I'm in a very complicated situation (Kinda long).

[Frankasy]

I was in a European tour about 2 months ago and stopped in different places among those Italy too in a small town. One of my dad's friends lived there, he had 2 girls and a boy. One of the girls will be 18 while the other is 20. I'm 16. Anyways at first I thought the typical things that I man would think but after talking to the 18 year old girl (Let's call her Jamie), I found out a lot of things in common and I really liked her. I met her sister too (Calling her Alice) and she was really fun. To make the long story short, I had a wonderful time with them, I turned into this new person, I suddenly became the funniest person etc etc. During the first 2-3 days we only talked about school and stuff like that. I made a lot of jokes but regular jokes. In the fourth day I started to make well different jokes, the type where you start with different compliments like "Everytime you smile my day shines". I know that it's not really a joke but at first Jamie and Alice found it funny. After wards they partly discovered that I wanted to propose to Jamie (Not for marriage of course). The road back to Eastern Europe they came along cause they due to the fact that one of the people in their family had a wedding.

 

Anyways the wedding was 10 days after. During those 10 days I thought a lot and in the end came to the conclusion that I had deeply fallen in love with Jamie (A lot of different signs) and decided to porpose to her at the wedding but didn't really get the chance. A day before they were going back to Italy I met them again and finally got the chance but Alice was also there(Older sister duh!). Anyways I had been preparing the speech since the day we got back from Italy and it was the most emotional and longest proposal that I had ever done. Jamie had never been in a relationship before and neither had Alice and I knew that. She gave me a lot of reasons why we couldn't be together and I gave her a lot of solutions to those reasons(Everything went well with Alice supporting me time to time too). In the end the only but strong reason that "knocked" me out was that she still wasn't thinking about having a bf and that she wanted to finish high school first. Alice had never been in a relationship either and she was 2 years older and there my hands were tied. I was heart broken and they realized that. They stayed close to me until I left.

 

Anyways the next day when they arrived back in Italy I talked to both of them and after I talked to Alice she said that she considered me like a brother (Something new to me) and that she loved me like one. I felt very well in those moments. I also asked her about my chances with Jamie but she said that the two reasons that made it impossible at the moment were me being 2 years younger and that Jamie wanted to finish high school first before thinking about dating. I said that I would forget about my feelings for Jamie although I lied. It was just an excuse so that I could still stay close to them and get the chance to propose again next year.

 

Now I've been preparing for a couple of weeks now. First of all I am younger but age doesn't really matter. I mean it isn't the main reason. Second of all they were both very cold girls when it came to boys, I mean boys whistled at them when they walked on streets but all they told each other was to keep walking. In other words not s***s. Now they consider me like a brother, both ask me for help with different matters(On the phone). I am preparing a longer proposation this time with more feelings. This time I got more time to prepare(Until July compared to 10 days) and well maybe last time it was a little early for them considering the fact that they have never dated and only knew me for 3 weeks while until July their trust towards me will have grown a lot and they'll know me for 1 year.

 

My main problem is what specifically to say to Jamie next year so that she'll understand my situation, honoest words. Thanks for reading.

[quankanne]

dude, I feel for you – you've got some serious feelings cooking for Jaime, but she's already got you identified as close friend/brother material. Might be because of your age and inexperience, might be because they like you a lot and to see you as a "brother" keeps the relationship legit and on-going because you're not like other guys they know.

 

either way, I think it's time to maybe reconsider your plans unless you're dead-set on being shot down by a girl who just isn't interested in you this way.

 

you sound like a kind, decent young man, but it sounds like the timing just isn't right for the kind of romance you're hoping for ...

[Frankasy]

dude, I feel for you – you've got some serious feelings cooking for Jaime, but she's already got you identified as close friend/brother material. Might be because of your age and inexperience, might be because they like you a lot and to see you as a "brother" keeps the relationship legit and on-going because you're not like other guys they know.

 

either way, I think it's time to maybe reconsider your plans unless you're dead-set on being shot down by a girl who just isn't interested in you this way.

 

you sound like a kind, decent young man, but it sounds like the timing just isn't right for the kind of romance you're hoping for ...

