Another one bites the dust!

[Gowithflow]

So, for those that know my story...I got the response from the D papers last month. It was agreed that we would settle out of court on assets, and that we would have joint legal and physical custody of our daughter. I was cool with that, but we would still need to hammer out the details.

 

I have been handling the daughters expenses, but I have not handed over any extra cash to the stbx for her rent or expenses, (nor has she asked). So, we have maintained limited contact, and when I do see her there has been no show of emotion whatsoever. At least for the past 6 weeks. I have moved on for the most part, and I have been focusing my time on my daughter when I have her, (1/2 the time), plus work, martial arts, and dating a hottie.

 

Well, I have been trying to schedule an hour or 2 with the ex so we could figure out what she will want from the divorce, and also to go over details of a parenting plan for the daughter. We made plans that fell through for whatever reason on a few occasions. I finally just said "you do want a divorce still right"? She got quiet. I left it at that.

 

So, we finally got together last night. We met at a local spot and had dinner/wine. She was still blaming me for all of our issues, and I just sat and listened. Then, she started to ask me if I can ever forgive her for having an affair, and wondered if maybe we should give our marriage another try!!! (she also mentioned that she stopped seeing the OM about a month ago).

 

We are legaly separated pending a divorce that would be final as soon as July 1st.

 

 

I don't really know what to do at this point.

• I'm pretty happy being single, but I miss all of the old family stuff as well.
  
• My daughter is adjusting well to our separation, but I'm sure she would be overjoyed if we got back together as a family.
  
• Sex is good with my hottie, but my wife is hot as well, (I do not expose my daughter to the GF, and the GF understands my situation and is cool about it either way).
  
• My wife asks if I could ever trust her again, and I responded "can you ever be trustworthy"?
  

Anyway, the conversation ended poorly because she kept talking about how she changed "for me" during the 5 years we were married, and I said "nevermind how you were, let's talk about how you are now"! She thinks it's my fault still because I gave her low self esteem. This is partially true, but I'm really tired of hearing it. I already admitted that dozens of times. I have truly changed for the better during our time apart. I'm a great dad now and that's huge. I'm also a waaaay better listener and understand more about how to be in a marriage going forward. I think she knows this otherwise she would not be interested in being with me again ever.

 

I do still love her, and I miss her a lot at times. I cannot snap my fingers and be back together since she is already settled in at her new place since December. 4 months apart is a long time. The odds are probably not in our favor.

 

She now agrees to counseling as well. I'm a little worried that I will have regrets if I don't give it another shot.

 

Should i take a chance and trust her?

[Nomad1]

For a start, she is still blaming you. Secondly, she had an affair and put you through hell! I wouldn't do it for anything. She has clearly learnt the hard way, and now. If you give it another shot, you might go back to square one in a year or two. Would you want to go through all that s**t again? The choice is yours!

[TrustInYourself]

As I have said numerous times here on this forum, you have the power to effect change in your situation. You've taken all the right steps and done what you had to do to get past this situation, but in the end, you made it out. Now do you want to rush right back in?

 

I don't think you can make a decision like this overnight. I think you need to take time to rebuild what was lost, before you rush right back into anything. Sure, things are good and you've learned quite a bit, but are you ready and is she ready to take everything you learned and make a lifelong change for the better? You need time for changes to stick and your wife needs time for her to really evaluate what she wants.

 

Sure, you could make it work with your wife. But do you choose to make it work? Do you want to make it work? We all deal with that each and every day and in the end, either decision will work out, if you choose to make it work.

 

We can all forgive, but we can never forget. This is a decision only you can truly make, because you live with the consequences.

[TrustInYourself]

For a start, she is still blaming you. Secondly, she had an affair and put you through hell! I wouldn't do it for anything. She has clearly learnt the hard way, and now. If you give it another shot, you might go back to square one in a year or two. Would you want to go through all that s**t again? The choice is yours!

 

It depends. What has she learned from this situation? What consequences has she faced? What kind of person is she? She could just be clinging to you because that's comfortable. Who knows, that is something you have to evaluate.

[Gowithflow]

Yes,

The affair ordeal has been hell. There were times when I felt like the whole world was against me and everything was hopeless but as everyone says...THOSE FEELINGS ARE TEMPORARY, (that's a note to those of you feeling the fresh pain of a recent loss).

 

I played it cool for the past several weeks and the ball is now in my court. I am one of the lucky ones who now gets to choose whether or not I want my wife back. Hmmmmmmm.

 

For me, it's not really a question of do I want her, because I do. The question for me is whether or not I am willing to deal with the road to reconcilliation, (counseling, swallowing my pride in certain situations, going above and beyond in the relationship, ect...).

 

My friends think I should give it another shot, and so far I tend to agree. We rushed into our marriage, (pregnant), and we are rushing out of it. There is a 5 year old child who deserves better than a stubborn mom and dad.

 

It just might work, and that's a big MIGHT. I think it depends on her. She needs to prove herself trustworthy all over again. If she's willing to do that then I'm willing to suck up the affair, (after all, I have not been a complete angel myself. I did not have an affair, but I did have a 1 night stand with a "party girl" during a motorcycle trip early in our marriage. I regretted it and never thought about cheating since. Nobody ever knew about that one).

