Recent study on Why Infidelity is on the rise

[NoIDidn't]

Currently, it is pretty acceptable for both sexes to be promiscuous early-on. This characteristic that in enveloped with excitement is engrained thereafter. The old saying bodes true in this case. Never have I seen a truly promiscuous person change much after marriage; those desires are suppressed for a while, but usually they end up cheating when something doesn't go well in the relationship, even if getting "bored" is what actually occurs. MORALS AND VALUES have gone downhill in many respects; how could this not be one of the factors?

 

I agree with this, in principle. I don't know anyone that was a *player* before marriage or other serious, committed relationship, that stayed faithful. Not one.

[Angel1111]

My 18 yr old son has very strong views about infidelity, so I don't see this as a trend among young people. As a matter of fact, what I see more of with the younger generation is being more selective and, after seeing the reality of divorce with all the previous generations, they're much more cautious about choosing the right partner. My son walked away quick when things didn't work out, and he didn't date around a lot to start with. He's with a great girl right now and she's such a great match for him that I hope they get married when they finish college.

 

I don't see things getting worse with younger generations. I see them learning and being smarter from all the dumb mistakes their parents made.

[sxyNYCcpl]

This has been an interesting thread.

 

I posted one in the general marriage board some weeks back opining that society is evolving sexually, and I think many of the points brought up here back that position up.

 

Our relationship with our sexuality is based on a long list of things we're supposed to NOT do. Much of this list is based at least originally in religious teachings, and over time I believe that people are reaching the conclusion that there really is no reason to blindly follow the rules.

 

 

• Don't have premarital sex.
  
• Don't masturbate.
  
• Don't look at dirty pictures.
  
• Don't have oral sex.
  
• Don't have extra-marital sex.
  
• Monogamy within a committed marriage is the only acceptable form of sexual expression.
  
• Don't do this, don't do that, don't do the other.
  

 

What's happened is people are starting to question many of those foundations, and in some cases are concluding that the rules are silly. What does that have to do about an increase in cheating within committed relationships? It's everything that has been mentioned in this thread already.

 

Casual sexual relationships are more common and socially acceptable. The world is smaller, communication is easier, and more people are keeping in touch with opposite sex friends from the past because it's easier (Facebook anyone?) So, the prevailing attitudes towards casual sexual relationships is relaxed compared to what it used to be, it's easier to be in contact with potential sexual partners, and things happen. It's a logical next step. And it's a shame. Seems to me consensual non-monogamy within a committed relationship is a much better answer, but that's still considered such a taboo that even people who should be considering it don't.

[Owl]

Well...these things may all be more acceptable to you.

 

From MY perspective...a marriage (unless otherwise specified at the time vows are exchanged) is a closed institution...and therefore, all those little "rules" you don't feel should be followed are actually the best possible way to MAINTAIN that marriage.

 

Now...if you specify AND AGREE on different 'rules' as part of your vows...or whatever the foundation of your marriage is...then that's your choice.

 

Or...if you don't marry at all...and therefore don't engage in a committed relationship...then there's no COMMITTMENT...and therefore nothing to protect.

 

Not following those rules are fine...if you're not hurting someone else by not following them.

 

BUT...if you agree to a committed relationship that is based on, or it is implied that it's based on, these rules...then you've agreed to follow these rules.

 

And this isn't society "progressing"...societies have always swung back and forth between conservatism and prosciumuity. You're just seeing the pendulum swing back the other way.

 

Don't confuse change with progress.

 

One last thought about the "not hurting anyone" by not following these rules. If YOU don't believe in monogamy...but use that as a basis to hunt specifically for married men or women...you're still hurting the spouses and families that were built on the basis of monogamy.

 

If you have an open marriage...and your spouse agrees...and you spend time with like minded couples or single people...and everyone involved or peripherally impacted by this agrees...you're NOT hurting anyone.

 

See the difference?

[grogster]

Great post, Owl. I'm of the antinomian school, and I'm not dating. Why? Because I don't want to hurt, disappoint or betray more traditionally minded women.

 

I'll either change or I'll try to find like-minded women.

 

The first and best Rule: Do No Harm.

[sxyNYCcpl]

See the difference?

 

Absolutely, and I agree with much, if not all of what you've said. In case I wasn't clear, for the record I believe that both genuine monogamy or open, consensual non-monogamy are acceptable forms of sexual expression, and both can lead to successful, happy relationships. I despise and disdain cheating.

