Author Lizzie60 Posted October 14, 2008 Author Posted October 14, 2008 ok, and you sure are doing the hard sell extolling the virtues of marriage, ascribing your own experiences onto everybody else. I don't want to be married, I don't want a life like yours, I think the whole monogamy concept is flawed. I want to be single and want to have hot sex with casual partners without any strings or obligations. I see the öther possibilities" and I don't want them. You go girl! I totally agree..
Author Lizzie60 Posted October 14, 2008 Author Posted October 14, 2008 Maybe for someone who prioritizes new sex with a fresh partner higher than a lasting, soul satisfying connection. We all have our priorities.. Like Soserious.. btdt.. and I don't want this anymore. If one like to scrub her H's skid marks... (I liked that SS ).. pick up his socks.. cook, clean the house, look after the kids, etc.. and pretend she's independant... We all have our priorities..
Woggle Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 My wife does not pick up my socks and scrub the skid marks out of my underwear. I don't even have skid marks in my underwear because that is just disgusting. IF you women are happy living this way more power to you but you don't even know donna's man and you are already making snap judgements. It's just another example of manhaters wanting to destroy every relationship they see. They just can't fathom the idea that maybe a couple is not as miserable as they were.
soserious1 Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Maybe for someone who prioritizes new sex with a fresh partner higher than a lasting, soul satisfying connection. that would be me. I dont want any more soul connections. I want sex, simple, hot,hard casual encounters without any further obligations. I don't want to listen to anybody's tale of woe, I don't want to cook his meals or fret over his health concerns. I don't want to share anything besides a glass of wine, a nice dinner and a few hours in the bed. So you keep your bliss and I'll keep mine:)
Author Lizzie60 Posted October 14, 2008 Author Posted October 14, 2008 As if all relationships involve skid marks, kids, etc. I would never have a man I had to "look after" like some kind of neanderthal. If that's the only type of "man" you believe exists, perhaps you're hooking up with the wrong kind of "men." You can attempt to denigrate my lifestyle all you want, but it won't change the reality of it. I own my own home on a HUGE amount of property - bought it all by my little self, so yes - I AM independent. I also know how to take care of things on my place - all by my little lonesome. I simply chose to share it with a man who, in his own right, has also made it on his own and continues to do so with no help from me. However, now that we're together, we make both of our lives better. Where he falls short, I excel. Where I fall short, he does. It's all about finding YOUR right partner. But if you go through life thinking men are nothing but hard cocks with skid marks in their underwear, well... Then why ARE YOU trying to denigrate MY lifestyle? I don't get it.. you accuse me of something you're doing yourself..
Author Lizzie60 Posted October 14, 2008 Author Posted October 14, 2008 My wife does not pick up my socks and scrub the skid marks out of my underwear. I don't even have skid marks in my underwear because that is just disgusting. IF you women are happy living this way more power to you but you don't even know donna's man and you are already making snap judgements. It's just another example of manhaters wanting to destroy every relationship they see. They just can't fathom the idea that maybe a couple is not as miserable as they were. Oh yeah.. coming from a man who ... never mind..
Woggle Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Oh yeah.. coming from a man who ... never mind.. Donna seems like the rare woman who knows how to appreciate a good man. When a woman says she is happy on a messageboard I tend to believe her since most women on here love to trash every aspect of the men in their lives.
soserious1 Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 My wife does not pick up my socks and scrub the skid marks out of my underwear. I don't even have skid marks in my underwear because that is just disgusting. IF you women are happy living this way more power to you but you don't even know donna's man and you are already making snap judgements. It's just another example of manhaters wanting to destroy every relationship they see. They just can't fathom the idea that maybe a couple is not as miserable as they were. All I want from men is pleasant,casual encounters,I don't want their money, I don't want them to do things for me, I don't want them to whisper promises of forever after. I don't want to share in their problems nor burden them with mine. I want to just have a pleasant evening culminating in sex and then go on about our respective lives. I don't consider this to be a problem.
soserious1 Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Donna seems like the rare woman who knows how to appreciate a good man. When a woman says she is happy on a messageboard I tend to believe her since most women on here love to trash every aspect of the men in their lives. I no longer believe that long term relationships or marriage are in my best interests, in fact I believe that such alliances would prove to be HARMFUL to my lifestyle and well being. I have zero interest in being a good,faithful,loving, supportive wife because I don't feel what I could possibly get in return is worth what I've got to give up to get it.
