Question for MEN only about hookers, really better than "civilian" women?

[Trialbyfire]

For some men, it is probably true that they have no (or very few) other options, so they need a prostitute if they want to have sex.

 

However, the couple of men I talked about this, said that the money is just the price they pay for some convenience. Those men also had ONS's and said that having sex with the prostitute isn't really different from a ONS, except that the prostitute gets paid. Sex is better than jerking off and that was the reason why they had ONS's or paid prostitutes.

 

With the ONS, they exchanged sex for sex and with the prostitute, they exchanged money for sex. Some men are simply lazy and they consider the money for a prostitute well spent. If you want people to do your laundry or clean your house, you have to pay them too.

 

Not that I agree with them, but if you view sex as just sex, I can see how these men came to those conclusions.

It can be explained as simply as that or it can be viewed as an opposite gender/intimacy respect issue. Domestic help doesn't encompass the intimacy of sexual contact.

[OpenBook]

Keeping prostitution illegal is much stronger evidence of hatred against women than anything else said or implied on this forum.

 

This beats all I've ever seen. I don't even know how to respond to this. Making prostitution illegal is evidence that we are a woman-hating society. I can't even wrap my brain around that, or how someone could think that.

[You'reasian]

Well I care because most guys enjoy hookers and if I were to ever date again, it would be something I would have to look out for and be aware of.

 

My ex used to have sex with hookers all the time... I found numbers and I am such an internet sleuth that I was able to pinpoint the numbers to the exact listings on Craigslist... It has a search engine and I would type in the number and I was able to find out exactly which prostitutes he responded to....

 

I think a lot of guys are into prostitutes, especially guys who TRAVEL a lot, its a big red flag, especially if they like to go to Brazil, Thailand etc... I think it's something women need to be more aware of. A lot of women probably have no clue their husbands/bf's are out there having sex on the side... It's important to know how it all works so I have a clue when it happens again...

 

A lot of men are into these things nowadays, it's one more thing to be aware of if you are even considering dating or having any relations with a man.

 

I'm into travelling and as I've mentioned before, I want my woman to come along with me - my interests are strictly cultural/sport etc. if I were single and to meet a woman there, hopefully it would be a regular civillian.

 

Using Thailand as the example, I would love to spend my time at a kickboxing camp, go crazy eating spicy foods, get some nice tailor-made clothes and spend evenings with my girlfriend, watching sunsets on the beach.

 

I would like to add that women travel for the same reason as mentioned by the OP. Not Thailand per se, but for some reason they really, really wanna go to Brazil for Carnival....uh huh

[movingonandon]

This beats all I've ever seen. I don't even know how to respond to this. Making prostitution illegal is evidence that we are a woman-hating society. I can't even wrap my brain around that, or how someone could think that.

 

You're welcome . Why yes, you ARE a woman-hating society - evidence is all around you. For example, the US is the only industrialized country that *still* (in the 21st century!) struggles with under-representation of women in the workforce. Not to mention that many european countries have had female presidents long time ago. Now why is that? How come everywhere else women've been equals in everything for so much longer, eh? When you put it this way, it's actually no surprise that so many women are on a mission "to get back" at men...

 

More to the point: once you arrest a women for prostitution and slap it permanently on her criminal record, how is this helping her establish better life for herself? Whether you want to admit it or not, all you achieve is "putting her in her place", and put any other options for making aliving even farther out of her reach.

 

How are you helping her if she gets assaulted by a pervert, and dares to seek help but all she gets is laughs and "you deserved it" from the police?

[Stockalone]

It can be explained as simply as that or it can be viewed as an opposite gender/intimacy respect issue. Domestic help doesn't encompass the intimacy of sexual contact.

 

Well, I didn't expect them to say they do it because they don't respect women. Who knows, maybe subconciously they do.

 

 

Domestic help doesn't encompass the intimacy of sexual contact.

 

I agree with you. But from what they told me, for them it is just a service they pay for.

[fral945]

Answer these questions. Why would someone pay hundreds of dollars to get off, when they can wank off on their own with or without a little bit of free porn? There's plenty of porn that's considered "forbidden" enough to make it "erotic".

 

Trial, I am as dependent on sex with another human being as I am dependent on food or sleep. If I went without food or sleep, after a while it would start to have a negative affect on me physically and mentally. Maybe it's different for women, but I think most men are dependent on sex for their well being to some degree.

