Why Do WSs Keep Coming Back to OWs?

[jj33]

To you MMs out there. Why after a PA is over do some MMs keep coming back to try to reopen the door?

 

The easy answer is because you miss the piece on the side. But sex is easy to find if that is all you are looking for. I keep telling him if you want sex on the side go for it there are lots of women who would be happy to fill that gap but not me.

 

I have told him with that we took our relationship as far as it could go given the fact that he was married. There is nowhere for it to go. The status quo of the A wasnt enough for either of us and he wasnt leaving.

 

Hes still married. Still looking for ways we could be together. There is no answer other than we can be friends.

 

Why does he keep trying? The only answer that comes to mind is he thinks he will wear me down - dont worry he wont.

 

I am curious to hear from married men who have been in this position. What are you guys thinking?

 

Many thanks

 

jj

[LadyDi]

Maybe he actually likes you and wants to be near you.

[jj33]

He does he loves me I know that. But I dont see a future in anything beyond a platonic friendship unless he makes a change in his marital status.

[Lizzie60]

I'm not a MM.. but I think it could be for various reasons:

 

Maybe he really loves the OW but he loves his kids more.. and can't leave them.. (I know I wouldn't leave my kids, I guess it's the same for men)

 

Maybe he's just 'checking' to see if he can have sex again;

 

Maybe he's just checking as he misses the sex and it's a lot of trouble to try to find another OW...

 

hard to say..

[jj33]

Thanks Lizzie. I think its a combo of all of it. He loves me but he loves his life more. And he misses what we had and he is checking. Finding love and sex is not always as easy as finding sex.

[TOWinNYC]

JJ - I'm not a MM (obviously) but here's my opinion.

 

Sex is easy to find (for a man or a woman) but the CONNECTION is not - and I'm talking about that incredible mental/emotional/physical "click". That kind of magic is hard to find. And for a lot of people (not just MM) once you find it you don't want to let it go.

 

In your case, he loves you and he can't let go of the magic.

 

That doesn't mean it's fair for him to keep knocking on your door (and boy, do I know how hard that can be!). It sucks.

 

How long have you been "friends"?

[jj33]

I know. The magic... you know the A has been over for so long now that the magic is a memory. Even if he left who's to say we could ever get things back on track romantically. There was great carnage after the A ended (not a D day or anything but just between us). Wed have to start from square one you cant go back you can only move forward. But despite everything we have managed to maintain our loyalty to one another. We knew each other for several years before we became involved with one another. And its been more than a year and a half since the A ended.

 

I feel for him really. I will meet someone new eventually. But if he stays where he is, the prospects for happiness in a romantic sense are bleak. But that is his choice. It may be a choice of evils (leave a very long marriage and the only life you have ever known as an adult) or stay for the glue and fabric of the life that you have even if you are lonely within it, but it is still his choice.

 

I still dont get what he is after. He knows my stance on things. Im not changing my mind. Happy to be friends but more is not possible so ???

 

Sometimes I think he just likes to know that I still love him. That his feelings are not unrequited. That it nourishes him in some way emotionally. I get that. Everyone likes to feel that they are loved.

 

Appreciate your responses ladies. Hoping some men will respond. U91746 Matt other MMs lurking out there? Hoping one of you will see this thread.

[LucreziaBorgia]

You are like the girlfriend his parents forbade him to see in high school. Just because he knows he can't see you, and has not intention of leaving his family - that doesn't mean he has simply lost the feelings that he associated with you.

 

Once those feelings subside, you won't hear from him again but until that happens he will fish from time to time.

[OWoman]

JJ this might not be the case in your particular situation, but IME MMs tend to be high achieving types, guys who're used to having it all happen for them. If an OW dumps them, they really struggle to make sense of that. They can't believe it's REALLY over - they're sure she'll change her mind and go back to them if they persist long enough. None of the MMs I was involved with had ever been dumped before (none had had As before, either - nor were any of then looking for that, so it's not as if they're suave serial MMs either) and it really blew their heads open when I terminated them. Without exception, they did the Many Happy Returns thing, in vain, but they kept trying. Your MM may be going through the same thing - he can't really believe you'd seriously dump him, and so he's hoping, hoping you'll "come to your senses"...

[jj33]

OWoman I hate to accept it but you may be right... he's used to being deferred to based on "who he is". And used to women coming on to him as if he were a trophy to be won.

 

So the idea that I could be honored with the position of OW and choose not to accept doesnt really add up... except he did once say to me hes been through this before, OWs who cant accept the rules (hes not leaving) but it sounds like he terminated them or lets them walk.

