jamie2002 Posted December 4, 2008 Posted December 4, 2008 I would like to know your story. I also have myself and this is really good therapy for me. Only in the last few months have i really understood what it was i was dealing with and i am curious how your stories went if you are willing to share. Therapy for anyone who would like to chat about it.
9Lives Posted December 4, 2008 Posted December 4, 2008 jamie2002 I am trying to figure this out myself. I think I need clarification since I keep meeting the type and not recognizing the warning signs.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 4, 2008 Author Posted December 4, 2008 Hi Ninelives, Thanks for showing an interest in my post. I was with someone for almost two years who now i know was a narcissist but i had no idea when i was with him. I was still in contact with him for another 3 years being in his life as a friend because at the time that is all he could offer me due to going to law school and stress .. but he said he wanted to work things out when he was done..I gave him a timeline in my head and continued to live my life and date. I told myself that if he didnt step up after school i was done..And i stuck to it thank god.. 6 months after i decided to really cut him out he played the i am ready to get married and i messed everything up for nothing card..but i didn't really bite.. i started doing a lot of reading not even sure how but on the subject of narcissism and to my surprise it was like it was telling my story. The most painful experience of my life to date. I have grown a ton from it but i am so interested on how other people delt with it and if they ever called the person out on the subject and just there story. I know i am not alone .. So what kind of guys do you date? Do you think you have dated a narcissitic man before? Or just selfish? There is a huge difference and until i researched this subject i thought i was going crazy. But i don't feel that way at all anymore. I feel stronger from the experience that i survived it. Please share your thoughts
9Lives Posted December 4, 2008 Posted December 4, 2008 Well first of all, tell me what the difference between selfish or narcistic person is? I did not know there was a huge difference. From what you described, maybe I thought he was selfish but....maybe he is more narc than anything. Yeah my ex gave the wait until this and wait until that story too. I waited, and waited, and waited...then he said he dont want a relationship, I should date other peeps. He was the love of my life so that is when I let it go. I did not want that and was not going to go along with HIS TERMS anymore. When i think about narcistic person...maybe that is what he was...I cant say he was totally selfish really, but maybe narc...I just know the difference...tell me so I can clarify...Either way...it all about them and we are need to quit dealing with those kind of people or learn how to put them in their place.
Athena Posted December 4, 2008 Posted December 4, 2008 Jamie, I married a narcissistic man after dating for only seven months. I did not realize he was the way he was, because he was on best behavior during that short time. I thought he was my ideal man come true. The day after our Honeymoon started, he seemed to change -- he got really angry over something minor, and threatened divorce! I was shocked. Anyway, it took me many, many years to finally understand that his behavior was not my fault. He blamed me whenever it was convenient and would say stuff like "You don't listen to me" which, I realize now was his code for, "You should do as I say if you hear me telling you to do something" 'Listening' to me means Hearing and Understanding someone, and then giving your response to it. 'Listening' to him meant not having a different opinion to him. It meant not contradicting him on anything by having my own viewpoint. Anyway, after he had several affairs behind my back, I sought individual, as well as marital counseling. The counselor was the first one to see he was narcissistic. She told me he was N and most likely would never change, but I still tried to help him change, since he claimed he wanted to change (That desire to change was a lie, as he admitted earlier this year when I found out about yet ANOTHER affair, However he NOW says he REALLY wants to change!) Over the past few years I have emailed him info about narcissism, and although he admits that describes him for several of the points, he claims he isn't a narcissist. But he is, he just cannot see it and admit it. He does whatever it takes to feed his need for admiration. Yet, it didn't seem to ever be enough. The admiration and adoration I gave him was accepted by him as a right, but then it wasn't enough and he sought admiration and validation from other women via affairs. We have two children together. They are now in college. We have been married 22 years and I feel I have 'done my time' and proved, again and again that he is a liar who will never change... all that he does is he gets better and better at getting his own way. Having been involved with a N husband has been so very damaging to me. I regret staying with him, and will be making plans to leave. I honestly have tried everything and anything to help him, us, our marriage, his needs, and now finally I see that I neglected my own needs. But that is Exactly what the N wants... the Significant Other to be completely and utterly focused on HIS needs.