Love is Tragic Posted October 22, 2008 Posted October 22, 2008 Ok, so my husband and I have been in what I call marriage "purgatory" for about 8 months now and we've pretty much mutually decided to call it quits for good, but we want to remain amicable and avoid lawyers-all that crap. Maybe Im dreaming to think it will remain friendly, but thats where we're at. We own a home together, joint bank account, he has a great paying full-time job and I have a not great paying part-time job but I love it. One child together, 4 years old. We had originally planned on putting the house up for sale, splitting the profit, and each of us obtaining separate residences. However, he has informed me he would like to keep the house, since he can afford it and is comfortable here. I told him he would have to buy me out somehow by re-financing and giving me the cash out. I think 10-15 thousand dollars is a fair settlement, considering I cant afford the house anyway and the real estate market is so terrible right now our home would likely sit on the market for a great deal of time, with no guarantee of profit made. We have agreed on what will be divied up, as far as furniture and other joint belongings. The majority of the belongings will stay with him, as I will be moving to a small place and wont have the room. What stumps me is agreeing on a child support amount, without having to involve lawyers/court system. I believe child support is calculated on 19 or 20% of the fathers income, in which case he would owe me a pretty staggering chunk of child support. As I am not a money-grubbing skank, I would not ask for that amount from him, but am torn on what my bottom line would be in terms of support. I have picked up hours at my job, but it still isnt enough to support our child and myself and I dont want to short-change her or myself. I plan to go back to school so I can get into a good-paying job and be independent. So... I need advice! Am I being too nice or should I ask for more? I dont want to bankrupt him and we'd like to come to an agreement as soon as possible, any advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks!
Gunny376 Posted October 22, 2008 Posted October 22, 2008 It depends upon what state you live in. Basically the courts take the custodial income and the non custodial's income, combine them. come up with a total and then a percentage. As a general rule it comes out to 60/40% split (could be different depending upon each's income ~ for example yours could be 70/30%). Then add in other variables, such as the needs for a "special needs" child. One thing to keep in mind is that its not and average cost of having to rent a two bedroom over a one bedroom, but an incremential cost, that is to say the the cost of having a dependent child live with you is incremential cost.
amaysngrace Posted October 22, 2008 Posted October 22, 2008 It sounds to me like he's already been talking to a lawyer. Or he's being advised by someone. You have to go to a court to file for divorce and to file for custody/support. There are state-mandated guidelines on what he should pay. You should have it set up through the courts. It costs $6 to have it set up in my state. This way you have a third party watching over the whole situation if he decides not to pay somewhere down the road. Things may be happy/happy right now but it doesn't mean it will always stay that way. $10,000 to $15,000 on your home sounds low. You have to take the purchase price compared to the current value of the home divided by two and that's what it will take to buy you out. Yes you can do most of the legwork yourselves and call it amicable but what you are signing off on now is forever lost once you sign the papers. I really don't think it's wise to do it without legal representation.
D-Lish Posted October 22, 2008 Posted October 22, 2008 I had an amicable divorce with my ex- husband. We used the same lawyer in fact, which saved money. One thing I don't recommend is foregoing legal advice. It's very important. The most amicable of divorces will benefit from legal advice. Both you and him need to know what is fair. The extra money that might need to be forked out now will most likely save you from snags in the future. We went to our lawyer with the terms we hammered out ahead of time and he looked it over, made some changes we agreed to and saved half the legal costs. Since the lawyer was a family friend of mine, he recommended my husband go and have a second opinion. It worked out well. The divorce can involve legal representation and still be amicable. It really is in both your best interests and the interest of your child/children. Good luck.
Author Love is Tragic Posted October 22, 2008 Author Posted October 22, 2008 Thanks for the advice thus far, the state we live in is very lenient and we dont have to involve lawyers for a divorce, as long as we are in agreement about everything, including child custody. The 10-15 grand I have asked for as a buyout is definitely a lowball number, however it is worth it to me to take that money and run, as he cannot afford to buy out my half of our house AND pay me child support. It seems more intelligent to avoid listing it on the market, as it is so bad right now and not looking to get better. It would save me much aggravation to take the buyout as is, especially since without that buyout, I could not move out as soon as I would like, and although we are keeping it friendly, it is definitely awkward to still be living together. I already know he can re-finance no problem, get me the cash out I want and pretty much keep the same payment we are paying now. That way he can keep the house and still afford to pay child support without sending himself into poverty. I have looked up child support calculators for my state and the amount of monthly child support I deem to be fair seems in line with the calculators-actually, all the calculators I used approximated a larger amount than what I see as fair.
Ronni_W Posted October 22, 2008 Posted October 22, 2008 actually, all the calculators I used approximated a larger amount than what I see as fair. I would want to consider that those types of calculators may be on the LOW side of what it costs, on average, to be able to properly provide for your child's healthy upkeep. Perhaps you can see your way clear to initially accepting a higher amount, and then review it in 6 months, and again when your own income increases, etc.? It might be easier to lower than to increase it later, I think. It is great to want to be "fair"...but might not be such a good idea to do that at the risk of not having the financial means to properly support your daughter. I would wait until I had a better idea of actual costs and expenditures, rather than start out being too generous/big-hearted (whatever is the motivation.) I do agree, though, that it may just best serve your daughter, yourself and your ex, to get adequate legal counsel. Best of luck.