 

Thanks for the reply. Well actually she didn't consider me like a brother from the first moment we met. I mean she does have a younger brother and if it's anymore helpful, only Alice said the brother stuff. When I talked to Jamie(After I proposed) I said that it would be nice for her to consider me like a friend or brother and she said ok. I didn't really get which one she picked so I called her the next day to clear out that it was brother and I kinda forced it that way.

 

Also I'm not inexperienced, she is. I've had a lot of gfs in the past but I've never actually felt anything for them. I only thought that I felt something for my first gf but when I met Jamie I thought more about her in 3 weeks than I had for my first gf in 5 years(If you see where I'm going).

 

Anyways I'm not trying to get rejected on purpose, never but it's love and I might not find a girl with the same personality as Jamie and I wanna fight for it. The rejection the first time was cold water for me but it also broke a little ice between her and dating. Next year I'm hoping to totally break that ice. I've prepared a much more emotion and longer proposal speech this time and it will be more and more longer until July. They write messages to me from time to time etc, something which shows that I managed to get into their hearts for 3 weeks although not in the dating way(For Jamie of course).

 

I don't know. I'm really confused.

[Frankasy]

I'm a guy and I've always preferred and dated older woman. I never liked younger woman than myself due to them being inexperienced and sometimes childish. Now I've fallen in love with this girl who happens to be 2 years older than myself. She refused me once. I plan on giving it another try but when she refused me age wasn't really the problem and it isn't. During the time I proposed to her when she mentioned age I said that love knows no age and stuff like that and she accepted me. Now next time is gonna be a lot more harder but I'm preparing myself and I know that she might mention the age issue once more. I can't only fill her mind with the stuff I said before, I need some new things to say, some positive things when a man is younger than a woman in a relationship. Help or your experiences are appreciated. Woman who have dated younger guys too are welcomed to express their opinions and maybe tips. Thanks.

[Frankasy]

Anyone else? Also it's Jamie's birthday on Sunday. What should I say to her besides the birthday wishes, something that will give her the impression that not all my feelings for her are gone.

 

[JohnnyBlaze]

If you don't mind my asking, how old are you and how old is she? Teenagers, I'm guessing? I'm not saying that critically, but based on your definition of 'older', it makes sense.

 

Other than teenagers, 2 years is not older/younger. 20 years may be, but not 2. Out in the world, the rule of thumb seems to be that, if the two of you were ever in high school at the same time (even if she was a senior and you were a freshman), there isn't any age difference. If I am correct about the age, then there won't be a whole lot you can say to change her mind. Teenagers generally see any difference in age as monumental. My guess is that it's due to two factors: first, with fewer years, any difference is greater. Example: for a 50 year old to date someone two years older, there's only a 2% difference in age. However, for a 20 year old, that equates to a 10% difference. The second factor is the status. There's generally a stigma associated with dating someone in a "lower class". Seniors don't date freshmen, and the one freshman that does break this barrier brags about it to his friends for the rest of his life.

 

If it is the percentage difference, all you can do is try and show her that you have enough other positives to outweigh this one perceived negative. If it's the social stigma aspect, I hate to say it but you're probably out of luck.

 

At the risk of being a real downer, you seem convinced that age really is the barrier here. Are you sure that's the case?

 

 

 

Disclosure: I have dated two older women before. One was 20 years older, and one was 15. The second one asked me out, and the first one just sort of happened. Don't ask; it's a long story, and I'm not gonna tell it.

[Shygirl15]

During the time I proposed to her when she mentioned age I said that love knows no age and stuff like that and she accepted me.

 

How could you say that when you have just stated yourself that age play a role in choosing the type of mate you want to be with?

[audrey_1]

Two years is nothing. I was in a four-year relationship with someone *twenty* years older than me, not once, but twice. Now that is definitely an age difference, and it was great on many levels.

 

Don't let it bother you, and kudos to you for admiring older women.

 

But how long have you two been dating, or are you dating? You said she refused you once, yet you proposed to her?

[JohnnyBlaze]

How could you say that when you have just stated yourself that age play a role in choosing the type of mate you want to be with?

 

"I love you"

"I haven't so much as looked at another woman since I met you"

"Yes, I'd much rather go antiquing with you than watch the Green Bay/New England game"

"No, those jeans don't make your butt look big" (doghouse corollary: "...your butt makes your butt look big!")

"You're much prettier than your 18 year old model sister"

 

Shall I continue?

