amerikajin Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 I don't think anyone thinks it makes a man a horrible person. But whether you like it or not, men that pay for it makes them seem desperate that they had to pay a woman to spend time with him. Women don't want to be with men that can only get other women by paying for it. Whether he can or not doesn't matter too much because his actions are saying he needs to pay for it and that is why he is paying for it. So we can play it off that every put together cool man that has it together pays for sex, that's not the reality. We need to know a man developed the skills to manage to deal with women rather then flashing some cash just to get a woman go off with him. It also comes off that the man is insecure and desperate. I can understand that escorts, prostitutes, strippers and the sex industry is disturbing to a lot of women; I would be careful about speaking for all women. All individuals have a history and some of it isn't as idealistic or as romantic as we might like to imagine. I'm not saying you're wrong for having your beliefs, but I just think a little flexibility is required here on your end as well. As for the OP and the guy in question, that's a tough one. I don't think I would write the guy off but then again I'm not in her shoes. I guess what I'm saying is that I can also understand this from the guy's point of view. Maybe he was single, depressed, lonely and just wanted some company or some private fun on a weekend. Maybe he was just curious or wanted some no-strings-attached fun. Maybe it's not my idea of fun or something I would do but I can see why some people might do it a time or two for kicks. I would probably begin to wonder if someone made a regular habit of escorts but that's just my opinion. Then again, it is entirely possible (though not likely) that someone used escorts for escorting and nothing else. I don't know. I think that if I were the OP I would definitely put the brakes on this relationship and just do a lot more talking. This is a good practice to follow whenever two people begin to sense that there might be some major differences of attitudes or opinions on certain issues, whether we're talking about sex with strippers or personal finance.
JamesM Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 If you're telling me that Charlie Sheen can't get laid without paying for it, I'm gonna have to call bullshit on that one. Okay, if your definition of someone who is secure and not desperate means someone who can get laid, then he fits your description. Besides, I didn't say that ANYONE on that list is insecure and desperate. My point is that simply because one has a career listed does not mean they will be secure and confidant. As for Mr Sheen, his ability to get women has nothing to do with his ability to keep them. Pretty much anyone who appears in movies can get women, but that in no way means they get women for who they are as a person. A man's career does not determine his level of self-confidence in his personal life.
Lizzie60 Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 Are you a CEO? Are you an escort? Unless you've been in the business.. you have no idea what you're talking about.. I've been with CEO.. (millionnaire).. I've been with very attractive singles.. To say that these men are desperate and having to pay for sex.. is soooo ridiculous..
clv0116 Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 As for Mr Sheen, his ability to get women has nothing to do with his ability to keep them. Pretty much anyone who appears in movies can get women, but that in no way means they get women for who they are as a person. So it's your contention he uses hookers as a way to segue that relationship into something long term then? I mean, you agree he can get laid at the drop of a hat without paying, so why would he pay?
JamesM Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 So it's your contention he uses hookers as a way to segue that relationship into something long term then? No. I mean, you agree he can get laid at the drop of a hat without paying, so why would he pay? I don't know why he does what he does. I don't know why he ended it with Denise Richards. I don't know why he chose someone who doesn't look as beautiful. I don't know why he over did it on drugs and alcohol. I am guessing that he has some sort of addiction problem and has a difficulty maintaining a relationship long term. However, the only interaction I have had with him recently is watching his antics on Two and a Half Men. And seeing him there simply reinforces the notion that he cannot keep a LTR. I do know that because he can get women "at the drop of the hat" and because he appears successful in no way means that he is secure and confident. In fact, many times utilizing woman after woman for sex is a sign that a guy is insecure and seeks out sex as a way to reassure him that he is really quite something. If I were to surmise why he might pay for sex, it would be that he then can have sex and as he said, send them home. Again, this does not mean he is confident with women who he has to work at keeping an emotional and working relationship.
calazhage Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 LOL Come on.. If you are rich and famous, it might actually be more dangerous to have sex with "non professionals" A girl may say you impregnated her.. Gave her a disease..(If true or not).. Say you raped her when you do not call her back..All types of women out there trying to capitalize on sex somehow..Sad but true.
clv0116 Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 I do know that because he can get women "at the drop of the hat" and because he appears successful in no way means that he is secure and confident. Who cares? The contention was that men who hire hookers do it because that's the only way they can get sex. I contend that for many men it's because the hooker will leave when the job is done without tears, endless phone calls and threats of litigation. In a nutshell, she is paid because she will leave quietly.
