Grief at finding out about Spouse's affairs

[Athena]

Some music made me so angry if it talked touched on the subject of sex that I day dreamed of hitting the car radio with a sledge hammer. And a few of his CD got snatched out of the player and thrown onto the highway,as we were driving, when they said something I didn't like . He would just look at me and want to complain but said nothing.

 

 

LOL!!!! :lmao: You crack me up!

[beyondsad]

So many of these posts are just how I am feeling. Just when I think everything is going to be ok I get the feeling like he is lying and setting me up. He swears he is 100 % committed to our R and he just wants me to be happy. My H has said to me please just be happy put a happy face on and don't look sad then everthing will be ok. What a hard thing to do to look happy when on the inside you feel like a fool. Alot of our H's seem to be narcistic and self absorbed I know mine is - Of course he is so good-looking and has a beautiful body and attracts women like you wouldn't believe.

I don't think our relationship or myself will ever be OK- in a way I think I am fooling myself believing he will never do this to me again. If only there was something that could make me forget everything that happened these 14 weeks. I want my life back when I thought my husband was all mine. How fing sad is that . Maybe it is the holidays! Oh well at this point I just want to believe what he says and get my life backl- I hope one day this hurt will go away and I can be happy again.

[2sure]

I have to share this with you: The marriage counselor, last year, when I told her that I had an odd feeling that my husband was straying again (while he was working abroad) said I must not get my antennae up! She said I must not focus on him, but on me. She said I would find out in due time if he WAS cheating, so why get myself worked up about it?

 

I am PMSing, having some holiday blues, etc. Prone to some anxiety anyway - so I dont know if it is just me. All over again I am angry that I even have to question.

 

Thank you for the above post. No matter what I think, no matter what I check up on, regardless of my feelings...I cannot really control him and dont want that job. But I can control myself - at least like you said - focus on me. Adding to my anxiety is just more crazy making. I have to give it up.

[2sure]

I am terrified of being happy because that is when he breaks my heart. This cycles me all the way back to the anger of being betrayed and I just want off this rollercoaster.

 

OK, so we all have the betrayal(s) themselves and on top of that the cycle of anger and fear of being happy. I cant help but think that H's betrayal is out of my control and my fear of being happy might be out of his control.

 

So, does this mean that even though there can be forgiveness and understanding and love...

 

The options on hand are: Divorce or get comfortable with the betrayl, dont trust but also dont care ...focus on me. I can do these things. Its just not what I had planned.

[porter218]

[/b]

 

OK, so we all have the betrayal(s) themselves and on top of that the cycle of anger and fear of being happy. I cant help but think that H's betrayal is out of my control and my fear of being happy might be out of his control.

 

So, does this mean that even though there can be forgiveness and understanding and love...

 

The options on hand are: Divorce or get comfortable with the betrayl, dont trust but also dont care ...focus on me. I can do these things. Its just not what I had planned.

 

Something that I learned during a long separation I had from my H, is that even if you D you still have to go through all these emotions. The only one you don't go through is worrying about what he is currently doing. The pain and aftermath of the A will have to be dealt with or without him.

don't trust but also don't care

I have been trying to master this one but I just can't. Have you figured out how to do this.

[2sure]

[quote=porter218;1958813]I have been trying to master this one but I just can't. Have you figured out how to do this.

 

Is this what it comes down to? Is this what me, you, and no doubt many others are ultimately here for?

 

When I found LS I was hoping to find others who were staying in the marriage - with misgivings, or even no matter what.

But having since used much of the advice Ive received, and followed some of my own...

 

I have higher hopes. But yes, lately, this is an idea I wonder if it is possible to embrace.

[Athena]

2Sure -- perhaps this is just one of 'those cycles' that you are going through, and it will pass. You know, like a monthly cycle for women (sometimes even men seem to have their own monthly cycles). Maybe humans are built with reacting to things cyclically, and when you suffer a betrayal that then gets included. I haven't really distilled this thought yet. But to answer you -- Yes, it (the distrust) may come around again, but you can be happy in between them....

[Athena]

Something that I learned during a long separation I had from my H, is that even if you D you still have to go through all these emotions. The only one you don't go through is worrying about what he is currently doing. The pain and aftermath of the A will have to be dealt with or without him.

quote <<<Don't trust, but also don't care>>>

I have been trying to master this one but I just can't. Have you figured out how to do this.

 

Porter this is something I always wished for! -- getting to 'not care what he is up to, not trusting and not caring either'

 

Unfortunately it comes with a price -- I let go of a lot of the love I had for him... I had to. That's how I could feel almost completely indifferent to him and what he was up to. I traded in love for not caring = not hurting inside myself. Is it worth it? Is this what you are prepared to do?

