explain how I can learn to accept porn and checking out other women

[Jersey Shortie]

I completely understand why the OP feels the way she does. Look, we all know men like other women even though they have a partner. He isn't going to stop being attracted to other women. But don't expect your woman to feel good about this or have it be easy for her. It's not easy. It's really hard to know the man you love alot still thinks about and lusts over other women. Sometimes even taking the time to seek out other women to lust over like visiting strip clubs or viewing porn. It's not easy for us stop deamanding that we except it with smiles on our faces. Sometimes it really hurts.

 

There are so many guys here trying to have women understand them that I wish they would stop to also understand the difficult spot women are in too. Men don't want their partners to stop expecting them to have attraction for other women and men shouldn't expect this to be easy for their partners when they give so much of themselves to their men. Our feelings on this are no less important or silly then a man's.

 

We love our men so deeply and we feel like we give so much when we do love him and it feels like it's all a waste. Like everything we try to do for him to please him and make him happy doesn't matter because he still will want other women. So why do we even try? When the reward is that he still will be thinking about other women?

 

It doesn't feel good to know that you put so much into your relationship with a man because you care for him. But at the end of the day your loyalty, honesty, caring and all the things you do trying your best to please your partner in and out of bed is just a failure because he still needs to see other women having sex, or lust after other women he passes on the street. Or have fantasies of 20 year old girls. No one person can meet all your needs. But it's like men always want to remind women how much they can't do to please them. Having fantasies of 20 year old girls in a threesome, looking at the million of options of girls in porn...when is enough enough? When do men feel greatful and happy for the things a partner offers? Men are visual but does that mean it's okay for them to act in certain ways?

 

I just personally wish more men felt happy, content and grateful for what they did have and for what their parterns do do for them rather that needing things that our so outside what anyone woman can provide. Prehaps that's just the way men want it because it gives men more control? Perhaps men do not think women's own female needs are as important as their own? Sometimes it seems that way. It makes a woman wonder why she tries or makes a woman just give up after a little while. Why keep giving and giving if he can't be grateful and pleased for what he has?

 

Can men really not understand why him wishing to be with two 20 year olds, and wishing to talk about that fantasy while you are trying to be intimate with him, is hurtful? Of course it's going to sting and cause insecurity. It can very easily and naturally make a women feel not good enough. Why shouldn't it? He is wishing to be with two 20 year olds when your just one 40 year old woman. Why do men bother having relationships at all if that's what they want? Why do you have relationships with us and then tell us you need variety and you need 20 year olds and you need porn? Do men not care what women need? If you want those things, that's fine. But why do you have to hurt the one woman that loves you for it?

 

We women love deeply and give so much of ourselves to our men. We know we get older. And it hurts that our man wants to replace us for 20 year old girls. It's like we don't matter or we aren't important and it doesn't matter what we give to him. It's like we aren't woman enough for him anymore. Is there a man here that wants to feel like he isn't man enough for his woman? You want 20 year olds over your own partner, your a man right, that's okay right? because it just matters what you as a man needs. WOmen's needs aren't as important. We shouldn't want to feel special or important to our partner. As women, I feel like the message is that nothing we do is good enough. We loose as women. At least, that's often seems to be the advice men give. How much more important men's needs are. Men need this and that to be happy and it doesn't really matter what the woman is thinking.She is silly or "insecure" to feel the way she does. Her feelings are "wrong". It's not fair and it's not about really being equal or giving women a fair chance. It doesn't seem like we get a fair chance from men.

 

Its just so frustating to want to give so much to your partner and ry hard to have fun with him and please him in bed and out of it and him still needing the stimulation of what other 20 year olds will provide him with. I don't think men are ever thankful for the women they have that love them. Or really understand the struggles we go through on these issues.

 

I also agree with the OP that men's actions and words don't always match up. They say they love their partners and are happy yet they still seek out more stimultion and *need* it on some level. I don't think men willl ever be happy with the things a normal real woman can provide him compared to the fantasy world he can have at his finger tips. Women are replacable and a normal everyday girl is just never enough. I will never understand why men get into relationships because we don't really seem all that important to men to begin with.

[sxyNYCcpl]

I figured it wouldn't be too long until we heard from you on this. You are so bitter, I don't know what happened to you, but someone clearly did a number on you. I do hope you find happiness, but fear your unrealistic expectations have only created a situation where nobody is capable of pleasing you.

