wildsoul Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 So the point about my classes was that, if I wanted him to think of me in any way, I would continue to go to the classes so he would see me and do all that BS stuff. I think that you've been acting very powerless in this situation, and have actually victimized yourself by not going to your classes as a way to deal with him. Unless you're acting that way because something DID happen between you and him, then here is what I would do. Go back to your classes and routines. Ignore him completely. If he doesn't stay within his boundaries, let him have it w/ both barrels. Even better if it's in front of others. His creepy behavior thrives in it's covertness. Draw attention to it. I can think of a few occasions in the distant past where a guy has made unwelcome advances. If they don't take the subtle request to stop, then I've said things loud enough for others to hear such as, "I asked you to stop coming on to me. Leave me alone!" The public shame will make them slink away. You have to do it in the moment though.
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 Fun, in your first scenario, the MM took advantage of you in a professional context, so I'd out him in that context - not to his W. What he did was unprofessional and unethical, and his professional board needs to censure him for that. His W will perhaps find out through the process of the hearing; either way, the professional misconduct should be addressed. I wanted to go that route, but found out that the board investigates only 4% of complaints, and of those, less than .4% get any action taken against them after a 2 year period of 'investigation.' So all that would do is NOTHING. In your second scenario, I feel you did owe it to your friend to explain to her why you were shunning her - but it may be too late to do that now. It would have been more appropriate at the time to respond to her invitation by saying something about feeling uncomfortable around her H, that you'd rather see her alone (without him, not necessarily without others) as you'd hate anything to happen between you (him and you) that might jeopardise your friendship. That would have allowed her to confront it at the time - you may have lost her friendship, but not telling her was going to cost it, too, and it would at least have given her the choice at the time. I had a colleague whose H behaved like that (she was the most stunning woman; he was hideous and a complete loser) and years later she confided in a friend that she wished she'd known why she was being frozen out of the work social circle. I completely agree. THis thread has helped me sort out my thoughts, and I agree with you that had I told the wife right away, things would've been taken care of and processed but it seems too late to go and rehash things at this point, now that I'm emotionally ready to. So I feel comfortable with just letting it go at this point... Good to see you back - how are you doing these days? Thanks!!, not too good but hanging in there u?
wildsoul Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 It's a stretch to call it an affair, considering I saw him during paid office visits. It was more like sexual assault IMO. More like sexual and emotional abuse. (Assault is patently against your will, whereas his abuse included games to get you to comply and play along.) The fact that he was charging you is extra revolting. Not only should you consider filing charges against him so you can get a settlement to PAY for the therapy you need, but think about the others he might be abusing. Surely, you've seen this sort of Dr/patient abuse on the nightly news. Typically the Dr is abusing a whole cadre of women. Blow the whistle. PS: I understand the statistics you quote about it being futile, but I still think that you have an ethical obligation. Even if nothing comes of THIS incident, you've started the paper trail on his record.
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 More like sexual and emotional abuse. (Assault is patently against your will, whereas his abuse included games to get you to comply and play along.) The fact that he was charging you is extra revolting. Not only should you consider filing charges against him so you can get a settlement to PAY for the therapy you need, but think about the others he might be abusing. Surely, you've seen this sort of Dr/patient abuse on the nightly news. Typically the Dr is abusing a whole cadre of women. Blow the whistle. Trust me, I've been wanting to, but it would be at the cost of my reputation. For the rest of my life if someone entered my name on the internet it would be tied to this case because it would blow up really big and I don't want that to happen. I stopped talking to my ex (who I've known for years and even though the relationship part had ended, he was still very furious and concerned about this whole thing, and threatened to go to reporters if I didn't myself. He just doesn't get that I don't want my name to be splashed all over the place, and he thinks it's being selfish bec I won't stop him from abusing others, which is where my therapist has been very helpful.She's been the only person to put MY best interest first. How could I be a martyer when my head isn't straight and I feel so confused and might do soemthing I'll regret out of pressure to please others who might have their own motives, such as the jealous angry ex etc. Also I was wondering what BS stands for. I can see in context it refers to the wife, but what exactly ?