 

btw, the 8 affairs that my H had, were disclosed in five D-days, with the last one leaving me cold.

It was just one too many for my psyche to handle.

He hates that he blew it.

[TearzShed]

"don't trust and don't care"

 

I am good at this right now. I am not questioning him one bit about his activities. I don't trust him and this distrust has led to dislike, which leads to me simply not caring one bit what he does. I know I love this person. But I'm not sure who I am loving, since the person that I thought I was loving is not that person. I can't care (that deeply anyway) for someone I don't know.

 

I agree that grief is a cyclical process. I think of it in the shape of a tornado. The closer the storm gets to the ground, the smaller the cycles of wind. Not to say the pain isn't intense during those smaller cycles, but they are shorter, and they hurt less.

[2sure]

After D-Day (2 of them) I decided we could recover. Knowing myself and my nature, I knew I would forgive him. However, I knew that the dynamics of my feelings for him and my security within the marriage might be forever changed but had hope. Surprisingly, I have found that some areas have improved since D-Day and that I trust him again. But I do not want to trust him. I had not figured on such a permanent scar. It feels like I am betraying myself.

 

Maybe a cycle Athena. I have voiced my recent insecurity to H. He has asked me to put aside these thoughts until after the holidays. And I pretty much shall. Having voiced my mistrust to him...it is sad to say, I feel better.

[Athena]

"don't trust and don't care"

 

I am good at this right now. I am not questioning him one bit about his activities. I don't trust him and this distrust has led to dislike, which leads to me simply not caring one bit what he does.

 

I think this is how it happened with me.

 

I like how you phrased this -- it hit on the truth, and it is helpful to me to understand this. Thank you.

[Athena]

After D-Day (2 of them) I decided we could recover. Knowing myself and my nature, I knew I would forgive him. However, I knew that the dynamics of my feelings for him and my security within the marriage might be forever changed but had hope. Surprisingly, I have found that some areas have improved since D-Day and that I trust him again. But I do not want to trust him. I had not figured on such a permanent scar. It feels like I am betraying myself.

 

Maybe a cycle Athena. I have voiced my recent insecurity to H. He has asked me to put aside these thoughts until after the holidays. And I pretty much shall. Having voiced my mistrust to him...it is sad to say, I feel better.

 

Yes, me too -- I forgave him. And we could have recovered, except apparently he didn't want to stop going with women. Did he think he wouldn't be caught?

 

What is a person supposed to do with a spouse like this? His behavior is out of my hands, always was, I just didn't know it at the time -- I was chasing the carrot he was dangling in front of me. He really had no intention of giving it up. Or perhaps he did -- for a period of time, and then just like an addict gave into his cravings when the temptation was there.

 

Can anyone explain this to me?

I can see how he could hope/expect me to forgive him once, MAYBE twice, but after that he must have thought it was his right!??

 

Last week he was complaining that I didn't trust him (!!!) and I said I did trust him with many things, but NOT fidelity, since he shows weakness there.

[porter218]

I guess I still want to beleive that my H can do right. My love for him is sooo strong and the one thing I have been told that kept me holding on is "if the goodness and happiness out weigh the pain and the heartbreak then it is still worth a fight". As long as he doesn't take so much from me that I don't have anything left for myself then I should still try. He has shown remorse and taken the evil things I have said in stride, so maybe we can be happy. I wish he could magically make me trust him again because I desperately miss thinking he was mine and mine alone. I hate not trusting...all I want is to be 100% happy but he stole that from me. Our separation was the only thing that made our broken marriage repairable, and I thank god I went through those 9 months alone so I could heal a little. We so far are a success case and even have made the decision to have another baby together which I just gave birth to.

[Athena]

the one thing I have been told that kept me holding on is "if the goodness and happiness out weigh the pain and the heartbreak then it is still worth a fight". As long as he doesn't take so much from me that I don't have anything left for myself then I should still try.

 

Congratulations on your new baby girl!

 

Thank you very much for sharing the above 'test' of Whether to Stay or Go.... I asked myself this and sadly the answer is that the pain and the heartbreak outweigh the goodness and happiness... and furthermore, he DID take so very much from me -- he broke me. So, then I should not still try. I should give up.

[porter218]

Congratulations on your new baby girl!

 

Thank you very much for sharing the above 'test' of Whether to Stay or Go.... I asked myself this and sadly the answer is that the pain and the heartbreak outweigh the goodness and happiness... and furthermore, he DID take so very much from me -- he broke me. So, then I should not still try. I should give up.