 

To wit:

 

Look, we all know men like other women even though they have a partner. He isn't going to stop being attracted to other women.

 

So you acknowledge that it a normal part of the human conditions. But then you go on to say:

 

 

But don't expect your woman to feel good about this or have it be easy for her. It's not easy. It's really hard to know the man you love alot still thinks about and lusts over other women.

 

So if you acknowledge it's perfectly normal and common, why would you then react negatively to it? It's not like you are going to find someone who doesn't do it. FWIW, I don't think attraction, fantasization, and yes, even lust is in any way limited to men. Between sexual repression and denial, some women believe they are not subject to it but that simply isn't true.

 

 

Can men really not understand why him wishing to be with two 20 year olds, and wishing to talk about that fantasy while you are trying to be intimate with him, is hurtful?

 

Everyone has fantasies. Everyone. Me, you, your SO, my wife. A relationship that is open an honest includes acknowledging that and not being afraid or threatened by it. As I said before, dening something exists doesn't make it so.

[Chat]

I figured it wouldn't be too long until we heard from you on this. You are so bitter, I don't know what happened to you, but someone clearly did a number on you. I do hope you find happiness, but fear your unrealistic expectations have only created a situation where nobody is capable of pleasing you.

 

To wit:

 

 

 

So you acknowledge that it a normal part of the human conditions. But then you go on to say:

 

 

 

 

So if you acknowledge it's perfectly normal and common, why would you then react negatively to it? It's not like you are going to find someone who doesn't do it. FWIW, I don't think attraction, fantasization, and yes, even lust is in any way limited to men. Between sexual repression and denial, some women believe they are not subject to it but that simply isn't true.

 

She acknowledged that it was something men did - she never commented on it being normal nor common - and just because something is human conditioning doesnt make it right either...whats good for one may not be for another....and there are social standards, otherwise we would all still be getting our freak on as soon as a girl got her period.

 

 

Everyone has fantasies. Everyone. Me, you, your SO, my wife. A relationship that is open an honest includes acknowledging that and not being afraid or threatened by it. As I said before, dening something exists doesn't make it so.

 

I dont think the porn/fantasy is an issue,to be frank - my man wouldnt be in my house if he chose such a time to bring up his fantasies. Being open and honest about what we want in sex is a MUST but timing and sensitivity are essential.

 

I think when women forbid the watching of porn it actually makes it more appealing because it's more taboo then. I don't understand where women get off telling their partners what they can and cannot watch though...can you imagine if he said we couldnt watch our favourite soap because of all the emotional needs being fulfilled being played out on screen??? I think impacts of actions need to be addressed, ie - if he watches that in place of sex with you - then you have an issue. If he lies about it, you have an issue.

 

As for the comments about why can't men just go get what they want instead of fantasizing about other women, well its simple really. Men will always fantasize about the other side of the fence, in fact we all do. If your fat, he will think about thin women, if your a brunette he will think about blondes, if your small breasted he will think about big breasts etc etc etc....it would be nice for our men to be so into us that he sees no other - but fact is that is OUR ego's and insecurity talking. And I think the insecurity is not just about our appearance, but also about our innate knowledge of what we are capable of. And if we are capable of it - then any woman is.

 

OP - verbally kick your partner in the head, he is being insensitive with his timing and execution of his fantasies. Sit down one night with a bottle of red and have a friendly discussion about how this makes you feel and discuss the fantasies with him - set boundaries as to how and when you would prefer to hear such things. And if you dont want to hear them - express that too.

[Chamari]

Just wanted to offer my opinion. Unless you actually have a desire to learn to accept your man checking out other women and porn I don't think you should. If you're okay with it, fine, if you're not you shouldn't have to deal with it. Porn is not something that every man indulges in. If you don't want to deal with it then you shouldn't have to. If you don't like smoke, you probably shouldn't get involved with a smoker. If you don't like porn you might need to find another guy who isn't as involved in it.

 

If he loves you and is aware that porn is actively causing you pain/serious insecurities, I would think that at the very least he should back off a bit or possibly even drop it. Porn is not a necessity of life and I think that a man that truly loved you would be willing to give it up to make you happy. But hey, that's my opinion. I just don't think that it's right for a partner in a relationship to continue with an activity that causes a lot of insecurity/anxiety for their partner.