 

I'm not stupid. I will be tempted to still rely on the phone tap to know what's really going on. At least for the first couple months anyway. This strategy could backfire and ruin our chances. I'll have to think about it real hard before I do that again.

 

Wost case if I get back with her in my opinion? More heartache and drama. I'm used to that, and I know how to handle it.

 

Worst case if I don't give it another shot? Regret. Wondering if I was stupid for not trying again with proper effort.

 

If we do give it a go, then the kid is the true winner. At least as long as we stay together.

 

All of this is very premature. Communication needs to continue for a few weeks before any changes take place.

 

Thanks for the input. I really appreciate it!

 

GWF.

[Woggle]

If she is still blaming you I would not give her another chance because she will only do it again. Go through with the divorce because it will hurt the kids even more to get their hopes up only to have mom flake out again which she will.

[Gowithflow]

Wife may flake out again, but the odds of that happening again go down if I'm willing to make some small adjustments, (I was always gone on business, plus leaving on trips with friends to ride dirtbikes and mountainbikes constantly. In addition, I was spending most of my quality time at home in the barn doing projects to support my various hobbies. Sadly, none of them involved my wife or kid. I was self absorbed and always had things my way. my wife ultimately left me because of it).

 

I'll be 47 this year. I don't need a divorce and I never wanted one. Yes, I filed for the divorce, but that was because she was not willing to fix the marriage. Now she seems to want to spend time to fix it. I take that as good news. Now I just need to figure out if that's a possibility.

 

I sowed some oats in the process of being apart. i feel good to go. Anyone else been there?

[seibert253]

You're in the driver's seat now. If it were me, I'd give it some time to see where it leads. You have everything to win, and nothing to lose.

Good Luck

[Kic]

You have another option: Go ahead and let the divorce happen on paper. You can date the ex, and after a year, if she turns out to have not changed, it will be much easier to walk away. By letting the divorce happen, you let her know that you are serious about walking away permanently if she does not improve, and you have more leverage in the relationship.

 

You sound like a changed man, so I doubt you will abuse this leverage - but it will be there to protect you.

 

If she turns out to have truly changed, you can remarry her again (and there's no hurry on this - if you live together again for 10 years before remarrying, what's the harm?).

 

Keep this in mind: EVERYONE can act on their best behavior for months, sometimes years. When evaluating whether she has changed, don't fall prey to the "recency effect" where you judge her new changes based on her recent behavior. Keep the entire history of what she has done in your mind constantly to prevent making a mistake.

 

Your story is an inspiration. For the sake of your daughter, it might just be worth another shot, but you have to protect yourself! Best of luck!

[mark982]

so her relationship failed. that makes you her back up plan.same thing happened to me but 25 plus yrs ago.there's gonna be ALOT of bad feelings,hurt, distrust,anger. it's alot to work through, and this is just on your part.maybe try dating,plus mc. but whatever you do tread slowly.good luck

[Kic]

I meant to add one more thing: She has to change, not you. You sound as though you've already changed enough for your part of it. From your first post today, it sounded like at dinner she was putting all of the responsibility of her actions onto you. You CANNOT let her believe that it was mostly your fault.

 

This is why you would benefit greatly from the leverage that the divorce gives you. If you take her back too soon, or too easily, then she will not have enough incentive to change, go to counseling (or if she goes, she'll think it's more for you than her,), etc.

 

Recall how she exaggerated the blame when complaining about you to her friends? Has that changed? Has she told them and her family that "Whoops, I was the one that ultimately made the wrong choice, and I have to change?"

 

Never remarry or cancel the divorce until she understands that she has to accept FULL responsibility for her actions and work on improving herself.

[Woggle]

Changing to please a woman like her will fix nothing. You can deliver her the universe on a platter and she will still resent the hell out of you. You are in the state of mind that you are to blame and if you just do this or that differently you will nake her fall in love with you again but it never works out that way. Nothing you do will ever be good enough for her.

[boldjack]

Flow, I've read your posts, but this is the first time Ive had to comment. Everything that you have done up to now has been spot on. You have admitted your shortcomings and realize that many of the reasons for your bad marriage were of your own making. Your concern for your daughter is also commendable and you have done a good job as a single parent. Your wife however, still seems to be avoiding any responsibility for the affair. Reconciliation can't happen until both of you are willing to be honest with each other and both of you accept the blame for the failed marriage. BTW, your ONS with the party girl IS cheating on your wife and is just as wrong as her affair, so you don't have the moral high ground. It doen't matter if it's a ONS or an affair, BOTH of you broke your wedding vows and you are just as guilty as your wife is. Have you told your wife about this ONS? YOu and your wife will probably fail because neither of you are honest.

[boldjack]

Sorry, Flow. My last sentence should have read, "being honest with each other.

[Gowithflow]

Thanks everyone for the input. I am struggling with the whole ordeal as you can imagine. I went out with some friends to a bar last night and had a good time. Met a girl. It was easy. I have no problem being single. That same scenario led to my ONS early in our marriage. The wife never knew about it, and never will. Just like she will never know about the phone tap. I do not claim moral high ground. I can sneak around and lie with the best of them. I choose not to in almost every situation in life, but like many, I have made certain judgement calls that have led to deception to a certain degree.

