Surfer Dude Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 Ok, seriously I feel down now... I got dumped by my fiance nearly 4 months ago. My life has been hell since then (I wrote about it in the coping forum), but lately I've started feeling better. So I decided to meet some girls and try something and see how it works out. So I met several girls in the last month or so, got to know each of them, got their phone numbers etc. But when I asked them out, I was rejected every single time. I never came off as pushy or anything, I always talked to them prior to getting their numbers, I tried not to fall in the friends zone and I'm sure I didn't appear desperate or clingy. For example take this last girl: I talked to her for several hours, we had a great time and I got her msn add. I'm thinking I'm all set, she's good looking, single, there's no reason not to ask her out. So I talk to her today and the convo is something like this: ME: hey wanna grab a drink together on friday evening? we could hang out or something. HER: Sorry, I'm doing my homework and I'm already going out with my friends. ME: Ok, that's cool. I'm also free on weekend, how about saturday or sunday? HER: Sorry, I'm busy then as well. I mean wtf.... She is single right? I'm not ugly, I hear it all the time that I'm a handsome guy, so what's up with this? If she were interested in hanging out then she'd suggest some other time she was free, right? I'm not gonna be played with or pushed around so I didn't suggest any other days, she should've done that had she cared. This is my 4th rejection in the last month or so and it's getting depressing. My self esteem is crumbling and I dunno if I can take it any longer. Everything starts off good with those girls, but as soon as I show my interest in them, they become flaky and cold... Seriously, people tell me I look good and I know I'm not bad looking or anything. I'm just a normal guy looking to connect with someone, I'm not some ******* interested solely in sex. I don't come off as a "nice guy" (average frustrated chump), but I'm also not a jerk either. I don't get it. Is this a norm? I'm thinking my ex was with me only because of our racial difference (she's Asian, I later learned she has an obsession with white men). Don't women see any qualities in me? They don't even know me, how can they reject me so easily? Is this normal?.... Sorry for my broken grammar but I'm really feeling down right now.
AlektraClementine Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 You're not back in your single guy groove yet is my guess. You are probably still exuding some sense of being that broken hearted dude. Right now, for you.. it's a numbers game. All about statistics and mathematics. It's an old sales trick. 15 cold calls = 3 leads. 3 leads = 1 sale.
diggy Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 hmm from the AFC comment I assume you know a thing or two about game. Seriously man, I feel for you about your fiance dumping you, that blows hard. 4 rejections is not really much though, sometimes when I go out i get like 20 in a night. Its not about looks or money at all. Maybe its some underlying attitude you are conveying, maybe the fact that you want somebody is portraying you as someone who is needy and a value taker, not a value giver. Im not trying to be harsh, just giving my opinion to help you. Also, when you have been talking to a girl for ages, dont get her msn, that is backwards progression. Call her on the phone or text her. Just go out to have fun, and dont put an expectation on the outcome, if it goes great then awesome, if nothing comes of it, who cares, you had a great time:) good luck man!
D-Jam Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 Is this normal? Pretty much. Grow a thick skin, try not to let their rejections hurt you, and learn to live your life for you...not for the quest to "find someone". Do look deep in yourself though and see if you're exuding the vibe that maybe you're not over the breakup or something. If women see that sort of thing in you, then it's a big red flag. No more than if you met a woman who wasn't over her ex. You are going to unfortunately find though that in your singledom, some women will just miraculously be into you and it won't be hard at all to get dating happening...but most women you meet will reject you, be it for actual logical reasons or for a myriad of illogical and/or shallow reasons. That's just dating.
Author Surfer Dude Posted December 17, 2008 Author Posted December 17, 2008 Yeah, I get what you guys are saying. I'm not really upset about a single rejection, I couldn't care less, but when it happens several times in a row, it becomes bothersome. @Diggy: Yes, I'm familiar with the game. But lately I've just been myself, I wanted to see if I can get any decent women by just being a normal nice guy, without pretending to be a player or some PUA dude. I know nice guy qualities are anything but attractive, I guess I should change my approach. I never appeared needy and desperate, still I need to do things differently. obviously. I was engaged to my ex for quite a while, so I definitely lost any game I had, and I'm definitely not a natural. But I'll be fine. Just wanted to see some opinions from you guys. BTW, I once read some interesting stuff from a PUA dude on some forum, he said that women who reject men for no reason and won't allow themselves to be physical are "broken" and should be ditched. I guess he was right
AlektraClementine Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 OK wait wait wait... Do men actually think that just because they aren't hideous looking and might be a nice guy, that they are entitled to a "yes" from every girl they approach? How do you know you're being rejected for "no reason". Maybe you're just not their type. I'm using the word "you" in general terms. By acting normal and being yourself, you are very likely to find a girl who's perfect for you. But that by no means, means (haha) that you will attract every girl you shoot at.
sumdude Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 You're still getting over your ex. They can probably sense it for whatever reason because of ways your acting you don't notice right now. Let it go for a while, work on other aspects of your life and it'll happen for you then.
