redvolvodavid Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 I recently came into contact with a young woman I went to High School with. She is 2 years older than I am. My cousin has become friends with this girl out of the blue and we were invited to the same party. Once the girl saw my invitation through facebook to the same event, she called me to see if I was going. I was in a different state at the time for work and wasn't going but we got together the next week somewhat as a "catch-up" since we hadn't seen each other in many years. She saw that my birthday was coming up and we were going to get together the night before, but I said either the day before or the day of my birthday were fine-so we did go on my birthday. Dinner, movie, then drinks with my cousin (her somewhat new found friend). We agreed that we should get together again at the end of the evening so next week we are going to the Biltmore Estate for the candlelight tour and dinner before. When speaking with my cousin yesterday, I found out that they went out a few nights ago and it was commented by the girl in question that I was "the most gentlemanly person she'd ever met." She is hard to read (which my cousin agreed with) so I need a little helpful advice... A few questions: 1. Is it safe to consider this upcoming event a Date? (yes, I have paid for the tickets and plan on paying for dinner) 2. Is being the "most gentlemanly person" she has ever met a good thing or not? I don't know if someone who is 27 considers this good or not... 3. Is it safe to kiss her at the end of the night-assuming things go well-or should I wait until next time? I love this forum and appreciate your assistance!
OpenBook Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 Awwww, that is so romantic - candelight dinner at the Biltmore!! Keep up the good work with the gentlemanly thing - she digs it!! I think she's giving you all kinds of green lights here. But I wouldn't assume that paying for dinner "earns" you a kiss from her at the end of the night. Just play it by ear, during the date. Is she happy and having a good time? Is she flirting with you, looking into your eyes, smiling at you? I'm betting you're gonna get that kiss, and maybe a whole lot more!! Good luck. It's heartening to see that gentlemen do still exist out there.
marlynshopgrl Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 I personally WOULD consider it a date, but remember its your first date so she and you are JUST getting to know each other, but a candlelight dinner (YES A DATE). I dont know of anyone that would prefer a JERK to a gentleman (at least no one worth having), so this is a good thing, but some girls do like a streak of bad boy. Lets throw some of that bad boy in there and YOU would be doing great (smiling). Either way, the fact that you are a gentleman is a GREAT thing and dont you dare ever loose that =) Finally, only the night can reveal IF you can go in for a kiss. Did you hold hands, did she playfully touch you, etc. YOU WILL KNOW! And if you don't, then lean in for a kiss on the cheek, and YOU JUST NEVER KNOW! Either way you seem very sweet, and I wish you the very best on your date.
alphamale Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 1. Is it safe to consider this upcoming event a Date? (yes, I have paid for the tickets and plan on paying for dinner) if your cousin is not there then yes 2. Is being the "most gentlemanly person" she has ever met a good thing or not? I don't know if someone who is 27 considers this good or not... its hard to say from info presented but on your date try to be a little bit good and a little bid bad 3. Is it safe to kiss her at the end of the night-assuming things go well-or should I wait until next time? she will let you know non-verbally what she wants...keep your eyes peeled I love this forum and appreciate your assistance! you're welcome
norajane Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 Yes, it's a date. Yes, continue to be a gentleman, but make sure you FLIRT. If you don't flirt, you'll end up in friend-zone territory. Lots of eye contact, give her compliments, touch her briefly now and then as you help her out of the car or guide her to her seat, tease and flirt. Yes, kiss her at the end of the evening if all goes well. You want her to think of you as a MAN, not as a friend. Do you know if she's seeing someone? Broken up recently? Is your cousin male or female?
Left in a Lurch Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 No offense to the women here that will no doubt shred me, but I have found the one sure fire way to blow an early relationship is to listen to other women's advice. They like to romanticize things and will always say, "Oh, I love flowers and guys that act like gentlemen....", but they don't. Gentlemen are boring, seen as safe and predictable. Women like jerks and roller coaster rides. Candy and flowers in real-life are corny and outdated. What your girl said is a sign that you need to "man it up" a bit. You are not trying to be her safe friend she can go on dates when the other guys don't call. If you are, you'll be the guy buying candlelight dinners for $150 a pop, and she will thank you, give you a hug, and go home and sleep with a "jerk" that doesn't do any of those things for her. If she was into you romantically she would have said to your cousin, "He's fun and pretty hot." Think about this- What would you say to a friend about a girl you were into compared to one that was nice but you were not attracted to? You'd say the latter was nice, or sweet, or easy to get along with. If you thought she was hot you'd say, she's pretty hot. Women give bad dating advice just like they give mixed signals. They will tell you to act romantic and sweet like they do in the movies, but if you did any of that in real life they would assume you were gay. I have nothing against women but think about it, women who give you dating advice have probably NEVER dated women! If this girl was really into you in more than a friends way, your cousin would be able to read her. My bet is that she doesn't know how she feels about you yet, but you are really nice and somebody safe to hang out with that she doesn't have to worry about sexually. At the end of the night, you go to kiss her. If she turns away you never spend one more dime on her. Not in a cold hearted way, but she is a friend and needs to pay her own way. You need to change her perception to you being a little unpredictable and maybe not so gentlemanly. She needs to see you as a little bit of a challenge and a mystery. As a guy, I am betting you already know this stuff. The biggest jerk in the world usually does better than the biggest gentlemen in the world when it comes to women. It like life is unfair, but it is what it is. I would forget the Hallmark movie of the month stuff and go for the James Bond bad-ass a little more and push the envelope a bit.
