Telling the person you're dating that their friend is hot - cool or not cool?

[Star Gazer]

With the alcoholic, is it possible that he was just a guy who couldn't always control his alcoholism, in that sometimes he could keep his drinking down to a functional level (decent guy) and other times he fell far off the wagon (abusive guy)?

 

Right. And I think in many of the other cases, some other "issue" could be substituted in place for "alcoholism" or "drinking."

[Star Gazer]

That's a bad example. Alcoholics can never be 100% available. Unless they stop drinking. Which many do not.

 

That right there should be a flag for you. Unavailable unavailable unavailable.

 

Right. I didn't know that he was an alcoholic until later.

 

Just like I didn't know the married guy was married until 7 months or so in. (I cannot even remember now.)

 

Just like I didn't know this guy was unavailable until the first time he flaked on me.

 

Just like I didn't know that my ex was unavailable until a few months in when he brought up that he might actually move away.

 

In other words, by the time I've found myself really liking them, it's too late. Perhaps the change is that I shouldn't allow myself to invest until I'm certain that they're available and invested as well?

[Trialbyfire]

Hey amaysn, while I agree that alcoholics have issues with availability, the point I was trying to make is that not all SGs selections were about unavailability. She didn't know this guy was an alcoholic when she met him. I think he was just bad luck. It's why we date so we can meet someone worthwhile. Sometimes it works, other times it doesn't.

 

This doesn't mean that SG doesn't select unavailable men though.

[Star Gazer]

This doesn't mean that SG doesn't select unavailable men though.

 

This is definitely true. I just can't figure out how to ascertain that they're unavailable SOONER...BEFORE I *really* like them.

[norajane]

I don't see the difference?

 

There is a difference between the men you choose to date, and the men you reject after a date or two.

 

You are attracted to unavailable men. Those are the ones that make you feel all excited about them right away. You get hooked on them from the start. And pretty much ALL of them have turned out to be unavailable.

 

You are not attracted to available men. You reject them as incompatible or uninteresting or dull or no butterflies.

 

Thus, YOU yourself are not available for a real relationship, because you make yourself unavailable by focusing only on the men you get hooked on right away and dating only them...the ones that are unavailable to you.

 

I'm not suggesting that you date men that you find unattractive. I'm suggesting that you take time away from dating for a while because the only guys you find attractive right now are the ones who are unavailable.

 

It may take a significant amount of time, but it may be necessary to reconsider your perspective on what you find attractive.

[sunshinegirl]

SG, have you ever read the book "Women Who Love Too Much"?

 

The title is off-putting but I read it a few months ago and saw myself in its pages.... and I see you in its pages too. Worth a read if you haven't already. I found it really illuminating...

[amaysngrace]

Right. And I think in many of the other cases, some other "issue" could be substituted in place for "alcoholism" or "drinking."

 

What about the guy with the bad shirt? Is he great otherwise except for his sense of style?

 

You have to see the pattern before you can change it. If you are rejecting the good guys and only have interest for the bad guys then maybe NJ is right that you are also unavailable.

 

Are you available? Are you ready to have a life partner and open up to that person or do issues arise that you haven't yet quite got your head around?

[Star Gazer]

SG, have you ever read the book "Women Who Love Too Much"?

 

The title is off-putting but I read it a few months ago and saw myself in its pages.... and I see you in its pages too. Worth a read if you haven't already. I found it really illuminating...

 

No, I haven't, but I think someone else has recommended it before as well. I will definitely take a peek at it now.

[Star Gazer]

What about the guy with the bad shirt? Is he great otherwise except for his sense of style?

 

I'm not sure I'm physically attracted to him (and not just because of the shirt ), but otherwise, yes - he's great. Really great. In fact, we've been texting or emailing a few times each day all week. We had plans for last night, but I had to cancel because of work obligations. He's polite and yet also clearly demonstrating his interest.

[amaysngrace]

This is definitely true. I just can't figure out how to ascertain that they're unavailable SOONER...BEFORE I *really* like them.

 

Well they're not going to be wearing a banner as much as we would like them to.

[Trialbyfire]

Does challenge stir up your senses, SG?

[Star Gazer]

Well they're not going to be wearing a banner as much as we would like them to.

 

 

Does challenge stir up your senses, SG?

 

Yes, but not in a good way. I feel....fearful.

[amaysngrace]

I'm not sure I'm physically attracted to him (and not just because of the shirt ), but otherwise, yes - he's great. Really great. In fact, we've been texting or emailing a few times each day all week. We had plans for last night, but I had to cancel because of work obligations. He's polite and yet also clearly demonstrating his interest.

 

Good. Attraction grows. You don't need to be all out into him from the start. You shouldn't be anyway. You're too smart for that.

 

But good.

[Trialbyfire]

Yes, but not in a good way. I feel....fearful.

You two met on a dating site. Did you communicate awhile sending flirty messages back and forth until he finally asked you for a date? Or was he there, wanting to date right away?

 

Edit - current ex.

[amaysngrace]

Yes, but not in a good way. I feel....fearful.

 

Remember this okay? Because if someone makes you feel this way from the start it's a gut reaction.

 

One you should not ignore.

[Star Gazer]

You two met on a dating site. Did you communicate awhile sending flirty messages back and forth until he finally asked you for a date? Or was he there, wanting to date right away?

 

Edit - current ex.

