Geishawhelk Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 I'm sure Geishawhelk would agree that killing by proxy is no better, and possibly worse. Thank you. You're right. I would. (should have double-quoted). We're getting off-topic. Does anyone still love me for my mind, now they know what I've done with my hands up a chicken's @$$....?
clv0116 Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 There's no sure fire way to catch or keep a man. He's either into you, as is, or he's not. The implication seems to be that there's no use improving oneself as a woman which is completely false. Hit that treadmill hard for a few years and the odds of it making a difference in your results with the opposite sex are pretty high. Attitude adjustments are often almost as effective.
iceis44 Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 I hate to break the news to you but that's not really a terribly difficult skill to master and therefore only differentiates you from the fraction of a percent with serious sexual hangups. Ha, I have heard more complaints in my lifetime about "2 minute men" and "shes cold as a fish" than I have ever heard about "my wife can't pluck a chicken"
Trialbyfire Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 The implication seems to be that there's no use improving oneself as a woman which is completely false. Hit that treadmill hard for a few years and the odds of it making a difference in your results with the opposite sex are pretty high. Attitude adjustments are often almost as effective. That's a pretty superficial view of attraction. I'm talking about what's inside of you. Unless you're willing to make core changes, you are as you are. Don't hide or play games.
clv0116 Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 That's a pretty superficial view of attraction. What's on the outside is really important to most men whether you like it, or they admit it, or not. After a few decades you have history and a shared loyalty but as for why one is married and another not ... it's not because your book lists are similar. Ha, I have heard more complaints in my lifetime about "2 minute men" and "shes cold as a fish" ... Well that's interesting, I never get or issue those complaints, nor do any of my friends (men of course) say anything like that. In fact the one complaint I heard so far this year was a guy describing why he was dumping his GF - "All she needs to do is just hold the )(*& still for 10 minutes for ^$%$$^ sake. What's hard about that?"
Trialbyfire Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 What's on the outside is really important to most men whether you like it, or they admit it, or not. After a few decades you have history and a shared loyalty but as for why one is married and another not ... it's not because your book lists are similar. Attracting someone and having a viable relationship with someone...worthwhile...are two different things. Each person can have a number of suitors or options by being attractive but when it grinds down to anything long-term, good luck with the superficiality. What you'll find is that the minute she or you lose your looks, is the minute the other person is no longer interested. You may find this acceptable as a man. What you won't find acceptable is if she finds someone who isn't balding, gaining a gut or just plain has more internal substance, than someone trapped in the superficial.
boxing123 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Any woman can sleep with, or date a man. The question is how to keep him. That takes actual work, and effort. These days the fact that you are giving a man sex means almost nothing, as he can get that anywhere. It is not 1820. Women are busy working on themselves. Their looks, their careers, etc. And that is very admirable. Great. But that does not mean you are entitled to a relationship, or a husband. Men want a woman who brings the feminine side he is lacking. Someone that respects him, follows him, and actually does tangible things for him. Such as cook. If you can make him feel special, chances are he won't even cheat. If you are "equals" and you are not very feminine, he will find it elsewhere.
anne1707 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Men want a woman who brings the feminine side he is lacking. Someone that respects him, follows him, and actually does tangible things for him. Such as cook. If you can make him feel special, chances are he won't even cheat. If you are "equals" and you are not very feminine, he will find it elsewhere. I love Boxing123. Just as I think he cannot get worse..... :laugh::laugh:
clv0116 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 What you'll find is that the minute she or you lose your looks, is the minute the other person is no longer interested. One thing I have learned over the years is that men look at women in an almost completely different way than women look at men. Like it or not it seems to be a natural law. One consequence of this is that women are well served to use their youth and beauty to attract a mate and impress themselves into his life before the gifts nature gave them fade. Sorry if reality doesn't toe the party line. Men are generally cursed with a strong sense of fair play, but to really play on it a woman has to create a strong pair bond and remain in a feminine role. If she exits that role and becomes 'one of the guys' she should expect to be treated as such.
Trialbyfire Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Gross generalizations of gender, based on personal preferences, is one way to view the world. "This is my truth so it must be your truth!"
clv0116 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Statistically correct and correct for everyone are not the same in the least either, but it's the way to bet. I know it's easy to mock when the truth stings, but try to stay objective if you can.
Trialbyfire Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 The human psychy is very easy to manipulate. Why the need is, what people should question about themselves, at core. In telling women that all men look for is someone hawt, with the rest mattering not at all, is a way to put someone into their place by playing on insecurities. That's malicious action and incredibly self-serving. People need to review their predatory behaviours and realize that in doing this, they're not really the predators, just the insecure, hoping to leverage off others. It's disrespectful to others and information that should be tossed in the garbage, due to its self-serving nature. You cannot make something the truth. You can only fool yourself and possibly others in believing it's the truth. It's foolish indeed.