 

Checking out other women is a little more vague--a man is going to notice an attractive woman, just like you would probably notice an attractive guy. I don't think that that should be a big deal. Now if he's actually lusting after her then that seems like serious disrespect to you and is something that needs to be dealt with.

[Mr. Lucky]

I Men need this and that to be happy and it doesn't really matter what the woman is thinking.She is silly or "insecure" to feel the way she does. Her feelings are "wrong". It's not fair and it's not about really being equal or giving women a fair chance. It doesn't seem like we get a fair chance from men.

It's a losing battle to try and assign labels like "right" and "wrong" when men and women are simply different. You can want us to be like you, think like you and want the same things you do - not going to happen. Estrogen and testosterone are two differnt hormones and their effect is profound. You can't fight Mother Nature, so why not just learn to celebrate the wonderful things that differences between the two sexes provide?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Jersey Shortie]

I agree completely. Keeping secrets is the beginning of the end for a relationship. One of the major compatibility factors I look at is whether I can tell her EVERYTHING I've done in life without fearing she will judge me harshly. If I can't we probably have no future together

 

Aren't you judging her harshly in turn for her own feelings about personal matters?

 

 

I figured it wouldn't be too long until we heard from you on this. You are so bitter, I don't know what happened to you, but someone clearly did a number on you. I do hope you find happiness, but fear your unrealistic expectations have only created a situation where nobody is capable of pleasing you.

 

Your here too so I don't really understand your first comment. I think it's funny you say this because you come off bitter yourself. I also personally think men's unrealistic expecations have created situations for women that make men incapable of being happy and grateful for what they do have.

 

 

 

So if you acknowledge it's perfectly normal and common, why would you then react negatively to it? It's not like you are going to find someone who doesn't do it.

I love how you ignored the feelings that it can cause in a female partner and continued to only want to acknowledge men's feelings.

While I understand it is normal, I do not think that gives a man or woman permission to stop considering the needs and promises they make by commiting to a relationship. If you want to lust after other women and go with every little thought you have, do so. But why get into a relatioship and continue to behave as if only your desires and needs are of value? I love when men flatter me with attention. When I am in a relationship, i do not seek this attention out of respect for my partner. Just because something is natural, doesn't mean you should not use self control. When you make the choice to be in a relationship, you can't behave like you are still single and only your feelings matter.

Everyone has fantasies. Everyone. Me, you, your SO, my wife. A relationship that is open an honest includes acknowledging that and not being afraid or threatened by it. As I said before, dening something exists doesn't make it so.

Again, you do not want to seriously consider how women can feel on this issue. You are more concerned with what men want and need and seem to have very little consideration for their female partners. Hopefully one day, for the sake of any partners you do have, you learn that her needs and desires also matter within a relationship. Sometimes those needs extend outside the bedroom but are no less important or silly then yours.

If men are so interested in other women that aren't theirs, why do men bother having relationships to begin with? Men don't seem to be happy with what they have anyway. perhaps it is men's own insecurity with themselves that makes them feel like they need continued sexual validation through pornn that is the real issue.

[Jersey Shortie]

It's a losing battle to try and assign labels like "right" and "wrong" when men and women are simply different. You can want us to be like you, think like you and want the same things you do - not going to happen. Estrogen and testosterone are two differnt hormones and their effect is profound. You can't fight Mother Nature, so why not just learn to celebrate the wonderful things that differences between the two sexes provide?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

 

Which differences would you like women to celebrate? The ones where no matter what you do for your partner he will always want what you are not? Or the one that tells us men need variety, along with you. Or perghaps the one that tells us that men want 18-25 year olds even of they have an aging mate of their own. Which differences do you want women to celebrate? Which parts are the most wonderful?

 

Why do men bother with relationships at all since when you men make the choice to be in one all you want to do is remind us about how little we matter and how much you need other women to be happy?

 

feel free to answer Mr. Lucky, or skirt around the tough questions I ask like you normally do.

 

Oh and i hate to tell you but men don't exactly accept women for who they are or celebrate us as we really are.

[headlesschicken]

how to accept it:

 

realize it has NOTHING to do with you.

 

the end.

[clv0116]

Why do men bother with relationships at all since when you men make the choice to be in one all you want to do is remind us about how little we matter and how much you need other women to be happy?