 

We exchanged only 2-3 emails before realizing that we had 3 mutual friends in common (one being my ROOMMATE!!!) and had actually been to the same parties, bars, etc., had literally been feet away from each other and not known it. (Well, I hadn't known it - he did, he recognized me.) Once we added each other to MS, I realized we knew even more people in the same circle. I see his comments on my friends pages', and mine on his friends' pages. So in a way it felt like it was only a matter of time before we met.

 

Because we were already in the same social circle, he suggested we just quickly bite the bullet and meet up. So we did. (He actually said something that as I sit here now sounds like a line. He said, "I never do this because I've had a bad experience on here, but seeing as we have X and Y and Z in common, .... and you can even ask Z [my roommate] for dirt on me." - And I did, I asked.) And so it began.

 

*** One thing I have found odd is this: When I sense we're getting closer, he'll take his profile down, usually the day of or the day before our next planned date. Then we'll have some fun date of some sort where I really feel like we bond and get closer. I will then take my profile down - not because he took his down, but because I don't want to date anyone else (without communicating this to him). He will then completely withdraw and disappear for a week or more. After a week or so, I get irritated and *think* I'm moving on and put my profile back up. Within a few days of me putting my profile back up, he'll put his back up and contact me and act as though nothing's happened. This is the constant cycle. That and him explaining that I had done something "wrong" to make him disappear to begin with.

[Star Gazer]

Remember this okay? Because if someone makes you feel this way from the start it's a gut reaction.

 

One you should not ignore.

 

I feel like it's the only emotion I know (well, fear mixed with butterflies). It's either that or "blah." So I always choose the former.

[Trialbyfire]

I feel like it's the only emotion I know (well, fear mixed with butterflies). It's either that or "blah." So I always choose the former.

You've just answered your own questions. You get apprehensive, then the fear of abandonment gets ahold of you, then you try to hold onto a guy who's unavailable. I think there's the challenge aspect too, at least at the very beginning. These guys keep you wondering to a degree, enough that it triggers that fear/butterfly effect.

[RecordProducer]

Cool?!?! It's not only bad manners and inapprorpiate, but I would conclude with "no right to appeal" that this person is passive-aggressive. Definitely not a keeper. A keeper would keep his opinion to himself and compliment YOU - the one he's dating.

 

I feel like it's the only emotion I know (well, fear mixed with butterflies). It's either that or "blah." So I always choose the former.

I know what you mean. I think this is because we're strong women and we like storng men. But most of what seems to be strong is just tough-guy-image passive-aggressive men who pretend to be strong and cool (and we buy it) to cover their complexes and seduce us. I understand the blah feeling; no, don't go for it.

 

Just become very, very picky.

[amaysngrace]

I feel like it's the only emotion I know (well, fear mixed with butterflies). It's either that or "blah." So I always choose the former.

 

What about this great guy with the bad shirt? How does he make you feel? Fearful or blah?

[Star Gazer]

What about this great guy with the bad shirt? How does he make you feel? Fearful or blah?

 

Somewhere between content/happy and blah. I have more moments of contentment than blah-ness though.

[amaysngrace]

Somewhere between content/happy and blah. I have more moments of contentment than blah-ness though.

 

But never fear?

[Star Gazer]

But never fear?

 

With shirt guy? Nope.

[amaysngrace]

With shirt guy? Nope.

 

I think it's really important for you to remember you have control. You have so much going for you and you are the prize here.

 

Any guy should be lucky to have the time you give to them. It's your time. It's a gift. And any guy you give your time to better be damn well worth it.

 

If you are opening up to them and letting them get to know you they better be worth you. You are a great woman with a kind heart and any man worthwhile is going to be appreciative and grateful that a woman such as you would share yourself with them.

 

You're an impressive girl. Are you perfect? Nope. No one is. But are you pretty great? Without a doubt.

 

You really should believe that. Because it's true.

 

The way I see it you have some choices to make. You can continue on with this shirt guy if you think he may be worthy of you or maybe not. Time will tell. You maybe already know if he is or not. Is he good enough? Make sure. If he's not say good-bye.

 

I like that he doesn't make you scared though. That may very well mean he's safe. But only you can decide if the time you give him is time well-spent. If it's not then "bye".

 

As for the other one, I don't know too much about him other than he plays games with you. It seems as soon as you take down your profile he backs off. You can play with him too by keeping it up. But again only if you think he's worth the time you're putting in. Only you know how you feel about him. If you want to continue on with him that is your choice. And if what you know about him makes you just want to say "bye" then do that.

 

I think it would be really good for you to sit back and seriously think about all the many ways you are wonderful. Why do you think people take the time to listen to you here?

 

It's because we believe you deserve so much better. We can't all be wrong.

[Cherry Blossom 35]

I think we go after the same types of guys, Star.

 

There must be some element of danger or excitement about these men that you pick up on before you ever find out they are in some way unavailable. I like that, too. Safe and stable means boring a lot of the time, but not always. I think if you enjoy the time with shirt guy and you are attracted to him, you should definitely see where it goes. Strong feelings can develop. I did date a guy like that once. I enjoyed my time with him, but he really liked me and I just didn't trust that. The more time I spent with him, though, the more I realized that he was a strong man of deep character, and there was nothing boring about him at all. I think I did something to put him of balance and he totally called me on it. I liked his strength in that situation, to not let me get way with it.