marlena Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 I think both sides of the argument are valid. It is all about free choice and living a life style that you are comfortable and happy with at whatever point in your life. What I believe is an important factor here is age. Younger people are at the beginning of their sojourn in life and it is only normal that they should seek to find that one special partner with whom to build a life, family and home with. For some it works out for others it doesn't. The reasons are too numerous to go into right now. For older women, such as Lizzie, Soserious and, yes, myself, who have already done the married with children scene, it is no longer important. They have already come full circle and other priorities take precedence. Many just do not want to play that scene over again. I see nothing wrong with this. In fact, it is liberating. Another consideration is that falling in love does not happen that easily after a certain age. Romantic love and the happily ever after scenario belongs to youth. I am not saying that it can't happen again but it is most definitely less likely. When people get older, they can not make the compromises and adjustments that were once so easy to make. Many think that now that they have fulfillled their responsibilities, it's time to live for themselves and enjoy whatever years they have left. This strikes me as being very normal and part of the maturing process. Ultimately, what is important is for people to live life they way you choose to, in the manner that they want to. It is a freedom that we all deserve and one that should be respected by all.
stillafool Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Today I had a long conversation with a work colleague.. there is absolutely no chemistry on my part.. he's just a very nice guy... Anyway.. we were talking about marriage in general, he's been married for over 15 years I think.. and he said that a lot of men marry because they just want to settle down with a nice woman, who they also chose to be the mother of their kids.. He said that a lot of times, the woman is way more in love with her husband than the husband is with her and it's her that wants the big wedding and all the fla-flas.. he said, for a lot of men, weddings are only a waste of money. For him, marriage is more to 'shack up', split all the bills, get financially stable.. have kids, but most of all, have sex whenever he wants.. no need to do all the 'dating/courting sh*t'... He said he's not in love anymore but is fine with the monotony of the everyday life.. he said after so many years, you get used to it.. He said most of his guy friends has the same opinion about marriage.. Humm.. we talked about soo many aspects of the marriage.. It's not the first time that I hear something like that, I think his opinions reflect those of many men.. who, most of the time, if they think like him. are just too chicken to admit it. I'm not surprised to hear this but I must add that a lot of women don't marry for love either. They chose men based on their careers and how that will impact them financially. They want to feel financially secure so if they chose to have children they won't have to work. So, as far as I'm concerned people who marry for reasons other than (pure love) are getting exactly what they deserve. There's no difference in the selfishness of men and women.
marlena Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 They way I see it, there are people who are pro-marriage and others who against it. That's cool. I don't see why this should be an issue. I would never tell someone to get married if they didn't want to nor would I tell someone not to get married if they wanted to. Neither life stlye is better than the other. They are equally worthy of respect and acceptance.
audrey_1 Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 But of course, and if mom and dad call each other a POS on a daily basis and degrade each other through words, then they obviously are not fit to be married and should divorce. My daughter says the exact same thing that you do, Pyro. She always says thank goodness, mom, that you had the sense to divorce him when you did. I would have been a basket case if you hadn't. If a marriage is bad, we owe it to our kids to get out. As much as I love my parents, I was thrilled when they divorced, so my brother and I could have a little peace. The tension was so thick between my parents, you couldn't breathe. No way they could hide their disdain for the other. It was tragic. My brother and I could see and feel it. I tend to agree, I think a lot of men marry for stability and then have their sex and fun and love or whatever else they need on the side. What I want to understand is, why does the marriage have to be for "stability" and the sex and fun be had on the side?? I want my marriage, if it ever happens, to be about sex and fun! Gah! Why is that such a stretch? I have no intentions of being a boring spouse out for my own selfish needs or whatever. I want a companion to indulge in various pleasures with, and to have that connection over time. I'm not surprised to hear this but I must add that a lot of women don't marry for love either. They chose men based on their careers and how that will impact them financially. They want to feel financially secure so if they chose to have children they won't have to work. So, as far as I'm concerned people who marry for reasons other than (pure love) are getting exactly what they deserve. There's no difference in the selfishness of men and women. I broke an engagement to a man who would have seen me financially secure for the rest of my life. That is definitely not my primary motivation. The sex and fun part, however, is.
angryyoungman70 Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 After watching the complete and utter destruction of several marriages, I can only see marriage as nothing more than a trap. I saw what happened to my father, and both of my brothers. I will never, ever go through that. Besides, the only real reason to get married, imo, is to have children. And that's not even really necessary anymore. You don't need anyone or anything in this world to be happy. I just can't see myself depending on someone or something else for happiness. And yes, I know that every marriage and woman isn't the same, but after having witnessed the things I have, I can honestly say I don't think marriage is for me. Begging for sex, or permission to actually go do something on your own or with your friends. I just don't see the point, really. I mean, my brother's ex-wife, all she did was tear him down and just be a complete bitch whenever she felt like it. I just don't see why I'd subject myself to that possibility. Many of us do subject ourselves to that. We stay in unhealthy, loveless, sexless marriages because we don't want to see our families break apart. Many of us got married very young, when we honestly did not truly know ourselves, or what's truly important to us in a relationship. We try for years to make things better, do all of those things the books and magazines tell us to do to try and get what we want out of marriage...and still end up miserable and in denial.
angie2443 Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Thing is.. my colleagues have absolutely NO idea of my lifestyle.. as most people don't... this is a very secret part of my life. I have tons of friends and acquaintances who also have no idea.. so to say that my views are skewed doesn't make sense.. I didn't mean that you told everyone you were paid money for pleasing men. I meant that, unless you completely lie about your beliefs and values to the people you meet, you are only going to attract people who believe as you do. If I was a Christian who strongly believed in what the bible said and believed everone else was wrong, I'm proably going to attract Christian people who are deep into their religion and repell those who are agnostic or athiest. Since I would not respect the other side's views, my views would eventually become skewed. I know. It's not the best example but it's the one that I thought of.
