Not sure how to handle this

[Mio]

I am in a somewhat unusual situation (I think). I'll try to explain it as simply as I can.

 

About 25 years ago, I met my first girlfriend. We fell deeply in love and after four years, we set a wedding date. A couple of weeks before we were due to marry, she called it off after discovering that I had taken money from our joint bank account (it's a long story). Instead of talking it out, the relationship ended right there and we never spoke again.

 

I was devastated for years and years, and the loss of her cast a pall across my romantic life. I married after a few years, but could never truly give myself over to my wife. After 12 years, I chose to separate.

 

I had never found the courage to confront my ex-fiancée and ask her what had happened. Now in my early 40's, I finally found the strength to write to her and ask just that. At first, she gave me a cold response, explaining that she was happily married with five children and leading a very successful life. This hurt more than I could describe, and I felt terribly invalidated. After a few days, I wrote back and shared my imperfect life story with her.

 

That seemed to crack her façade. She dropped the pretence and asked to meet me, to have the talk we should have had 20 years earlier. We met in a public place for propriety's sake. When she saw me, she threw her arms around me and held me tight for at least ten minutes. In that instant, she was 17 again. It was a very strange and powerful moment. We sat for hours and answered each other's questions at length. We had prepared so much for this meeting - lists of questions, photos, letters etc. - all aimed at giving each other closure in a single afternoon.

 

It turned out that both us had been deeply affected by our break-up. She had broken up with me, she said, because she knew we had a powerful bond together and if she stayed, she would never leave, no matter how bad it got. She was frightened and shut her feelings right down. One year later, she met her future husband. His lack of affection and stability felt safe, but ultimately unfulfilling. She lamented that he did not cherish her, and never had.

 

We cried, exchanged parting letters and agreed to not speak again. But the power of that meeting - of thawing a cryogenically frozen relationship - was undeniable. We met a few more times. I tried so hard to avoid physicality, but our old sexual chemistry was just as strong as ever. Some couples just have it. Inevitably, we slept together. We even had several incredibly romantic dates in secret.

 

In 9 months, we slept together only twice. After the first time, I tried so hard not to ever let it happen again. I hated hurting her, and I was uncomfortable thinking that I was risking her marriage. In emails, I spoke again and again of wanting to do "the right thing", and asking her to attempt the restoration of her marriage. I even sat her down a couple of months ago, after our chemistry was threatening to engulf us once more, and said we shouldn't write each other for a while.

 

She wrote me at Christmas while on holidays interstate. She was consoling her best friend, who was in the beginnings of a separation from her second husband. That man was there with them, and was making inappropriate advances on my ex. She felt lonely and weak, and I feared for her well-being. Nothing serious has happened, and I suspect nothing will up there. But I am still concerned.

 

This brings me to the point of all this. I can still feel that incredible chemistry with her, and I feel my resolve weakening once more. As usual in my life, my compassion leads to my undoing. Life was so straightforward when I felt the power of my values, and I could look her in the eye and say, "I don't want to have an affair. I don't want to be that person. And I don't want to hurt you. I care about you deeply, but I am not in love with you."

 

But if she came to my front door now - and she inevitably will one day soon - how will I turn her away? How can I possibly feel justified in what will happen? What happened to my values?

[bentnotbroken]

Did you have any values? If you do, nothing and no one can make you walk away from them. You know what you are doing is wrong, so don't' open the door if she shows up.

[LavendarGirl]

Continue on and you're surely setting up a situation where ultimately her happy marriage and her family life will suffer severely. There's no graceful/honest way for her to maintain her family and marriage and have an affair with you at the same time.

[Mio]

Continue on and you're surely setting up a situation where ultimately her happy marriage and her family life will suffer severely. There's no graceful/honest way for her to maintain her family and marriage and have an affair with you at the same time.

 

 

That's the problem though - she doesn't have a happy marriage. I've made it clear that I don't want to have an affair, nor am I placing myself in her romantic future. I try to speak only as a friend in our correspondence.

 

But am I kidding myself? Maybe that's what I'm really asking. Can I really be a friend to her?

