but I'm guessing you know what I mean?)

 

Could I ask why you haven't, or suggest that you do, delete those 35 unread texts? As you say, you've already worked through that...well, I know what you mean, there. Cos it really ain't "worked through" at all, is it?

 

It's nice to be "needed", of course. It does offer a sense of esteem and worth.

But if there is a part of your personality that is more tending towards being a caregiver and ensuring others' happiness and well-being...then that could be the part that is keeping you stuck parenting this guy (or trying to parent him, if/how/when he lets you.)

 

At least, that is how it was for me, in my "over-responsible/parenting" days. WE are the insane ones to expect empathy and other adult contributions from people who act like children. We stay optimistic that they are going to "get it" at any second, and grow into their chronological age. (They won't, as long as we don't step out of their way so that they can! It just becomes one big codependent mess, to which we are equal contributors and for which we are equally responsible. Sadly, and in my experience.)

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Posted

Excellent point Ronni about the pets taking what we give them. I guess I just feel so loyal to any pet I choose to adopt that I'll give what I can and don't realize that I can let it go if it takes up too many of my resources.

 

Bringing me to being codependent. Yes, I realize I am that way. Just as warped as the other person in the relationship. Why haven't I deleted those texts? I don't really want to read them, but I guess I imagine there might be something in one of them that gives me some kind of clue to understanding him.

 

I know I cant change anybody, I know that intellectually anyway. But something makes me miss the red flags with this guy until I'm in the middle of some mess. I've dated others when I've noticed red flags and bailed right away. But I really enjoy this guy, we have so much fun together all the time. We don't bicker, get on each others nerves, etc. It's when we don't see each other a few days we have some trouble.

 

I'm not a mess right now, not freaking out about "us." Intellectually I'm confused and my heart feels, I don't know, it doesn't feel much at the moment.

 

I see that many have read my post, and only you respond. Are my issues so painfully obvious to everyone that they just say "oh geez, next..." ha ha?!?

 

How did you pull yourself away from your "over-responsible/parenting" days?

Posted

OP, how old are you and he and have you met his parents?

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Posted
OP, how old are you and he and have you met his parents?

 

Embarrassing to admit, I'm almost 30 and he's in his mid-30's.

 

I've met his parents and if it'll help I'll be glad to tell you about them/my experiences with them/his family if you'll direct me with some questions.

Posted

I just feel so loyal to any pet I choose to adopt that I'll give what I can and don't realize that I can let it go

 

Lawd, I do know what you mean! It's such a struggle cos there is this deep sense that we're not 'supposed' to give up on people. But, when we deplete ourselves, we are giving up on the Self. And the caregiver does NOT want to be seen as uncaring, lacking compassion and the most dreaded "selfish", does it?

It's a constant struggle...well, less so now but something I still have to 'think' my way through. It is that I am JUST as important as the next person, when it comes to my caretaking, and trying to keep happy and sane -- I deserve that from me, too.

 

I imagine there might be something in one of them that gives me some kind of clue to understanding him.

 

I may be totally wrong, but my sense of it is that you understand plenty -- you don't need any more "clues" to understanding him. If that's close to being accurate, then... well, if those were my texts, I'd be hoping for something that will compel me to find, within myself, even MORE understanding and forgiving and patient. Yes? Put another way, looking for a "clue" that will 'help' me to deplete myself even further.

 

It's when we don't see each other a few days we have some trouble.

 

Er...or when your car breaks down or people come in unexpectedly, from out of town. That is, EVERY TIME he does not get his way.

 

only you respond. Are my issues so painfully obvious to everyone that they just say "oh geez, next..." ha ha?!?

 

I can't speak for anyone else, of course. But sometimes people just don't feel that they can offer the type of support or guidance that appears to be called for -- it's them feeling, rightly or wrongly, somehow ill-equipped...NOT them feeling that YOU are past all help :laugh:

 

How did you pull yourself away from your "over-responsible/parenting" days?

 

What type of therapy have I NOT tried? Feels like ten-thousand hours of it, and I'm pretty certain I'm not half done yet!

I prefer cognitive-type therapies but have also done psychodynamic, and regression, energy work, interactive hypnotherapy (I think it's called), chakra cording -- whatever feels 'right' on an intuitive level, I will try. I like the psychospiritual/transpersonal stuff a lot :)

Posted
Embarrassing to admit, I'm almost 30 and he's in his mid-30's.

Nothing to be embarrassed about...in the "olden days", it was closer to 40 that this type of self-awareness started happening. It's great that, as a collective, we are getting smarter, younger :)

Posted

I see some signs of inappropriate emotional states that I battled when I was younger. They largely never made it to the relationship arena, but certainly were private demons.

 

Basic questions:

 

Siblings?

 

Parents married/divorced?

 

Abuse/molestation?