 

Must admit there is this fantasy that he is still hanging on more than a year and a half later because of what Lucrezia said, that he still has feelings for me and a quick shag here and there just isnt the same.

 

But I suppose it doesnt matter. Hes still married and so far as I know still not planning to change the status quo.

[Trialbyfire]

The more people can't have something, the more they want it, particularly if it's something they once had.

[KismetGirl]

OWoman I hate to accept it but you may be right... he's used to being deferred to based on "who he is". And used to women coming on to him as if he were a trophy to be won.

 

So the idea that I could be honored with the position of OW and choose not to accept doesnt really add up... except he did once say to me hes been through this before, OWs who cant accept the rules (hes not leaving) but it sounds like he terminated them or lets them walk.

 

Must admit there is this fantasy that he is still hanging on more than a year and a half later because of what Lucrezia said, that he still has feelings for me and a quick shag here and there just isnt the same.

 

But I suppose it doesnt matter. Hes still married and so far as I know still not planning to change the status quo.

 

You know, I was just thinking about another MM I know. I never personally got physical with him, but he certainly tried. I admittedly tried to be nice to him because he was "up there" on the social and financial ladder, and thought he might have some good connections for me, but eventually I didn't want to lead him on. He was one of those 7-figure-income wall street guys (and strangely, also from England....I seem to find alot of those). Anyway, he told me had a basic arrangement with "OW"'s he'd meet and had in the past.....they got to be wined and dined and he'd give them financial gifts and etc, and in return he got the physical beneftis of an A without the mental hassle (it was expected that they would never ask him to leave his marriage or to expect him to give them weekend time away from his family and etc.)

 

Funny thing is, I think he actually came to quite like me on an emotional level, would get drunk and call me while on business trips to tell me he was thinking about me, and etc etc, and despite my resistance to his advances, has kept at trying to get me to give in. So in a way, I think some of these guys might be intrigued by the "I want what I can't have" thing, but I think as well when you really feell like you have this emotional connection with someone and respect them as a person, it isn't that easy to find. Yes, they are used to having women throw themselves at them, but they ARE NOT used to women that they consider to be their equals on an emotional and/or intellectual level, which I think they find intriguing. It isn't the same as a quick shag with some gold-digging woman who wants you for your social notariety. So I think, in your case, he really just misses....you. And the fact that he probably IS used to getting what he wants, is doubly frustrated that he wants something so much and still can't have it. And triply frustrated that he realizes he'll never have connection that he has with you with his W, and is still reluctant to leave that stability.

 

At the end of the day it's about comfort, sadly, and most men will stay where they are most comfortable it seems to me. The "risking it all for true love" bit seems to happen alot more in the movies for men. Which is pretty sad. Love is one of the greatest feelings in the world when it is requited, probably second only to the feeling you get when you see your child born for the first time, I would imagine. But reality and logic are often in adamant denial of emotions. Can't control how you feel, but you can control your actions, and really in the end, that's what matters most. Someone could tell you they love you over and over again but if they never show it or act on it, what's the point?

[desertmoon]

The more people can't have something, the more they want it, particularly if it's something they once had.

 

ahhhhhhh...thus my theory stands! Life/Relationship is Economics! the Law of Supply and Demand is always at play.

 

Side comment: I once jokingly referred to my MM as "my dirty little secret"....boy THAT didn't fly very well.....apparently, you can't call a successful lawyer that!

[WalkOnWater]

Appreciate your responses ladies. Hoping some men will respond. U91746 Matt other MMs lurking out there? Hoping one of you will see this thread.

 

Hi jj, I'm a MM, but my situation's different than yours. You may remember me, you helped me "get over" my feelings for the OW. I left my W so that OW and I could develop a R, but she couldn't handle the feelings of homewrecker, and she also has career way ahead of R in terms of priority. It was through help from you, LavendarGirl, OWoman, Frannie, and others that opened my eyes, and I realized she was just not that into me. I told her I would stop pressing her, and I did. Now, she texts me every week or two and says she really misses me. I miss her too, but I don't know what to do about it. So, why would a MM keep contacting you? Because he misses you. As others have said, he could find sex if he wanted to, but he misses YOU and the bond he had with you. He probably wonders about the possibility he could end his M, and he wants to keep you available in case that happens. I was in that position for a while, wondering if I wanted to stay in my M for the sake of the kids or not. If that's where he is, then he's in a really tought spot. I remember those days, lots of lost sleep, thoughts going around in circles, it was awful. So, my guess is he doesn't want to lose touch with you, wants to keep open future possibilities.

