Jaytb Posted March 6, 2009 Posted March 6, 2009 Seriously, I think the human race in general is pretty ugly. Go to a zoo and look at the wildcats, pandas, heck even look at the chipmunks and squirrels in the forest, and even the prettiest people look sort of awkward and graceless in comparison. At least that's the way I see it. Hey! I don't think humans are that bad looking! And to the OP, no one's perfect. Even attractive people have plenty of trouble with relationships. So don't dwell on it because it won't help one bit.
Mahatma Posted March 6, 2009 Posted March 6, 2009 Actually average is an imprecise term usually taken as "mathematical mean"; this definition does not in and of itself indicate that the average falls anywhere near any of the actual sample data. For instance consider the following data set: 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 100, 100, 100, 100, 100 The mean is 50, however no value in the set is very near 50 in value. My comment was meant to point out that although 'attractiveness' varies among individuals the statistical variation seems to approximate a Gaussian distribution, although I'm unaware of any actual study confirming this result. But I still think my original assessment was accurate and much more concise. I can not believe you decided to fight my comment. Ok, fine haha. In your explanation you gave an example as if half of the people are amazingly attractive (100) and the other half just got screwed by god (0). In your mathematical game, yes you are right, average doesn't necessarily mean the "mode." However, in the MAJORITY of cases, the mean, median, and mode are all VERY close. Especially when we take 6.75 billion people and mesh them all together. Or if you just want to take 300 million population of America. Either way, I would bet my life that the majority of the people in America would have your label of "average." I am sorry if my post offended you and you felt you had to come back and defend yourself... it was mostly a joke. If you really believe that you made a useful comment I feel bad.
nicki Posted March 6, 2009 Posted March 6, 2009 There is a lid for every pot! It's true. You must believe that there is someone out there for you....and he probably feels exactly like you do about women. Studies have shown that people usually end up with people who are on about the same scale of attractiveness. (Unless there is a whole lot of money involved, or another factor like an amazingly kind or funny personality) So, widen your own perspective to include more men, of all looks and circumstances, as long as they have good character and values and you find something about them attractive. Ask your female friends what your best asset is, and play it up big time. If you have nice legs, show them off and don't worry about any other part of your body. Men are visual, but it's simply the hook that gets them in. And it usually only takes one thing about you that is unique and beautiful. And you already have it, but maybe you don't know it. Eyes? hair? Update the way you dress, and dress for your figure type. As another poster said, keep your weight in a normal range, and it's fine to be a bit fuller figured. It's when it goes off the scale into obese that it becomes a problem. Get involved and interested in something. That is the BEST way to meet someone who enjoys what you enjoy. I've met many men in my yoga classes. Stay away from the bar scene. It's no fun to feel like a contestant on The Bachelor or The Bachelorette! People there do seem to focus soley on looks and who wants to be judged desirable for that one thing only? Your post shows you to be intelligent and kind. Men love that. You can add the hotness factor that you need by figuring out what YOU enjoy to feel sexy. We women are all sensual creatures. Feel that when you walk around and see what kind of reaction you get from men!
nicki Posted March 6, 2009 Posted March 6, 2009 I reread your post. You ARE female, so you can be feminine. Get in touch with that. Something like yoga can make you feel your body. So do a lot of other things like walking, taking a long bath, getting a massage. Anyting that makes you feel gooood. You deserve that. You don't have to fit some silly "perfect" standard to in order to deserve it....you deserve it right now. I've seen a lot of women in my yoga classes who aren't yet at home in their bodies. Honestly, when you are, you will feel uninhibited and men really respond to that in a woman. So, wear silky soft clothing because it simply feels sexy. Go out and buy yourself some sexy, naughty lingerie that YOU like. Wear it every day. It makes a big difference in how you carry yourself. And you are wearing it for YOURSELF to make YOURSELF feel good. And that feeling is contagious. I have several friends who simply appear attractive because they have a nice hairstyle, good clothes, wear perfume and make up. They are the basics. Add a feeling of enjoying your body, and you will turn up the dial on attractiveness.
clv0116 Posted March 6, 2009 Posted March 6, 2009 I am sorry if my post offended you and you felt you had to come back and defend yourself... it was mostly a joke. If you really believe that you made a useful comment I feel bad. I wasn't offended I just didn't understand why it would be funny. I thought maybe you didn't understand that if someone like the OP was so concerned about being ugly that they might not be aware that in reality they are probably not ugly anyway. I was not originally intending a discourse on statistics, I was merely trying to point out that what the OP likely has is a bad self image and lack of confidence.