 

I think that whole 'spread our seed' argument is broken, and recent research actually shows that humans, male and female, have structures in our brains that are specifically involved in pair bonding and the 'love goggles' phenomenon. Three distinct mechanisms have been shown that produce 'pleasure' neurotransmitters when presented with the pair bound mate over different time spans.

 

 

We're not just monkeys.

[sxyNYCcpl]

I also personally think men's unrealistic expecations have created situations for women that make men incapable of being happy and grateful for what they do have.

 

We're talking about objecting to fantasies. Which everyone has, male and female, whether or not they admit it, even to themselves. Having fantasies does not imply that someone is not happy or grateful. Objecting to your partner fantasizing is akin to objecting because he gets erections in his sleep. It's a standard, normal part of being human, and it says absolutely nothing about the state of the relationship, nor the respect garnered in either direction.

 

While I understand it is normal, I do not think that gives a man or woman permission to stop considering the needs and promises they make by commiting to a relationship.

Well, duh. Who has intimated otherwise?

 

If men are so interested in other women that aren't theirs, why do men bother having relationships to begin with? Men don't seem to be happy with what they have anyway. perhaps it is men's own insecurity with themselves that makes them feel like they need continued sexual validation through pornn that is the real issue.

 

You are assuming facts that are not in evidence.

[Jersey Shortie]

how to accept it:

 

realize it has NOTHING to do with you.

 

the end.

 

Real message = men want it both ways. accept it. don't expect self control. His needs are more important than yours. the end.

 

I think that whole 'spread our seed' argument is broken, and recent research actually shows that humans, male and female, have structures in our brains that are specifically involved in pair bonding and the 'love goggles' phenomenon. Three distinct mechanisms have been shown that produce 'pleasure' neurotransmitters when presented with the pair bound mate over different time spans.

 

I have made this arguement many times. The problem is that men seem to want it both ways.

 

We're talking about objecting to fantasies. Which everyone has, male and female, whether or not they admit it, even to themselves. Having fantasies does not imply that someone is not happy or grateful. Objecting to your partner fantasizing is akin to objecting because he gets erections in his sleep. It's a standard, normal part of being human, and it says absolutely nothing about the state of the relationship, nor the respect garnered in either direction.

 

I agree to a certain level but too often it gets justified and abused and over used. Men take it too far and often abuse it and have too many expectations and don't ever seem to want to use self control. It's like it's justification enough to be a man and your sexual needs are more important than what your partner could need. No compromises are made. He gets you. He gets his porn. And no matter what you do he isn't happy or statisfied with what you offer. Why keep trying with someone that isn't happy with what he gets and has to keep looking out for more titillating ways to excite himself? I think this is probably why women stop trying. Men aren't appreciative of what they get and always want *more*. Never being happy with just what they are offered out of love. Always expecting women to make the consessions and compromises and be undestanding of their needs but not vice versa.

[Mr. Lucky]

feel free to answer Mr. Lucky, or skirt around the tough questions I ask like you normally do.

Because there isn't any answer that doesn't invite the same formulaic response from you. I'll say (as headlesschicken did) that a man's fantasies may have nothing to do with you and you'll be off. Sorry, but I've heard it before.

 

You obviously feel strongly about these things. Why not just limit your relationships to men that feel the same way you do?

 

Mr. Lucky

[headlesschicken]

real message: try the serenity prayer.

 

why get all worked up over something that you can't control? that isn't yours to get worked up over?

[Trialbyfire]

Just wanted to offer my opinion. Unless you actually have a desire to learn to accept your man checking out other women and porn I don't think you should. If you're okay with it, fine, if you're not you shouldn't have to deal with it. Porn is not something that every man indulges in. If you don't want to deal with it then you shouldn't have to. If you don't like smoke, you probably shouldn't get involved with a smoker. If you don't like porn you might need to find another guy who isn't as involved in it.

I completely agree with this. If he's not what you want, find someone who can meet your needs.

 

If he loves you and is aware that porn is actively causing you pain/serious insecurities, I would think that at the very least he should back off a bit or possibly even drop it. Porn is not a necessity of life and I think that a man that truly loved you would be willing to give it up to make you happy. But hey, that's my opinion. I just don't think that it's right for a partner in a relationship to continue with an activity that causes a lot of insecurity/anxiety for their partner.

The bolded words give me some difficulty. People don't necessarily do things because they don't love you. They do things for themselves.

 

If what they do, causes you grief, to the point where you can't stand it, then it's more than likely they don't hold to the standards you do, or the beliefs that you do, so it's best to find someone who shares commonality with you.