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 4, 2008 Author Posted December 4, 2008 I am only talking from my experience of why i believe he was. Maybe yours was just selfish which that is exatly what i thought also and immiture etc.. but when i read and looked at the bigger picture and really looked back on my relationship with this person i realized something totally different. My ex at the start was very handsome,charming,smart,funny,romantic,loving,caring, and swept me off my feet. He told me he loved me 4 months into our relationship and started talking about living together by the 6 month. I didn't move in with him because he was just starting law school and i didn't want to add to the stress with the move so i told him we should wait until he got adjusted for a 6 good months. So we continued to date and i just saw things that were not right in the relationship over a period of time and let me tell you a very slow process and a little bit at a time so i thought i was going crazy.. it boiled down to him acting very selfish,he manipulted everything around so it was my fault, he belittled me for the most stupid things i ever heard,he talked down to his family and also belittled them, they were afraid of him i think..i was just more like WTF is wrong with this guy and thought he had immiture issues.. He was all about himself and if the subject didn't revolve around him he had no interest. He was very materialistic and i mean down to his underwhere ha. He had to have the biggest best of everything than anyone he knew.. he hated holidays, he had no empathy for anyone. He told me he loved me all the time but i never really felt it after the first 6 months.. I was crazy in love and so brainwashed by this guy. He kept me in his life after our breakup as his friend now i know as his back up supply because i was feeding his supply.. if you date a guy like this you will know because all of your energy will be drained, you will have to pick up the peices of your life and try to get your sanity back.. it is so insane and it will almost make you insane.. You will think he is the love of your life but in reality its the mirage he portrayed at the beginning that you hold onto. He is a master manipulator and will lie about whatever he can to get his way. And he will do it in a way that has you convinced he is right. I hope your guy was just the typical selfish type. But i only saw the difference when i really stepped out of the picture.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 HI Athena, Thank you sooooo much for sharing your story with me. I can relate on absolutly everything you have said.. its like we were dating the same guy but i know that is not true. Isn't so insane when you really realize who you are dating???? It makes me feel like i was dating the devel or something of that sort.. I did think i was going insane and he made me feel by the end the weakest person and insecure thing i have ever been in my life. I loved him so much and he drained everything out of me to where i didn't even know myself in the mirror because i gave him all my energy... Thank god above that i found the truth and so did you.. i believe that we were both saved from a life of living hell.. I am sure you are like me.. giving,loyal,caring,trusting,understanding, and put other people you care about in front of yourself.. To a normal guy i believe those are good qualities to have. I wasnt insecure or unstable when i met him.. I was very strong and doing my life. But he knew exatly how to push my buttons and to find my weakest points against me. I know he cheated also of course he never admitted to it but we fought alot so i know he had to get his fix somewhere else.. i guess i stayed so long because my love was so strong and i felt he was kind of broken inside but also saw good points that i held onto.. I never tried to change him I just wanted to love him and be with him and he push and pushed until i almost broke.. and then i finally woke up to the distored life i was in.. My advice to you is get out as fast as you can and dont hold on to anything .. you have children so you have to stay in contact but i am sure you have read how to deal with them when children are involved.. there is a way but just dont let your gaurd down.. you will never win as you know they will never love us the way we need them to because they are empty shells very hollow inside.. I read that if you put one in a room by himself for 3 days with nobody to talk to it could make him go insane... after my experience i bet that could be true.. if you want to talk more i am here to listen .... i bless you and your children... just be happy that you can love so deep and care so much they have no idea what that means..that is a very sad way to live..