boxing123 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 What is wrong with what I said at all? Ladies, you do not like men to do things for you? You can say whatever you like, but most women either want a man to pay for things, fix things, drive, plan,protect etc, or any combination of the above. So why is it odd that men want to keep a woman that does things for them that they need? Do you think men yearn for and seek a "manly" female? Are you seeking a "feminine" man? Funny how on all these threads a man's income is so important. Or if the female makes good money the man's income must at least "be equal" . Well not exactly all about love is it? Well men value age,looks, and personality above a woman's income. Each sex has their preferences. If you are an older "independent" female, your pool of men whom will marry you is smaller. If you are a man with a lower income and vertically challenged your pool of women whom will marry you is smaller. So?
boxing123 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 To be completely honest, I am very surprised at many female's complete lack of logical thinking when it comes to keeping a man. Now obviously, any man in question that you want to marry would have other choices. He already has a career, decent looking, good height, etc. So what makes you better than other women? He does not need your second income to live. Just being you means you are entitled to the lifetime devotion of a man? When a man marries he is giving up all freedom, some hobbies, some friends, and more importantly his future financial security and his ability to sleep with a variety of women. So he MUST be getting something tangible in return. We all know your looks will fade, and there will always be younger and hotter.And sex is easy to get these days, so he can get that anywhere. What can you offer? He is already giving you a lot. So you have to give something. If it is only company and a second income that isn't good enough. Any woman can give that. Men grab and keep the more stable/submissive/nurturing/feminine types. I know if you are not that type you hate to hear it, but that is reality.
clv0116 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 The human psychy is very easy to manipulate. .... In telling women that all men look for is someone hawt, with the rest mattering not at all, is a way to put someone into their place by playing on insecurities. Never said it's all they look for, but it's what they notice first, and second isn't your wonderful career or you cat collection. Men will notice a fit pretty woman, and if she has feminine qualities and home making skills she enhances her chances of keeping him. So they can buy this BS book and waste time and money or do what I said and get results. *shrug* Up to you.
zicke Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 To be completely honest, I am very surprised at many female's complete lack of logical thinking when it comes to keeping a man. Now obviously, any man in question that you want to marry would have other choices. He already has a career, decent looking, good height, etc. So what makes you better than other women? He does not need your second income to live. Just being you means you are entitled to the lifetime devotion of a man? When a man marries he is giving up all freedom, some hobbies, some friends, and more importantly his future financial security and his ability to sleep with a variety of women. So he MUST be getting something tangible in return. We all know your looks will fade, and there will always be younger and hotter.And sex is easy to get these days, so he can get that anywhere. What can you offer? He is already giving you a lot. So you have to give something. If it is only company and a second income that isn't good enough. Any woman can give that. Men grab and keep the more stable/submissive/nurturing/feminine types. I know if you are not that type you hate to hear it, but that is reality. I am guessing you are in your 20's or are a very immature 30's guy. Newsflash, men's "looks" fade as well. And there are younger and hotter men chasing older women as well. Women can get sex much easier than men can, and any man can give company and a second income as well. Yes, and just being who I am is good enough for a man that I am dating. I have a personality, you either will click with it or not, If it isn't, it's good enough for some other man. I have options. A lot of them. Don't kid yourself thinking that most women don't. They do. I was asked out three times this week by men I've never met before. In addition, with the divorce rates, a woman in her 40's-50's-60's has just a great a chance of meeting and falling in love with a man as a woman in her 20's does. I'm in my 40's, damn sexy, dating a damn sexy man in his 40's. I am dating him because I like him, his personality, his masculinity, who he is. Not because I am looking for a free ride, which I doubt he would be able to give. I don't need his money, and I don't want children, and I don't want to get married. If what I have is not "good enough" in his opinion, he is free to go find someone more to his liking. Most men are looking for a companion, a sex partner and ultimately love. Most men aren't constantly looking to one up the woman they are in love with, and most men have much more compassion, patience and trust in their hearts than you have. In addition, I have yet to meet a man who wants a completely submissive doormat who does everything at his whim. Yes, men want a woman who looks good, keeps herself in good shape, dresses well, loves men, loves sex and has minimal baggage. Men want a woman with an opinion. But they don't want a ball breaker. Femininity is the key. Not Hotness, Youngness and complete submissiveness. You think that dangling marriage in front of women is a free pass to be an ass. It's not. And you better hope that you only meet women who's only goal is marriage if you insist on using that to get your needs met. I would never want the man I am with to stop his hobbies or not hang out with his friends, it's a part of what makes him him. And women who do, are going down the wrong path. You are deluding yourself and your take on your own sex if you think any different. Your base problem is that you haven't realized yet that women have personalities. Women are not interchangeable. And women are more than their looks. You need to learn that lesson.
boxing123 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Yawn.... I agree, all women have options for sex.. Men approaching you want sex, not to marry you. Younger men always approach women in their 40's, as they think they are easier. I thought we were talking about which women men want to keep and marry, not have sex with. I love when women tell men what they want. If men are being honest, then of course they are immature/inexperienced, etc. Time to shame them, or call the names. What you are doing is so obvious. You are a middle aged woman. So, naturally you are trying to believe that you are exactly what men want. You say "Men do not care about hotness, youth, want a woman with an opinion, want a companion, want love, a non- submissive woman" , or in other words they want someone whom is just like you, or wants the exact things you want. Convenient for you I suppose, and unfortunate for those younger beautiful women whom would be more on the feminine submissive side..Must be HUGE market for older opinionated women I did not know about. If men were all about love they would be reading romance novels, and not buying porn magazines. I never heard a man in my life say "I just want a companion", and submissive is far from "doormat". But believe what you wish. Men think of and seek power, success, and sex. Not exactly love, companionship, and older women with opinions.