 

Checking out other women is a little more vague--a man is going to notice an attractive woman, just like you would probably notice an attractive guy. I don't think that that should be a big deal. Now if he's actually lusting after her then that seems like serious disrespect to you and is something that needs to be dealt with.

Agreed. If someone is exceeding the boundaries of good taste within the relationship and is unable to cleave to one person, perhaps monogamy isn't within their values, thus once again, incompatible.

[Lovelybird]

you didn't read that thread yet? a woman compromised with her husband when she was very young, they together watched porn, later when she gain some ages, her husband lust after teenagers, even said cruel words to make her feel bad, she had divorce with deep bitterness.

 

Lust is a monster, the more you feed it, the bigger it gets. before long he will treat you not as lover, but as prostitute in porn.

WILL YOU SUPPORT HIM VIEW WOMEN AS SUCH???

 

there is no easy way, either you fight with it, or you deteriorate your values and gain nothing but bitterness

[taylor]

Why don't you just start sharing your own sexual fantasies with him..very openly and explicitly.

 

Tell him how you would love to dance naked in front of his best friend and then have oral sex with him...just a fantasy of course.

 

Tell him how you saw two men talking to each other the other day and how you fantasized about doing them both at the same time...just a fantasy of course.

 

Tell him how your fantasies ran rampant about one of those guys who finds you attractive...how the fantasies got you so turned on you had to go take a shower to freshen up.

 

Open up a couple porn site accounts and let him see what you did. Tell him how surprised you were at how excited the things on the site made you and how you pleasured yourself by it. Carry on about how sexy the men were on the sites.

 

Tell him the porn sites gave you a great idea...to have a threesome with two men while your husband's away at work...just a fantasy of course.

 

And don't forget to point out all the amazing attributes of all the young buff men you and your husband pass on the street...how attractive you find a full head of hair, bedroom eyes, wide shoulders, tight butt, flat abs, flashy smile...how much you admire the male physique.

 

If you can't beat em, join em, honey....I'm SURE he wouldn't mind.

[Mr. Lucky]

I completely agree with this. If he's not what you want, find someone who can meet your needs. If what they do, causes you grief, to the point where you can't stand it, then it's more than likely they don't hold to the standards you do, or the beliefs that you do, so it's best to find someone who shares commonality with you.

Wow TBF, you make it sound so simple. Too bad more people don't take your advice...

 

Mr. Lucky

[taylor]

Wow TBF, you make it sound so simple. Too bad more people don't take your advice...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I see nothing wrong with TBF's advice. Life is too short to allow someone to make you feel miserable about yourself just because they are too selfish and ignorant to make you feel good about yourself.

 

If this man had one ounce of sensitivity or one brain cell in his head he would have kept his thoughts to himself. He was too ignorant/too insensitive to realize his remarks would hurt her. Ignorance is a self-imposed permanent condition often used to justify bad behavior.

 

Why should she learn to accept that?

[Mr. Lucky]

If this man had one ounce of sensitivity or one brain cell in his head he would have kept his thoughts to himself. He was too ignorant/too insensitive to realize his remarks would hurt her. Ignorance is a self-imposed permanent condition often used to justify bad behavior.

 

Why should she learn to accept that?

She shouldn't and, in echoing TBF's statement, for her to do so would be the opposite of my intent. If she is continually hurt by his "ignorance" and "insensitivity", she should find someone whose interests are more closely aligned with her own...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Trialbyfire]

Wow TBF, you make it sound so simple. Too bad more people don't take your advice...

 

Mr. Lucky

It's that simple. People complicate their own lives.

[sxyNYCcpl]

I agree to a certain level but too often it gets justified and abused and over used. Men take it too far and often abuse it and have too many expectations and don't ever seem to want to use self control. It's like it's justification enough to be a man and your sexual needs are more important than what your partner could need. No compromises are made. He gets you. He gets his porn.

 

This is the second time you've agreed that having fantasies is a normal part of the human condition, only to continue ranting and raving because of it. You have deluded yourself into believing that somewhere out there is a man who is "good enough" and has enough "self-control" to make sure that his lover is the only human on the face of the planet who will ever enter his mind in a sexual way. That's like arguing that if someone were to just try hard enough, they could sprout wings and fly.