Jersey Shortie Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Most of my guy friends have seen a hooker at some point in life. They are all married or in long term relationships now, and their relationship skills and the way they treat and are devoted to their wifes/girlfriends are way above average Joe Schmo's relationships skills. I am glad to run in circles where men aren't paying hookers to sleep with them. Were your friends upfront about their hookers to their partners? And are you trying to say that their relationships skills and their devotion is that much more then the average man because they have been with hookers? Any woman that would have turned them down based on the hooker episode/s alone would have done herself a huge disservice. There are other great guys out there that treat their partners very well and didn't feel the need to buy hookers. I mean, that's great that they treat their wives great but if a woman is given the choice, I don't know one woman that wouldn't pick a man that hadn't been with a hooker over one that had. I never said men that had been with hookers where bad people. I however think most women, and rightly so, will look differently at a man that had been one. You loose respect for him on a certain level. Maybe other men won't loose respect for him but he isn't dating other men unless he is gay. Basically, it is not true that the only reason men would consider a hooker is that they cannot get laid otherwise or have some issues. I'm sure that's what most men would want to believe of their selves but the reality of what it is, is far different. ---------------------------------------------------------- Besides, I didn't say that ANYONE on that list is insecure and desperate. My point is that simply because one has a career listed does not mean they will be secure and confidant. You put it into better words then I could JamesM. You said what I was thinking. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Are you an escort? Why would I need to be an escort? I'm not pretending that I know anyting about what an escorts life is like. Lets rationally look at this. The average guy is comparing himself to CEOs. The average man can't compare his life experieces to those of a CEO. It's like me comparing my life experiences to Angelina Jolie. Not of the same hemisphere. Maybe the average CEO is desperate. Maybe he isn't. I personally don't think money means your a good partner or even a good sexual partner. But the average guy hooking up with a hooker ain't no CEO. Unless you've been in the business.. you have no idea what you're talking about.. I've been with CEO.. (millionnaire).. I've been with very attractive singles.. To say that these men are desperate and having to pay for sex.. is soooo ridiculous.. But I never said that these men were automatically desperate. I said that's the perception they are protraying to most women. Go back and reread my post. The message is: He is paying for sex. About 98% of the female population doesn't want to be with a man that is paying for it. They want a man that actually wants to engage with women on a deeper level. A man that is paying for sex is saying that he doesn't want to engage with women on a deeper level and he possibly doesn't have the skills to do so. Who cares? The contention was that men who hire hookers do it because that's the only way they can get sex. It's probably the case more then men want to admit. It's like that old arguement that All strippers are stripping so that they can get theri Phds. I contend that for many men it's because the hooker will leave when the job is done without tears, endless phone calls and threats of litigation. In a nutshell, she is paid because she will leave quietly. She's paid to provide the service of sex. Only very insecure men believe otherwise. And actually, I think men that are paying for sex are pretty well aware of the real lack of power they have in that setup.
calazhage Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 LOL Jersey, what are you crying about now.. You have no clue which guys get hookers, or why. No clue..Completely ignorant. You asked if I am a CEO, actually yes I am. I am the CEO of the corporation I own and started. So? I just didn't answer your question before because it is irrelevant.