9Lives Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 WEll, yeah he is the N word. They are very charming, handsome, ...too good to be true in the begining. He took my breath away. Gave me so much attention. I thought to myself...I have found what the world is looking for in a man. They move very fast too. He got my heart and as time went on, there went my life. I did not realize until now that it is a N trap. I dont think he is extreme but he definately has alot of the N traits. I have never had such a hard time moving on from someone. I wanted this love to work so bad. I would do anything to make him happy. It wasnt going to work no matter what I did. Looks like this was the best thing for me....the Man upstairs freed me from the future hurts and disappointment that were coming my way as long as i was with him.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 Yes 9lives the man up above did save you. i thought i found the man of my dreams also until they were ripped away. thanks for sharing your story ..i am here to talk if you like..
9Lives Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 I still love him. I still miss him. I am glad that I dont have to deal with him but i still love him. That is why I wont talk to him. He was special to me. He made me happy at one time. I loved being with him. When it was good, it was good. Once he got into character N....it was very hard on me. I wanted what we had and i did not want it to change. It has been along road to come to this point. I tried all could. I read books, emails, asked so many people. I couldnt save my relationship. he would try to be with me but inside he was not giving his all. I was giving 100 he was giving 40 or 50 or 60 or back to 40..sometimes 70. I think he got over me while we was together. I think he cared for me but he was definately ready to get involved with other people. He made up his mind. I dont think he expect me to walk away for good though cause he was so cocky and he knew how much I loved him. He wasnt too worried about it. I think at one point he gave it some thought about ending things. Deep down he wanted me to stay but he did not want to commit anymore. He wanted to have commitment free sex. He wanted us to hang out and then not hang out. It was just strange to see how he could be cold and hot.....he would want to be bothered, then he would not want to be bothered. I hated when he would tell me no. I would ask would he like some company...he would say no. I hated that. Then the last time we departed, I left him alone...this was in October. He was call and texting. I gave in thinking he wanted to get back to doing us and he would treat me better....that last for about 3 weeks and I was being treated like a nobody. I finally gave up.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 I am sure that your ex is npd also.. we have the same story.. my ex almost said the same things hot cold alot. Was it good only when you fed his ego, or when you agreed with him on everything? And then it got bad if you stood up for yourself on anything ? He wants you around to feed his supply i promise he isnt in it for the right reasons.. stay strong and continue nc.. you made the right choice.. it is strange to understand these people exist but they do and will feed off whoever strokes there ego.. and sex is a power for them.. we are possesions to them not someone they care about.. and they will cheat lie and and put you in there web as long as you let them..ignore any texs etc..it is all the same.. all they want is supply anyway they can... the more i read the more i know its a game..a sick twisted mind game and we are the playing pieces on the board..
You'reasian Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 Sorry to hear about these stories. All I can say as the guy here is that someday I do hope to find the right one for me and that she'll have been constantly making herself ready to be in a long-term relationship but until then its going to be about dating.
underpants Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 If the company of someone is a hidden burden to your self esteem, and you feel like it is something you should not discuss or mutually resolve. Keeping the peace means walking on eggshells. That is a huge flag that something is way wrong in the dynamic. Time and distance is the only medicine. Figure out the answers for yourself not him/her, and let the experience strengthen you. Some people just suck. There are better mountains ahead once you crawl out of the pond scum.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 Hi underpants- thank you for your kind words of wisdom.. I totally agree on every level that the experience made me stronger. That person brought out a side of me that i didn't know and pulled out all the insecurities i had deep inside myself i guess. But if i didnt go through that experience I am not sure if i would have ever seen my true self ..the raw part that you keep hidden and hit rock bottom to kind of rebuild my new life. I also believe that i wouldnt be with my boyfriend today because he is a very strong soal that needed a partner that is just as strong inside and i became that person from the experience i was in before him...strange how it all played out and makes so much since..It just proves i am stronger than i thought in the end because now i wont take any s.it from anyone and if anybody diserespects me on any level i am very quick to put them in there place. You will find the right person when you are living your own true life happy and free.
