Don't know how to break the cycle

[Phateless]

I've messed up on nearly all of the above many times in the past, but that does not mean I have to mess up tomorrow. I feel more confidence than I have in awhile so I'll see over the next days how much that helps. I think starting to buy some new clothes and starting to exercise is gradually helping my confidence.

 

Keep it up bro, and keep reading. The main purpose of reading is not to take instructions literally, but more to trigger epiphanies that you can use to grow and reform, and change your behavior. I'm PMing you another link you'll find useful.

[likestolaugh]

I've messed up on nearly all of the above many times in the past, but that does not mean I have to mess up tomorrow. I feel more confidence than I have in awhile so I'll see over the next days how much that helps. I think starting to buy some new clothes and starting to exercise is gradually helping my confidence.

 

 

all those points aren't always rules though. It depends on who you're talking with...

[39388]

Keep it up bro, and keep reading. The main purpose of reading is not to take instructions literally, but more to trigger epiphanies that you can use to grow and reform, and change your behavior. I'm PMing you another link you'll find useful.

I see exactly what you mean. It can be painful sometimes. A number of times in the last couple of years, some being in the last few days, I realize some particular behavior of mine was hurting me socially. When this happens I think I can't believe I didn't see this in all those years, but I know to change that behavior in the future.

 

It is like I learned to do some kind of chemistry experiement using the wrong equation. For many years, I just don't get why the experiement failed every time. Then I suddenly realize what I did wrong!

[39388]

all those points aren't always rules though. It depends on who you're talking with...

None of the statements use words like "always" or "never". Definietly a good reason for that.

 

For example, "don't compliment her way too much early on". That leaves room for some compliments. Just not way too many.

[samspade]

It sounds like you are already on the way to self-improvement. You recognize you're doing something wrong and aiming to fix it. Congrats!

 

The best advice I can give is be happy, regardless. I went through a rut in my early twenties, then did what you are about to do: Changed my approach. I tried different things, studied up, asked advice, succeeded, and failed. The bottom line was that I was having fun. At first, the setbacks made me angry or depressed, like "here we go again..." At some point, something in my mind clicked, and I realized my happiness did not HINGE on having a woman or women on my arm at all times. And you know what? I think women find me more attractive than ever.

 

I can't overstate how much not giving a damn matters. That doesn't mean don't try, or not care about a woman's feelings, or whatever. It means not caring if you fail. Think about all the shots Michael Jordan took in his career. You think his life was going to crash and burn if he missed one, even a game-winner? There's always another shot to take.

 

And be happy with yourself, or no one else will. Good luck!

[39388]

I can't overstate how much not giving a damn matters. That doesn't mean don't try, or not care about a woman's feelings, or whatever. It means not caring if you fail.

 

And be happy with yourself, or no one else will. Good luck!

I've been working on talking to people and reading up on all this stuff. More slow improvement.

 

I still don't get this how not giving a damn matters. I could conceivably work to get over rejections much easier. This not giving a damn at all seems to be the opposite of me.

[Phateless]

I've been working on talking to people and reading up on all this stuff. More slow improvement.

 

I still don't get this how not giving a damn matters. I could conceivably work to get over rejections much easier. This not giving a damn at all seems to be the opposite of me.

 

It takes time. After a while you will meet a new girl per month. And then a new girl per week. And then two new girls per week. And then a new girl every day.

 

After a while you're coming home from the bars thinking about the three numbers you got that night and the two you didn't even bother to ask for.

 

Eventually you realize there is ALWAYS another one to meet, so if one doesn't go well, big deal.

 

Women are just people. There are 7 billion of them on the planet, half of which are women.

 

Messing up a few times won't kill you and doesn't mean you are an uncool person. You have to learn to reframe your thinking to put yourself on an even playing field as women. It's slow going.

 

My internal transformation took around a year. Keep at it.

[likestolaugh]

this is seriously one of the best threads on this forum. It's a therapy session that's actually seemingly working to improve what was once thought to be a hopeless situation. A+

[D-Lish]

Try this move: Say you're going on a date with a girl ask to be hooked-up, like D-Lish suggests, and tell her you'll come back and tell her how it went.

Then ask her if she has a coffee break coming up so you can tell her about it.