[bentnotbroken]

That's the problem though - she doesn't have a happy marriage. I've made it clear that I don't want to have an affair, nor am I placing myself in her romantic future. I try to speak only as a friend in our correspondence.

 

But am I kidding myself? Maybe that's what I'm really asking. Can I really be a friend to her?

 

 

No you can't. You have had sex with her, how do you just go back to being a friend, you have crossed the line. You just can't pretend nothing happened.

[Mio]

No you can't. You have had sex with her, how do you just go back to being a friend, you have crossed the line. You just can't pretend nothing happened.

 

Does that mean that people who have had sex can never be friends ever again?

[LavendarGirl]

Does that mean that people who have had sex can never be friends ever again?

 

Mio, I am in a very similar situation to yours, and in an affair with my lost love of 26 years. I am here to tell you...as much as you want to be her friend...it is because you want to have a part of her, if even a slice. Because losing all of her is too heartwrenching. You may be friends in the sense that you are supporting her and her endeavours and vice versa. But the desire will not wane, nor will the temptation.

 

You said when you first called her, she said she was happily married with five kids. Realize that your being in her life as you are now is only damaging her marriage, and she is having to lie and deceive her H in order to see or communicate with you.

 

Oh, and as much as the label is all icky and everything...you are having an affair.

[Mio]

I am here to tell you...as much as you want to be her friend...it is because you want to have a part of her, if even a slice.

 

That might be true. I think secretly I know that part of her belongs to me, and maybe always will. In that sense, I feel guilty because I am coming between her and her husband, no matter what contact I have. I have tried to talk her out of this many times. She hates this cool-talking side of me, which she calls "Dr Mio".

 

I know that she believes in the fairytale that society sold her on. I am trying to gently talk her out of it, but I really only make any headway with her when I am empathic and compassionate. That then tends to open the door to my own feelings. Even though I don't disclose them, I still feel that temptation lurking within.

 

Do I just abandon her to her unhappy marriage? She has gone to marital counselling, partly at my urging. I don't know what is the right thing anymore. I feel like this an example of Colin Powell's "Pottery Barn" rule. I feel like I broke it!

[LavendarGirl]

Well Doc , if you stay in where you are, you are propping up her unhappy marriage. She continues to pretend to her H that all is well, he senses that things are getting worse and not better. She continues to get her emotional and intimacy needs met by you, while the H is wondering what happened to the woman he married.

 

Where do you see her situation in a year if you are on the sidelines as her comfort and solace? In three years? Ask yourself honestly. Where do you see this all going? Yeah, I know, you've already played these scenarios in your head, you're a smart guy. But you see what I'm talking about.

 

The party line advice is that she needs to fix or leave her marriage. Granted. Difficult to set her down and walk away quietly when you have so much of your heart vested with this woman. I know. It's the dilemma. If you love her, you got to let her choose the right path all on her own.

[Mio]

Thanks LG. I'm not really disagreeing with your conclusions. I think I just need to talk this out, to work out what is in my head. This discussion is really helping.

 

She hasn't pretended to her DH that all is well. He knows they are in crisis. She hates him because he doesn't "cherish" her. She has another platonic male friend who gives her the emotional support she needs, and has for many years.

 

It's all a terribly sad situation. I do care about her, very much, but I'm not in love with her. This is not a fantasy for me. I explained this all to her in November and felt I had let her go. I felt very good that I could honour my values like that.

 

I think I fear that she won't find the right path by herself. It's terribly presumptuous of me to say that, I know. I have now appeared twice in her life, given her a terribly unrealistic sample of "love", and then I'm gone. What will it take for her to stop believing in The Fairytale?

[bentnotbroken]

Thanks LG. I'm not really disagreeing with your conclusions. I think I just need to talk this out, to work out what is in my head. This discussion is really helping.

 

She hasn't pretended to her DH that all is well. He knows they are in crisis. She hates him because he doesn't "cherish" her. She has another platonic male friend who gives her the emotional support she needs, and has for many years.

 

It's all a terribly sad situation. I do care about her, very much, but I'm not in love with her. This is not a fantasy for me. I explained this all to her in November and felt I had let her go. I felt very good that I could honour my values like that.