9Lives Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 I am sure that your ex is npd also.. we have the same story.. my ex almost said the same things hot cold alot. Was it good only when you fed his ego, or when you agreed with him on everything? And then it got bad if you stood up for yourself on anything ? He wants you around to feed his supply i promise he isnt in it for the right reasons.. stay strong and continue nc.. you made the right choice.. it is strange to understand these people exist but they do and will feed off whoever strokes there ego.. and sex is a power for them.. we are possesions to them not someone they care about.. and they will cheat lie and and put you in there web as long as you let them..ignore any texs etc..it is all the same.. all they want is supply anyway they can... the more i read the more i know its a game..a sick twisted mind game and we are the playing pieces on the board.. Did your ex keep secrets from you often. Like he knew he had plans, or he knew inside of him that we werent going to be together at times. It was like he was keeping me arround trying to decide if he really wanted to let me go. I think he went back and forth about it within himself. I think that had alot to do with the ups and downs too. Did you or anyone date someone like that? He knew friendship was not going to work with me and he did not want to lose everything we shared.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 Yes ninelives he did.. and he would make plans with me and then tell me last minute he forgot he had to do something else..that happend slow but a lot over time.. i think they see in us something strong that they want to reflect on themselves what drew them to us in the first place was our strength and they wanted to break us by making us weak.. i know by cutting my ex out of my life it caused him narcissitic ingury.. I was a very big source of his supply.. when his dog died he called me to get him through it even thought i wasnt dating him they need us kind of strong soals in there life so they can take our energy and they think it restores theres..if that makes any since.. Your ex is the same you have a hold on him but not in the healthy way you deserve.. best is to let him go because it was a lesson for yourself to learn not the person that was supposed to be YOUR ONE... you will find him and going through this experience will gaurd you from the other evils out there.. Its kind of strange after i now know the truth when i have met people since him that are similar to his personality..something inside me knows this person isnt good..like its a deep gut thing that i kind of freeze inside and alarms go off that i need to get away.. i cant describe it exactly but now i now what evil is...
9Lives Posted December 5, 2008 Posted December 5, 2008 Well I dont think they do it intentionally....because as we both said..they were so wonderful at first. But as time goes on you learn that they dont know how to have a good relationship with someone. They get in their own way. I'm still trying to get over it. But I am doing really good.
Author jamie2002 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Posted December 5, 2008 I really would advise you to do your reading on the subject.. They paint a really pretty picture at first to suck you in.. there intentions are all for themselves not u..they study people and what makes them tick very quick so they romance you to draw you in to the illusion..nothing is real for them its all how they get there source.. they would die without there source..they would go insane and the reason is because if they are all alone with there own thoughts it scare the heck out of them because they dont like there true selves so that is why they make up false selves they hate who they are inside and want to become a differnt person so they collect all these peoples energy and makeup there own person by watching people and learning how they tick.. they know that in society they need to be strong,handsome,caring and very smart people because that is how our society is..but it is all false..they have to have there egos fed constantly..they did choose you but not for good intentions. It is really hard to believe but they never really loved us..because they dont know how that feels to love someone..when someone gets close to that step that is when they switch gears in there mind and become the guy you want to hate..there egos are so fragile that is why they cant feel anything they push it out of there mind..it hurts them like they are dying inside i promise if you read this stuff it will blow your mind if your guy is a true N. I came to this site because i would love to shed some light to others if they experienced this kind of person..when you are in it you have NO idea what you are dealing with but i am out and ready help anyway i can to as many people i can so they are aware of the evil around.. we are all too trusting as being humens.. some things you just cant trust..