whichwayisup Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 It's a stretch to call it an affair, considering I saw him during paid office visits. It was more like sexual assault IMO. Then I totally mis-read your post. I know not too long ago you were involved with another MM, a neighbour or something? I didnt know that this thread was about the MM therapist. Before you tell his wife, make sure you have everything written down, with the help of your new T, and not only tell her (wife), but charge him for sexual harrassment. This so-called ex therapist of yours used your vunerablity against you and we (a long time ago) encouraged you to file a suit against him, but you didn't want to as you thought you were inlove with him. Glad that you now see what a scumbag this guy is. He certainly should've be a practicing and licensed therapist anymore. can see in context it refers to the wife, but what exactly ? BS= Betrayed spouse. BW is betrayed wife, BH is betrayed husband..
wildsoul Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 Ugh. What you're saying is exactly what makes this abuse! -Power differential -Done within the context of paid services -Gets you playing along, so you'll feel guilty -Knows you won't speak up because you have as much to lose -Knows it's hard to prove as you "went along with it." What you're going through now is more than the typical rejected OW scenario. I seldom say this, as I think a lot of what happens to us is within our control to prevent, but you've been victimized. I'm really sorry this has happened to you. It's great that you're getting therapy that's working. I wish you didn't have to pay for it too. But it does sound like you're doing well overall. Peace be with you.
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 Most of it happened while he had put me under hypnosis as well. I am just really upset and full of hate and feel powerless to do anything about it, other than wait for time to make me feel it less and help me forget about it. I'm not trying to act like a victim, like poor me. I went through that for a while, but I feel anger like I want to do something, take action, but like I said the board doesn't do anything, and the police would make it public info and things would really blow up, so it's like ok, just forget about it and hope that I'm not responsible for other women this happens to since I for one was not warned when I walked into his web and got all my being sucked out of me - emotionally, physically and monetarily - only for him to crawl on to his next patient in all probability and sink his fangs into another woman.
jwi71 Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 Most of it happened while he had put me under hypnosis as well. I am just really upset and full of hate and feel powerless to do anything about it, other than wait for time to make me feel it less and help me forget about it. I'm not trying to act like a victim, like poor me. I went through that for a while, but I feel anger like I want to do something, take action, but like I said the board doesn't do anything, and the police would make it public info and things would really blow up, so it's like ok, just forget about it and hope that I'm not responsible for other women this happens to since I for one was not warned when I walked into his web and got all my being sucked out of me - emotionally, physically and monetarily - only for him to crawl on to his next patient in all probability and sink his fangs into another woman. So knowing he will prey on another you will let him. YOU can make a change. And this is telling the W. Now he faces the consequences of his actions - maybe they get a divorce and he is free to date. Or maybe they work on the M and recover. In any case, its positive change. And the BS is no longer in the dark as to the true nature of the M. Now she can choose to either allow him to attempt reconciliation or leave. As to proof. I'm sure you have more than enough. I'd tell. This isnt play ground rumors in grade school - its lives. Its STDs. Its living in a lie. I am glad I discovered my wife's A. Painful, devastating and all that. But I am 1000 percent better now as a man. Positive change.
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 So knowing he will prey on another you will let him. YOU can make a change. And this is telling the W. Now he faces the consequences of his actions - maybe they get a divorce and he is free to date. Or maybe they work on the M and recover. In any case, its positive change. And the BS is no longer in the dark as to the true nature of the M. Now she can choose to either allow him to attempt reconciliation or leave. As to proof. I'm sure you have more than enough. I'd tell. This isnt play ground rumors in grade school - its lives. Its STDs. Its living in a lie. I am glad I discovered my wife's A. Painful, devastating and all that. But I am 1000 percent better now as a man. Positive change. I'm realizing that it's best to not say anything. Personally I could care less about helping his marriage. Why would I want to help someone who abused me? Who I PAID to help me but instead chose to abuse me? And as many have said the wife will only attack me instead of seeing it as a favor. My conscience was only concerned about HER because I was putting myself in her shoes but need to realize that in reality she will see me as the bad guy... I've gone through enough and feel like I got the answers I need, so thanks to everyone.
White Flower Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 Hi, I've read most of the thread and feel that most have offered advice they would want for themselves. I don't believe that an OW tells only for the hope of gaining the MM all to herself. I believe oftentimes that the OW has many other reasons for telling; she may want forgiveness, to lift a burden, or realize over time that she would want to know were she in the same shoes. I have pondered this often. I finally concluded that I will wait to see if it is important enough for the W to come to me and ask. If and when she does, I will hold back nothing. When she is ready for the truth, she will come looking for it. If she prefers to bury her head in the sand, that is her prerogative. Now, she may need help in deciding if she needs to know anything at all. What do I mean? Maybe she would want to know if there were obvious clues, but what if she noticed no clues? Someone could hand her an email address in a parking lot and ask her to write to it if she 'had certain questions' or some similar obvious suggestion. It is her choice to then listen to her heart and write this person or not if she were truly looking for answers. Or, she could decide this was a crazy person and throw the paper away. It's an idea that could work. And the choice lies with the BS whether to inquire or not.