Author redvolvodavid Posted November 23, 2008 Author Posted November 23, 2008 Cousin is a female, about 2 years older than she is. She's single right now and hasn't been seeing anyone for several months (from what I gather-she didn't bring up ex's at the first dinner). I think the first "date" may have been a bit ambiguous, but that's better than being all friend. I think that her considering me as a gentleman may have helped me be more of a potential prospect since typical friends-even the gentlemanly ones-may not always show it as well as I did. I did open doors, including the car, and cover everything that evening...not that it makes it a date, I'd do that anyway if it were one on one with a friend (girl). I'll try and dust off my flirting skills...I'll use the gentleman in me to carefully do so, but make it obvious.
OpenBook Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 I have nothing against women Uh, yeah, we can tell. Gentlemen are boring, seen as safe and predictable. Women like jerks and roller coaster rides. No, this is not true! I will try to explain from the female perspective, although I cannot guarantee that this is how ALL women feel... The reason why we sometimes respond favorably to "jerks and roller coaster rides" - and why we sometimes treat "boring" gentlemen badly - is because the jerks are typically supremely self-confident (the ultimate aphrodisiac!!), and oftentimes the "gentlemen" we know lack this self-confidence and we perceive him as an emotional black hole (a total turnoff). We hate the jerk side of the bad-ass, but we love his self-confidence! The biggest jerk in the world usually does better than the biggest gentlemen in the world when it comes to women. It like life is unfair, but it is what it is. I would forget the Hallmark movie of the month stuff and go for the James Bond bad-ass a little more and push the envelope a bit. But James Bond is always a gentleman, and even though he's also a bad-ass he NEVER displays the need to prove it to anyone. The combination of BOTH traits in the same man is why he is so irresistible to women. It all boils down to self-confidence... without the arrogance.
shockandawed Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 I really hope you come back and post the results of your evening here. Sounds like a great night coming up. Relax, in my opinion, this is actually your second date. You have already met, and she expressed interest in seeing you again to both you and your cousin, so the awkwardness should be out. You made the cut. Just be yourself. If there is one thing you can do is make her laugh. I mean make her laugh the entire time. Funny guys can be gentlemanly and playfully bad at the same time. Chat Room Hero brings up some valid points and had me laughing, but she doesn't seem to be the type of chick that loves the loser bad boys. I am sure if you are yourself, treat her well and make her laugh, you will have a wonderful date.
OpenBook Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 And by the way, I actually agree with Chat's bit of advice here: At the end of the night, you go to kiss her. If she turns away you never spend one more dime on her. Not in a cold hearted way, but she is a friend and needs to pay her own way. If she digs you, she'll kiss you. If she turns away, that's a pretty clear sign that she's not attracted to you, and if I were a guy, I wouldn't waste any more money on her either.
alphamale Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 I mean make her laugh the entire time. Funny guys can be gentlemanly and playfully bad at the same time. the OP is going on a date, not presenting a comedy show... make her laugh a few times to show a sense of humour but don't come off as a 24/7/365 clown. females like men who know when to be serious also
Author redvolvodavid Posted November 23, 2008 Author Posted November 23, 2008 Another idea I got from a friend was to just enjoy the evening, making her laugh and making slight contact and at the end of the evening, and, presuming things go well again, ask her for a "date." I thought this was a good idea and it doesn't make me have to put up some bad ass facade. It allows me to be me and if she likes me for that-then great, she can accept a true date. In my offer, "How about a date next (pick a day)? Dinner and (whatever)? I could pick you up at six?" Is that a good game plan?
norajane Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 Another idea I got from a friend was to just enjoy the evening, making her laugh and making slight contact and at the end of the evening, and, presuming things go well again, ask her for a "date." I thought this was a good idea and it doesn't make me have to put up some bad ass facade. It allows me to be me and if she likes me for that-then great, she can accept a true date. In my offer, "How about a date next (pick a day)? Dinner and (whatever)? I could pick you up at six?" Is that a good game plan? I'd suggest kissing her and while you're still holding her, look into her eyes and ask "When am I going to see you again?"