Sorry to hear that he has drained you that low. If he has left you empty then yes, you should leave. Whatever it takes to bring you some little amount of happiness again. Everyone has a point at which enough is enough and when it is time to go you just know it is time. Good luck with your new chapter in life.

[2sure]

After having voiced my mistrust and generally anxious feelings to my husband, we decided together to basically try to put this aside until after the holidays and with some relief, I'm happy to give myself a break.

 

We did talk a little however...

 

I told him that I feel I have forgiven him and he agreed. I dont bring up the infidelity , throw it in his face, or even question him anymore. Thats as far as I can get. I told him that the rest - making me feel secure, validated, etc...had to fall on him. I dont know how exactly he can do this but it needs to be addressed or readdressed. I told him that when i was not feeling secure it led to me being suspicious, which of course leads to defensiveness and general mistrust. I told him that I will be probably never again be reassured by words - that I know his words can be false - but I do trust actions.

 

Maybe a cycle.

 

Athena - I would like to hear more from you. Have you decided to leave the marriage? Have you taken steps towards that or have you just recently resigned yourself to this course?

[desertmoon]

Yes, me too -- I forgave him. And we could have recovered, except apparently he didn't want to stop going with women. Did he think he wouldn't be caught?

 

What is a person supposed to do with a spouse like this? His behavior is out of my hands, always was, I just didn't know it at the time -- I was chasing the carrot he was dangling in front of me. He really had no intention of giving it up. Or perhaps he did -- for a period of time, and then just like an addict gave into his cravings when the temptation was there.

 

You let them go..and die within yourself...when you come back to life, you won't be the same person. It took several affairs and several years for me to get to the point of not caring...it's over-exposure, saturation...you hit rock bottom and then you have no choice but to let go....and let them be...

[Athena]

You let them go..and die within yourself...when you come back to life, you won't be the same person. It took several affairs and several years for me to get to the point of not caring...it's over-exposure, saturation...you hit rock bottom and then you have no choice but to let go....and let them be...

 

This is exactly right. This is how it happened with me too. But here is the difference -- you are willing to leave it like this, whereas I am considering getting out of the marriage, as hard as it is to do.

 

Also - you don't enjoy him in an intimate way -- emotionally or physically, whereas it has only been this year where the emotional part has been severely affected with me, but still capable of great sex. This probably confuses me in the end --?!

[Athena]

 

I told him that I feel I have forgiven him and he agreed. I dont bring up the infidelity , throw it in his face, or even question him anymore. Thats as far as I can get. I told him that the rest - making me feel secure, validated, etc...had to fall on him. I dont know how exactly he can do this but it needs to be addressed or readdressed. I told him that when i was not feeling secure it led to me being suspicious, which of course leads to defensiveness and general mistrust. I told him that I will be probably never again be reassured by words - that I know his words can be false - but I do trust actions.

 

Athena - I would like to hear more from you. Have you decided to leave the marriage? Have you taken steps towards that or have you just recently resigned yourself to this course?

 

Wow -- I really like the way you have expressed all this. I can definitely identify with the underlined parts.

 

However -- all I have is WORDS from him. I guess it does not help that he has taken to working abroad for two months at a time, returning home for two weeks.

 

He has a work contract there for three years. He is in the SAME town as OW who apparently is dating his best friend (I confirmed this earlier in the year, but don't know if its still going strong like H claims). H came home recently sporting his OW's namesake as a key chain on his foreign cell phone!! Now why would a man do this (it's an animal key ring that is her nickname) from June, if she means NOTHING to him? He said he just likes the keychain, that's all, but he was lying about it at first, telling me HE WAS GIVEN THE CELL WITH THE KEY CHAIN ON IT BY WORK!!!!! See, that's what I hate -- he still lies to me, whenever it's convenient. How can I trust him? I told him its as hurtful as if he was carrying a photograph of her around on his person, in his pockets, on his nightstand, etc... and this item is FROM HER (from when they were living together last year, unknown to me).

 

2Sure, I took to my bed for several weeks after he left and after a month I came to the understanding that my decision must be to divorce him.

No, I haven't made concrete steps like seeing an attorney, although I have told some of my family members, and one brother of his knows (since I am best friends with the brother's wife)... I am mentally steeling myself, and trying to gain support.

 

I still see a counselor on a regular basis. She was our marriage counselor. However that sometimes complicates things. This is because I tend to get mixed messages from her about the subject of divorcing my H (she says because I was not ready to leave him all this time. She says I have been Stuck).

