From the outside I am the victim, but inside....

[mezarashii]

Hi everyone,

 

I used this forum a few years ago to ask some very difficult questions about my relationship. It turned out she was a keeper but I didn't act on it. Earlier this year she left me and I am crushed. Her ultimatium was to get my life back together "stand on your own feet" and let's see how we feel.

 

So I did just that. I am now very fit, have my own social life, have reconciled with my family, am becoming financially stable and things feel pretty good.

 

The continuing dilemma in my life though is how to make her forget the terrible times I gave her by not living my life as I needed to.

 

Before she left I leaned on her for everything. She was like my mom and my gf all in one. I didn't work unless we worked together at our private business, I didn't eat unless she asked me to eat. The only thing I did on my own was internet surf, "gamble" in the stock market with our profits--and lose, and view porn every night. I admit it, I was truly a wretch and she deserved to leave me. And she did.

 

The trouble is not that she left me. The trouble is she found a new guy. And this guy simply filled a void for her EXCEPT the one thing which makes relationships great, she does not love him. How do I know? Well the way she talks to me and looks at me I know she is still in love with me. She also tells me how torn she feels because she only cares for him because he loves her.

 

She also admitted she borrowed quote a bit of money from him. This immediately made me feel responsible as I did not make ANY attempt to help her in the past. I just did not work hard enough to build a future for us. That has changed though, I am now working very hard.

 

It feels to me that she borrowed this money to cling to him so, eventhough she is not filled with bliss and passion as she was with me, she now has a reason to stay with him which she cannot get hurt with.

 

Now, why do I not accept this and move on? Well, I love her truly. I have dated with so many girls over the past few months. For the previous 4 years I dated no one. I only saw my gf and nobody else. When she left, I knew I would go crazy with jealously if I did not go out and "chase" some girls. I was really good for my confidence. I met some really great girls and a few of them are still friends. But the whole time I just feel like I am waiting for the old gf to get over her fear of the old me and come back.

 

She has not fared well emotionally with the whole thing either. She is gaining weight, feels depressed and has no sexual feelings for her new bf.

 

I told her recently that she can always come to me if she needs help. But I also told her that she is hurting so many people by staying this way. Her family loves me and I love them. I love her and she loves me. When I remind her of this she says, "I can learn to love him over time." It seemed like a very cold thing to decide about her life. It makes me feel she has given up.

 

So I guess I should too? For me I want to live my life through the passions of my heart. I did live that way with her in the past but I gave too much power to my negative passions and not the beautiful ones which made us fall in love in the first place.

 

Some curious but interesting items. She DID tell me that she is SURE, but has no idea when, that we will oneday find a way to be together again. She has said it many times. And something even more whimsical is that a psychic told her a few months ago that she would be seperated from her true love this year.

 

I am reaching for certaininty and there is none. All I know is I love this girl and have made changes in my life to have her back but I am imapatient and jealous. I don't want her staying at his house and having heartless sex as she is now. If she could say to me, I have fallen in love and I am happy I would walk away, I am sure. But she hasn't she keeps giving me hope that we really will find a way to get back.

 

However I wonder if she stays with him for more than, say 6 months, will her heart ever be able to accept her real feelings again? I see it as if she is having a revenge affair because of my actions. I accept it because I really was a bad bf and I did need to fix myself.

 

I guess it is possible she is leading me on. Although I trust her so much. She never lied about her feelings to me in the past. Should I just close it all? Because when I talk to her it just gives me hope and I miss her so much. It's my belief that she is the one for me. But it took a breakup and her being taken care of by another to realize it.

 

Any thoughts would be great.

 

Marc

[BCCA]

Marc,

 

I think you should back way off and get your mind off this for a while, for your own sanity if nothing else. Talking to your ex knowing she's with someone else is like shooting yourself in the foot, over and over. You just can't do that to yourself. Just let her contact you and limit any interactions until she bails on this guy. If she wants to talk about what it will take, say helping her pay off the $ she owes this guy, then use your own judgment about what to do. If you know you were in the wrong and have some things to make up for, you might have to swallow a little pride for a time, but you need a better answer than 'maybe, someday, I dont love this guy'. Thats not helping you feel anything but crappy.