[Owl]

FWIW, I don't believe that the majority of relationships can successfully maintain an "open" lifestyle long term...I think that jealousy is as hard-wired into our mindset as is the desire to be "with" others is as well.

 

That's why a lot of marriages or relationships START out as 'open'...but at one point, one or the other partner is no longer comfortable with the relationship in that state.

 

I don't think we're "coded" for monogamy OR polygamy.

 

Bluntly...if you want to look at it from a purely genetic/instinctual viewpoint...most people are wired to want to spread their genetic material far and wide. That means that THEY have the desire to be polygamous, but at the same time want their prospective partners to be monogamous to THEM.

 

BUT...I'm also a firm believer that we're NOT ruled by our instincts.

 

We can make CHOICES.

 

And 'society' is simply the rules that exist to allow us to exist together in large numbers. They prevent us from killing each other off.

 

I, personally, am in a monogamous, committed marriage of 21 years so far.

 

So, for me...those 'rules' you outlined apply. They're how I safeguard my marriage.

 

Good conversation, btw.

[sxyNYCcpl]

FWIW, I don't believe that the majority of relationships can successfully maintain an "open" lifestyle long term...I think that jealousy is as hard-wired into our mindset as is the desire to be "with" others is as well.

 

That point is something I've been exploring and trying to understand. I have come to the conclusion that the "ability" to have a successful, long term open relationship is a fundamental part of our personalities. You either have it or you don't, and either way you're unlikely to change to the other way of thinking. I'm not completely married to this hypothesis, but it certainly matches my observations.

 

That's why a lot of marriages or relationships START out as 'open'...but at one point, one or the other partner is no longer comfortable with the relationship in that state.

 

I think much of the time when you see this, it's not that they're "no longer" comfortable with it, it's that they never really were and went along with it for whatever reason.

 

And 'society' is simply the rules that exist to allow us to exist together in large numbers. They prevent us from killing each other off.

 

That's true, but many of our sexual "rules" were handed to us by people who claimed to be speaking for God. While I believe in God, I have a hard time believing He sits around spending time worrying about what us puny humans are doing with our genitals, especially if nobody is being harmed.

[Owl]

That point is something I've been exploring and trying to understand. I have come to the conclusion that the "ability" to have a successful, long term open relationship is a fundamental part of our personalities. You either have it or you don't, and either way you're unlikely to change to the other way of thinking. I'm not completely married to this hypothesis, but it certainly matches my observations.

 

I'm not sure on that one way or another...you could be right. I know what I personally am 'coded' for at least.

 

 

 

I think much of the time when you see this, it's not that they're "no longer" comfortable with it, it's that they never really were and went along with it for whatever reason.

 

A lot of the time, I think that's right. But, I think that equally common are the cases where they've not thought about what it is they're signing up for. It SOUNDS great...but then the actual execution of it is vastly different. It also loses its luster for many people over time. That's why many fantasies are far more powerful as fantasies...but the reality turns out to be much less fun.

 

 

That's true, but many of our sexual "rules" were handed to us by people who claimed to be speaking for God. While I believe in God, I have a hard time believing He sits around spending time worrying about what us puny humans are doing with our genitals, especially if nobody is being harmed.

 

I disagree. I think He DOES care about that...simply because the majority of the time...someone IS harmed by what we're doing with them.

 

Think about it. How many people DO begin their relationships with the expectations of committment and monogamy? It's when the cheating and lying start...it's when the broken promises and the betrayal hits...that's a result of what soemone is thinking with those parts rather than their brains.

 

So He sets down rules intended to reduce the frequency of these betrayals.

 

He gave guidelines for successful, long term, committed relationships. But when people don't follow those rules...people ARE harmed.

 

Would they be less harmed if they went into the relationship with different expectations, different rules? Maybe...but as you'd mentioned earlier, some people are more inclined towards polygamy, some towards monogamy. It all depends on what the person is more geared towards as to whether or not they will follow those rules. AND...BOTH parties have to be in complete agreement on that...

[sxyNYCcpl]

But, I think that equally common are the cases where they've not thought about what it is they're signing up for. It SOUNDS great...but then the actual execution of it is vastly different.

 

I'm sure that happens, but when it does I suspect those folks appear and disappear rapidly. Go to a single party, maybe two, and then are gone.