LucreziaBorgia Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 Fun, I am so happy you are out from beneath MM1's influence. I hope you can do something to stop him from continuing to do this with other patients.
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 11, 2008 Author Posted December 11, 2008 Fun, I am so happy you are out from beneath MM1's influence. I hope you can do something to stop him from continuing to do this with other patients. I thought I'd let you know that I am scheduled to meet with an attorney tomorrow re: MM1. It's been a long, painful, turbulent couple of years and we'll see what my rights are tomorrow. I feel like going to the wife like you all say, will not get anything constructive done, just add more drama such as trying to convince her if she doesn't believe me, when the bigger picture is that this is a man who is abusive and why should I rely on his wife who may or may not know about it in the first place, to do anything to stop him. I'm both nervous and feeling eager about the appointment tomorrow. Wish me luck. I am so so so so so so so so fed up and angry and ready to do something, or more like go to someone who can do something considering the people I've confided in thus far have not pulled through or else were going about it the wrong way leaving me in a vulnerable situation to get exploited.
serial muse Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 I thought I'd let you know that I am scheduled to meet with an attorney tomorrow re: MM1. It's been a long, painful, turbulent couple of years and we'll see what my rights are tomorrow. I feel like going to the wife like you all say, will not get anything constructive done, just add more drama such as trying to convince her if she doesn't believe me, when the bigger picture is that this is a man who is abusive and why should I rely on his wife who may or may not know about it in the first place, to do anything to stop him. I'm both nervous and feeling eager about the appointment tomorrow. Wish me luck. I am so so so so so so so so fed up and angry and ready to do something, or more like go to someone who can do something considering the people I've confided in thus far have not pulled through or else were going about it the wrong way leaving me in a vulnerable situation to get exploited. I do wish you luck, Fun. But I just wanted to add that I do hope you'll report him (MM1) to the board. I understand that you're not sure it'll do any good - but honestly, just making the report is taking action. Having that on his record is taking action, and if nothing happens now, then it may benefit someone in the future. Please, do what you can to get this on the record. It's incredibly important, not only because you'll have taken a stand for yourself, but also because it will ultimately build a case against him. He's a predator, he has a history and he'll keep doing it until the evidence is overwhelming. And, truly - you don't know for sure that it won't work.
OWoman Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 I do wish you luck, Fun. But I just wanted to add that I do hope you'll report him (MM1) to the board. I understand that you're not sure it'll do any good - but honestly, just making the report is taking action. Having that on his record is taking action, and if nothing happens now, then it may benefit someone in the future. Please, do what you can to get this on the record. It's incredibly important, not only because you'll have taken a stand for yourself, but also because it will ultimately build a case against him. He's a predator, he has a history and he'll keep doing it until the evidence is overwhelming. And, truly - you don't know for sure that it won't work. Yep - all of that, from me too! Good luck Fun!! (((hugs)))
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 11, 2008 Author Posted December 11, 2008 I do wish you luck, Fun. But I just wanted to add that I do hope you'll report him (MM1) to the board. I understand that you're not sure it'll do any good - but honestly, just making the report is taking action. Having that on his record is taking action, and if nothing happens now, then it may benefit someone in the future. Please, do what you can to get this on the record. It's incredibly important, not only because you'll have taken a stand for yourself, but also because it will ultimately build a case against him. He's a predator, he has a history and he'll keep doing it until the evidence is overwhelming. And, truly - you don't know for sure that it won't work. I've already informed the attorney my hesitation to report to the board, having to do with the fact that they investigate so few complaints and take action on a tiny percentage etc. I'm sure I won't be a small fish who will be ignored once I have the assistance of this attorney (who by the way is no small fish, I'm sure you've heard the name on many cases on the news before). Hopefully will be the end of being taken advantage of for me, let's see if he can get away this time.
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 11, 2008 Author Posted December 11, 2008 Yep - all of that, from me too! Good luck Fun!! (((hugs))) Thank you.