BCCA Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 Whats done is done, but maybe next time, try not to move so fast. If you add her to your IM, maybe exchange some friendly chat for a couple of days. Dont IM her all day long, but at the same time, a quick 'hey hows it going' once in a while cant hurt. Also, if you get an initial 'no' it could not be a rejection at all, just bad timing. Try not to follow it up with asking her out for another day, because it does kind of come off as desperate. I would just say thats fine, let me know when you have some time, and back off completely. Even if you never hear from her again, its still better than trying over and over and getting shot down everytime. Then, the girl probably doesnt value you that much, because youre not valuing yourself. Remember, your time is important and women are just as lucky to go out with you as you are to go out with them. And dont take it so hard when women arent interested in dating you right away, it doesnt mean that there is anything wrong with you. Who knows what these girls have going on, there could be an ex/other guy in the picture, and you wouldnt want to get involved anyway. This is the approach I take: Find a girl, let them know youre interested (and trust me, getting their #/IM is enough to let them know), then try and play it as cool as possible and only ask them out when you feel like its the right thing to do. Going to fast too quickly gives the impression of desperation. Also, I dont think youre 100% over your ex, and women can pick up on the fact that you're not being selective, and are essentially just looking for anyone (within reason) to fill the void your ex left. That doesnt make people feel very special. Women want you to want them because they stand out from the crowd, not because they have the appropriate reproductive organs and a cute smile.
D-Jam Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 OK wait wait wait... Do men actually think that just because they aren't hideous looking and might be a nice guy, that they are entitled to a "yes" from every girl they approach? I think many men who can't get a lot of results more believe that a hot looking bad boy will easily find a plethora of stupid girls who will throw themselves at him, hoping to tame him. Mind you I said "stupid girls" to show that I don't mean all women, because I have seen the attractive mature adult woman reject said bad boy. Likewise, there are many women who believe that by having a tight slender body, nice size breasts, long hair, and a pretty face, that there will be a plethora of horny little boys who will give them the world...just in the hope of having a trophy. It's a vicious cycle on both sides, but many fail to see that we're talking not of love, deep intimacy, and the other non-sexual things when this comes up. I don't see many of the bad boys or trophy girls end up golden in the end. Lord knows how many of the "uber hot" women I've known in my life are still single and complain how they can't find a man who will commit. Kind of says then that looks and a wild attitude aren't the keystones to success in love. Maybe in sex, but not in love. By acting normal and being yourself, you are very likely to find a girl who's perfect for you. But that by no means, means (haha) that you will attract every girl you shoot at. I agree wholeheartedly. It's why I tell men and women to not make it a ginormous priority in life. Live your life for you, and let the right person see you for who you are...then they will love you for that. Not for some wild elaborate act/show to get their affection.
Author Surfer Dude Posted December 18, 2008 Author Posted December 18, 2008 Whats done is done, but maybe next time, try not to move so fast. If you add her to your IM, maybe exchange some friendly chat for a couple of days. Dont IM her all day long, but at the same time, a quick 'hey hows it going' once in a while cant hurt. Also, if you get an initial 'no' it could not be a rejection at all, just bad timing. Try not to follow it up with asking her out for another day, because it does kind of come off as desperate. I would just say thats fine, let me know when you have some time, and back off completely. Even if you never hear from her again, its still better than trying over and over and getting shot down everytime. Then, the girl probably doesnt value you that much, because youre not valuing yourself. I'm not being pushy or IMing those girls all day long. I either text them on their phone or IM them whether they're interested in hanging out. If they say they're busy, I'll suggest some other time. If they refuse again, well the ball is in their court and I'm backing off, if they're interested they should suggest some other time to hang out. I'm not going to chase them around, I do not waste my time with ice queens who play mindgames This is the approach I take: Find a girl, let them know youre interested (and trust me, getting their #/IM is enough to let them know), then try and play it as cool as possible and only ask them out when you feel like its the right thing to do. Going to fast too quickly gives the impression of desperation. Waiting and stalling could backfire, because in the meantime they could meet someone who asks them out or ends up with them, and it would convey image of an insecure guy who doesn't really know what he's doing. It's all too easy to fall into friends zone if you play that game, plus if a woman is genuinely interested in you, she might start resenting you for not making a move and for stringing her along. I'm a firm believer that people should make a move as soon as they feel attraction building up. It's a vicious cycle on both sides, but many fail to see that we're talking not of love, deep intimacy, and the other non-sexual things when this comes up. I don't see many of the bad boys or trophy girls end up golden in the end. Lord knows how many of the "uber hot" women I've known in my life are still single and complain how they can't find a man who will commit. Kind of says then that looks and a wild attitude aren't the keystones to success in love. Maybe in sex, but not in love. I had this friend who was sort of a "playa". These PUA guys are master manipulators and it's really easy for them to get together with majority of women. So anyways, he had tons of girlfriends but he could never find a lasting relationship, they would always fall apart after a while, for one reason or another. Let me remind you, this guy was really good at conveying his "alpha" characteristics to women, that's why he was so successful. One time though, he really fell for a girl and desired something long term with her. As soon as he put his show down, became just a normal guy he is, his gf left him for some ex dude who was cheating on her with other women and treating her like crap. I'm beginning to question all attempts at making models and explanations of the whole dating system. For most people getting together with someone is just a mix of some luck, circumstances and provided that they were single at the moment. Can't see any specific pattern that would work in all cases. Me and my ex met online and talked on msn for 9 months prior to getting together, and it's not like she didn't have any offers in the meantime, she's a really good looking girl. Ah the futility of trying to see a pattern in all this.