Trimmer Posted October 22, 2008 Posted October 22, 2008 $10,000 to $15,000 on your home sounds low. You have to take the purchase price compared to the current value of the home divided by two and that's what it will take to buy you out. No, no, no... To buy someone out, you pay them half the value of the equity currently held in the house, and then you keep the mortgage in your name (or refinance to accomplish that...) This isn't as simple as just "current value minus purchase price" - purchase price doesn't matter; what matters is the mortgage debt you currently have against the house. Example: If you have a house that would fetch $300k on the market, and you have $200k of mortgage debt outstanding against it, then together you "own" $100k of equity in the house, which is the net "asset" to be split in half; thus a $50k buyout. The reason purchase price doesn't matter is that you may actually have MORE equity than that represents, if you put down a significant down payment when you purchased - that down adds to your equity, and should be split as well. Or, you could have LESS equity than the purchase price vs. current value calculation represents, for example, if you took out additional mortgage debt against the house some time after the purchase. What matters is current value minus mortgage debt. That's what should be split in half. The trick in doing this as a "buy out" (i.e. not actually selling the house) is determining that "market value" on the house. There's no way to guarantee exactly how much equity you really have in the house until you realize the profit upon a real sale. So a buy out requires you to come to an agreement on the value of the house, which you can then factor together with the mortgage debt to see what equity is available to split. The OP stated that the house might not even make a profit if they sold it now. So it sounds like there may not be much equity available to split. If you've got a $300k mortgage on a $300k home, it's a zero value asset - there's nothing to split, so whoever walks away from it isn't owed anything. Now, separate from all that, I would encourage you both to see lawyers in an advisory capacity, to educate you about the divorce process in your state. You may choose to keep it amicable, and to come to your own agreements and everything, but you will need to work the process through your court system in the right way, with all the "t's crossed" and "i's dotted" and schedules met, or you will be wasting a lot of time and energy. A lawyer can be a good advisor in this process. My ex and I came to all the agreements ourselves, with no need for mediation or anything like that. In our case, we did sell our real estate and split the equity proceeds, agreed to a child care schedule which we had been using ad hoc for 3 years anyway until we finalized the divorce, and agreed to zero child support either way, since we have both a 50/50 child care arrangement, as well as roughly equal earning power. However, we still had to write all this up in the proper way (including doing a child care calculation according to our state's requirements, and then taking an exception to it based on our equal parenting time and earning power, which our judge accepted upon explanation...) and get it filed, submitted, etc. We mutually understood that a lawyer would be involved on each side as a check on our process, but neither of us wanted our lawyers to play the role of "going after" the other. We made it clear to them that their role was to "check our work." I did all the documents myself, filed everything myself, and because my ex joined the initial petition and everything else was completed "by agreement", I was able to finalize it with an ex parte appearance before the judge (just me, by myself - she didn't need to be there) that took about 5 minutes. So it can be done, but we were as amicable as they come, which was helped by the fact that we were both properly focused on the well-being of our children, and we made sure our lawyers understood that they were not there to engage in an adversarial process.
CoryCosmetics Posted October 22, 2008 Posted October 22, 2008 You've received some good advice and valid points here you really need to consider. I had an amicable divorce with my XH -- and eventually even ended up back together (dating only) with my now X husband years later. However, the scenario you present here is a disaster waiting to happen. An ounce of prevention now, is worth MORE than a pound of cure later! Protect yourself and your child from the beginning.
Author Love is Tragic Posted October 23, 2008 Author Posted October 23, 2008 Has anyone here obtained a divorce through an online company? You pay them a fee, they send you simple paperwork to fill out and send back, once its been reviewed and okayed you take your completed paperwork to the courthouse in your county and wait on a court date. Then you pay your court costs and its done. Of course, everything has to be completely uncontested and all the financial stuff agreed upon. The company is also available for any legal advice/counsel for any questions you may have. Also, does anyone know how it works for tax purposes? If we were married for all of 2008, can we still file joint-married, even if our divorce becomes final in early 2009? The 10-15 grand that I am asking for in the buyout of our shared house seems to be considered a low number on this thread. Actually, it is fair. I calculated the approximate value of our home(which a real estate agent helped us out with) and if I subtract the amount of the value from what we currently owe, the 10-15 grand would be my cut of the profit.
Geishawhelk Posted October 23, 2008 Posted October 23, 2008 The important thing is to think with your head, not your heart. I realise you want to be fair, and not be seen as a gold digger, which is both commendable and admirable. But the danger there is, that your respect and desire to do good by him, will mean you are led by sentimentality, not cold hard facts. It's important to keep it civil, respectful, amicable and on an even keel. But you have a child to consider, and the escalating cost of living. Trust me, recession or no recession, life is never going to get cheaper. Do what's right, but do what's fair. And although some things may not seem fair on paper, you have to look at the long-term and bigger picture.
amaysngrace Posted October 23, 2008 Posted October 23, 2008 Also, does anyone know how it works for tax purposes? If we were married for all of 2008, can we still file joint-married, even if our divorce becomes final in early 2009? I think you have to file married. Whatever your marital status is on 12-31-08 then that is how you file your taxes. You can file married filing separate. Possibly joint too? I'd call the IRS or visit their website. Also you may want to reach an agreement on who claims your daughter as a deduction. You may want to alternate years by odd and even or something. The 10-15 grand that I am asking for in the buyout of our shared house seems to be considered a low number on this thread. Actually, it is fair. I calculated the approximate value of our home(which a real estate agent helped us out with) and if I subtract the amount of the value from what we currently owe, the 10-15 grand would be my cut of the profit. I'm sorry I messed up the figures on how it's done. My ex and I didn't own a home and I guess I got confused when it was explained to me before.
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