LovieDove24 Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 So I was in Barnes and Nobles the other day and found myself caravaning around the self improvement aisle. Ok, I always feel sorry for the people who are wandering around that section but alas I was one of them that day. Anyways I found a book titled "Stop getting Dumped." It was only about 75 pages long and I had to pick it up since my last three relationships ended with, well you guessed it, me getting dumped. It was a book written for women. Don't sleep with a man before the first month! Always make him pick you up! Don't initiate phone calls! Don't call him back even if you just missed it! You know, all the typical stuff that we women learn about men: they really really like the chase. So go ahead and let 'em chase, right? Well I realized at this point that I didn't need this book. I had learned all of these life lessons in the school of hard knocks. But it also made me start thinking about my last relationship that ended. I essentially played by EVERY SINGLE dating "rule" where I let the man chase me. Sure enough it worked for the first couple of months. He was all over me like white on rice! But alas I still got dumped...so what went wrong? The problem with all these dating rules is that they only delay the inevitable. You will still eventually get dumped if you are not compatible. I say be your damn self and follow your own rules. Because if you like to call a man and he can't handle it, well then you're not compatible and its better to find out sooner rather than later right? Anyone agree that the rules of dating only prolong the inevitable if you're not essentially compatible from the start?
zhsoj Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 Well I guess I'm the non-typical guy then as I hate that ****. I'll chase up to a point. After that it's just mean to not let me know where I stand.
movingonandon Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 That's the spirit . My current girlfriend *seemingly* "plays" by these rules, but I say seemingly, simply because she's pretty traditional and I think that's just her natural reaction to how things unfold anyway; I would be really surprised if any of that is actually any calculated 'strategy' (plus she violates some of them...). Anyway, my point is that if i suspected that this was a strategy, I would be irritated and would have probably dumped her early on. I think that guys are sensitive to any kind of game-playing, so yes, you're probably much better off using your own common sense rather than try to control the interaciton on such a superficial level
rogerahman Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 I do enjoy the chase, but not forever! I think one problem with the chase is that it really doesn't help communication and getting to know each other better. That's probably for when you're dating, but if you can get to know them more and more as you chase, I think you'll have a much more stable base as a couple. The chase hinders some important early communication to me.
BCCA Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 It basically always comes down to interest. The more interest, the more effort someone will make. In the early going, however, this is a delicate balance. You're not fully invested, and I think a lot of women try to play this game right off the bat, and it backfires. For example, if I get a womans number and she doesnt answer or call me back ONE TIME, thats it. I'm done, I'll never call again. I agree, they only delay the inevitable, and how happy are you going to be playing games and being someone you're not?
calazhage Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 Roger is right... The chase does get a man interested.. However, interested in what? I have been through it before. You chase, you get the girl, then realize you are not into her. You were into the chase. Then you even resent the girl for putting you through all of it, so if she is not extra phenomenal, you have no problem whatsoever walking away.
socialight Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 i wouldn't entirely dismiss the rules. I think people are very quick to judge in the early stages and following some key protocals can be of use. I don't think following "the rules" can get you a person you wouldn't otherwise get. But they may keep you from losing one over something stupid. All that being said, most of the relationships that I have witnessed would have started regardless of anyone following said rules.
Chicago_Guy Posted February 18, 2009 Posted February 18, 2009 Some of those "Rules" are so stupid. Not every guy will continually chase a woman who does annoying things like not returning calls. Many guys will assume that a woman who makes a habit out of not returning calls is not interested in them.
BCCA Posted February 19, 2009 Posted February 19, 2009 Some of those "Rules" are so stupid. Not every guy will continually chase a woman who does annoying things like not returning calls. Many guys will assume that a woman who makes a habit out of not returning calls is not interested in them. As he should. Its funny, in one breath, you'll hear about some guy being a creepy stalker that wont stop calling. And in the next...youre not returning his calls to peak his interest. And if hes not a creepy stalker, guess what? Your phone is going to stop ringing really fast.
Trialbyfire Posted February 19, 2009 Posted February 19, 2009 Anyone agree that the rules of dating only prolong the inevitable if you're not essentially compatible from the start? Pretending to be anything you're not will get you dumped fast. Forget the game and be yourself, from start to finish. Always stay true to yourself.
Author LovieDove24 Posted February 20, 2009 Author Posted February 20, 2009 Men, I think you may be slightly confused here. The common dating rules I speak of are not intended to have the man chase the woman FOREVER. Of course that is frustrating. Of course the man will give up after awhile. But thats not what I'm saying, that's not what the book is saying, it's not what the "rules" are saying either. For all intents and purposes the commonly known dating "rules" are centered around the woman distancing herself enough for the man to feel in control. You can interchange this with "chase" if it makes more sense to you.