xpaperxcutx Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 If you meet girls online, they're more reluctant to meet anyone. Avoid AIM or MSN because that will put you in a cycle of neverending chit chat and no personal closeness. The phone is good only if the girl has any desire to call you. Then they'll be happy whenever you call them. If you merely ask them for their number, they'll give it to you, but they always patch you to their message machine. Then there's the fact that you're not over your ex. If you're truly well off none, one or two rejections won't damage your self esteem. You could just as easily move on to the next girl you want to ask out.
Author Surfer Dude Posted December 18, 2008 Author Posted December 18, 2008 I don't meet girls online, getting their msn or phone# is just a medium to set up a date later. The fact that I met my ex online was a pure coincidence.
xpaperxcutx Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 I don't meet girls online, getting their msn or phone# is just a medium to set up a date later. The fact that I met my ex online was a pure coincidence. How about laying off dating for a while. Because your hearts not really in it you're setting yourself up for disappointment.
D-Jam Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 As soon as he put his show down, became just a normal guy he is, his gf left him for some ex dude who was cheating on her with other women and treating her like crap. Bear in mind that this example should then show you why men like you and your friend need to learn to see women like this as a wasted effort. Someone you shouldn't bother with ever. Look at her the way many men would look at a 400-lb woman with a shaven head. Seriously, I don't care how hot she is or anything. If she's got a taste in her heart for bad boys, jerks, playas, challenges, etc...then she's a waste. She's someone who will bring a man drama more than happiness. So when guys (not directing this at you personally) pine on message boards wondering why the bad boys get the hot girls, they should take a step back and wonder if these women are really worth having. If a RL with one of those girls would be romantic bliss, or just games and misery. Ah the futility of trying to see a pattern in all this. This is why I say to live your life for you. You'll go crazy trying to analyze this mess.
Author Surfer Dude Posted December 18, 2008 Author Posted December 18, 2008 Bear in mind that this example should then show you why men like you and your friend need to learn to see women like this as a wasted effort. Someone you shouldn't bother with ever. Look at her the way many men would look at a 400-lb woman with a shaven head. Seriously, I don't care how hot she is or anything. If she's got a taste in her heart for bad boys, jerks, playas, challenges, etc...then she's a waste. She's someone who will bring a man drama more than happiness. So when guys (not directing this at you personally) pine on message boards wondering why the bad boys get the hot girls, they should take a step back and wonder if these women are really worth having. If a RL with one of those girls would be romantic bliss, or just games and misery. I know. I call those women "broken". I really hate the whole chasing and playing cold game, it's a major waste of time and a deal breaker for me when a woman starts pulling that. I do not beg to get a date, I ask once and if she acts all flaky, I'm done. I do my best to get her interested but if she needs all the drama and action in her life, I'm not going to provide that. I try to convey my value to a girl, and if she's not interested, but 2 days later I see her with some ******* who is known to be a cheater and a douchebag, I know she's not worth it. I know I sounded desperate in my original post, but I was just frustrated. Well, don't wanna become an AFC I just think it's a bit disappointing that I spend great time with a girl, we connect in a way and realize we have things in common, and suddenly she starts acting cold when I want to meet again. Oh well, that's life.