You'reasian Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 I am glad to run in circles where men aren't paying hookers to sleep with them. . Most men who do or would probably aren't going to bring up the issue to you in the first place. Imagine if a guy said he would not run in circles where women use sex toys... I'm actually agreeing with Calzaghe - I'd wager that you've probably been interested in atleast one guy whose seen an escort. I'd wager that some decent guys who didn't see escorts have been rejected by women who have in turn gone for other decent men who did see escorts at some point. There are other great guys out there that treat their partners very well and didn't feel the need to buy hookers. I mean, that's great that they treat their wives great but if a woman is given the choice, I don't know one woman that wouldn't pick a man that hadn't been with a hooker over one that had. . Having a partner who also see's an escort is not the OP's issue. The issue is that the OP is concerned that he had done so in his past. I'm sure that's what most men would want to believe of their selves but the reality of what it is, is far different.. The only way to get the reality of men is to be one or atleast be the kind of girl who has tons of guy friends, be rather tomboyish and spend alot of time really understanding them rather than rely on liberal values of idealism. And actually, I think men that are paying for sex are pretty well aware of the real lack of power they have in that setup. I'd imagine its not all about power - its probably about the guy getting some form of intimacy (with the case of escorts, not street-walkers) or maybe just sex without having to play silly games. A female poster from UK mentioned an interesting point (can't think of her name at the moment) that went something like this: What's the difference between a decent guy going on a nice, pricy traditional date, doing all the right things for the right reasons and getting no where versus a decent guy paying for an intimate evening with an escort whom he knows he won't see unless he feels like paying? Somewhere else on here I read a guys post about the money he spent cruising bars, clubs, dating sites, dating in general etc. looking for that connection vs. hiring an escort. That's an eye opener.
Jersey Shortie Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 You asked if I am a CEO, actually yes I am. I am the CEO of the corporation I own and started. So? I just didn't answer your question before because it is irrelevant. You're business, while I am sure is successful, is not on the same level of the CEO's that are being referenced in this topic of converstion. My father was CEO of his company and he was the average farmer and truck driver with his own business. It would be like me comparing my life choices and the reasons why I do things because of the life choices someone like Jennifer Anistan made. This is a case of guys wanting it to look like they aren't desperate or needy and paying for sex when the fact is that's exactly the message they are sending. Maybe these guys are desperate, maybe they aren't. Either way, that's the message they are sending. 98% of women, if asked, would rather be with a man that did not hire a prostitute, then one that had. I would also say that it would change the opinion the woman had of the man knowing the facts because of what that situation represents. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Most men who do or would probably aren't going to bring up the issue to you in the first place. Imagine if a guy said he would not run in circles where women use sex toys... A sex toy is not even 1/10 the same as paying to have sex with a prostitute. Why ar eyou comparing something some completely uncomparable. How many men do you think would look kindly on a woman that hire a prostitute herself? I would bet that most men would not be so open minded..but of course, all the men of LoveShack would be. I'm actually agreeing with Calzaghe - I'd wager that you've probably been interested in atleast one guy whose seen an escort. I think the type of guys I am interested in are of a different group then Calzaghe is in. I'd wager that some decent guys who didn't see escorts have been rejected by women who have in turn gone for other decent men who did see escorts at some point. I'll wager many decent women who have decent men were able to do so with men that didn't visit prostitutes once in their life time. The only way to get the reality of men is to be one or atleast be the kind of girl who has tons of guy friends, be rather tomboyish and spend alot of time really understanding them rather than rely on liberal values of idealism. Again, I go by what a man's actions say. I am sure I would uncover more truths being that type of girl but A man's actions speak louder then his words. As does a woman's. Liberal views of idealism is promoting the notion that all men visit prositutes because they are really cool, confident, put together men that makes tons of money and know how to treat a woman and are always successful. That's a liberal view of idealism that seems to be what some of the men here are trying to protray. I'd imagine its not all about power - its probably about the guy getting some form of intimacy (with the case of escorts, not street-walkers) or maybe just sex without having to play silly games. I personally think it's a man copping out to a relationship that requires more from him then just pleasing his own needs and actually having to work at making sure another person's needs are of value and deserve to be meet along with his. That is one main reason why this set up will always be unattractive to most normal women. It says that this man is selfish, self-indulgent and is more concerned about his own needs and unwilling to give of himself. I am not saying that is always the truth, but that is the message sent. No woman wants to be with a man that is more concerned with taking then giving. And this setup appeals to the lowest common denominator in a man. A female poster from UK mentioned an interesting point (can't think of her name at the moment) that went something like this: What's the difference between a decent guy going on a nice, pricy traditional date, doing all the right things for the right reasons and getting no where versus a decent guy paying for an intimate evening with an escort whom he knows he won't see unless he feels like paying? Okay so the message is that real women are worthless and don't deserve to have the effort put into them for courtship? Hey I guess all that matters is a man gets his because he is a decent guy and screw all the decent women out there..their just money hungry less deserving human beings who don't deserve the time and attention a man should take in putting in the effort to wooing them. I guess it doesn't matter about all the decent women out there that struggle with dating themselves. Because we don't matter right? Somewhere else on here I read a guys post about the money he spent cruising bars, clubs, dating sites, dating in general etc. looking for that connection vs. hiring an escort. That's an eye opener. What is the eye opener? That encounters with hookers where the man is paying a female to sleep with him is better then actually trying to make a connection with a female on a deeper level? Of course trying to meet and make a connection with someone is more difficult. When you pay someone for a service, they don't really like you or even might not really want to be with you. They are being paid to be with you. Finding someone who you connect with and really appreciates you is 10 times harder. You think it's easier for women? News flash, it isn't.