 

 

 

 

Hey D-Lish,

I work in reality television maybe I'll pitch this idea.

 

Only if I get to be one of the hosts!!!

 

Good for you OP- Even that little bit of chatter with the sales girls was a step in the right direction!

 

The clothes and stuff will help, get you started anyway. When you look in the mirror before you leave your house and you are pleased with what you see... it will just give you that extra burst of confidence.

 

The clothes don't make you- your thoughts about yourself do. That's where the real work takes place- changing how you view yourself. It's just taking it one day, one situation at a time.

 

The more you do it, the more comfortable you will feel.

 

That's awesome you went into the store and chatted up the sales girls.

[39388]

Good for you OP- Even that little bit of chatter with the sales girls was a step in the right direction!

 

The clothes and stuff will help, get you started anyway. When you look in the mirror before you leave your house and you are pleased with what you see... it will just give you that extra burst of confidence.

 

The more you do it, the more comfortable you will feel.

 

That's awesome you went into the store and chatted up the sales girls.

I taked to an attractive saleswoman in a (non clothing) store and had a few laughs. I am still nervous, but it is getting easier. I want to do this at least 20-30 more times and see what happens with my confidence. I'm not going to expect anything more than just talking for a minute or two for now.

 

Once I get a little losser, it will be easier for me to start thinking more than just the minute or two talk.

[turnshyness]

Yup I agree. It does takes practice. So keep doing what you're doing and you'll get there.

 

Hey follow-up w/ the girl. I thought I'd let you know - I think we're on good terms now. So I'm really really really going to take it slow. We just spoke on the phone and it was a pleasant conversation.

 

I taked to an attractive saleswoman in a (non clothing) store and had a few laughs. I am still nervous, but it is getting easier. I want to do this at least 20-30 more times and see what happens with my confidence. I'm not going to expect anything more than just talking for a minute or two for now.

 

Once I get a little losser, it will be easier for me to start thinking more than just the minute or two talk.

[D-Lish]

I taked to an attractive saleswoman in a (non clothing) store and had a few laughs. I am still nervous, but it is getting easier. I want to do this at least 20-30 more times and see what happens with my confidence. I'm not going to expect anything more than just talking for a minute or two for now.

 

Once I get a little losser, it will be easier for me to start thinking more than just the minute or two talk.

 

See, that's great!

 

You communicate well here on the forum- so it's not like you don't have the skills. They are transferable you know.

 

I know where you are coming from- but from a different place. After I lost my business and found myself trying to write a resume and go through job interviews, I found it extremely difficult. I just took a bartending course to supplement my income- and I know my stuff... But it's so scary to walk into an establishment with my resume and talk to an owner or manager.

 

I sat in front of a place today where I really want to work. I was dressed nice, my resume is in great shape.... but I froze up and didn't go in. I started second guessing my skills, visualized them asking me the recipe to a drink I don't know... etc. So I am trying to do the same thing- force myself to walk through the door and make a good impression.

 

I think we all suffer through matters of confidence.

 

You reminded me that I need to take my own advice and go back tomorrow and hand in my resume.

 

Keep up the flirting- when the opportunity arises- jump on it! It's true that it just gets easier.

 

I'm proud of you though- mostly because I know how hard it can be to take these steps you are taking.

[tkgirl]

I assumed that they did more often than rarely. You would definitely know better than me. It's just that over all these years I've never even heard in the background a compliment on my looks.

 

I do get compliments, but they are always on my intelligence. I should be happy for the compliments I do get rather than concentrate on what I may not get.

 

intelligence is VERY sexy! that mixed with some confidence and you're well on your way...

[39388]

See, that's great!

 

You communicate well here on the forum- so it's not like you don't have the skills. They are transferable you know.

 

I know where you are coming from- but from a different place. After I lost my business and found myself trying to write a resume and go through job interviews, I found it extremely difficult. I just took a bartending course to supplement my income- and I know my stuff... But it's so scary to walk into an establishment with my resume and talk to an owner or manager.

 

I sat in front of a place today where I really want to work. I was dressed nice, my resume is in great shape.... but I froze up and didn't go in. I started second guessing my skills, visualized them asking me the recipe to a drink I don't know... etc. So I am trying to do the same thing- force myself to walk through the door and make a good impression.

 

I think we all suffer through matters of confidence.