[Frankasy]

If you don't mind my asking, how old are you and how old is she? Teenagers, I'm guessing? I'm not saying that critically, but based on your definition of 'older', it makes sense.

 

Other than teenagers, 2 years is not older/younger. 20 years may be, but not 2. Out in the world, the rule of thumb seems to be that, if the two of you were ever in high school at the same time (even if she was a senior and you were a freshman), there isn't any age difference. If I am correct about the age, then there won't be a whole lot you can say to change her mind. Teenagers generally see any difference in age as monumental. My guess is that it's due to two factors: first, with fewer years, any difference is greater. Example: for a 50 year old to date someone two years older, there's only a 2% difference in age. However, for a 20 year old, that equates to a 10% difference. The second factor is the status. There's generally a stigma associated with dating someone in a "lower class". Seniors don't date freshmen, and the one freshman that does break this barrier brags about it to his friends for the rest of his life.

 

If it is the percentage difference, all you can do is try and show her that you have enough other positives to outweigh this one perceived negative. If it's the social stigma aspect, I hate to say it but you're probably out of luck.

 

At the risk of being a real downer, you seem convinced that age really is the barrier here. Are you sure that's the case?

 

 

 

Disclosure: I have dated two older women before. One was 20 years older, and one was 15. The second one asked me out, and the first one just sort of happened. Don't ask; it's a long story, and I'm not gonna tell it.

 

Yes, I'm a teenager and so is she.

 

How could you say that when you have just stated yourself that age play a role in choosing the type of mate you want to be with?

 

Well actually that's what I thought before I met this girl. Now that I think about it, even if she was younger I would go for it. Plus I'm not saying that I would never date a younger girl (In fact I've dated one once) but all those younger girls that I know are inexperienced and childish.

 

Two years is nothing. I was in a four-year relationship with someone *twenty* years older than me, not once, but twice. Now that is definitely an age difference, and it was great on many levels.

 

Don't let it bother you, and kudos to you for admiring older women.

 

But how long have you two been dating, or are you dating? You said she refused you once, yet you proposed to her?

 

Thanks.

 

Well actually it's complicated. I've explained everything in this thread: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t164927/ . If you have any advice, I'd be pleased to hear them.

 

"I love you"

"I haven't so much as looked at another woman since I met you"

"Yes, I'd much rather go antiquing with you than watch the Green Bay/New England game"

"No, those jeans don't make your butt look big" (doghouse corollary: "...your butt makes your butt look big!")

"You're much prettier than your 18 year old model sister"

 

Shall I continue?

 

I liked the first 2, in fact I've already thought of those. Anymore?

[Geishawhelk]

Yes, I'm a teenager and so is she.

 

Then excuse me for saying so, but first of all you're far too young to be worrying about stuff like this....you're BOTH teenagers??

 

The question is - are you legally old enough to be entering into a relastionship??

 

If she's a maximum (teenage) age of 19, that makes you only 17....only JUST old enough!

And if she's younger than that......

 

Sheeeeesh!

This is just ridiculous!!

 

Wait until you're 45 and your SO is maybe 52..... then think about age differences...

But right now?

 

Gimme a break!!

[Frankasy]

Then excuse me for saying so, but first of all you're far too young to be worrying about stuff like this....you're BOTH teenagers??

 

The question is - are you legally old enough to be entering into a relastionship??

 

If she's a maximum (teenage) age of 19, that makes you only 17....only JUST old enough!

And if she's younger than that......

 

Sheeeeesh!

This is just ridiculous!!

 

Wait until you're 45 and your SO is maybe 52..... then think about age differences...

But right now?

 

Gimme a break!!

 

Yeah, we're pretty much where you put it. Since when is there an age required to enter a relationship? I've heard of there being an age to marry, to drink, drive, work etc but never an age to start dating. Plus in case you haven' thought about it, once I'm 18 I'm gonna start living on my own and having a relationship with her would mean that in an year or so she could move in with me. According to you I'm gonna have to wait until 30 years and than ask her about age differences?! That's stupid! One of the main reasons I asked this question is cause we're still in school and age differences now are really big (Emotionally at least) cause she's 1-2 grades above me but when you're 45 and she's more, it doesn't really matter. I mean you both work etc and age differences aren't really important in that age. Love comes unexpected and mine came now, what am I supposed to do, tell it to come again after 30 years?! Crap advice. The forums allows you to view the threads posted and you can pick the thread you want to enter and weather you wanna reply or not, if the thread doesn't interest you, I suggest you don't enter it.