Phateless Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Ok, seriously I feel down now... I got dumped by my fiance nearly 4 months ago. My life has been hell since then (I wrote about it in the coping forum), but lately I've started feeling better. So I decided to meet some girls and try something and see how it works out. So I met several girls in the last month or so, got to know each of them, got their phone numbers etc. But when I asked them out, I was rejected every single time. I never came off as pushy or anything, I always talked to them prior to getting their numbers, I tried not to fall in the friends zone and I'm sure I didn't appear desperate or clingy. For example take this last girl: I talked to her for several hours, we had a great time and I got her msn add. I'm thinking I'm all set, she's good looking, single, there's no reason not to ask her out. So I talk to her today and the convo is something like this: ME: hey wanna grab a drink together on friday evening? we could hang out or something. HER: Sorry, I'm doing my homework and I'm already going out with my friends. ME: Ok, that's cool. I'm also free on weekend, how about saturday or sunday? HER: Sorry, I'm busy then as well. I mean wtf.... She is single right? I'm not ugly, I hear it all the time that I'm a handsome guy, so what's up with this? If she were interested in hanging out then she'd suggest some other time she was free, right? I'm not gonna be played with or pushed around so I didn't suggest any other days, she should've done that had she cared. This is my 4th rejection in the last month or so and it's getting depressing. My self esteem is crumbling and I dunno if I can take it any longer. Everything starts off good with those girls, but as soon as I show my interest in them, they become flaky and cold... Seriously, people tell me I look good and I know I'm not bad looking or anything. I'm just a normal guy looking to connect with someone, I'm not some ******* interested solely in sex. I don't come off as a "nice guy" (average frustrated chump), but I'm also not a jerk either. I don't get it. Is this a norm? I'm thinking my ex was with me only because of our racial difference (she's Asian, I later learned she has an obsession with white men). Don't women see any qualities in me? They don't even know me, how can they reject me so easily? Is this normal?.... Sorry for my broken grammar but I'm really feeling down right now. You're probably still not yourself after the breakup yet. Give it some more time. You're meeting girls and getting numbers so you're obviously doing something right. Try playing with your methods after you get the number. Call one up right away and be straightforward "i wanna hang out with you." Call another 3 days later and play it aloof. Text one the next day and flirt/tease her over text, but don't ask her out. Try different things and see what happens. Different girls and different situations require different handling. Eventually you'll develop better intuition for this sort of thing.
Author Surfer Dude Posted December 18, 2008 Author Posted December 18, 2008 You're probably still not yourself after the breakup yet. Give it some more time. You're meeting girls and getting numbers so you're obviously doing something right. Try playing with your methods after you get the number. Call one up right away and be straightforward "i wanna hang out with you." Call another 3 days later and play it aloof. Text one the next day and flirt/tease her over text, but don't ask her out. Try different things and see what happens. Different girls and different situations require different handling. Eventually you'll develop better intuition for this sort of thing. Thanks man, that's exactly what I'm going to do, take a different approach with every girl. No person is the same and no person requires same methods. It's impossible to find a system that would work with every woman. As for breakup, I'm over it. I don't feel anything towards my ex anymore, I just want to connect with a nice lady and have a good time together, it wouldn't be a rebound.
norajane Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 I just think it's a bit disappointing that I spend great time with a girl, we connect in a way and realize we have things in common, and suddenly she starts acting cold when I want to meet again. Oh well, that's life. I know it's disappointing when you feel like you've made a connection, but consider these rejections as saving you a huge amount of time and effort. If those girls aren't that interested, or if they are and they're playing games, then you're better off not wasting your time on them. This frees you up to meet someone who will be a better fit instead of wasting time taking girls out who aren't that interested.
Phateless Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Thanks man, that's exactly what I'm going to do, take a different approach with every girl. No person is the same and no person requires same methods. It's impossible to find a system that would work with every woman. As for breakup, I'm over it. I don't feel anything towards my ex anymore, I just want to connect with a nice lady and have a good time together, it wouldn't be a rebound. Good. That is exactly the right attitude that will carry you forward. Have fun!
Isolde Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 You are going to unfortunately find though that in your singledom, some women will just miraculously be into you and it won't be hard at all to get dating happening...but most women you meet will reject you, be it for actual logical reasons or for a myriad of illogical and/or shallow reasons. That's just dating. I couldn't have said it better. Browse through loveshack--you'll see how common it is to be rejected often, even the women on here experience the same volume of rejections you do.
Perry Posted December 19, 2008 Posted December 19, 2008 BTW, I once read some interesting stuff from a PUA dude on some forum, he said that women who reject men for no reason and won't allow themselves to be physical are "broken" and should be ditched. Yet another example on why these laughable "pick up artists" don't know what they are doing or talking about.
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