 

Death/illness when a child?

 

Loner personality? Few friends?

 

Mental disease or defect?

 

Performance in school?

 

Is he close to his family now and does he speak favorably of them?

 

Describe his closest male friend today.

 

This is some of what our MC went through with my wife and myself in our initial sessions.

Posted

Hey, Heartford.

I forgot to list as part of my "therapies", that I also did group, stress & anger management, and pre-marital & marital.

Couples' counseling is a whole different animal though because the "couple" is the client, and goals are focused on making the unit work -- not really on developing self-awareness and becoming more autonomous (although some of that will naturally occur.)

 

You mentioned earlier about those texts maybe holding "clues" to help you understand your b/f. But I was thinking: Even if you DID gain greater insight into what makes him tick, that wouldn't change anything about how he relates to you and others. Couples' counseling can help both of you, but only if your b/f is an active and willing participant.

 

So, and for what it's worth, my suggestion would be to focus on your SELF-awareness and development, instead -- gaining insight what makes your "Caretaker/Fixer" tick, and how to manage it so that you are also a beneficiary; make new decisions about how you want to and are going to relate to others, etc. THAT'S where you have 100% power and control.

 

Have a happy weekend! :)

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Posted

Ronni I keep trying to quote you and respond directly to what you've said to me, but the bottom line is YES, you're so accurate in pointing out what goes on in my head. And in what I need to do. I'm so co-dependent it's bizzaro-world. You must be an expert at therapy, considering all that you have been involved with! I think psychodynamic and some cognitive work is what I should look into. But I can't afford it at this time.

 

This is what happened this morning. I ironed his shirt, one that he obviously wore recently, and noticed some dog hairs. (The night he turned off his phone is a mystery... I have no idea what he was doing, thus my interest in the dog hair.) So I asked him "who's dog were you around when wearing this shirt?" He didn't blink an eye and told me the name of a co-worker (an obvious lie)... I said "Wow, you are so good at lying it just rolls off your tongue and you don't even blink. Amazing." At first he tried to laugh it off. The he asked me about a doggie bag I had in the fridge (implying I got it on a date). Long story short, he basically got angry and tried mimicking me, criticizing me, tried telling me what to do until he left and I watched thru the window and he flipped me off (without knowing I'd see him). Then he came back in and got something he forgot and when he saw me he waved "bye-bye" basically implying this was the last time I'd see him.

 

I was left feeling a little amazed at his behavior and not much else. I actually almost called him to remind him that this is a great opportunity for him to examine how he handles anger and what he does to "get back" at the person who "slighted" him... How lame was that urge!?! But mostly I'm curious about why I feel some kind of emotional detachment - this is new to me and I don't know what it means.

  • Author
Posted
I see some signs of inappropriate emotional states that I battled when I was younger. They largely never made it to the relationship arena, but certainly were private demons.

 

Basic questions:

 

Siblings? He has one sister, who he feels is the golden child, while he is the black sheep.

 

Parents married/divorced? His parents are married, and apparently his mom had an affair while he was a young boy. His father has self-medicated with alcohol until very recently, when his health wouldn't allow it, although I think he's drinking again. They are east european immigrants, and have a huge chip on their shoulder about being Americanized. He was the only one born in the US, and I think somehow that relates to his feeling "less" than the rest of his family.

 

Abuse/molestation? I'm not aware of any.

 

Death/illness when a child? Not aware.

 

Loner personality? Few friends? Yes, I'd say so. He loves the internet and I think he believes his "friendships" online to be true, even though they are superficial. He has a high school buddy he sees, and thru him maintains occasional socialization. But mostly he is online or with me. I don't think he tolerates being alone very well at all. He'd almost hang out with anybody to avoid it. (although he is alone quite a bit)

 

Mental disease or defect? He was apparently diagnosed with depression after his divorce (married for a little over a year, new her 6 months prior, she left him). Went to therapy for about 6 months. I think he suffered a kind of narcissistic injury when she left him, and I believe that he neglected her and took her for granted.

 

Performance in school? Not too good. He's very intelligent, but didn't do too well in school and he's wishy-washy about it, but based on a few things he said I think he may have been held back a year in high school. He started smoking pot and doing drugs at 14, and said he stopped his senior year of high school, which I think was because his older buddy had already graduated and moved on.

 

Is he close to his family now and does he speak favorably of them? He and his sister are not close, although they live nearby and he even lived with her for a few years. For some reason she doesn't trust him alone with her child. He claims he has no idea why. At first I thought this odd, but now I believe she realizes how uncaring he is toward her child. I don't know if there was any specific "incident." He's met my nephews, who I adore, and he barely looks at them.

 

He sees his parents every few weeks, and they seem to feed into his "I'm victimized" perspective. They've given him money when he's needed it, and let him use one of their cars because one of his isn't working -- which, by the way, I have no idea why... somehow I never get an answer when I try to ask what happened to it.