 

Masturbation is not the same as sex. It feels good to masturbate, but it's not just about getting off. There is something about intimacy with another human being that I think is wired into all of us (or at least to me).

 

I use escorts. I have 2 regulars for when I'm in between relationships and masturbation just doesn't cut it anymore. It's my way of getting the actual physical contact of sex and not have to find a FWB I have to deal with or who might become attached and want something more. The escort gets her money, I get the sex I want, and then we both go our separate ways. It's honest, straightforward, and no frills.

 

The girls I see are high end and tend to have a regular clientele. They know what I want and like and make sure I get it. Sure, there is definitely a risk, but not having sex until I find a meaningful relationship or finding a FWB is just not feasible or realistic. I am not a risk taker or thrill seeker by nature. I simply need to get laid.

 

I've gone months and years in between some relationships, and I would go insane if I didn't have sex of some kind with another actual human being. I've tried to deal with my sexual urges through masturbation, but it only works so long. There is something missing from it that only another human being can provide.

[Stockalone]

Keeping prostitution illegal is much stronger evidence of hatred against women than anything else said or implied on this forum.

 

The legalization of prostitution is not the silver bullet that will solve all the problems that come with prostitution.

[Trialbyfire]

I use escorts.

fral, this is all that matters. You use escorts. Why are you willing to use anyone for sexual gratification? I would never use anyone for sexual gratification, in that I surprisingly have respect for anyone of interest.

 

You know it's a false sense of intimacy since it's a business transaction.

[You'reasian]

You're welcome . Why yes, you ARE a woman-hating society - evidence is all around you. For example, the US is the only industrialized country that *still* (in the 21st century!) struggles with under-representation of women in the workforce. Not to mention that many european countries have had female presidents long time ago. Now why is that? How come everywhere else women've been equals in everything for so much longer, eh? When you put it this way, it's actually no surprise that so many women are on a mission "to get back" at men...?

 

German women have it about the same (a little worse maybe) than American women.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/03/business/worldbusiness/03women.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

 

 

Part-time work is counted in Euro women's income, whereas it is not counted in US.

 

As an American, I don't hate women. I just want to love one woman.

 

More to the point: once you arrest a women for prostitution and slap it permanently on her criminal record, how is this helping her establish better life for herself? Whether you want to admit it or not, all you achieve is "putting her in her place", and put any other options for making a living even farther out of her reach.?

 

In the US, women are given equal rights as men in terms of education - can get college educated and get employed as well as American men. Fact. Women don't have to go the corporate route, they can just as easily start their own private company - selling any legal good/service that any male can.

 

I would argue women have better opportunities in the U.S. compared to the rest of the world. Women are taken much more seriously here than in Europe, as a whole, not comparing city to city.

 

How are you helping her if she gets assaulted by a pervert, and dares to seek help but all she gets is laughs and "you deserved it" from the police?

 

She certainly doesn't deserve it, but physical security is common sense to security professionals, especially men. They will tell you its not a good practice to dress too sexy and hang around bad parts of town. They will tell you to travel in packs if you must and they will tell you to carry any legal form of physical protection at your disposal - provided you can get good training with it.

[Taramere]

No..no.. it doesn't work like that.. they don't dictate anything.. (except some perverts/jerks) they are mainly 'normal' men.. who wants 'normal' sex ... the only difference is that they're paying for it.. it's that simple.

 

That's your situation, Lizzie...but are you certain that the same would be true of most other prostitutes? I might be wrong here, but my impression is that prostitution is some sort of money-making hobby that you're not financially dependent on.

 

That's quite a different situation from someone who is dependent on prostitution for her living/to feed her children (and, in a lot of cases, to feed an addiction) and who can't afford to be very fussy about the clients she accepts or what she agrees to do with them.

 

I agree with OpenBook in that paying for sex to be hassle free is a power thing. I'm not interested in sitting in judgement of that, but I do tend to judge people who start denying their motives the moment someone uses a word they find less than flattering to define those motives.

 

Wanting hassle free sex sounds like a good-natured bloke who's stressed out with all the demands that the female gender impose on him. I can see that most men would be happy enough to be regarded in that category. The word "power" traditionally has darker, more sinister connotations....but they both come down to the same thing.