Isolde Posted March 6, 2009 Posted March 6, 2009 Hey! I don't think humans are that bad looking! And to the OP, no one's perfect. Even attractive people have plenty of trouble with relationships. So don't dwell on it because it won't help one bit. Maybe I'm just weird, but I think ALL humans are "gross" in comparison to other animals. I can't explain it, LOL.
julkat Posted March 7, 2009 Posted March 7, 2009 The man I'm dating is not what one would typically call attractive. He has only a few good teeth, some wart-type things on his face, etc. I was friends with him for years before I started to really see him. I think he's beautiful in so many ways. And I never see his "defects" anymore. He's wonderful and any woman would be lucky to have him. You will find someone. Concentrate on having a rich life full of your passions and interests. Everyone likes happy!
clv0116 Posted March 8, 2009 Posted March 8, 2009 The man I'm dating is not what one would typically call attractive. He has only a few good teeth, some wart-type things on his face, etc. I was friends with him for years before I started to really see him. I think he's beautiful in so many ways. And I never see his "defects" anymore. He's wonderful and any woman would be lucky to have him. Just out of curiosity, how would you rate your own physical attractiveness?
stepka Posted March 8, 2009 Posted March 8, 2009 A few things occurred to me from the OP's original post: 1. If you truly are unattractive, which I'm not sure I believe, your youth works against you, at least for men your age--they tend to be more motivated by looks than older men ( I think) 2. I've noticed that very beautiful women seem to have more trouble in their relationships and get dumped more than average looking women--at least that's the way it seems to me. 3. If you're unattractive, you will probably eventually find someone but it will take longer 4. You may be perfectly normal looking but not know how to flirt--you've got to learn to tune your radar and send out a few signals yourself. Unfortunately this is one of those skills that comes naturally, so I don't know how to tell you how to do it. I know a few people who seem to be clueless about this and I've never been able to explain it to them, but a lacking of flirting expertise could certainly slow things down and make you think you're unattractive--most men look for the "go-ahead" before they ask a woman out. Your best bet may be to have some friends set you up.
JerseyShortie Posted March 9, 2009 Posted March 9, 2009 I reread your post. You ARE female, so you can be feminine. Get in touch with that. Something like yoga can make you feel your body. So do a lot of other things like walking, taking a long bath, getting a massage. Anyting that makes you feel gooood. You deserve that. You don't have to fit some silly "perfect" standard to in order to deserve it....you deserve it right now. I've seen a lot of women in my yoga classes who aren't yet at home in their bodies. Honestly, when you are, you will feel uninhibited and men really respond to that in a woman. I think this is beautiful and good advice. Niki is so right, you are female, so you can be feminine. You need to figure out what things make you feel good, pretty, or like a woman. And do them.
hobnobnhobgoblin Posted March 10, 2009 Posted March 10, 2009 Traditional Hollywood beauty is like McDonald's french fries in that, statistically they are America's favorite, but if a person were pressed as to which, out of all the fries they'd had was really their favorite, they'd say some other one. For me it's Checkers (mmmm grease). Men prefer women with character, women who will remain novel and enjoyable as their time continues, which can be a long time. I'm not just talking about personality and charm, which are major bonuses, but also physical quirks. That model with the mole (Claudia Schiffer?) is more noticeable because of the mole. Wabi-sabi is a concept in Japanese aesthetic philosophy which declares that beauty is made more beautiful when it is imperfect, impermanent, or incomplete because these create melancholy and spiritual longing in the observer. That's probably the closest classic theory to this idea, but it's really more about sparking interest than it's about guiding the soul. Another way of looking at it is genetics, where people are driven to refresh the gene pool by seeking out partners who are different from themselves, from what they might consider normal. “Your quirks make you ordinary, with the little extra,” says the fortune cookie (in bed). A good understanding of line, color, basic eye movement, will help you dress yourself to accentuate your good qualities, as well as your interesting ones. Don't just strap on a thong and call it a day like the common model does. Thongs, microskirts, baby-tees, these are all bad style, clinging to, revealing, and even emphasizing every gaudy imperfection, the inevitable fallback of their purpose which is to reveal and emphasize as much as possible. In the opposite direction are sequins, which cover the body and are gaudy as well, but in themselves, blinding the man from seeing the woman's true beauty. The only person who can