Author redvolvodavid Posted November 23, 2008 Author Posted November 23, 2008 I agree that's quite powerful, but is it not too much like a movie or fairy tale? I know that girls a lot of the time say they want a prince charming to sweep them off their feet, but not found that to be the reality. But I might try it. She is 27 and most of her friends are already married...so maybe she will be up for a fairy tale ending. Thanks for the tips!
prettybaby Posted November 23, 2008 Posted November 23, 2008 the OP is going on a date, not presenting a comedy show... make her laugh a few times to show a sense of humour but don't come off as a 24/7/365 clown. females like men who know when to be serious also That is very true. I like guys who can make me laugh, but if a guy makes me laugh the entire evening, it kills the romance and sex appeal. I actually went out with a funny guy once. He seriously made me laugh so hard that my cheeks hurt by the end of the night But guess what? It killed the attraction. He ended up being a good friend though lol
Left in a Lurch Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 Uh, yeah, we can tell. No, this is not true! I will try to explain from the female perspective, although I cannot guarantee that this is how ALL women feel... The reason why we sometimes respond favorably to "jerks and roller coaster rides" - and why we sometimes treat "boring" gentlemen badly - is because the jerks are typically supremely self-confident (the ultimate aphrodisiac!!), and oftentimes the "gentlemen" we know lack this self-confidence and we perceive him as an emotional black hole (a total turnoff). We hate the jerk side of the bad-ass, but we love his self-confidence! But James Bond is always a gentleman, and even though he's also a bad-ass he NEVER displays the need to prove it to anyone. The combination of BOTH traits in the same man is why he is so irresistible to women. It all boils down to self-confidence... without the arrogance. 1. Just because I have gotten bad advice from women consistently doesn't mean I have something against them. They just tend to try to make men think like women and that is not what women usually want. 2. That is my point. Being a gentlemen when trying to date does not translate to positive romantic results. 3. James Bond does display bad-assness to the women. He doesn't take their sh*t, and acts like a man. He often gets a little rough with them. If you want women to be your friend, act like a gentlemen or try doing things you think a woman would like. If you want to have a relationship that includes sex, you need to bring up thoughts of getting naked not opening doors and saying please and thank you. Most salesmen fail because they forget to ask for the sale. Ask for the sale.
OpenBook Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 James Bond does display bad-assness to the women. He doesn't take their sh*t, and acts like a man. He often gets a little rough with them. If you want women to be your friend, act like a gentlemen or try doing things you think a woman would like. If you want to have a relationship that includes sex, you need to bring up thoughts of getting naked not opening doors and saying please and thank you. Most salesmen fail because they forget to ask for the sale. Ask for the sale. Oh really? Do you use this approach yourself? Rough 'em up a little, make them open their own doors, and talk dirty to them? How's that working out for ya?
norajane Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 3. James Bond does display bad-assness to the women. He doesn't take their sh*t, and acts like a man. He often gets a little rough with them. Don't most of the women in James Bond movies end up dead?
Author redvolvodavid Posted November 24, 2008 Author Posted November 24, 2008 Ok...different opinions on everything are good. I'm feisty and argue with people. Better to: -Be a gentleman to her and fight with others? (What I am used to) -Be a gentleman all the way around and don't fight with others? -Don't be a gentleman to anyone (no doors, don't let her go first, etc...) and still fight with others? All her friends are getting married...she's not really into the college frat bar scene any longer and I assume the guys that go along with it... I'm leaning towards being myself, a true gentleman, and I can be harsh to others if we don't get what we need to make the evening special. I'm the one at work that does most of the purchasing because I use a even keel tone at start then ramp it up to down right nasty if I reach the boiling point. It's odd that I don't typically do that in any argument though-just for savings and when it comes to safety.
Left in a Lurch Posted November 26, 2008 Posted November 26, 2008 Oh really? Do you use this approach yourself? Rough 'em up a little, make them open their own doors, and talk dirty to them? How's that working out for ya? I rough them up mentally a bit and don't act like a woman and they tend to get confused and interested. And yes, opening doors and buying flowers is the quickest way to look timid and dorky at the cost of $50. If women really wanted gentlemen, they would hang out at church instead of the bar. The chess club would get the women and not the football team. There would be mass flashings at dungeons and dragons parties. Since none of these are true, I'll wager being a gentleman isn't the #1 panty-dropper move a guy can make. You don't have to be a jerk, but you have to be something relatively cool and not-so-safe. If a women is turned on by you even a little, she will have no problem letting people know. If she is not but feels bad you aren't doing it for her she will call you a "catch", or a "gentleman", or a "sweet heart", or a "nice guy"... Redvol needs to make her think, "I thought he was a gentleman but he has a wild side and I need to find out more! I am confused and intrigued by him and my panties seem to be losing the battle with gravity." It sounded like originally she was thinking, "He's sweet. He'd be fun to hang out with when my boyfriend is being too much of a dick to take me any place nice."
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