[Shygirl15]

One of the main reasons I asked this question is cause we're still in school and age differences now are really big (Emotionally at least) cause she's 1-2 grades above me but when you're 45 and she's more, it doesn't really matter. I mean you both work etc and age differences aren't really important in that age.

 

lol..

 

How about making that comment when you reach 45, huh?

[Frankasy]

lol..

 

How about making that comment when you reach 45, huh?

 

You're right. I just disliked the advice though.

[Geishawhelk]

I didn't say you'd be with this girl when you were 45, I said your SO - because believe me, it won't be her.

 

My point is that you are waaaay to young to be thinking about moving in and forging something serious because chances are this won't get as far as you seem to currently think it will.

Hey, maybe I'm wrong.

Maybe she will be the whole, entire love of your life.

Maybe you will grow old together.

 

Age differences are irrelevant in the 'middle' years. At the beginning they're a big deal (precisely for the reasons you mention) and at the end they're a big deal because (as is the case with my mom and dad, who have 11 years between them) the younger person stops being a partner and becomes more of a carer.

 

This matters now, but it shouldn't, because you are both really too young to be considering really getting serious. It's a rare thing for a first love to remain a last love. You have your schooling, and a whole world of other people to befriend and enjoy the company of.

 

But take no notice of me. I'm 50, and live with my partner, who's 5 years younger than me. He's not bothered about the age difference, and neither am I. But sure as eggs is eggs, I sure wouldn't have dated a 14 year old when I was 19.....

 

get my point?

[Lucky_One]

I took you at your word when you said you proposed to her and she turned you down.

 

You are both certainly too young to be married, and I am glad to see that she realizes that.

 

You don't have an age difference, if she is 18-19 and you are 16-17. She just isn't into you.

[JohnnyBlaze]

I liked the first 2, in fact I've already thought of those. Anymore?

Actually, those were just smarta__ lines directed to Shygirl for questioning why you said what you did (although, if the Green Bay line does turn her on, tell her to call me!). My indirect point to her was that guys will say most anything to make a girl happy, even if it is contradictory. Those were just some of the more well known examples.

 

Feel free to try #2 all you want, but steer clear of #1 for now - telling her that you love her right off the bat will only serve to make you look needy and creepy. And at this point in time, definitely don't mention even the remote possibility of you two moving in, even if it is after you turn 18 and get your own place. Did I stress that enough? Once again, you'll come off looking needy. She thinks you're just trying to get to first base, while you're already talking like you want to sign her to the team and make her your starting shortstop! One step at a time, otherwise you'll scare her off.

 

As was mentioned in another thread recently, women want to be wanted. They don't want to be needed. There's a difference. A wanted woman feels sexy. A needed woman feels trapped. One's a good feeling, one's not; I'm sure you can figure which one is which.

 

Forget trying to convince her that the age isn't an issue; try to make her forget it altogether. Find out what she's interested in. Are there any commonalities between you two? She needs some way to feel a connection with you; until that happens, nothing else will either.

[Frankasy]

Actually, those were just smarta__ lines directed to Shygirl for questioning why you said what you did (although, if the Green Bay line does turn her on, tell her to call me!). My indirect point to her was that guys will say most anything to make a girl happy, even if it is contradictory. Those were just some of the more well known examples.

 

Feel free to try #2 all you want, but steer clear of #1 for now - telling her that you love her right off the bat will only serve to make you look needy and creepy. And at this point in time, definitely don't mention even the remote possibility of you two moving in, even if it is after you turn 18 and get your own place. Did I stress that enough? Once again, you'll come off looking needy. She thinks you're just trying to get to first base, while you're already talking like you want to sign her to the team and make her your starting shortstop! One step at a time, otherwise you'll scare her off.

 

As was mentioned in another thread recently, women want to be wanted. They don't want to be needed. There's a difference. A wanted woman feels sexy. A needed woman feels trapped. One's a good feeling, one's not; I'm sure you can figure which one is which.

 

Forget trying to convince her that the age isn't an issue; try to make her forget it altogether. Find out what she's interested in. Are there any commonalities between you two? She needs some way to feel a connection with you; until that happens, nothing else will either.