[jj33]

Thanks Walk on Water. That makes a lot of sense based on everything. As you have found, its hard to be kept "on the hook" so to speak when someone has other priorities. I have only just in the last month or so started to "break free" mentally.

 

Its odd too because being in touch is not the same as having a real relationship. And being in touch doesnt guarantee that if and when he leaves that we will have the same feelings for one another. Last year was so so brutal. There would be a lot to get over and trust to rebuild etc etc. Its like I didnt lose my love and respect for him, but it was so tortured between us that I am not blindly in love the way I was.

 

But maybe that is healthy. Its highly unlikely he will ever man up and leave as you did. If he did who is to say we would end up together? If we did, a relationship needs a stronger foundation than those warm tingly feelings.

 

There are a lot of huge "and ifs" there. But if given the improbability of all that we were able to overcome all the bloodshed, it would certainly say alot about the strength of our relationship.

 

Am trying to look at it compassionately, it cant be easy to be struggling with should I leave or shouldnt I. Especially when we have not been together in so long. He no longer has the safety of knowing that if he left, we would be together. To my mind that is not a good reason to leave anyway, but I think it makes people feel better knowing that there is a cushion on the other side.

 

But, thats not my job am not a cushion. Can almost hear him saying we should take up again and in and he will think more about leaving. Not going to happen.

 

Hope you are doing better Walk on Water.

[Owl]

The MM keeps "coming back" because he doesn't share your view on the end of the relationship.

 

He still thinks the door is open. He thinks that he stands a chance of getting what he wants out of this...and suggesting ANY kind of continued interaction with him feeds into his beliefs.

 

That's one more reason why you can't go LC with a former affair partner. It's either NC...or it's going to remain like this.

 

In other words...he's not suffered a consequence for his actions...and he's going to keep trying to resume the affair until he DOES suffer a consequence. Either he gets "busted" by his wife (or someone else where it hurts him), or you SLAM that door in his face so clearly that it dashes his hopes that he can still hook up with you.

 

It's really that simple. Not easy...but simple.

[jj33]

Maybe its my vanity but Id like to think that not getting to see me or spend time with me even over coffee for many moons is a big big consequence in and of itself.

 

Owl I cant disagree NC is easier but simply not in my best interests in this case.

 

And he KNOWS he cant just hook up with me. That is very very very clear and in his face. He wouldnt ever ask me to hook up with him. He simply wouldnt because he knows the response would be nuclear and he doesnt want to us to be on bad terms as we would be if ever suggested it.

[Owl]

To you MMs out there. Why after a PA is over do some MMs keep coming back to try to reopen the door?

 

The easy answer is because you miss the piece on the side. But sex is easy to find if that is all you are looking for. I keep telling him if you want sex on the side go for it there are lots of women who would be happy to fill that gap but not me.

 

I have told him with that we took our relationship as far as it could go given the fact that he was married. There is nowhere for it to go. The status quo of the A wasnt enough for either of us and he wasnt leaving.

 

Hes still married. Still looking for ways we could be together. There is no answer other than we can be friends.

 

Why does he keep trying? The only answer that comes to mind is he thinks he will wear me down - dont worry he wont.

 

I am curious to hear from married men who have been in this position. What are you guys thinking?

 

Many thanks

 

jj

 

Doesn't jibe with:

 

And he KNOWS he cant just hook up with me. That is very very very clear and in his face. He wouldnt ever ask me to hook up with him. He simply wouldnt because he knows the response would be nuclear and he doesnt want to us to be on bad terms as we would be if ever suggested it.

 

I don't get it. Is he trying to get back with you, or isn't he? I'm just not tracking here...

[jj33]

Sorry Owl. I think I took issue with your use of the term "hook up" because to me it implies some tawdry little affair where someone comes by has sex and goes away until next time..... We spent substantial amounts of time together. There was no "hooking up" if what you mean by that is dropping by for a few hours having sex or leaving and going home to sleep next to his wife. That was never ever part of our relationship. No I stand corrected, it happened once and it was so distasteful to both of us (that he had to go home in the evening) that it never happened again.

 

If what you meant by hook up was recommencing the relationship, neither of can continue the relationship the way that it was. The only way we could be together again (since I dont do hook ups...) is for him to be single. And he knows that.

 

Hence my question.

[Owl]

OK...so is he still trying to continue the affair with you?

 

Or is he divorcing his wife so that he can pursue his relationship with you?

 

You didn't really make it clear what exactly it is that he's doing or not doing right now.