You'reasian Posted March 5, 2009 Posted March 5, 2009 I personally think it's a man copping out to a relationship that requires more from him then just pleasing his own needs and actually having to work at making sure another person's needs are of value and deserve to be meet along with his. That is one main reason why this set up will always be unattractive to most normal women. It says that this man is selfish, self-indulgent and is more concerned about his own needs and unwilling to give of himself. I am not saying that is always the truth, but that is the message sent. No woman wants to be with a man that is more concerned with taking then giving. And this setup appeals to the lowest common denominator in a man. . You're assuming that the guy who visits an escort is being selfish over working to make another person's needs met in a relationship - which may be the caes. How about the case where the guy just doesn't want to bother with the normal kinds of women who play games? I think you took the wrong message. And I think you've chased too many bad guys.
boxing123 Posted March 5, 2009 Posted March 5, 2009 Well I am sure 99% of men would prefer the woman they love did not have one night stands either. But as we mature, (some of us at least) we realize what is really important. I am not so DUMB as to believe all of the women I dated never had a one night stand, because that is what they told me, lol. The reasons a man might try a professional at least once in his life are many and varied. Unless you are a virgin waiting for marriage to have sex you really can't throw stones. I have more respect for a prostitute, than a woman who spends her time, thoughts, and energy trying to land a "high earner".
Jersey Shortie Posted March 5, 2009 Posted March 5, 2009 You're assuming that the guy who visits an escort is being selfish over working to make another person's needs met in a relationship - which may be the caes. How about the case where the guy just doesn't want to bother with the normal kinds of women who play games? Relationships require work. It would be great if everything in life was easy, but it doesn't. Men aren't any easier to try to date and have relationships with then you think women are. You don't think men don't play games? They certainly do. Their games are different but no less annoying and tiresome or hurtful. And yet, I still try to have a relationship that requires more of me then meeting just my own needs and indulging myself. And I think you've chased too many bad guys. I think the world is full of more bad guys then good ones.
You'reasian Posted March 5, 2009 Posted March 5, 2009 Relationships require work. It would be great if everything in life was easy, but it doesn't. Men aren't any easier to try to date and have relationships with then you think women are. You don't think men don't play games? They certainly do. Their games are different but no less annoying and tiresome or hurtful. And yet, I still try to have a relationship that requires more of me then meeting just my own needs and indulging myself. . Then you need to meet a nice guy and stick with him and not just talk the talk. I think the world is full of more bad guys then good ones. Its not just a black and white world. What you are commenting on are the shades of grey.
Jersey Shortie Posted March 5, 2009 Posted March 5, 2009 Its not just a black and white world. What you are commenting on are the shades of grey. Hookers and prostitutes aren't shades of grey.
You'reasian Posted March 5, 2009 Posted March 5, 2009 Hookers and prostitutes aren't shades of grey. Hey, some like em older.
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