 

Wanting what you want, when you want it - and without being bothered by anyone else's needs or desires....beyond, in this particular scenario, their for the terms of whatever bargain is made beforehand to be adhered to.

[fral945]

fral, this is all that matters. You use escorts. Why are you willing to use anyone for sexual gratification? I would never use anyone for sexual gratification, in that I surprisingly have respect for anyone of interest.

 

You know it's a false sense of intimacy since it's a business transaction.

 

Because that is what I need. What are my other options, assuming I cannot find a meaningful relationship at the time? Are men just supposed to jerk off or somehow suppress their urges until they find the right woman?

 

It is intimate contact, whether false or not. That is all that matters to me.

[Trialbyfire]

Because that is what I need. What are my other options, assuming I cannot find a meaningful relationship at the time? Are men just supposed to jerk off or somehow suppress their urges until they find the right woman?

 

It is intimate contact, whether false or not. That is all that matters to me.

fral, why can't you find a meaningful relationship? I suspect there are people who are better/worse looking/personality than you, just like everyone else. So, what stops you from finding the person who you can have a meaningful relationship with?

 

Myself personally, I know why I'm not in a meaningful relationship. Right now, I'm not only relationship-averse due to enjoying my freedom but also, I'm currently risk-averse.

 

I use myself as an example of what can stop relationships from happening.

[Ocean-Blue]

Let's take the morals out of this for a second.

 

I think biology explains attraction.

 

So then, how do you explain a man wanting to have sex with a woman who is ANYTHING but the female ideal (as far as mating practices of the human animal are considered - I mean from an evolutionary perspective). She has slept with countless men. Where is the biology-driven incentive for a man to want to be with such a woman?

[Woggle]

Part of it is power but it is not because a man wants to control a woman. After a long stressful day some men just want to get their rocks off with a woman and a prostitute is a good way to do that. Trying to get layed with your average woman is too much drama and she might want something more plus she might become pregnant and it can became a total mess. Why do so many women fault men for just wanting some drama free fun? Why is everything that men enjoy considered wrong or immoral?

[alphamale]

I am just curious about this.... For men that have been with a lot of hookers/call girls/prostitutes, are hookers really that much better in bed than a normal "civilian" woman?

 

are these ladies of the night in the military?

 

.... What is it that these hookers do that is so special that regular women don't compare?

i don't know...i guess you don't have to take them out for an expensive dinner or make small talk???

[fral945]

fral, why can't you find a meaningful relationship? I suspect there are people who are better/worse looking/personality than you, just like everyone else. So, what stops you from finding the person who you can have a meaningful relationship with?

 

A number of reasons. One is that, like you, there are a very limited number members of the opposite sex that meet the expectations I have for relationship material. Some would be good for sex but not good for long-term and vice versa. I'm looking for both.

 

I admit my expectations may be too high, but they are what they are. If I lower them I fear that I will become just another divorce statistic or be in a miserable relationship. I prefer lonely over miserable.

 

Myself personally, I know why I'm not in a meaningful relationship. Right now, I'm not only relationship-averse due to enjoying my freedom but also, I'm currently risk-averse.

 

I use myself as an example of what can stop relationships from happening.

 

Freedom for me was and still is (though to a lesser extent) a factor.

[Trialbyfire]

A number of reasons. One is that, like you, there are a very limited number members of the opposite sex that meet the expectations I have for relationship material. Some would be good for sex but not good for long-term and vice versa. I'm looking for both.

 

I admit my expectations may be too high, but they are what they are. If I lower them I fear that I will become just another divorce statistic or be in a miserable relationship. I prefer lonely over miserable.

Then how can a hooker fill that void? You know exactly what you want and need, therefore, the following of what you've stated, has much to do with it:

Freedom for me was and still is (though to a lesser extent) a factor.

 

So...a hooker isn't all about getting off, is it?

[Taramere]

Part of it is power but it is not because a man wants to control a woman. After a long stressful day some men just want to get their rocks off with a woman and a prostitute is a good way to do that. Trying to get layed with your average woman is too much drama and she might want something more plus she might become pregnant and it can became a total mess. Why do so many women fault men for just wanting some drama free fun? Why is everything that men enjoy considered wrong or immoral?