 

You want a guy who doesn't get turned on by sexual imagery. One who doesn't imagine that, hey, it just might be fun to have sex with more than one woman at a time. One who doesn't even notice the perfect-10 that just walked in the room. I get it. The problem is, that simply doesn't exist, and the bitterness and resentment you hold towards men who are just being who they are is only holding you back. It may not seem fair to you, but life isn't always fair, and we can't just change the nature of reality just because we've decided we don't like it.

 

And no matter what you do he isn't happy or statisfied with what you offer.

 

You keep saying that over and over, but repetition doesn't make it true. It could be that your current or former lovers were in fact not satisfied with you, I know not, but I know that having fantasies or using porn doesn't automatically indicate that.

[Jennifer26]

I'm not crazy with the idea of the person I love fantasizing about having sex with other women - but I also realize this is not abnormal and doesn't reflect personally on me.

 

My marriage has been rocky for sometime now, and I'm not sure how things will ultimately pan out. In my heart I don't believe it will work out in the end. I guess right now I am just biding my time and hanging on to any hope I have left.

 

I've spent a lot of time wondering what life will be like if I do divorce my husband, and the possibility of remarrying. I've always supported marriage, and thought people who were "anti marriage" were immature, selfish or had some other issues. Now, if I were to find myself single once again, I don't think I would ever remarry.

 

My looks will fade, no doubt. Right now I am 28, and am told I am pretty - but I know that won't last forever. It seems so many men put so much value into their wives appearance, especially in her weight. I don't want to spend the rest of my life worrying if my husband is no longer attracted to me because I went through menopause and my metabolism has slowed and I've put on 15lbs. Or because things have begun to sag, or because I am developing wrinkles.

 

I don't want to have to deal with porn, or strip clubs, or any of the other outlets he chooses to explore to squelch his inner urge to sleep with multiple women.

 

I know men can and are faithful in marriages, and do love their wives - but let's be honest those cases aren't the norm. Also, even if he never has a full on affair, how many times will he go to a strip club to have some nude (or near nude) woman rub her genitals and breasts on him to get excitement? Or how many times will he choose looking at some woman half my age on the computer over making love to me, because it's more exciting?

 

I've known women who remained single after a divorce, and they seem the most happy. They tend to have a large group of girlfriends, active social lives, a fling here and there, and many hobbies. I envy them for being so independent and not having to deal with all of the stress and BS involved in being married.

 

And sure, men have to deal with unpleasant things being married as well. I'm not trying to demonize men. I just think with our life expectancy these days, and the fact marriage isn't really about religion or financial matters like it once heavily was - we're really setting ourselves up for failure. It's not a natural situation, and not one that even makes much sense these days.

[Jersey Shortie]

Because there isn't any answer that doesn't invite the same formulaic response from you. I'll say (as headlesschicken did) that a man's fantasies may have nothing to do with you and you'll be off. Sorry, but I've heard it before.

 

You obviously feel strongly about these things. Why not just limit your relationships to men that feel the same way you do?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

 

That's a cop-out response on two accounts Mr. Lucky. You justify your lack or reponse on what you assume my response will be. I don't see what my response should have to do with your own ability to explain your own thoughts on a question asked. And two, you try to turn the topic of conversation to be highlighted on my relationship choices. Two things you are too under informed about on to comment on.

 

 

 

Tell him how you would love to dance naked in front of his best friend and then have oral sex with him...just a fantasy of course.

 

Tell him how you saw two men talking to each other the other day and how you fantasized about doing them both at the same time...just a fantasy of course.

 

 

I would also suggest this if not for the reason to show him what it's like and how it feels. Usually men don't understand until they are put in the same situation or position they have put you into.

 

It's that simple. People complicate their own lives.

 

In real life, not everyone gets what they want even when they try.

 

 

This is the second time you've agreed that having fantasies is a normal part of the human condition, only to continue ranting and raving because of it.

 

You have purposely left out a huge chunk of my comments to best suite your personal agenda. As I said previously, I agree fantasies are normal. To a point and degree. I think people today over-indulge themselves and give themselves free licenses to do so because that is the easier path then exercising self control or thinking about what their partner could possibly need. Fantasy isn't bad. However, we live in a world of over-loaded information and yes over-loaded on "fantasy". We justify every little feeling and want we have and give free licenses to entertain it. Hell, if I ate cake to the same degree men viewed porn, I would be over weight. Fantasy is normal. The level and degree we tell ourselves is okay, isn't cool. The type of things grown men with families and wives might indulge in like thinking about their babysitters or three somes with 20 year olds...why even bother having a family if that's what your thinking about.