 

Describe his closest male friend today. Well, this is an interesting topic. His real closest male friend is also his boss for the last few years. But they are on the outs and I think it's because his boss is sick of his BS and realizes something about him that makes him want to turn away. But to describe him, I'd say his friend is a guy with a very good job, but who is personally insecure. He cheated on his wife, she found out, they contemplated divorce but didn't get one, the guy acted like he didn't want one only because it would be too expensive. This guy will steal from work (or have my bf do it for him) and spends most of his time out of the office working his side job, rather than with his family. He is smart, cute and funny.

 

This is some of what our MC went through with my wife and myself in our initial sessions.

 

I hope what I've answered provides some insight. And thank you Carhill, for reading and responding to my post, I really appreciate it.

 

Oh, what I wrote above after the bolds are my answers, not really quotes... anyway I guess that's obvious... duh.

Posted

My instinct is to give this a break. During this period, examine your emotional detachment. Do not initiate contact. If he contacts you, take his phone calls only and calmly explain your perspective (that you feel detached and wish to have some time alone to deal with it). If he is persistent, repeat yourself one time. After that, if he doesn't accept your position, hang up on him and accept no further contact.

 

What I'm looking for here is evidence that he senses and understands what his actions and words are doing to you and is interested in modifying his behavior to make the relationship healthier. Your responsibility is to communicate your perspective to him in clear and simple language. No ambiguity. The harsh truth, as hard as it might be. Men understand simple truths. Imagine being so annoyingly honest that someone you don't have mutual caring with would leave the room. I say this because we often have differing levels of feeling about communication style and what you think is yelling (not literally) he hears as a whisper.

 

Be clear and let him then digest the sound of silence.

 

Consider other advice, but, now that I've had MC, if I were in this situation and not married, that's what I would do. Being married, we opted for MC.

 

Keep us posted :)

Posted

Okay, I'm going to come at this from a different angle. I see a two way street here. An intricate dance, if you will where there are two people involved who are at times emotionally reactive to the actions of the other.

 

He does something and then you respond (perhaps more subtly) and then he does something in response to that, etc, etc, etc. He is playing games with you, but you are part of the game as well. I will bold what I see as perhaps some emotional reactivity and less than obvious game playing on your part. You may disagree and that's okay. I am just offering up some observances is all.

 

Keep and toss what you see fit. :)

 

 

 

 

Ok here's my story: I've been with this guy for almost 2 years, exclusive after about 6 months. The past couple weeks we've been having some problems due to not being able to see each other much. First I was upset around V-day because he behaved in a way that brought up old issues, so that took a few days to work out. During that time I didn't want to see him and told him I needed time to stop feeling angry and think.He constantly called and texted, asking what he could do to work things thru, etc. Eventually I calmed down, we talked and had a wonderful few days together.

 

But then some family members unexpectedly came into town, at the same time I had car problems. So this all interfered with our being able to get together much for 4 or 5 days, and he was really disappointed. Then they left and we were fine again... until we started talking about LOVE.

 

We've said it to each other, and all that, it was a general conversation but all of a sudden he said he wasn't sure if he loved me (WTF?), I got emotional so I asked him to leave before things were said that shouldn't be. That was the night before he left for a long weekend camping. I tried calling him a few times (after you asked him to leave???) , but he wouldn't take my calls. He finally called from the road and told me he thinks he loves me but he's not sure, mixed up with all this stuff about how great we are together, but then throwing in more wishy-washy stuff about his feelings.

 

On his way back from his trip he texted me a couple times and I didn't respond because it was late and I thought he might want to come over just to smooth things over and not deal with them, as he tends to do. The next day we text a bit, then he turns off his phone until about midnight, answers one text saying something about "tit-for tat, see how you like being ignored."

 

Then the next day we were both more calm, texting all day, he was getting a little flirty while I kept keeping it more serious. Then he says he realized last night (while his phone was off) that he really does love me and looks up to me, although we've had some ups and downs lately. From then on it's been all mixed signals -- he wanted to come over to talk about his career (he's soon to be laid off), when I said I can't and don't want to be just friends he started getting flirty and sexual. Talked about why he loved me. When I responded in kind he said he just wants to be friends, talked about how "we've disappointed each other"... back and forth, confusing me to death. He asked if I'd kick him out again if he came over.

 

So finally our last convo was about him being too tired to talk or come over that night. I told him that's too bad, I miss him, want to see him etc. He agreed he missed me and we said goodnight. Half hour later he sends an inside joke text, I assume to make sure I'm not mad and to alleviate guilt, so I responded light-heartedly. That's it.

 

What is up with all this?

 

I'm sure this is all unclear to read and reflects my confusion. I appreciate any and all responses, questions, etc. Thanks!

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