 

I think I fear that she won't find the right path by herself. It's terribly presumptuous of me to say that, I know. I have now appeared twice in her life, given her a terribly unrealistic sample of "love", and then I'm gone. What will it take for her to stop believing in The Fairytale?

 

 

You can't live her life for her. You can't make help her make life decisions. You aren't in her character or her psyche. Her choices with her H(just like her choices with you)are her's to make. And no you can't be friends with a MW who you had sex with. If you think that it is okay to do, then go tell her H that you had sex with her and ask him if you can still be her friend.

[Mio]

You can't make help her make life decisions.

 

Why not? Isn't that what friends do all the time? I don't really understand what you meant about not being in her "psyche".

 

go tell her H that you had sex with her and ask him if you can still be her friend.

 

Obvious solution = don't tell him!

[LavendarGirl]

Hi Mio,

Alrighty...your MW is pretending to her H that there isn't an A going on (or has gone on), though I'm assuming it didn't come up in MC.

 

Very definitely, she may take the wrong path for her. Or take several wrong paths. It's her choice, and you can't guide her to the right ones, know which are the right ones to take even, and hold her hand through the process. She's got her big girl britches on, she'll manage okay. You've got to take a deep breath and believe that she'll be okay in the end.

 

Also, not your job to disspell her dream of the Fairytale. You may be speaking from the heart OR you may be speaking out of guilt, but I'm reading you say that her Fairytale doesn't include you. She may still find Mr. Right out there for her in the future, someone who's not her current H and not you (or she may rekindle something between her H with some effort and MC). It's just no way to determine that for her.

 

Good that you let her go in November. Stick to your guns.

 

You do feel guilt in that you feel responsible for giving her false hopes? I think that's what you're saying perhaps?

[Mio]

Also, not your job to disspell her dream of the Fairytale. You may be speaking from the heart OR you may be speaking out of guilt, but I'm reading you say that her Fairytale doesn't include you. She may still find Mr. Right out there for her in the future, someone who's not her current H and not you (or she may rekindle something between her H with some effort and MC). It's just no way to determine that for her.

 

Good that you let her go in November. Stick to your guns.

 

You do feel guilt in that you feel responsible for giving her false hopes? I think that's what you're saying perhaps?

 

Oh wow, LG! Now we're really getting down to it, aren't we! I think you're right. I do feel guilty for sparking her hopes. For once suggesting that we might have a future one day. I shot that down in November.

 

I would like her to have the fairytale - with her DH preferably. He is the father of her children after all. Some are very young, so she is bound to him for some time in any case.

 

Maybe you're right. Maybe I do just need to trust that she will find her way. The day will come soon enough when I have a new partner, and I won't want to betray her trust in me by continuing to have a friendship with my ex.

[lkjh]

Dude, you are not her friend. You seeked out a married woman and got her to cheat on her H and children. You are the OM and she does not love you. Sorry I know it is harsh but if her H found out she would throw you under the bus. You would quickly see how much she really loves her H.

[bentnotbroken]

Why not? Isn't that what friends do all the time? I don't really understand what you meant about not being in her "psyche".

Her psyche= what is really in her mind, what her real intentions are. What her real reason for continuing to contact you. This is a person who you don't know how life has changed her. It is obvious that it changed her enough to cheat on her family. What else is there.

 

 

 

 

 

Obvious solution = don't tell him!

No, the obvious would have been not to sleep with his wife in the first place. But if you think you can still be her friend and help her after having sex with her, I think the right thing to do would be for her H to know what he is really dealing with and have the same opportunity that she had.

[Mio]

Her psyche= what is really in her mind, what her real intentions are. What her real reason for continuing to contact you. This is a person who you don't know how life has changed her. It is obvious that it changed her enough to cheat on her family. What else is there.

 

I'm still not getting you. I know I can't see into her mind - that's why we talk, yes? We have achingly honest talks together. These are not "I love you" talks, rather the kind where we talk about what we each believe is important in life.

 

I haven't just come along and "changed her". Her marriage was already in crisis long before I re-appeared.

 

 

No, the obvious would have been not to sleep with his wife in the first place. But if you think you can still be her friend and help her after having sex with her, I think the right thing to do would be for her H to know what he is really dealing with and have the same opportunity that she had.