 

Would they be less harmed if they went into the relationship with different expectations, different rules? <snip> AND...BOTH parties have to be in complete agreement on that...

 

To have a successful open relationship of any length absolutely requires that ALL parties involved be in complete agreement. Anyone who is dragged in unwillingly will eventually explode in a drama bomb. It's not necessarily that those "different rules" be present from the beginning of the relationship, though it would be nice, but if the terms of the relationship are altered by mutual consent, that consent must be real and not coerced.

[NoIDidn't]

Owl and SxyNYCcpl

 

Concerning "coding" for polygamy vs monogamy.

 

How come males that want to practice polygamy want their females to practice monogamy? Harems and the like?

 

Is it more like the human male is more wired for polygamy but can choose monogamy (as he has proven throughout history that he certainly can enforce monogamy on someone else, so he should be able to practice it himself, lol) and the female is more wired for monogamy but can choose polygamy?

 

Good conversation, btw.

[Lovelybird]

If one find a faithful one, then he/she is extremely lucky

 

why people cheat? because lack of faith in some important things

[pelicanpreacher]

I think that the female, while fertile, who's produced offspring is more hardwired toward monogamy in order to support her need to invest time and energy in nurturing while relying upon their partner to provide for the necessities required for survival. Once beyond the "brooding" stage of life or sometimes during it women who have a predisposition toward variety will often be more open to polygamy if their primary relationship proves unsatisfying.

 

Men, on the other hand, have always been hardwired toward polygamy but will often tame themselves to adopt the female perspective in sharing nurturing duties of their mate toward offspring by imposing monogamy upon themselves. Given enough time in this state men will often show restraint against opportunity to indulge in polygamy in deference to the instilled status quo. Those men who have very little instinct toward nurturing or who simply lack maturity and cannot tame themselves fully unto the role of monogamy are likely to remain polyamorous throughout their lives regardless of their relationship status.

[sxyNYCcpl]

How come males that want to practice polygamy want their females to practice monogamy? Harems and the like?

 

Some do.

 

But in my experience with hundreds if not thousands of people who practice consensual non-monogamy that is not the case, in fact it's usually detrimental. I would never ask my wife to allow me to do something that I did not also allow her to do, and vice versa. Our boundaries are mutual.

 

I would note that I consider polygamy to be the sharing of emotional relationships, and only peripherally related to sharing physical sexuality. That may be a matter of semantics, though.

[Lovelybird]

Agree !

 

Only man with maturity is capable of monogamy, this is real evolution

[amerikajin]

I think the main reason people are cheating more has to do more with the fact that our generation is less long-term commitment-oriented. We're a more mobile society than we have been in the past century or more. My grandparents' generation stayed in the same town, the same house, the same job, and stayed married to the same person for decades. That system of stability has been turned on its head. People now move from job to job, city to city, apartment to apartment, girl to girl/guy to guy, and we have just generally become a less stable society. I think the Internet is more symptomatic of this larger trend than it is responsible for the rise in cheating. But the real issue here is that people probably enter relationships with the idea in the back of their mind that if things don't work out, they can always move on to someone else. People now see relationships as they do just about everything else in their life: it's something that works out for them now, but it doesn't necessarily mean that they're going to make a life-long commitment out of it.

 

I'll say this much, though: if you think people 50 - 100 years ago didn't cheat, you're sadly mistaken. The difference is that women cheat more because unlike in the past, when women were completely financially dependent on the man, women can take care of themselves. The consequences of being outed for women are less dire than they used to be, so they're catching up to men in that regard. But men even cheated during the Victorian Era. Red light districts flourished during this time. Men would go to the other side of town for a drink and some sexual relief before coming home to their wives and children. Women probably knew about it, but nobody dared to get a divorce because nobody wanted their dirty laundry aired in public at a time when people were supposedly living moral lifestyles in public.

[ella23]

And as I've said before, there is no such thing as a really close "friend" of the opposite sex. At least not a close friend of the opposite sex that you hang out with. I know, there will be people that say that they have lots of opposite sex friends that they hang out with alone and nothing will ever come of it. Ya right:rolleyes:

that certainly is true of many people. you can't speak for everyone. not everyone has an affair with their friends of the opposite sex.

just because it doesn't work out for you or even for many people, doesn't mean that everyone is sleeping with their friends of the opposite sex. You don't want to believe it then that's your problem, but stop generalising and trying to speak for everyone on the planet.