Alma Mobley Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 I think Lizzie might be right, and that is what really depresses me. (I'm a newlywed after all -- just got married in July!) The only thing that keeps me a bit optimistic is that my husband has always said that the top three reasons he married me were 1) my intelligence 2) my personality and 3) my performance in bed. That number 3 might get us going for awhile, I hope, before his inevitable betrayal.
Trialbyfire Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 I didn't mean that you told everyone you were paid money for pleasing men. I meant that, unless you completely lie about your beliefs and values to the people you meet, you are only going to attract people who believe as you do. If I was a Christian who strongly believed in what the bible said and believed everone else was wrong, I'm proably going to attract Christian people who are deep into their religion and repell those who are agnostic or athiest. Since I would not respect the other side's views, my views would eventually become skewed. I know. It's not the best example but it's the one that I thought of. Cynicism attracts cynicism. It's a form of self-justification for lifestyle choices. As a 15 year old OW, you have to wonder where that attitude came from. If people are raised on negative foundations, some know no other way to live. There are very few people who can break free of their foundational constraints. Only the very determined are able to dig deep into personal strengths and make fundamental changes. Most, through formative year dysfunction, continue to live as such. A personal comfort zone.
Author Lizzie60 Posted October 14, 2008 Author Posted October 14, 2008 I didn't mean that you told everyone you were paid money for pleasing men. I meant that, unless you completely lie about your beliefs and values to the people you meet, you are only going to attract people who believe as you do. If I was a Christian who strongly believed in what the bible said and believed everone else was wrong, I'm proably going to attract Christian people who are deep into their religion and repell those who are agnostic or athiest. Since I would not respect the other side's views, my views would eventually become skewed. I know. It's not the best example but it's the one that I thought of. I have to disagree.. doesn't apply to my situation.. sorry.. nice try though.
angie2443 Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 I have to disagree.. doesn't apply to my situation.. sorry.. nice try though. I don't know you. I will never know if what you just said is true or not. I do get the sense from all of your post that it is not. I'm curious. How was your parent's relationship when you were a child? How was your relationship with your father?
Alma Mobley Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Cynicism attracts cynicism. It's a form of self-justification for lifestyle choices. As a 15 year old OW, you have to wonder where that attitude came from. If people are raised on negative foundations, some know no other way to live. There are very few people who can break free of their foundational constraints. Only the very determined are able to dig deep into personal strengths and make fundamental changes. Most, through formative year dysfunction, continue to live as such. A personal comfort zone. Well, I was raised without cynicism. My parents have stayed together through their 70s and will probably die together. In my teens and 20s, I never thought my BFs cheated on me. (Looking back, there are a few I think did, just from the signs, but I was very trusting.) It never really occurred to me that anyone was cheating on me for a very long while. Now I am quite cynical on the subject. I don't want to be cynical -- I really don't! I don't think I try to form dysfunctional relationships. I think I form what would be deemed "healthy" ones. Knowing the stats and the information that the internet provides on men's attitudes..... well, yeah.... completely cynical. Unfortunately.
Trialbyfire Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Well, I was raised without cynicism. My parents have stayed together through their 70s and will probably die together. In my teens and 20s, I never thought my BFs cheated on me. (Looking back, there are a few I think did, just from the signs, but I was very trusting.) It never really occurred to me that anyone was cheating on me for a very long while. Now I am quite cynical on the subject. I don't want to be cynical -- I really don't! I don't think I try to form dysfunctional relationships. I think I form what would be deemed "healthy" ones. Knowing the stats and the information that the internet provides on men's attitudes..... well, yeah.... completely cynical. Unfortunately. As a child, were your parents happy in their marriage and still are happy? Traumatic events can cause dysfunctional reactions albeit not near as badly as someone who during their entire family life, was raised on dysfunction. I don't know your situation alma but most people go through periods of cynicism based on assorted situations, then they move on beyond it. If you still remain in a dysfunctional situation, you'll find that it's far more difficult to move forward.
marlena Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Is cynicism always bad? I think not. I'd rather be cynical than foolish.
Trialbyfire Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 I agree donnamaybe. There's a difference between blind trust and ensuring you're not being led by the nose. Having said that, I'm also a tad cynical although I'm determined not to allow it to run my life. I run my life as I see fit. Y'know?
marlena Posted October 14, 2008 Posted October 14, 2008 Isn't there a happy medium? Like, perhaps, wary? Watchful? Take care of your heart, but use your head in doing so? What is the difference between being cynical and being wary and watchful?
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