She -- a professional -- says H is narcissistic. I have read a lot about this N subject and it looks like its better to walk away from H. Has anyone here on these boards knov of a N who changed their ways???? Is there any hope??

 

I am forty-something and both kids are in college, so the house has just me in it. I went back to school when the kids were in school and got a scholarship and graduated two years ago. Unfortunately I do not have a job, career, nor a good resume since I was the only parent physically in the house with 3 children, then 2 children (his child from an earlier marriage lived with us for a while full time) and also due to the depression I kind of mostly was with family.

 

I stuck out his wayward ways for the past decade but now we are empty-nesters. Is this the time to leave him?

 

I'm sorry if I am rambling... its so hard to know what to do... its so hard to let go of someone you love. I guess I came to LoveShack for some clarity and direction, because I don't have it in me on my own.

[Athena]

Sorry to hear that he has drained you that low. If he has left you empty then yes, you should leave. Whatever it takes to bring you some little amount of happiness again. Everyone has a point at which enough is enough and when it is time to go you just know it is time. Good luck with your new chapter in life.

 

Hi Porter. Thank you for your encouragement.

 

I know I am sometimes hesitant to let him go, because he still wants to be married.... this makes it tough. Also, because I wonder if its true when he says he has finally seen the light, that he has finally changed his ways... how would I know this?

[pelicanpreacher]

Wow -- I really like the way you have expressed all this. I can definitely identify with the underlined parts.

 

However -- all I have is WORDS from him. I guess it does not help that he has taken to working abroad for two months at a time, returning home for two weeks.

 

He has a work contract there for three years. He is in the SAME town as OW who apparently is dating his best friend (I confirmed this earlier in the year, but don't know if its still going strong like H claims). H came home recently sporting his OW's namesake as a key chain on his foreign cell phone!! Now why would a man do this (it's an animal key ring that is her nickname) from June, if she means NOTHING to him? He said he just likes the keychain, that's all, but he was lying about it at first, telling me HE WAS GIVEN THE CELL WITH THE KEY CHAIN ON IT BY WORK!!!!! See, that's what I hate -- he still lies to me, whenever it's convenient. How can I trust him? I told him its as hurtful as if he was carrying a photograph of her around on his person, in his pockets, on his nightstand, etc... and this item is FROM HER (from when they were living together last year, unknown to me).

 

2Sure, I took to my bed for several weeks after he left and after a month I came to the understanding that my decision must be to divorce him.

No, I haven't made concrete steps like seeing an attorney, although I have told some of my family members, and one brother of his knows (since I am best friends with the brother's wife)... I am mentally steeling myself, and trying to gain support.

 

I still see a counselor on a regular basis. She was our marriage counselor. However that sometimes complicates things. This is because I tend to get mixed messages from her about the subject of divorcing my H (she says because I was not ready to leave him all this time. She says I have been Stuck).

She -- a professional -- says H is narcissistic. I have read a lot about this N subject and it looks like its better to walk away from H. Has anyone here on these boards knov of a N who changed their ways???? Is there any hope??

 

I am forty-something and both kids are in college, so the house has just me in it. I went back to school when the kids were in school and got a scholarship and graduated two years ago. Unfortunately I do not have a job, career, nor a good resume since I was the only parent physically in the house with 3 children, then 2 children (his child from an earlier marriage lived with us for a while full time) and also due to the depression I kind of mostly was with family.

 

I stuck out his wayward ways for the past decade but now we are empty-nesters. Is this the time to leave him?

 

I'm sorry if I am rambling... its so hard to know what to do... its so hard to let go of someone you love. I guess I came to LoveShack for some clarity and direction, because I don't have it in me on my own.

 

If you proceed to divorce while he's away on the contract he's obligated to he'll go ape ***** for a narcissist hates to lose what they feel they own. The possibility that he may lose control and be helpless about it will bring out his deepest, darkest, and most devious mindset so don't be surprised if he attempts to leverage your affinity for his children of his earlier marriage if they're young enough to require parentage in order to buy more time to stay your action. Foil his plan to the contrary by announcing your intention to his ex-wife lest he enlist her to ambush you by having her drop them at your doorstep!

[Athena]

If you proceed to divorce while he's away on the contract he's obligated to he'll go ape ***** for a narcissist hates to lose what they feel they own. The possibility that he may lose control and be helpless about it will bring out his deepest, darkest, and most devious mindset so don't be surprised if he attempts to leverage your affinity for his children of his earlier marriage if they're young enough to require parentage in order to buy more time to stay your action. Foil his plan to the contrary by announcing your intention to his ex-wife lest he enlist her to ambush you by having her drop them at your doorstep!