norajane Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 This thread cracks me up. It's certainly not news to any woman that men like attractive women. The cosmetics, hair, and fashion industries wouldn't exist otherwise. However, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and once you attract them with your looks and femininity, personality also comes into play. And that's where the great divide is. Men can't be lumped into one category, and neither can women. Some men appreciate an athletic, sports loving, hot wings and beer eating girl. Others like them to appreciate scifi and Warcraft. Others admire the ladies who can debate the merits of Obama's infrastructure plan. Others are into women who can use a blow torch to solder a cracked pipe or to carmelize a creme brulee. And on and on, ad infinitum. I think the only thing you can say about all men, is that they appreciate a woman who makes them feel like superman. So that book is silly if it's trying to tell you what kind of personality to have, as all men do not appreciate the same things in women. Might as well be yourself and attract a man who is attract to who you are.
fral945 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Intellectual attraction the main factor in keeping a man long-term? Looks like someone is trying to sell a book or website. If intellectual stimulation was a high priority then most men would be married to college professors, doctors, and lawyers. That article is mostly hot air. IMO it starts with physical attraction and stimulation for men. Beyond that, if you exhibit enough feminine qualities and have fairly compatible beliefs and values you will likely have long-term potential. It's not rocket science.
clv0116 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 This thread cracks me up. It's certainly not news to any woman that men like attractive women. The cosmetics, hair, and fashion industries wouldn't exist otherwise. However, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and once you attract them with your looks and femininity, personality also comes into play. And that's where the great divide is. Men can't be lumped into one category, and neither can women. Some men appreciate an athletic, sports loving, hot wings and beer eating girl. Others like them to appreciate scifi and Warcraft. Others admire the ladies who can debate the merits of Obama's infrastructure plan. Others are into women who can use a blow torch to solder a cracked pipe or to carmelize a creme brulee. And on and on, ad infinitum. I think the only thing you can say about all men, is that they appreciate a woman who makes them feel like superman. So that book is silly if it's trying to tell you what kind of personality to have, as all men do not appreciate the same things in women. Might as well be yourself and attract a man who is attract to who you are. That's a pretty damn good post.
boxing123 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 I think the only thing you can say about all men, is that they appreciate a woman who makes them feel like superman. I think we agree, but are wording it differently. I would call that woman a more "submissive" or "traditional" or "old fashioned' woman. How does she make him feel like superman? Certainly has little to do with her career. Men seek that feeling from a woman. Not necessarily or exactly "love". I think women more or less seek love. When a woman can make a man feel like that, he gives her true love. No matter how good she looks, or how much money she makes, it is hard to truly "love" a woman whom does not make you feel the way you described.
allina Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Men want a woman who brings the feminine side he is lacking. Someone that respects him, follows him, and actually does tangible things for him. Such as cook. If you can make him feel special, chances are he won't even cheat. If you are "equals" and you are not very feminine, he will find it elsewhere. I somewhat agree with this, thought I have an issue with one thing. Why do you consider being feminine and cooking as being unequal? You want a woman who cooks and is feminine yet you consider that to be beneath you. Why wouldn't you look at a woman who cherishes you and likes to cook for you as your equal?
norajane Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 I think we agree, but are wording it differently. I would call that woman a more "submissive" or "traditional" or "old fashioned' woman. How does she make him feel like superman? Certainly has little to do with her career. So that's your criteria of what it takes to make you feel like superman. Different men have different criteria for what a woman does and how she treats them that makes them feel like superman.
boxing123 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Nora, I did not even list my criteria as to what would make me feel like superman. Some things are hard to word. I know what sexy is when I see it, but I cannot define it. I know when a woman makes me feel that way, and it is also hard to define. I do know many women have no clue as to make any man feel that way, as they are thinking men want something else. Allina, We are equal, but different. Many women use the word equal as in complete division of responsibilities down the middle. That is the "equal" that does not make sense to me. An "equal" they do not even want. The above type of "equal" is actually lowering yourself to an inferior version of a man.
clv0116 Posted January 17, 2009 Posted January 17, 2009 Different men have different criteria for what a woman does and how she treats them that makes them feel like superman. Of course we're all unique, just like everyone else The fact remains however that largely the same survival pressures have shaped all men and women and when it comes to mating behavior men are more alike than they are different, and the same goes for women. Most of the differences, while fascinating, are not really core differences. If you look at what men do, you will see the similarity among them, and if you look at what women do you will see it also. What we say, what we think is right, wrong etc. is strongly informed by society but in the end instinct is a powerful force. Seems to work OK, we're fairly prolific as a species.
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