 

You reminded me that I need to take my own advice and go back tomorrow and hand in my resume.

 

Keep up the flirting- when the opportunity arises- jump on it! It's true that it just gets easier.

 

I'm proud of you though- mostly because I know how hard it can be to take these steps you are taking.

 

There could be a possible opportunity! A woman responded postively to my partially done profile on a dating site. I don't even have a photo up yet. She asked for one so I'm going to to send her one. We'll see if anything comes of this, but I've never felt closer.

 

Definitely take you own advice! Talk yourself up. If anyone is going to say "no" to you getting the job, it should be the company and not you. You owe it to yourself to go the company and make the best impression possible. As everyone tells me on here, relax. You started with no job there. The worst outcome is you will still have no job there. The best is you will have a job there!

 

Also, walking through the door to the company with your resume can't be any harder than what I'm doing.

[39388]

intelligence is VERY sexy! that mixed with some confidence and you're well on your way...

I hope so! I'm working hard on the confidence. Someone today asked how I am and I said "great" instead of "ok" or "fine". If I keep saying more positive words, I think I'll actually feel that way.

[39388]

I just sent a picture to a woman on an online dating site. My profile was just started so it doesn't yet have all of the items completed including the picture.

 

I know this woman is interested in what is there and I like her profile which does have pictures. I'm so nervous now! Will she respond positively? My appearance is still the the thing I'm least confient in (though it is slowly imporving as I'm starting to buy some new clothes).

[likestolaugh]

I just sent a picture to a woman on an online dating site. My profile was just started so it doesn't yet have all of the items completed including the picture.

 

I know this woman is interested in what is there and I like her profile which does have pictures. I'm so nervous now! Will she respond positively? My appearance is still the the thing I'm least confient in (though it is slowly imporving as I'm starting to buy some new clothes).

 

don't get discouraged if she doesn't answer. You probably know this already, but lots of women ignore messages for no apparent reason. Not saying that'll happen here... but just don't worry about it.

[D-Lish]

I just sent a picture to a woman on an online dating site. My profile was just started so it doesn't yet have all of the items completed including the picture.

 

I know this woman is interested in what is there and I like her profile which does have pictures. I'm so nervous now! Will she respond positively? My appearance is still the the thing I'm least confient in (though it is slowly imporving as I'm starting to buy some new clothes).

 

Always put your best pic forward. I find most guys just throw up any photo just to have one.... My friend put up his profile recently but the pics he put up were really bad, didn't even represent what he actually looks like. Once we got some better pictures up there- he started getting more responses.

 

Whether you get a message back or not- don't sweat it. In fact, online dating IS a good way to develop a thicker skin. Not everyone is going to respond, you get used to it- and it will help you get used to it in RL as well.

 

The positive self talk helps in a big way. Your subconscious bounces back what you feed it and then you attract more of it. You can even look in the mirror in the morning and say your positive affirmations.

 

You have to take that confidence and skill you have from teaching and apply it to your dating practices. If a hot girl asked you a question in class, I'm sure you'd engage her in the same way you would some old gross dude:p.

 

Did you find some tops to match your jeans yet? Time to head back to the mall and engage some more sales girls ((Dee says standing on her front porch in Canada waving and giving you the thumbs up)).

[Cherry Blossom 35]

I used to be in sales. I took a lot of rejection. I learned how to not take it personally. I used to count up the "no's" because I knew they were leading me to the "yes's"....

 

Dating is really not that much different!

 

And remember that anyone you talk to, or go on a date with, only knows one tiny part of you. So any rejection shouldn't be taken too personally. They don't really know you.

 

You just have to get out there and try it. Make it a game. How many "no's" until I get a yes? think of it as research, since you are an academic.

 

And remember to laugh. Laugh a lot! Because dating is funny. There are a lot of weird people out there. At least you are racking up some great stories! Seriously, though, laugh at the whole thing. Don't take it too seriously. So what if some dumb girl doesn't like you? Who cares. She is probably too boring for you anyway.

[39388]

don't get discouraged if she doesn't answer. You probably know this already, but lots of women ignore messages for no apparent reason. Not saying that'll happen here... but just don't worry about it.

Yeah, I sent her the pictures and I know she read the mail and no answer. I'll see if I get anything over the next couple days.