 

His child from his previous marriage is 27 and lives in another country. We get on well.

 

I absolutely am afraid of what you said " <<<If you proceed to divorce while he's away on the contract he's obligated to he'll go ape ***** for a narcissist hates to lose what they feel they own. The possibility that he may lose control and be helpless about it will bring out his deepest, darkest, and most devious mindset >>>"

 

I know I must get a job and try become financially independent... it has been difficult for me when almost paralyzed by depression...

I am afraid he might once again threaten suicide, or disappear on us (and our two children). I am afraid of his rage. I am afraid of him becoming vindictive. Sometimes it's almost easier to just accept him for two weeks as a familiar person I once greatly loved, and then get two months peace. But in that case I won't ever cut ties and make myself whole again. I won't be available to a decent man if I stay with my H out of fear of "what if".

 

All I can say is I am stuck, but at least I managed to make the decision of divorce. Now all I have to do is get a job, save money, and be prepared to be thrown away by him when he gets angry that he no longer has me. Yes, I am apprehensive.

Plus -- he swears up and down he is a different man now, from January, when I found out about his recent affair and told him to go to her -- that I didn't want him and certainly wasn't going to fight for him.. He said that THIS time he knows he is not lying when he promises me he won't cheat again.

 

I highly doubt he is capable of change. But then when I tell the counselor this -- she says that she is in the business of change (counseling) and that if someone really wants to change, they will. She says I would have to go live with him and really work on the marriage in order for it to work. But I am ashamed to go stay with him in that country where he paraded his OW around for a year in full view of everyone! I feel sick to the pit of my stomach to think that HER face will be associated with my H, and if I go there they will look at me and think of her.

[pelicanpreacher]

OMG! This guy uses every manipulative extreme granted unto his license to exact control. Get yourself a job, become financially independent, and leave him a note saying "It's over, I'm done, Get used to it"!!!

[Athena]

OMG! This guy uses every manipulative extreme granted unto his license to exact control. Get yourself a job, become financially independent, and leave him a note saying "It's over, I'm done, Get used to it"!!!

 

Yes he does use every manipulative tactic possible. It took me a long time to recognize this, because I come from a family where I didn't learn about manipulation, but rather very blunt, honest, direct talk (lacking diplomacy is not always good either:p)

 

His mother is extremely manipulative and effective (and although I love her I can see this in her behavior with others), and his Dad is too (esp. emotionally manipulative with H's mother)... so my H learned first hand, I guess. Also his paternal grandmother was Wickedly and deviously manipulative and has left a legacy of her tactics widely talked about by her children, their spouses, and the grandchildren... and H lived with his grandmother from age 17 till 19 when he left to get married the first marriage... so he lived with a devious relative!

 

Thank you Pelican. You can see the situation as I describe it without the emotions and tangled history I have with H....

I remember my counselor telling me that it is a 'shame to waste my brain' over focusing on my H and what he is up to... that I should go put my talents to good use in the workplace and enjoy my own life.

 

I was feeling the obligation of working on my marriage, and on not 'deserting' my H when he begs me to not leave him. It would have been far easier if H could just admit what he really is, and say he's not going to change, but he doesn't want to lose me -- he says I am the love of his life and he regrets all his 'mistakes' and so on and so on. I guess what I am saying is that I wish he could be honest with himself and me, so as to let me move on without a guilty conscience, but he probably cannot do that.

[desertmoon]

I am afraid he might once again threaten suicide, or disappear on us (and our two children). I am afraid of his rage. I am afraid of him becoming vindictive. Sometimes it's almost easier to just accept him for two weeks as a familiar person I once greatly loved, and then get two months peace. But in that case I won't ever cut ties and make myself whole again. I won't be available to a decent man if I stay with my H out of fear of "what if".

 

Athena, we are married to the same guy!!!!!! LOL! sorry...seriously, my H threatened suicide, disappearance, etc. even though I never brought up the subject of divorce....I THOUGHT it, though and I am pretty sure he knew I was considering it...his words? "Losing you would be like losing everything..." I actually do not believe he will kill himself...but I think there will be a LOT of drama---he told me that if I leave him, he wants custody of our daughter because he can't trust me--I was afterall, committed for Psych issues...nice guy, huh? I was confused about his statements, actually, first, he said he will kill himself, but yet, he wants custody of my daughter....LOL!!!!! I stay quiet...I do not fight or reason with him....it drives him crazy....