 

I doubt I will ever fully trust my wife again. I've been down this road many times with GF's. It happens. It's not uncommon for women to do this sort of thing to me. That made me study why it happens, and I think I have a pretty good idea. It's the viking/caveman syndrome. I always give the impression that I am no longer interested in my mate and appear that I am the one who wants to "move on".

 

I have direct family ties with a couple in the same situation but worse. These two hated eachother for cheating and lying.The went ahead with the divorce and were apart for 3 years. Now they are back together and happier than ever. 2 kids by the way. Go figure.

 

My own mother had an affair and left my dad for another man over 20 years ago. My mom and the OM married and are still together for over 20 years and it all started with them cheating on my dad. No one is bitter and we all go to family functions together with no issues. My point is that life is fickle and emotions get the best of us in the short term. Forget about attraction, can you sit in a room and enjoy eachothers company? Can you change for the better and adapt to whatever situation life brings without putting yourself first? Are you willing to accept that things don't always work out and you may have to deal with more pain and heartache than you would if you just keep to yourself and mind your own business?

 

I sail a boat in the pacific at least a couple times a month. The seas are rough and constantly changing. There are good days and bad. Sometimes it's downright scary. The only time it's ever truly safe is when the boat is tied to the dock. But, the boat was not made to sit there tied to the dock. It was made to hit the high seas. For me to not take chances is for me to sit tied to the dock. To get back with the wife and try to trust her is a big risk, but only to my heart and bank account. Could I wind up worse off than I am now? Maybe, but I doubt it because this time I know that there is a very real chance that we could wind up in a huge fight that gets ugly for the obvious reasons. Then, we split again. At this point it sounds like no big deal to me. On the other hand, if it does work out, I am one of the few that took a risk and beat the odds. That is a story in itself.

 

The wife seems sorry for her actions. She is hurt and confused but not mentally unstable. She sees changes in me for the better. I have changed and that is fact. I will be fine with or without her. But, the prospect of working it out and being together again as a family is exciting to me.

 

There's no rush, and I realize there are no guarantees. To go ahead with the divorce and just date may be a good idea. I will proceed in that direction until we decide what is real and what is not. No doubt.

 

A divorce will cost me. As they say "It is cheaper to keep her".

[Kic]

Wise sentiments - you are correct: No risk, no reward.

 

However, consider your choices as several opportunity costs, both of which follow risk-reward:

1. If you move on from your Ex, it's a risk, but you might find an even better woman for you and an acceptable mother figure for your daughter.

 

2. If you stay, it's a risk, but you already know that your Ex is a good mother and this is potentially the best outcome for your daughter.

 

I suppose, because you have a young daughter, exploring option 2 is the best choice. I think you're right about it being a long-shot that your Ex will make long-term changes (she will seem nice for the first few months) that are needed to earn your trust.

 

Is there a set date for the divorce becoming final? I wonder how many months you have to evaluate her improved behavior.

[boldjack]

Dude, forget about the high groung for a minute. Your ex doesn't sound like a stupid person. She will eventually find out about the ONS, someone who was there will accidently tell their wife or gf and she will tell someone else and finally it will get around to your ex, so I wouldn't be too smug about it. She will also probably find out about the tap, she will see something on TV about infidelity, or read something, or find something on the net, so I wouldn't be too sure about that either. My point is , you seem to have adjusted to single parenthood, your daughter seems to have adjusted to the living sitiation, so why put her, yourself, and your ex back thru the ringer again? You've avoided the minefield once, do you really want to go back into it again? I would think looooong and haaaard, before I'd do it.

[Gowithflow]

Well, we were supposed to have more talk about the possibility of counseling or getting together to work out more stuff, but I found out that she was with the OM over the weekend in front of my daughter. She played it off like "oh, we just ran into him". I found out that was not the case of course, and that they actually went to a party and an amusement park with the kids. Oh, I got very pissed off and had a huge fight with her over the phone last night.

 

Bottom line is that she still cannot be trusted. Shame. Now I am cutting her off. She will have to take me to court to get a single dime. I'm ok with that. I pay plenty for her daycare and the ex is supposed to pay half. I also told her we would go week to week with the daughter to minimize transfers. She hates me for that, but I think it's best for my daughter right now.

 

When I spoke to her this mornining she asked if we could get together tonight to talk over some details going forward. Details that have absoloutly nothing to do with anything other than divorce and child issues.

 

I agreed. Should be interesting. Such a BIIIIOTCH!

[imagine]

Read your own posts. You have cheated before. Guess you guys deserve each other.

 

You got lucky to find her out. Why should she trust you?

[LuckyClover]

How's it going gowithflow? She still stringing you along? Mine still hasn't left the house.....She is still in contact with OM.....today she's leaving, tomorrow she's not, for now I'm done....I don't see any hope...this sucks! How's the exchange of kids week to week? we've been talking about 4 days on, 4 days off. I wonder if they will be okay.