wear sequins is Dianna Ross because she is so incredibly glamorous (and beautiful) she could slaughter a pound full of puppies, strap their pelts together with bungy cord, and still be more marvelous than any of girls today. Which is another thing to consider. When a man sees a woman, he doesn't see her as a still picture, usually, unless he has retinal damage, but sees her in motion, as she interacts with other people. Smooth, fluid, elegant movements, good posture, etc. all imply a woman who is on top of her game enough to also master minutia. This is a generalization, but men want to be kings and their women to be queens. It makes you look like a person who would be a good financial partner, a good mother, and a good negotiator when he's too angry or sad to take point. Yep, subtle things like that say a lot. But this is all too general. Let's talk specifics. The most basic no-go is being overweight, but obesity is pandemic in America and you probably have it. There's also being too skinny, too muscular, too flat chested, and so on, all of which each man has a personal preference to. Find a man who you know leans towards what you are and you've already won half the battle. The rest is dressing in clothes that complement your shape and tone. Skinny girls look better with a vertical emphasis, long, flowing clothes; large girls look better in relaxed, somewhat baggy clothes; body building girls are more likely to wear form fitting clothes because they know how their body looks and actually set out to make it look that way; flat chested girls could either dress in mock-maculine clothes or in vertical clothes like skinny girls. This is all hearsay, I'm not a stylist, I'm not even gay, but there are people out there who understand how to make different shapes look good, find them, hear what they have to say. Then there's things like bug eyes, buck teeth, baldness, mustachios, and so on. With bug eyes you could smile a lot, which brings attention to your mouth and makes you squint at the same time. Guys like looking at girls mouths... But if your bug eyed and you have buck teeth, then you're in trouble. Actually, you should probably go to a dentist because it can't be healthy leaving your teeth like that. Being bald isn't bad; with a smooth round head and a long neck it looks gorgeous. If you feel too self conscious, there are some nice wigs out there, too. If you have a mustache, then either shave it or wax it really long and wear a monocle. Mostly the guys who like girls with mustaches are twisted beyond simple preferences into the real of compounding fetishes, and that's not a person you want to be with. Just shave. Men have to do it, it's not that bad. There's such a big difference in bone structure there's nothing that can be said about it. The one thing that's almost never naturally embraced is a masculine face, in which case you'd be better off looking for a bisexual boyfriend. If you are too self-concious and cannot seem to embrace the true beauty of the way you look, then consider how much of your doubt drives you toward commercial products and recognize that you are being bombarded with McDonald's french fries. There's one more thing, which has nothing to do with appearance but may even win a man who is not naturally inclined towards your physique. That is intellectual inclination. If you know what a guy is into, and you sideswipe him with a witty joke that shows (1) you are well informed about his interest, (2) you are intelligent, (3) you are funny, he would be blown away. It's important that you know what you want to teach yourself, because if you're faking interest, he'll realize relatively quickly and lose interest in you. Or, if he doesn't lose interest, you'll feel miserable pursing an education you have no interest in and drop out of the relationship like a drunken frat boy out of college. But, give his interest a chance before you decide; you might like it. Now, I'm not talking about a minor interest. It has to be that which dominates his free time. Every guy has some fanaticism, a specific genre of music, a sports team, a car, certain movies, comics, even his family. It can be complicated or simple. Remember, blonde bombshells are the social default, not the NATURAL default. In the end, given the opportunity and encouragement to be embraced, nature will win. Always.
LovieDove24 Posted March 10, 2009 Posted March 10, 2009 I'm surprised that I am the only one who is going to agree with CLV0116. Yes, there IS such a thing as universal attractiveness, how can anyone deny that? It has everything to do with facial proportions and yes, it has its roots in biology. The healthier the skin, hair and other features LOOK the quicker we humans can asses if they are a healthy mate. There have been studies done with six month old babies where they were given two pictures to look at: one with an attractive model and another with a "less" attractive person. Without any interference, the babies chose to stare at the "attractive" woman for longer periods of time than the "unattractive." We can sit and argue "subjectiveness" all we want, but when it boils right down to it, there are some general "rules" to be followed.