 

I'm not commenting on whether visiting a prostitute is wrong or immoral.

What I have a problem with is the rationale, rearing its head in parts of this thread, that men go to prostitutes because "civilian" women are too much "hassle. To me, there's an element of not wanting to take full responsibility for a decision in that line of reasoning.

[OpenBook]

I am as dependent on sex with another human being as I am dependent on food or sleep. If I went without food or sleep, after a while it would start to have a negative affect on me physically and mentally. Maybe it's different for women, but I think most men are dependent on sex for their well being to some degree.

 

Really? I wonder how many men - and medical professionals - would agree with you on this. Is sex really as necessary as food and sleep, for a man to survive??

[alphamale]

i guess some of the "civilian" women are mad that their "military" sisters will give it up just for a few bucks and undercut the "civilian" womens power & control base...

 

i could see that being quite disconcerting for the civilians

[Trialbyfire]

Anyways, everyone can try to rationalize all they want, be it for or against hookers. But...what it boils down to is that everyone has a preference for a mate. If someone turns them off by having commerce with hookers, that's their preference. Just like it turns others off that anyone would pass judgement over their choices, for hookers or for whatever they choose.

 

No one is universally accepted or attractive. We each have our selection criteria. Also, no one is universally liberal, to pass judgement on people for passing judgement, is also a judgement within itself.

[fral945]

Then how can a hooker fill that void? You know exactly what you want and need, therefore, the following of what you've stated, has much to do with it:

 

 

So...a hooker isn't all about getting off, is it?

 

There are currently zero women that I am aware of who are available in the area I live that meet my expectations. I've tried online as well with mostly the same results. I haven't given up but finding someone worthwhile may take time.

 

I already admitted it isn't just about getting off, but maybe you missed it. It is about the actual physical intimacy and contact (whether feigned or not) that I am missing when I am not in a relationship.

 

I ask you again, how does a man meet that need when not in a relationship? Other than getting involved with a woman under false pretenses or attempting a FWB?

[Trialbyfire]

I already admitted it isn't just about getting off, but maybe you missed it. It is about the actual physical intimacy and contact (whether feigned or not) that I am missing when I am not in a relationship.

Why not get that through a one-night stand, instead of paying a hooker?

[movingonandon]

I'm not commenting on whether visiting a prostitute is wrong or immoral.

What I have a problem with is the rationale, rearing its head in parts of this thread, that men go to prostitutes because "civilian" women are too much "hassle. To me, there's an element of not wanting to take full responsibility for a decision in that line of reasoning.

 

Oh, I'm totally taking responsibility for this line of reasoning. As fral says, at any given time there are limited number of women that are true relationship material that truly incite a man's desire to win them, whatever it takes. Some are perfectly attractive to have sex with, but don't really attract much of other type of interest. But even with them there are a number of 'rituals' that need to happen. So what's wrong with calling this a "hassle" if I'm not interested in anything more than their body anyway? This is the situation where a hooker makes more sense. Basically, we get hammered for admitting that sometimes we're not particularly interested in other aspect's of a woman's being than her body... This does not mean that we view them as a less of a person, but just that we're not *interested* in that particular person... This obviously does NOT mean that this is the attitude we have towards women in general (which is the point that many had attempted to make). Moreover sex with someone you truly have a connection with always beats a quickie with a strange girl. But this does not mean that the quickie is inherently evil.

 

So the source of the controversy seems to be the fact that many people feel that "we are not supposed to view sex this way". But, there is no "one and only" way to view sex. Given that sex is such a big part of humans, why is it so surprising that it is a complex and multifaceted urge that can show up in so many different scenarios? Basically what some say is a version of biblical "you're not supposed to have sex unless it's with your one and true love". Umm, scuse me? Even when you are in a relationship, sometimes you want to have the kind of hand-holding truly intimate sex that poems are written about, and sometime you just want ho holds barred f***. So the latter doesn't "count", eh? (And don't tell me that this is guy's point of view: I have female friends who have actually complained that their men are getting a little too emotional during sex for their taste!)

[fral945]

Why not get that through a one-night stand, instead of paying a hooker?

 

A ONS is not enough. The odds of the sex itself being good are low. Been there done that. I have yet to have an enjoyable ONS experience. The hooker knows my likes and wants. The sex is personalized and catered to me.