 

You have deluded yourself into believing that somewhere out there is a man who is "good enough" and has enough "self-control" to make sure that his lover is the only human on the face of the planet who will ever enter his mind in a sexual way. That's like arguing that if someone were to just try hard enough, they could sprout wings and fly.

 

But I never once said that a man should never ever again have another sexual thought of another woman ever again. What I did say, over and over again that you like to ignore is that men should exercise more self control then they do. And that just because you have a feeling for something, doesn't mean you should be acting out on it at your whim of fancy. Do men have the ablility to use self control or not? Because I fully believe that men are strong enough and good enough to have self control. I really believe that men have that strength in them. I just think that there are alot of men that rather justify it or not use control and think that every little whim of fancy they have because it's easier for them. I have no doubt being a man isn't hard. But so is being a woman. And it's about compromising when you are in a relationship. If you don't want to compromise, don't have a relationship. But why get into a relationship, saying how much you want to be with this one person, then tell that one person how much you need other women?

 

You want a guy who doesn't get turned on by sexual imagery. One who doesn't imagine that, hey, it just might be fun to have sex with more than one woman at a time. One who doesn't even notice the perfect-10 that just walked in the room. I get it. The problem is, that simply doesn't exist, and the bitterness and resentment you hold towards men who are just being who they are is only holding you back. It may not seem fair to you, but life isn't always fair, and we can't just change the nature of reality just because we've decided we don't like

 

That's right. Life isn't always fair. But why is a man's desire to both have one mate and the ideas of other women to entertain himself with beat out what a woman can need or desire as a woman? Life isn't fair, so why can't you apply that statement to all the men out there that use their own partner and porn interchangably as a message for them to use selfcontrol. "Life isn't fair guys, so put down the porn and don't purposely seek things out that you know goes against the message of being commited and loving and loyal to your partner." Why do you think that message only applies one way? Again, I never said men should never ever see another woman as a sexual creature. I will reiterate that I think men should use more self control then they currently do when they have made a promise to one woman.

 

You keep saying that over and over, but repetition doesn't make it true. It could be that your current or former lovers were in fact not satisfied with you, I know not, but I know that having fantasies or using porn doesn't automatically indicate that.

 

Maybe it's true. Maybe it's not. What matters is what the action says. Not what the words say. Because actions speak louder then words. And a man that is taking the physical action to get off to porn and have sex with his partner on top of that is sending the message, to some women, that she is not good enough for him to be happy with. Maybe you think that shouldn't be true. But just like you don't want me dicitating what men should or shouldn't feel sexually, who are you to dictate what women should feel on this issue or say they are wrong for thinking that way when their man is proving something very real to them?

 

If you men don't want a relationship that makes you consider the other person, don't! It's simple in that regard. But it's not fair that men get to have it both ways and it's the women that seem to have to make the consessions out of love. I just wonder when men say enough is enough and give their own partner a chance.

[Trialbyfire]

In real life, not everyone gets what they want even when they try.

So, why not? Is it because their expectations are unrealistic? If you have realistic expectations, some luck and patience, there's nothing that should hold you back except yourself.

[Jersey Shortie]

I am glad your life is cake and all you have to do is wish upon a star and wait for good things to happen but in the real world..the one with John Lennon.."Life is what happens to you while your busy making other plans."

 

My father just had massive heart surgery and almost died on the table. Was I unrealistic for expecting that not to happen? Was that my fault for making my life more complicated? My ex would go to see strippers even though he knew how it made me feel. I thought he was being honest. I trusted him. Was that my fault to find out that he lied about it because he thought my feelings on it were not as important as his feelings for strippers?

 

Life *IS* complicated. And the I don't know one person that doesn't think so. I also don't know one person that never made a mistake or didn't love someone that was difficult to love. Some of us are trying to figure it out and we make mistakes along the way. Because that is what real life is about. Maybe all the choices you made were good ones and you never made a wrong one or you just had to wait and be patient and things worked out how you wanted, but I have learned that life is unpredictable and you can do all the right things and things still happen that aren't in your favor. Does that mean you give up? No. But I think it's arrogant to say that people make their lives more complicated as if that's all they want from life. As if you've never made a mistake or were wrong about something.