 

The next thing you really need to do is consider why you made these changes in your life. They absolutely have to be for YOURSELF because you want to be a better person, not because you want to win this girl back, or they'll never stick. Trust me, you want to be a better person to attract a love to your life. You can't really pick and chose who it's going to be. And if it's meant to be with this girl, it will be. You can't force the universe's hand. Things tend to happen when you least expect them, just be patient.

 

As for psychics, I am absolutely 100% sure that they're all full of crap. There are several people offering $1M for anyone who can prove some psychic ability in a testable enviroment. No one has taken the challenge, let alone won it. I called a lot of psychics at a dark time in my life, and they always seemed to give me hope. But they were always wrong, and then I read up on cold reading. LOL trust me, she told the psychic something about breaking up with you, etc...and the lady recycled it back to her. It's easy to fall for, because you want to associate anything they say with your actual life, and you'll unknowingly give them info and tips. It's a total scam man, I can tell you first hand.

 

Just leave her be and focus on moving on. Taking care of yourself for a while doesn't mean forgetting she exists. It's obviously not the time right now, so get out and enjoy yourself. You're not a bad person for taking a break from the whole thing for a while, it would be really healthy.

[mezarashii]

Marc,

 

I think you should back way off Just let her contact you and limit any interactions until she bails on this guy.

 

The next thing you really need to do is consider why you made these changes in your life. They absolutely have to be for YOURSELF because you want to be a better person, not because you want to win this girl back,

 

Just leave her be and focus on moving on. Taking care of yourself for a while doesn't mean forgetting she exists. It's obviously not the time right now, so get out and enjoy yourself. You're not a bad person for taking a break from the whole thing for a while, it would be really healthy.

 

 

Hi,

 

Not too good with these quotes but the juiciest stuff for me is above.

 

Ok I am on the same wavelength as you. All excellent advice btw.

 

I DID back waaaaay off. I did not contact her for more than a month. We even still have a business. I hired an assistant to speak directly to her. I made no attempt to speak to her. In fact when I was first dealing with the break I would not let her contact me at all.

 

I went out with tons of girls, even enjoyed some casual play =). But in the end it all feels like I am biding my time for her so when she started contacting me again directly, I let her speak for a while. She still seemed a bit angry a few weeks ago but I could sense that she missed me almost as much as I missed her. But under not circumstances will she say that YES she will come back to me. I feel like she is playing with my heart a bit and enjoying the power that comes along with it.

 

I changed my life 80% for me and me only. I needed to grow up. I needed to become mentally and physically stronger. I am making these changes for ME. If she is there when its all said and done, all the better. But I have no delusions about changing myself for her. Other than giving her credit for speaking out and telling me to get straight and grow some balls.

 

So the problem remains. Now we are seeing each other more and more. We spent the day together, it felt great EXCEPT she is insistent that this is her time to try it with another and see how far it gets her. Pure and simple regret when I hear this from her. I am truly a world class idiot for letting this get so far out of hand.

 

But man, she truly does FEEL like she still loves me. If you could see us together, you really would have no idea were were broken up at all. We hold and hold stroke eachother gently. We even kiss on the lips. I made a joke with her today that if she opened her mouth when we kiss is she cheating? She laughed and agreed.

 

She even asked me to go on vacation next week to Cambodia--we live in Vietnam.

 

So to answer you inital question, I did back off. But she is contacting me again. When I talk about the boyfriend, she just reminds me of the past and how this guy did nothing to deserve her leaving him. It's all a bit hopeless for me. She is obviously torn between comfort and her heart and cannot live this way forever. But I have the distinct feeling she is secretly enjoying the attention from two guys rather than the miserable one she had for 4 years (ahem, that would be me!)

 

My friends say just ask her to marry. But I think she is not ready.

 

In the end I am deluding myself that things can go from pretty terrible to pretty good in between her other relationship. It's not natural to fall in love a second time is it? I feel like I have though. And only after I lost 10 pounds, got a haircut, some money in my pocket and had quite a few dates in between. I encouraged her to work on herself today, she looked at me and said she is the strongest woman she knows, I just laughed and bit my tongue.

 

I know I will look back on this and smile. Because this struggle is making me stronger, I am sure of it. I just wonder, can I really get what I THINK I want? Or is there another plan in store for me from the heavens? Almost makes me want to pray =)

[mezarashii]

I just wanted to follow up on what I wrote a while back.