Why? Why is that the "right" thing to do?

[bentnotbroken]

I'm still not getting you. I know I can't see into her mind - that's why we talk, yes? We have achingly honest talks together. These are not "I love you" talks, rather the kind where we talk about what we each believe is important in life.

 

I haven't just come along and "changed her". Her marriage was already in crisis long before I re-appeared.

 

 

Why? Why is that the "right" thing to do?

 

 

Because you both are allowing him to live a lie. Yes, her marriage was clearly not what it should have been if she was willing to lay down with another man, but to keep that man in the dark to all the truth is cruel and wrong. He should at least have the truth so that he can be tested for STD's. You may believe that you are the only one she cheated with, but that doesn't make it so. His life should mean more to one of you at least.

 

You can't change a marriage, but you can remove yourself from the equation completely. You are a crutch and an enabler. You are enabling her to continue the farce she is perpetrating against her H.

[Mio]

He should at least have the truth so that he can be tested for STD's. You may believe that you are the only one she cheated with, but that doesn't make it so. His life should mean more to one of you at least.

 

Actually, we were both tested for STDs. And she stopped sleeping with her husband for a while as a protest, so it was a moot point in his case.

 

Am I an enabler. Maybe so. How does that make me different to her other platonic male friend?

[bentnotbroken]

Actually, we were both tested for STDs. And she stopped sleeping with her husband for a while as a protest, so it was a moot point in his case.

 

Am I an enabler. Maybe so. How does that make me different to her other platonic male friend?

 

 

You aren't platonic and unless you both have been tested every six months and were actually in her home to see she didn't have sex with her H, you only know what she told you.

[Mio]

You aren't platonic and unless you both have been tested every six months and were actually in her home to see she didn't have sex with her H, you only know what she told you.

 

You're going to have to take it on faith that he doesn't have an STD. Nor does she, and nor do I. I don't understand why are so fixated about this. I had sex with her twice. I'm not proud of that. But I'm not promiscuous.

 

Giving me a "facts of life" talk isn't helping. I'm not sleeping with her now and not planning to. I asked the question at the start, "What will I do when she shows up at my door?" To paraphrase your own words, you are not in my psyche. I will not suddenly invoke your conscience and act accordingly. It has to be my conscience.

 

Reason with me, but don't tell me what to do.

[bentnotbroken]

As I said before you assume she was telling you the truth. My concern isn't for you or her, but her H. What you do when she shows up at your door.....well we can only assume you will eventually get to the right thing. Her H on the other hand...............................

[Mio]

I talked to her husband on the phone a few months ago. He didn't threaten me, he just said that he was scared of losing her. He knew that she and I had a strong connection that the two of them would likely never have. That conversation really affected me.

 

I've actually wondered if maybe he is having an affair himself. He behaved inappropriately with a friend of mine when they met earlier this year.

 

Life is full of surprises!

[bentnotbroken]

I talked to her husband on the phone a few months ago. He didn't threaten me, he just said that he was scared of losing her. He knew that she and I had a strong connection that the two of them would likely never have. That conversation really affected me.

 

I've actually wondered if maybe he is having an affair himself. He behaved inappropriately with a friend of mine when they met earlier this year.

 

Life is full of surprises!

 

 

Indeed it is.

[LavendarGirl]

Oh wow, LG! Now we're really getting down to it, aren't we! I think you're right. I do feel guilty for sparking her hopes. For once suggesting that we might have a future one day. I shot that down in November.

 

I would like her to have the fairytale - with her DH preferably. He is the father of her children after all. Some are very young, so she is bound to him for some time in any case.

 

Maybe you're right. Maybe I do just need to trust that she will find her way. The day will come soon enough when I have a new partner, and I won't want to betray her trust in me by continuing to have a friendship with my ex.

 

Ah, a lightbult moment! You feel guilt for upsetting the apple cart and you're really hoping that you didn't hose up her marriage by altering her perceptions.

 

As much as you might want, you still can't pick out who (if any) is her Fairytale Man. Don't forget. And if the H is hitting on your friends, he just might not be Prince Charming, ya know.

 

--LG.