Prettyinblack Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 My ex was and still is a total N....I should have been a little wiser from the very first date on Dec 21, 2001, when he said that he was *selfish with his time*. Man, I should have hit the floor running! This man only thought of himself and I made it very convenient at the time, because I was sick with Chrons and he had a lot of available time because of my illness. It worked perfectly until I got healthy and began to make more demands...demands isnt even the right word...wanted to spend more time as a couple which then, infringed on his own personal time. This guy actually said to me at one time that he doesnt look forward to the day something happens to one of his parents because he *didnt want to deal with the disruption to his lown life*....god! I was and still am in love with him and he now has a new girlfriend. He needs constant vailidation and someone to pump him up...someone quiet and who sings *Stand By Your Man*. Back to the *N* subject......totally into himself, wanted what he wanted at any cost to anyone, put his own needs first, could not empathize with anyone, only talk about how it affected him, if he talked. Took no responsibility for anything in the relationship..everything affected HIM and when he had an affair, said the communication broke down....I get paid to talk. lol...yeah, I am glad its over, but miss him horribly and hope I get over him really soon. I want a man that LOVES not takes. That what a narcisist does. They take and leave you wondering where the Heck your self-esteem went.
9Lives Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 Back to the *N* subject......totally into himself, wanted what he wanted at any cost to anyone, put his own needs first, could not empathize with anyone, only talk about how it affected him, if he talked. Took no responsibility for anything in the relationship..everything affected HIM and when he had an affair, said the communication broke down....I get paid to talk. lol...yeah, I am glad its over, but miss him horribly and hope I get over him really soon. I want a man that LOVES not takes. That what a narcisist does. They take and leave you wondering where the Heck your self-esteem went. I am still tryinhg to see if this is the same for me. Some of it was like this and some of it was not. It worked perfectly until I got healthy and began to make more demands...demands isnt even the right word...wanted to spend more time as a couple which then, infringed on his own personal time. Time was always a issue, especially the weekends were a fight. We would spend weekends together ONLY if he wanted to. If I did and he did not...we would have a big fight. I still find myself confused. Sometimes I think he was a N and sometimes I dont.
kymberann Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 Well I just got out of a relationship and yes he is N. Here is the thing. We went to High School together. Went our ways and then about a year ago found each other on Face Book. we had been talking and then picked up with things. Well in September I left my job, a good one and left my house, gave it back to my ex husband. I have been divorced for 5 years. My kids stayed where they were with the intention of them moving in in about a year. So I moved from Utah to Colorado. I got a job and we lived together. At the beginning of our dating prior to the move he was smooth, affectionate and wonderful. We talked every night for 3 to 4 hours. We planned how it would be, including disagreements. He seemed to be everything I had been waiting for. However about three weeks into living together he changed. He could not hold up the facade. You know the details. All the walking on egg shells and bowing down so he would not retaliate or explode. And here is a big one. One time I put the toilet paper on backwards! Well instead of changing it once he explained his annoyance, he took TP and holder and all off the wall! I brushed it off and told him It's no big deal with TP roll on the floor as I had done that before. Anyway, it gets worse and so he finally kicks me out and makes a big scene in front of everyone! So he can have his show. In fact this was a week ago tonight that it happened. He takes off and goes to an ex's house. I finin=shed the weekend, talked with him about how it is really immature to run off like that. And here is one, he keeps telling me that he hates drama and conflict, well for someone who hates it so, he sure creates it! So now here is the sitch. I pack all my stuff. It was bad and gory. He even had his daughter watch over me so I wouldn't take anything. Was told he is getting back with his GF and blah all the crap. I load my car, my dad comes and helps me and my daughter move (she moved in over thanks giving) and we get the hell out of there. Now I am back in Utah and life just sucks. I have no job and no place to live. The last job I had was wonderful but due to a hiring freeze in Utah they are not filling any state jobs right now (and go figure I am a therapist!). I gave up EVERYTHING to be with this conniver! And do you think he cared? Of course not. He has his house, he lost nothing and here I sacrifice and suffer. Go figure right? So I am so glad I found this thread as support is truly needed. I am glad I got out when I did, but now I am still left with the clean up! Help!
Prettyinblack Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 My advice on that one, is never give up what you cannot afford to lose. Both people have to equally invest in the relationship and make the adjustments. Thank God I never gave it all up.....thought about it but decided that he needed to give something as well. (we were going to live together and he suggested I sell my house and move into his-----no, no, no) That just gives away too much personal power. Good luck.....you must feel like Hell....my thoughts are with you, forsure..
sedgwick Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 Although I have no place diagnosing anyone with Narcissistic Personality Disorder as I am not a qualified professional, the last guy I dated was pretty damn selfish. I won't go into the specifics, but yeah. It beat down my self-esteem so much, because I always felt like everything else he did was more important to him than I was. Ah well.