 

I just returned from a trip with the ex and it was very very confusing to say the least. It really was a wonderful time and there was so much happiness there for us to enjoy but I still had a very heavy heart in the reflective moments.

 

At night when we slept in the same bed things got very confusing. We could touch and caress in a very sweet a tender way but if I tried to go any further she would playfully pull back. However she thought it was ok for her to touch and tease without any consequence making comments on my attractiveness and the physical aspects of my "new" body(I have been working out a lot). It was very frustrating. Satisfying because she shared the bed with me, eventhough she could have slept in the second bed, but frustrating because she told me again and again it made her feel angry that I was asking too much too fast.

 

So it was good and bad, all a bit mixed up and confusing. We cried so much. We did not make any promises and just accepted that we needed time. But of course we were both so happy to be spending time together and I know the NC idea on this forum is so prevalent, but it seems to me that when you really love someone you don't have a rulebook to follow.

 

It was also a good chance for me to take a very hard look at why I was such an ******* to her in the first place. And no doubt there are some very hard things to accept about her. She can have a real blind spot for compromise. She honestly cannot accept that there is more than one way to, for example, pack a suitcase. I know that this is not the healthiest thing to have in a partner, but truth be told, she is pretty good at taking care of things which are just not that important to me. So I surrendered to the moment and just focused on myself when she pulled into her alpha organizing mode.

 

One thing that I feel was a real success in our communication is I made it very clear that regardless of how things turn out, friends, together or even nothing, she must think more before she speaks about how she wants me to do things--or any other man for that matter. I told her a man needs to be respected if he is living in a sincere manner. If he does something she disagrees with there is a proper way to convey this and to assume she knew a better way to do anything was oversimplfying life. At first I thought she did not agree and just brushed it off. But on the way back to Vietnam she said something inspiring and made me feel like we had a real breakthrough. She said that what we are doing now is learning to live in a balanced way with the intense feelings we still share and that there is no need to hurry through this phase of our lives. In time when I really see things clearly it will not be up to her to make this work again, she said it would be up to me. Afterall, I am a man I am strong enough to know what is right for me. In all the time I have known her I never once heard her say that I was the one in control. In the past it was always her who insisted that she was--even in the bedroom =)

 

 

She asked me questions about my new life without her. She asked if i was more clean and energy conserving than i used to be. The truth is, I have been in some ways. More out of having so much time to take care of myself, but I suppose partially because I expect that any girl will worry about these types of things that I could care for. I know it's a mistake to change for one person, but I don't think its such a bad idea to change to become more attractive to others.

 

So in the end it was a really great trip. Sure there was mountains of angst and jealously to deal with. She sent a few emails back home and I knew that a handful of them would be to her current BF. And I told her it made me very unhappy. But she was very careful not to make it obvious. And I have to accept this guy in her life for now as this is who she is right now. She told me there was already a nonexistent sex life with the new guy because she felt so torn about the mess she has made of everything. This seems like a small consolation. But the truth is, I also need the space, and sleeping alone, or with others only casually, makes me feel more incontrol of my heart and this is something I have always struggled with.

 

I also knew that this next week would be difficult as she will probably call me and keep in closer contact but of course she would still be seeing him and staying with him. This I truly hate. But in time it will mean less and less, I am sure. After all it was I who told her to go out and find what she wanted. And by splitting her heart like this I know it is me who she has always wanted, but in a stonger more dependable form.

 

Slowly I think we are both getting what we wanted. And regardless of how this relationship turns out I will learn to love myself. If I had a stronger sense of self-love in the first place this relationship would not have turned out so conflicted. There would have either been a clean break or a convincing bond.

 

I am rambling so much now. But it feels right and I want to come back in a week or so and take a look at what I wrote to see if it makes things clearer or if I cringe at how I am thinking now.

 

There is a plan for another trip to China soon for our business, which I am very useful to her since I speak the local language, and I look forward to this as we can be sweet and intimate for a few more days. I know someone will chime in here and slap me and say I am being a doormat. But to me it really feels like a way to show love that I refused to grant before when she let me walk over *her*.

 

We both get a clearer sense of what we want or don't want from each other. All the while, what I really really really want is to be able to keep my head and my heart in balance and have her in my life. And I know this is what she wants too. I just fear that it cannot be in a monogamistic relationship. And that is a tragedy for two people who have such a strong bond.

 

 

Thanks for reading and would love to hear from anyone in a smiliar experience.