Author LovieDove24 Posted February 20, 2009 Author Posted February 20, 2009 Roger is right... The chase does get a man interested.. However, interested in what? I have been through it before. You chase, you get the girl, then realize you are not into her. You were into the chase. Then you even resent the girl for putting you through all of it, so if she is not extra phenomenal, you have no problem whatsoever walking away. Right. Its like you're damned if you do, damned if you don't. If you DO play by the rules and it gets you through the murky (and awkward) dating stages...theres no guaranty the prize will be worth it in the end. The girl had to restrain herself from him for what? The guy had to be persistant for what? If you DON'T play by the rules you may not even make it a week. Because men, lets face it you respect a girl more the more you have to work for it.
zhsoj Posted February 20, 2009 Posted February 20, 2009 For all intents and purposes the commonly known dating "rules" are centered around the woman distancing herself enough for the man to feel in control. You can interchange this with "chase" if it makes more sense to you. In control of what? The only "control" I can really think of is not having her disrespect me... There really is nothing about chasing that I really value. Why should I need the chase in order to be interested? Seems silly...
Author LovieDove24 Posted February 20, 2009 Author Posted February 20, 2009 I understand your point Z but general rules are just that, general. Obviously, as you state, you're the exception. What I was trying to say is that from my life experience and understanding, men put forth a lot more effort when something is a challenge. They put forth less effort when something comes easy. Women crave this effort on the mens behalf (aka courting) therefore she will probably behave in a way to ensure it is there and that it remains. Now, it just so happens that my life experience also coincides with the publics general dating "rules." Coincidence? You decide. BUT onto my whole point in this post. Sure the guy will probably be all over you like white on rice while you play this game because most (see I didn't say all) men are designed to work in the way I stated above. They enjoy the hunt, the chase, the control (pick the version that works best for you). BUT I have come to the realization that I want my man to be all over me for REAL reasons and not superficial ones. Are you with me ladies? THATS my main point. You can weed out a lotta the bad guys by just calling when you want, initiating when you want and overall just being yourself. Do what feels comfortable to you.
tincanman99 Posted February 20, 2009 Posted February 20, 2009 Chasing goes only so far and than its time to bail out. If she does not reciprocate or toys with your interest its time to call it quits. Why waste your time on someone who is playing games? There are a lot of fish in the sea.
ddraper Posted February 20, 2009 Posted February 20, 2009 I would not agree that these "rules" only prolong the inevitable if you are not compatible from the start. The reason, any man and any woman are not compatible form the start. Men think differently and react differently to everything. The stereotypical joke comes to mind from the "breakup." "I just want you to want to do the dishes." Vince's character, "But I don't want to do the dishes." The bottom line, people are inherently incompatible, the only thing we can do is choose to try to work at it or choose not to. Those "rules" lay a good ground work to get the emotions going but you still gotta work at it, within the confines of the "rules" and the confines of how men and women interact. The "rules" just help you weed out the undesirables and uninterested.
Surfer Dude Posted February 20, 2009 Posted February 20, 2009 It basically always comes down to interest. The more interest, the more effort someone will make. In the early going, however, this is a delicate balance. You're not fully invested, and I think a lot of women try to play this game right off the bat, and it backfires. For example, if I get a womans number and she doesnt answer or call me back ONE TIME, thats it. I'm done, I'll never call again. I agree, they only delay the inevitable, and how happy are you going to be playing games and being someone you're not? It backfires on those dumb women very often. Example: - a girl gives me her number. I give her a call and want to set up a meeting. She says she's too busy. Since I operate on feedback, I try to see if there is any positive statement that getting together IS something she wants to do. Obviously she blew me off without any positive feeback. I delete her number and get together with another girl. She calls me couple of weeks later, all desperate... by then I have all the power over her and I can decide if I want to screw her or not. Some of those "Rules" are so stupid. Not every guy will continually chase a woman who does annoying things like not returning calls. Many guys will assume that a woman who makes a habit out of not returning calls is not interested in them. And rightly so. I always do my best to present myself in the best way possible, to show her my goods and to let her know I'm a fun and a great guy. If she plays/is unavailable, I will delete her number and next her. Funny thing is, it's then when they usually start chasing you... haha Men, I think you may be slightly confused here. The common dating rules I speak of are not intended to have the man chase the woman FOREVER. Of course that is frustrating. Of course the man will give up after awhile. But thats not what I'm saying, that's not what the book is saying, it's not what the "rules" are saying either. For all intents and purposes the commonly known dating "rules" are centered around the woman distancing herself enough for the man to feel in control. You can interchange this with "chase" if it makes more sense to you. Dating and relationships should be about romance and spontaneity. Any woman or man who is stupid enough to abide by any rules instead of being spontaneous and fun deserves to be single. And no, men don't like to chase. It's just that most are perpetually single and desperate, that's why they chase. I give girls one call or one message, if there's no positive feedback, I next them. Obviously those books can work on doormats and chumps, not on confident men with self esteem.
calazhage Posted February 20, 2009 Posted February 20, 2009 Lovie dove, if you have to chase a woman, she has all of the control. Example.. Let's say I date a woman whom says she is busy often, and does not return my calls. So, I have to persist, and be with her on her one free night. She is in control. If I call a girl I am dating, she answers, and I say "Let's go out Friday", and she agrees, then I am in control. Or it is equal. If you do not make the man chase, yes, if he is the wrong guy he will get tired of you in a week. If you make the guy chase, if he is the wrong guy, he will chase for a few months, then get tired of you. Which is better?