 

I had a nice chat with another woman and we exchanged emails and she did like my picture!

 

I realize you have to have the mentality to keep looking until you are in a relationship (or at least getting dates).

[39388]

Always put your best pic forward. I find most guys just throw up any photo just to have one.... My friend put up his profile recently but the pics he put up were really bad, didn't even represent what he actually looks like. Once we got some better pictures up there- he started getting more responses.

 

Whether you get a message back or not- don't sweat it. In fact, online dating IS a good way to develop a thicker skin. Not everyone is going to respond, you get used to it- and it will help you get used to it in RL as well.

 

The positive self talk helps in a big way. Your subconscious bounces back what you feed it and then you attract more of it. You can even look in the mirror in the morning and say your positive affirmations.

 

You have to take that confidence and skill you have from teaching and apply it to your dating practices. If a hot girl asked you a question in class, I'm sure you'd engage her in the same way you would some old gross dude:p.

 

Did you find some tops to match your jeans yet? Time to head back to the mall and engage some more sales girls ((Dee says standing on her front porch in Canada waving and giving you the thumbs up)).

I don't know which pics to put up and which to make my first one. I have a pic in a work setting, having fun and a formal setting.

 

Is there any way to show people pictures, but not everyone on LS? I'd love a woman's opinion on what I should post, but don't want everyone on here to know what I look like.

 

I have this feeling the the first woman may not write me back. However, I had a nice online chat with another woman. I got tired and was starting to make more typos because of it so I had to say goodnight, but not before sending her a pic which she liked and emails. I'm not sure if it will lead to anything, but we both want to keep talking in email.

 

I bought a new shirt, but still want more. I want to get another pair of shoes also since athletic shoes are not the best for a date and my dress shoes may be too formal.

[39388]

I used to be in sales. I took a lot of rejection. I learned how to not take it personally. I used to count up the "no's" because I knew they were leading me to the "yes's"....

 

Dating is really not that much different!

 

And remember that anyone you talk to, or go on a date with, only knows one tiny part of you. So any rejection shouldn't be taken too personally. They don't really know you.

 

You just have to get out there and try it. Make it a game. How many "no's" until I get a yes? think of it as research, since you are an academic.

 

And remember to laugh. Laugh a lot! Because dating is funny. There are a lot of weird people out there. At least you are racking up some great stories! Seriously, though, laugh at the whole thing. Don't take it too seriously. So what if some dumb girl doesn't like you? Who cares. She is probably too boring for you anyway.

Very helpful yet again Cheery Blossom.

 

I know some of the rejections will be very easy to take and some may be less so. The more I do this, the more used to it I will get too. However, I can't let them get me down too long as I'm always looking for someone new until I'm in a relationship. Most women like positive people! I was very negative a couple months ago and am more positive now. The differnce in how people react to me is incredible.

[Phateless]

Yeah, I sent her the pictures and I know she read the mail and no answer. I'll see if I get anything over the next couple days.

 

I had a nice chat with another woman and we exchanged emails and she did like my picture!

 

I realize you have to have the mentality to keep looking until you are in a relationship (or at least getting dates).

 

You're really getting somewhere now.

 

If you haven't already, take some new pics with your new clothes and style and look. It will make a difference.

 

The best reaction I ever got was when my pic showed me sitting on my motorcycle, and my tagline told the girls not to message me because i'm trouble.

 

Apparently reverse psychology works. They don't like being told what to do.

[39388]

You're really getting somewhere now.

 

If you haven't already, take some new pics with your new clothes and style and look. It will make a difference.

 

The best reaction I ever got was when my pic showed me sitting on my motorcycle, and my tagline told the girls not to message me because i'm trouble.

 

Apparently reverse psychology works. They don't like being told what to do.

I just put a couple of pictures up. We'll see how that helps. I'll probably put up new pictures if I get better ones taken.

 

A few people are messaging, but some of them have so many typos in their profiles or live in other states. I may have to do half of the rejecting.

[clv0116]

It's nice your're getting results of a sort, but it doesn't really get elevated beyond a really obscure online game until you get to the "let's meet" phase, and I'm thinking that for you this is gonna be a potential crutch to allow you to put the real life interaction off.

 

You need to get out there and stop hiding behind that PC.