crosswordfiend Posted March 10, 2009 Posted March 10, 2009 The definition of attractiveness varies widely between cultures or eras (with some constants like symmetry, health, etc.), but it doesn't seem to vary nearly as much within cultures. Why? Because I strongly believe that people, particularly men, are hardwired to imprint on what people around them find attractive. Sexual selection. Like the peacock's tail a trait considered attractive can be fairly arbitrary, serving no functional value, but once that trait becomes desirable in a culture it benefits an individual to find a mate who has it or his offspring will be hard up for dates. It is better to learn preferences than to be born with them, because then your standards can adjust according to the climate of the times. In a period of poverty and starvation, for example, the chubby people will actually be healthier. Functionality tips the scales in one direction and sexual selection does the rest. I'm surprised by how rarely this theory is applied to people. Men insist that they all have their own physical preferences, and this is true to a point. But they don't realize or acknowledge what lemmings they can also be. With globalization the Western, Hollywood ideal of beauty is becoming the golden standard that defines individual desire and preferences. One study a few years ago found that men adjust their standards according to the sample of women they see. The more beautiful women they view on a daily basis, the higher their standards. But their viewing sample surprisingly extends to women they see in movies or magazines, even if those women are unavailable to them in real life. In general I agree with this, however I will add that this imprinting happens during early childhood (6-12 years). I grew up in Toronto in the 80s and many of my schoolmates were immigrants. What ended up happening was that the older siblings married someone from the old country (in appearance only, not necessarily culturally), and the younger siblings married anglo-saxon types who were the majority in our neighbourhood at the time. Toronto has changed now and is much more diverse and I would say that many of the people that I know who grew up in the large Chinese communities in the 90s to give an example, are dating and socializing almost exclusive within the ethnic group. So yes I believe it's environmental, but I think that Hollywood and mass media have less influence than you think. Rather, it's more about the type of people you interacted with on a regular basis as a child - much more local.
crosswordfiend Posted March 10, 2009 Posted March 10, 2009 As a follow-up, I'd like to invite everyone who throws numbers around like 8, 9 and 10 etc... to think about what they mean? Think back on all the people that you've rated a 10 over the years - I bet they didn't all look the same. They probably varied based on height, body shape, skin tone and facial structure to name some of the more obvious characteristics. What I'm trying to say is that sexual preference can't be distilled down to a single number. It's multi-dimensional. For the social science nerds out there, think factor analysis with an overall domain for attractiveness. Now the next question is, would you be willing to date everyone that you've rated as singularly attractive? I know I wouldn't. Even though I can appreciate overall attractiveness, I still have strong preferences on all those superficial traits such as body shape and facial structure - not that there is anything wrong with it. Physical attraction is a combination of many factors. The received wisdom is that men are pickier than women. But in reality what I think happens is that men place more emphasis on overall attractiveness and are more forgiving of different types of looks, whereas women place more emphasis on a specific feature set and are more forgiving on overall attractiveness. Confused yet?
SincereOnlineGuy Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 Hi all, I'm in my early 20's and I haven't really had anyone interested in me romantically. To be honest, I don't have a pretty face and my body is not very feminine. I do try to have a warm, friendly personality and I have lots of female friends because of this. I just don't have any men that want to date me! They rather go for my typically attractive, quiet friends. Please do not suggest plastic surgery because I don't believe in it. Is there anything I can improve on that is possible to do? Thanks so much for your help! The seeming urgency in your words is what will eventually defeat you. If you give it time, you will probably encounter a guy or two down the road who will be so well-matched with you (for common interests, most probably) that the draw to one another you'll both feel will be just like (what you sense the beauties to be feeling now). It would be a good move to keep schooling yourself on the topic of meeting lots of people with a schedule that keeps you active in places where lots of other humans congregate. This does NOT have to be a place immediately crawling with single males in your age range, for it will very likely be the friend of a friend, or the like with whom you'll one day share mutual attraction.
The Blue Pill Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 I'm hoping that the OP will come back and at least reply, maybe even post a pic for curiosity's sake.
LeroyJose Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 Hey, you can improve a few things like the way you dress and the way you interact with others. This will help you a lot. Also, remember that everyone is unique so let that unique personality of you shine! Emphasize those things that are beautiful and improve those that are not (i'm not referring to surgery) what I'm trying to say is that if your hair is not that good, then go to a parlor and get it done. Remember that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
dwightl Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 It all starts within you. Be confident. Ask suggestions from you girl friends. I'm sure there's a lot that'll you'll learn from them. Also, don't pay attention to what the others will say! It's you and that's you. We all are unique. Remember, fashion and music that are different from the current trend are being laughed at and those who are wearing those look like weirdos but eventually, when more people tried it, it becomes the new trend. Never be afraid to go out there. Be confident.
Yamaha Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 Just because someone doesn't ogle you to death doesn't mean you're not attractive. You think of yourself this way so don't blame other people for something coming from your brain. I'm sure they don't see you walking down the street and say "my, what an unattractive person that is". Attraction can be in many forms and you need to think of yourself as desirable and sexy so you can show the person you find attractive that they are just as desirable. Attraction creates attraction. Say this many times until you believe it and then go out there and show someone some attraction.
Scottdmw Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 You might have more luck with older guys. For example, I'm 36 and usually date fairly attractive women. But last year I had a brief relationship with a woman in her early 20's. She would probably have been called unattractive by people her own age, but was so much younger than me that it outweighed that and I still found her attractive. It helped we had a lot of interests in common. Didn't end up working out, but you get the idea. Scott
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