You'reasian Posted December 7, 2008 Posted December 7, 2008 Do women act in ways reinforce the NPD qualities that you ladies are talking about? I'm thinking that these guys understand that certain NPD behaviors are rewarded. As another person above mentioned, I also am not a mental health professional and cannot properly diagnose the disorder. Look at social venues. Take a quiet, content male who doesn't say much, demonstrated social constraint and does what he's supposed to do and take an extroverted, confident male who is clever, witty and full of personality. Which male do you tend to gravitate to? It maybe natural for women to gravitate to males who might have NPD traits. And what is a NP? Is a politician who enjoys being in the spotlight a NP? How about someone behind the curtain with no appearance but alot of control in a situation - like the lighting, staging, audio, image consultant, speech writer - his works affect an outcome?
steve9417 Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 interesting post and thought would add my words to it as the woman that i went out with clearly has these tendencies - she often used to get very angry, swear at me, push me away emotionally, blame me for failings in the relationship without considering that she had done anything wrong .... we had such destructive arguments and went onto lose our honeymoon closeness - with the presence of another woman she felt threatened and would swear or totally ignore them ...... she would get very angry if she was not getting enough attention and would often choose to do it in public places or make a scenes in front of my family - at the beginning she told me that she'd never felt so in love and finally met the "one" ..... however she moved on into a new amazing relationship 6 weeks after i chose to end it ...... although she says she ended it i recommended she saw a therapist at one point when going out and she said "**** off you just want to change me" ...... it became a complete emotional mess and i couldn't talk to her without me feeling i was a fault ........ and thus i started to lose my identity and sense of us i made a complete mistake then and went back to talk with her 4 months after we split when when she emailed me and said she missed me and felt sad about us ending ............ what she had omitted to say was that she was in a new relationship and had been for over 2 months ....... she was basically still hurt by me and i believe she wanted to hurt me back and of course i allowed her to by asking to talk ....... we got back together but her new guy worked with her and had left a 15 year relationship ........ thus we had a love triangle ........ she loved the attention and the game i felt ....... she told me once during the "triangle" period during sex that she wanted me to "adore her" .......... it was clearly getting a bit weird i went back to see if we could mend the past and talk about being together without the abusive sides to our old relationship but she never wanted that instead she only saw the failings in our past based on my faults and my errors .... it was a mess and it continued to be a mess ...... she's now finally back with the guy after she "played" coming back to me for a while ........ she just recently told me she needed a break and not sure what she wanted from us ......... she would not say we were 100% over though .......... i think she wants to keep hurting me while she gets on with her new guy and keep me hurting still / still wondering Jamie2002 your words resonate for me .. I was crazy in love and so brainwashed by this guy. He kept me in his life after our breakup as his friend now i know as his back up supply because i was feeding his supply.. if you date a guy like this you will know because all of your energy will be drained, you will have to pick up the peices of your life and try to get your sanity back.. it is so insane and it will almost make you insane.. You will think he is the love of your life but in reality its the mirage he portrayed at the beginning that you hold onto. He is a master manipulator and will lie about whatever he can to get his way. And he will do it in a way that has you convinced he is right. I hope your guy was just the typical selfish type. But i only saw the difference when i really stepped out of the picture. however the good news for me is i've got complete closure ........ its 100% over for me - i'd rather eat glass than go back to her ........ i went out with a needy, insecure, angry, obsessive, rude, emotionally immature little bitch ..... and yes i'm getting some of my anger out here myself ........ but she was and needs someone to "adore her" and that person is not and never will or could be me ........ i wish her well by the way after all that as i know all my hurt will never help me to move on ......... put it this way i'm enlightened now and that presents relief and most importantly closure .......... phew
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