OWoman Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 I've already informed the attorney my hesitation to report to the board, having to do with the fact that they investigate so few complaints and take action on a tiny percentage etc. I'm sure I won't be a small fish who will be ignored once I have the assistance of this attorney (who by the way is no small fish, I'm sure you've heard the name on many cases on the news before). Hopefully will be the end of being taken advantage of for me, let's see if he can get away this time. You go, Fun!!!
wildsoul Posted December 12, 2008 Posted December 12, 2008 I'm so glad to hear this news. It's a dirty job, but it needs to be done. Glad your sense of righteous anger kicked in. Remember, a big part of why you hire an attorney is so THEY can guide and protect you. You're a victim and a witness. Your attorney is the prosecutor, not you. May grace strengthen and protect you while you do your part in setting the record straight.
Reggie Posted December 12, 2008 Posted December 12, 2008 I think it is best to tell. The "informed decision" rationale has a ton of merit. These women should know the truth. It is that simple.
Dexter Morgan Posted December 12, 2008 Posted December 12, 2008 I won't go through all the details but here are two scenerios I am dealing with and am not sure what to do. 1. I was involved with a married man who I THOUGHT loved me. I recently realized it was wrong and he took advantage of me. I don't know if his wife should be informed. Did you feel the need to inform her when you were with her husband? I wrote a few letters but am not sure if I should send them. I keep thinking, if my husband was cheating, I would want to know. Hmmmm. If you're husband was cheating, you would want to know, yet you start an affair with someone elses husband. Ya sure. Go ahead and tell the wife. She deserves to know. But you'd be a hypocrite to be the one to do the snitching. So in both scenerios, what should I do? And for the record, neither would be to retaliate or because I wanted to be with these men (both are doctors and if I wanted to be with them I had the opportunity and would've pursued things). So if you didn't want to be with either of them, then why do you care about whether you thought the MM loved you or not. If you didn't want to be with him, you could really care less, right? Again, I think a betrayed spouse should be informed. But I think by you doing it, it IS to retaliate. I admit I was taken with #1 and love clouded my judgement but I finally thank goodness got clarity and am angry at what he did. And are you equally as angry with yourself for sleeping with someone elses husband? But part of my confusion is also trying to figure out if punishing them is the best thing as well since why should they get away with a crime especially if I was the victim? Uh, you knew he was married. You slept with another woman's husband. You are not the victim here. The only victim is the wife.
Dexter Morgan Posted December 12, 2008 Posted December 12, 2008 As far as I am concerned, I don't believe in telling the wife so that she can "make an informed decision." I don't buy into this for a minute. Anyone who tells is only doing so out of bitterness and rage and a need for vengeance as well as a secret hope that if she finds out, she'll leave her husband. wrong. Plenty of people could have told me about what my xW was doing. And because they kept their mouths shut, many years of my life was wasted on her. As the xBS, I DEFINITELY wanted to know. I could have made more out of what precious years I have left on this planet if I had known.
Dexter Morgan Posted December 12, 2008 Posted December 12, 2008 I have evidence if they want to take it there. Both of the wives are doctors too You slept with not one, but 2 wives husbands? Aye yi yi
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 13, 2008 Author Posted December 13, 2008 I'm so glad to hear this news. It's a dirty job, but it needs to be done. Glad your sense of righteous anger kicked in. Remember, a big part of why you hire an attorney is so THEY can guide and protect you. You're a victim and a witness. Your attorney is the prosecutor, not you. May grace strengthen and protect you while you do your part in setting the record straight. I thought I'd let you guys know that the attorney was not interested in helping me. THey couldn't understand why someone my age (adult vs. a minor) would continue to see someone who was taking advantage of them, especially the fact that I continued to pay for my visits after it turned sexual. I feel really hurt but at least in the future I won't regret not having tried to do something. I think it also had to do with the fact that I didn't want to sue him for like everything he's worth. I just wanted to recoup the amount I paid him for those visits, even if it was to give it away to charity. I feel angry that he profited from abusing me.
Author Fun2BMe Posted December 13, 2008 Author Posted December 13, 2008 wrong. Plenty of people could have told me about what my xW was doing. And because they kept their mouths shut, many years of my life was wasted on her. As the xBS, I DEFINITELY wanted to know. I could have made more out of what precious years I have left on this planet if I had known. I think that's how you feel in hindsight, but the reality based on all the feedback is that had you been told at the time you were still married, you would not have believed it at all, especially if your spouse were to deny it.
Recommended Posts