Author LovieDove24 Posted February 20, 2009 Author Posted February 20, 2009 I AGREE the rules are crap in the long run. I do however believe that if done right, they DO work in the short term. For them to work the woman of course cannot completely ignore you, this is common sense. Some of you are insisting that this is what the rules intend but NO it's not about ignoring. What it IS about is the woman distancing herself just enough to 1) Peak your interest and 2) Allow you to control the pace. It is my experience bar none that this works nearly every time. Hence millions of books sold about it, hence there even being a labeled set of "rules" about it. Guys aren't that difficult to understand...Please u guys just stop arguing it. Where I think we can all agree however is that in the long run its all a bunch of crap. The reason being that the woman was playing a game all along and you, the man, were liking the chase as opposed to HER. THIS is why I am no longer interested in the rules. I sure as hell won't keep as many guys around but the ones that I do will be so much more worth it.
calazhage Posted February 20, 2009 Posted February 20, 2009 Let me make this point.. For many guys, and myself, we do not "enjoy" the chase. It is some type of mechanism in us that is set off, that makes us chase. More and more of your thoughts are on that woman, and you ignore other things. That is unhealthy. That is why guys stop "chasing" after a few times of going through that. I do not know to what degree we are speaking. If I were a woman I would allow the man to pursue, but also be malleable. I would accept his offers for dates, and answer his calls. A woman pursuing does not work. But neither does a man completely chasing.
fishtaco Posted February 20, 2009 Posted February 20, 2009 I wouldn't call those rules. Dating rules are more like etiquettes. They are to help the dating process become smoother, maybe to minimize damage when things go bad, and certainly for self protection. What you're talking about are more like techniques. You use techniques to successfully "get" the person when things are not going the right way. It is useful, but it's only useful for its intended purpose -- creating interest, and nothing more. It doesn't guarantee the person you "get" is a good person or the right person for you; that's a judgment call you make outside of those techniques. It doesn't guarantee relationship bliss; that takes a whole different set of skills. Once you manage to "get" the guy, the technique is a success, mission accomplished, and it no longer applies. Basically like what calazhage said... no amount of rules, techniques, whatever, can magically make the wrong guy into the right guy. But I believe techniques have their place in dating, and are useful in certain situations. Learning the techniques isn't rocket science. But knowing when to apply and which technique to use can be pretty tricky. So I would say since you got the guys, you win. Your technique is great. That's not your weak link. If you must point your finger at something, maybe you should examine 1) your judgment, are you a bad judge of character? 2) your relationship skills. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you're bad at any of those, I don't know you, I have no information to base that on. Plus most likely it's not even you, it's probably just bad luck. I'm saying _IF_ you must examine yourself and say "what do I need to change", look at those two areas first, not your "technique". You're good at that already.
Author LovieDove24 Posted February 21, 2009 Author Posted February 21, 2009 I do not know to what degree we are speaking. If I were a woman I would allow the man to pursue, but also be malleable. I would accept his offers for dates, and answer his calls. A woman pursuing does not work. But neither does a man completely chasing. Yes. You and I are on the same page. This is what I was referring to.
Author LovieDove24 Posted February 21, 2009 Author Posted February 21, 2009 Basically like what calazhage said... no amount of rules, techniques, whatever, can magically make the wrong guy into the right guy. But I believe techniques have their place in dating, and are useful in certain situations. Learning the techniques isn't rocket science. But knowing when to apply and which technique to use can be pretty tricky. So I would say since you got the guys, you win. Your technique is great. That's not your weak link. If you must point your finger at something, maybe you should examine 1) your judgment, are you a bad judge of character? 2) your relationship skills. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you're bad at any of those, I don't know you, I have no information to base that on. Plus most likely it's not even you, it's probably just bad luck. I'm saying _IF_ you must examine yourself and say "what do I need to change", look at those two areas first, not your "technique". You're good at that already. Thanks and I agree with the first two paragraphs as well. Im glad people are at least understanding me now. Maybe I wasnt clarifying well before. Its been days with a sleepless 8 month old baby...will make me kinda confoozing Anyways I agree. And I am self aware enough to proclaim that I do indeed have a problem with the actual relationship part not my initial technique. Im just at a point in my life where I don't want it to be a game, rules, technique, none of that. I just want it to be au natural. I want it to flow effortlessly. At least for as long as possible while still being realistic. When I'm trying to have a love life like that...theres no room for techniques from books! So I'm dumping "Stopped getting dumped!"
bluehare07 Posted February 21, 2009 Posted February 21, 2009 I'm sure Mr. Right will come and fetch you. Just do your best in every relationship so you won't have regrets whenever breakup happens. It's not your loss, you know?
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