 

Ok that exactly, making her feel wanted and not needed, how do I do that? I realize the difference but I can't really do anything with actions. Her birthday is on Sunday for example, I'm gonna call her and maybe make a compliment to her, is that a wanted or needed sign?

[Lucky_One]

Does she give you any indication at all that she likes you romantically? Have you ever gone on a date?

[Frankasy]

Does she give you any indication at all that she likes you romantically? Have you ever gone on a date?

 

No date yet. Just go to my thread on Second Chances and everything is explained there.

[Lucky_One]

Frank, you are in a different country than this girl. How often do you think you are going to see her to "date" at your age?

 

She thinks of you like a brother. Those are relationship-killing words at any age. No one wants to kiss their brother passionately. No one wants their brother to "propose" to them (whatever "propose" means). No one wants to be BF/GF with their sibling.

 

You sound like a nice guy, but you need to find a local GF who likes you and wants to be with you.

[Lucky_One]

Frank, you are in a different country than this girl. How often do you think you are going to see her to "date" at your age?

 

She thinks of you like a brother. Those are relationship-killing words at any age. No one wants to kiss their brother passionately. No one wants their brother to "propose" to them (whatever "propose" means). No one wants to be BF/GF with their sibling.

 

You sound like a nice guy, but you need to find a local GF who likes you and wants to be with you.

[Frankasy]

Frank, you are in a different country than this girl. How often do you think you are going to see her to "date" at your age?

 

She thinks of you like a brother. Those are relationship-killing words at any age. No one wants to kiss their brother passionately. No one wants their brother to "propose" to them (whatever "propose" means). No one wants to be BF/GF with their sibling.

 

You sound like a nice guy, but you need to find a local GF who likes you and wants to be with you.

 

Well I could see her every summer plus even if I get together with her (Next year during the summer), we're probably gonna be away for only 9 months. I mean she's got a final year in her high school (2 with this year) years while I still got like 2 more years but surprisingly she said that she might continue university in Toronto (Where I've lived and plan on going back) or I could go to Italy to do school. Our education is as complicated as our story but the point is that distance isn't really the issue and even if we get together we're only gonna be apart from each other only for 9 months.

 

Her older sister was very touched when I proposed to her and felt very sorry when I got refused. When I talked to them a day after (They had gone back to Italy) Alice (Older sis) told me to forget about Jamie (The girl) and said that currently we couldn't be together mostly cause of Jamie preferring to date when she'd finish high school. She said that she loved me like a brother. I felt very good at that moment and got this I dunno, desire I guess to give it another try and my plan is simple, I have to make both of them believe that I've forgotten my feelings for Jamie and than when I'm back with them next summer I could give it another try. Of course the reason I did this was so that they'd still talk to me with no difficulties (Me being still in love with Jamie although I am) and during these 9 months they'd earn more trust at me. So far everything's going as planned and I was the one that insisted that Jamie referred to me as a brother cause she never specified it so in the end, Jamie didn't consider me like a brother at first, I asked her too, only Alice (Older sis) does. So I don't think that she would see it that way, kissing her brother and stuff like that.

 

I could find a local girl, it's very easy in fact but Jamie is different. I don't really know what to say about her cause I can't find the words. She's everything, just being with her makes me feel as if I've touched the sky. Her refusal was a stone in the road, not a rock. Basically I had only 10 days to prepare. Now it's different, I've got 9 months. If I get refused again after 9 months (During which I've began and will continue to work on my speech) the chances of me and her being together will decrease a lot, in fact will probably be 0. Jamie's my Everest, I can't quit that easily.

[Frankasy]

Frank, you are in a different country than this girl. How often do you think you are going to see her to "date" at your age?

 

She thinks of you like a brother. Those are relationship-killing words at any age. No one wants to kiss their brother passionately. No one wants their brother to "propose" to them (whatever "propose" means). No one wants to be BF/GF with their sibling.

 

You sound like a nice guy, but you need to find a local GF who likes you and wants to be with you.

 

Saw this after I posted my reply on the Age differences thread. Um, let's continue this convo her instead of the other thread ok? Check my reply on the age differences thread and reply here.

[Federica]

No, don't.

 

These are two different threads.

 

You created them, so I please let's not cause confusion by leaping from one thread to the other. it ruins continuity for others.

Threads therefore MERGED.