[Dexter Morgan]

that certainly is true of many people. you can't speak for everyone. not everyone has an affair with their friends of the opposite sex.

 

I'm not saying everyone has opposite sex friends that they have affairs with.

 

I'm saying that an opposite sex friend can fullfil the same needs as their partners and if there is the slightest bit of attraction, then boom.

 

Now if my SO wants to hang out with a fat balding man, then no problem! she wouldn't want me hanging out with any other women as well. Why do you think that is?

[ella23]

I'm not saying everyone has opposite sex friends that they have affairs with.

 

I'm saying that an opposite sex friend can fullfil the same needs as their partners and if there is the slightest bit of attraction, then boom.

 

Now if my SO wants to hang out with a fat balding man, then no problem! she wouldn't want me hanging out with any other women as well. Why do you think that is?

Platonic relationships are not for everyone and there are people who don't feel comfortable with their SO's having friends of the opposite sex. But similarly, there are others who are comfortable with it(especially when the friend had been there before the relationship with the SO). What needs are you talking about? For many it's similar to hanging out with your group of friends of the same sex (and it really is, even if you refuse to believe it).

Just because your SO and you don't like it, doesn't mean others will have exactly the same views.

I know people for whom it has worked out and others for whom it didn't. So what you're claiming is certainly not true, that "people of opposite sexes cannot be friends."

Affairs will happen even if you don't have close friends of the opposite sex, because men and women can interact freely in today's society, e.g. with a co-worker.

[movingonandon]

Yes, it is. If you consider the current self-entitled generation, why would people who are raised with no self-restraint, practice self-restraint?

 

Surprisingly, couldn't agree more on this one.

(it is only surprising because i've disagreed with pretty much every other word of yours on this forum :laugh:)

[movingonandon]

I think the main reason people are cheating more has to do more with the fact that our generation is less long-term commitment-oriented. We're a more mobile society than we have been in the past century or more. My grandparents' generation stayed in the same town, the same house, the same job, and stayed married to the same person for decades. That system of stability has been turned on its head. People now move from job to job, city to city, apartment to apartment, girl to girl/guy to guy, and we have just generally become a less stable society. I think the Internet is more symptomatic of this larger trend than it is responsible for the rise in cheating. But the real issue here is that people probably enter relationships with the idea in the back of their mind that if things don't work out, they can always move on to someone else. People now see relationships as they do just about everything else in their life: it's something that works out for them now, but it doesn't necessarily mean that they're going to make a life-long commitment out of it.

 

True (all) dat, but none of dat is an excuse for cheating.

[amerikajin]

True (all) dat, but none of dat is an excuse for cheating.

 

Didn't meant to suggest that it is. I think what all of these social changes mean is that we need to be very careful and marry only when we're really ready for it.

[Nikki Sahagin]

To be honest, no matter how good you are, how moral you are, how committed you are, how devoted you are, how resilient you are, how controlled you are - all it takes is one, natural moment of human weakness and everything you stand for comes crashing down around you.

 

I actually am one for believing the seemingly tired cliche 'it just happened' because not everything is a thought out, purposeful intentional. Sometimes things DO just happen.

[Nikki Sahagin]

Also I might add, I think there is an element of disillusionment. People are brought up to believe in Princesses and Prince Charmings and happy ever afters. But reality is always so different. REAL RELATIONSHIPS are so different from story books and movies and magazines. And for some reason they are made boring. For instance i've always thought relationships shouldn't be boring, routine, 'stable', they shouldn't just be 'there', it should be about adventure. You should want to DO things with your partner. But I think people see relationships as one part of their life just as work and friends and hobbies are another and they don't bring their partners TRULY into their life's and it is this compartmentalisation of life that makes it easy to cheat in a way because things can be kept seperate.

[Nikki Sahagin]

... providing someone lacks integrity, sure. I mean, does our brain drive our body, or vice versa?

 

But you are acting as though all people are perfect. We are ALL works in progress. Our brains do drive our bodies but our brains are also combined of three drives; the id, ego and superego - constantly at war. And the superego can't always win. Whether you give into something silly like a donut when you're on a diet or something larger - we all have the capacity to disapoint ourselves, to give in. If circumstances are right, if there's a time when you are less strong, less controlled, less sure - it can happen.