 

If he's still trying to continue the affair...then it's because he believes that if he keeps pushing you, you'll resume the affair with him. He doesn't believe the door is closed. And as I said...he "got away" with the affair with you before...suffered no consequences such as his wife finding out or whatever...and he believes that it's possible to get you to resume.

 

He wouldn't keep trying if he completely shared your belief that resuming the affair was not an option.

[jj33]

Im not sure. Time will tell. My sense is that he is thinking about leaving. Not that he will leave, but he is thinking about it. I would be very surprised if he ever pulled the trigger. I know your next question will be why do I think that, not ready to discuss in a public forum.

 

I think what Walk on Water said makes alot of sense. He is grappling with his position. No more me, but then his marriage is intact such as it is because as you say, its not that he never got caught (she knew and I believe she knew it was me) but there were never any real repurcussions. I think she was displeased that he let it get "out of control" but we havent ever discussed in detail. Not my business what goes on between them.

 

he knows I wont go back to the A. I guess he is just I dont know. Just trying to figure out what to do with himself. Hes not young but hes got a good 20-30 years left and he has to decide how he wants to live them.

 

In the meantime my life goes on. No I havent dated anyone but that is as much a consequence of overwork and being older as anything else. Its not because of him it was initially, but it hasnt been for quite some time.

[WalkOnWater]

...its not that he never got caught (she knew and I believe she knew it was me) but there were never any real repurcussions.

 

Never any real repurcussions??? That's amazing, I would think there would be huge ones. In my case, when my W found out, the repurcussions were dramatic. If your xMM and his W had no real repurcussions, that indicates not much of a R between them, just a M of convenience.

 

I guess he is just I dont know. Just trying to figure out what to do with himself. Hes not young but hes got a good 20-30 years left and he has to decide how he wants to live them.

 

I had that same decision. I realized I only have one life to live and couldn't let it slide by on cruise control. He may be facing the same reality. It's not easy no matter what choice he makes. In the meantime, he doesn't want to lose touch with you.

[jj33]

You got it in one WOW it is that indeed a marriage of convenience. I hope for his sake it wasnt always that way.

 

But at this point they have children grandchildren friends they have known since childhood, extended family, business contacts through that family etc etc. There is a fabric to their life and a glue even if they dont have much of a relationship and you have no idea how appalling the distance is. Things I couldnt say on the board because it would be indiscreet. But they go on vacations etc etc on the surface they are the perfect Leave it Beaver family.

 

If he had left and we had been together, life with me would have been vastly different. And he would not have had half that sort of freedom, hopefully he wouldnt have wanted it, but who knows.

 

So Walk on Water it sounds like he thinks I am his back up girl... that really bugs me. I am nobodys back up.

 

Back to the same old thing. If you dont know what you want, you dont want what you have....

 

But of course he does know what he wants. He wants to clone himself so we could resume our relationship and he could maintain the status quo. perhaps in a parallel universe...

[WalkOnWater]

But at this point they have children grandchildren friends they have known since childhood, extended family, business contacts through that family etc etc. There is a fabric to their life and a glue even if they dont have much of a relationship and you have no idea how appalling the distance is.

 

That reminds me of a book wildsoul referred me to, Surviving Your Boyfriend's Divorce. It had a quote in it about divorce not simply being the end of a relationship, but the end of a mini-civilization. You're basically saying the same thing, and are smart to realize it.

 

But of course he does know what he wants. He wants to clone himself so we could resume our relationship and he could maintain the status quo. perhaps in a parallel universe...

 

Clone myself in a parallel universe, that's EXACTLY what I would've wanted, but didn't realize it until you wrote that. I wish those physicists would figure out how to do that

[jj33]

I never asked him to leave or even mentioned it. But he brought it up once and said you if he ever left he would always be looking over his shoulder it would change who his is. That makes sense to me, the marriage and everything that goes with it (not his w mind you) defines his whole life. Its the only life he has known as an adult and her extended family is very all encompassing. They permeate every level of his life, social business etc. It would be so much to walk away from. And they have a really big house and staff so its not like they have to spend much time together when they are home alone and they are rarely alone constantly entertaining.

 

So I guess I will assume he is busy talking to physicists looking into the cloning process because unless the distance has increased to a point where he just cant stand it anymore, I dont see him making any changes in his life. And I dont wish that for him (that he would have to dismantle his life). I would like to think he can find more happiness at home. I would like to believe that he is happy tho I know at this point he is not.

 

Thanks Walk on Water. Did you like that book?