djhall Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 For women who believe it is fair for men to pay for dates, how do you see that as being equal? If both people are putting forward equal effort for equal reward, and one person is paying, either that person is getting an unfair deal or the time and company of the person who isn't paying is worth more than the time and company of the person who is.
Tomcat33 Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 TC, you sound insecure... As if the man is paying so you feel valuable..Or, you are just cheap. is that all it takes to make you feel valuable? 30 dollars for your half of the meal? lol.. You are doing one thing wrong... If you were intelligent, you would get a lot more in the long run by being openly generous. Sure, you might get a few free meals. Will you get a marriage proposal? Will he splurge on a vacation for you? Or will it be bogged down into some really low level keeping track of a few dollars on a date to help you with your feelings of insecurity. Think big... The only guy I am openly generous with is the man that wins my heart. That's ok perception is all we have to go on here. I don't mind that you perceive me as you do, I consider the source. Now if it were someone who knew me very well and whom I respected and I valued as a personal friend of mine I would be pretty hurt that they could see me in such a low light. But that's not the case. I don't need free meals and even less from a man I am not interested in. I don't date men I am not interested in, and if I don't like them I won't go out with them a second date just to be out, to me that is TORTURE. I have plenty of fiends I can be out with doing my own thing. Which is why I don't agree to dinner dates the first few dates. I have food in my fridge and cash, credit cards and a corporate entertainment card in my wallet so money is not an issue for me and neither is eating I eat very well and live even better thank you very much. I have a certain standard of living and I like it this way. I am planning a three week vacation and I am trying to decide where to go, you can't do that kind of thing without planning and good management of money. I like my standards and I want to keep it that way. Attitude is important to me. If a man invites me out on a date I like it that he treats me to the date. It shows that he is not a flake it shows that he is willing to court me and it shows that he is not a cheap skate. I like a man who has the same standard of living as myself I just can't see myself dating someone who is struggling financially or who is not good at managing their money, those are very unattractive qualities and I can't see myself building a future with a man who is not only not on the same page as myself financially but who is going to micro manage how I spend MY money because he has no sense of responsibility himself. I rarely accept dinner dates on a first or second date because I find that too intimate in terms of how much he will spend without fully knowing if there is full interest on either part. SOOOO I DO think big. Which is why I have no time for men that think like you. I would never invest my days getting to know someone that was cheap and petty on the first dates. If you made a genuine offer to pay (not the fake slowly pull your wallet out and quickly put it back in your purse), or even insisted paying at the next venue, he would go home, and see you in a different light. That few dollars could possibly lead him to seeing you as generous, decent, normal, and someone who is not just out for a free dinner. He may then be VERY generous with you. If I make a genuine offer to pay I just pay I don't pull this "let's go dutch nonsense" there IS no going dutch you invite me you pay I invite you I pay. And these very same men have been very generous with me without me having to pay for anything, they see what I have to offer and they see what type of woman I am they know I am not there to milk them for any sort of dinner or drinks or anything of that sort and they eaggerly want to see me again. Only to find out in time their generosity comes back to them two fold. It's not as cut and dry as you paint it out to be. Some men get it, some don't The ones that don't are not for me.
Tomcat33 Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 Furthermore Von if YOU were smart you would learn to differentiate between the types of women that are just going to use you and chuck you and the ones that are going along with being courted because they see you as a potentially good candidate for more than just a meal. I only let the types of men that I see a potential treat me, maybe this is where the breakdown happens in what some of you men see. And I can understand that if you keep picking the types of women that have no scruples and are looking just for a meal ticket you are going to see all women as a potential threat and I would assume it gets pretty expensive after a while to date bimbos that only want you for some shooters at the bar. Clearly you have been burned too many times. But maybe you should be less shallow in your selection process and invest your time and money on women that won't ride you and chuck you and pick women that are worth the time effort and money.
vonerik012 Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 TC Not all men that date you know your life history, lol. They do not know you at all. You are a stranger. All they see is some chick who site back, waits for the check, makes a fake effort to pay (like men have not seen that a hundred times), and just takes. Wow, so unique . If a man offers Dutch you ASSUME he is broke, a cheap, a loser. So they might ASSUME the same of you. If you ask you pay, lol. So you ask men out on dates often, plan the date, pick them up, and pay?Yeah right. If you ask your girlfriend out, does she expect you to pay? Or is it just whitewashed prostitution when a man is involved because you have a vagina? I understand paying for the first few dates, but you seem like the type that will never want to pay. Or be stressed if you actually do. Or always be keeping tabs on who paid for what. Or just EXPECTING him to pay, with no appreciation. Evolved successful people just flow,and money is irrelevant. Being so cheap about a few dollars does not make you look wonderful.
Tomcat33 Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 Evolved successful people just flow,and money is irrelevant. Being so cheap about a few dollars does not make you look wonderful. Cool then stop crying over having to pay for a measely check when you invite a woman out. If she is worth it will come right back at you eventually if she is not then you will soon find out what she is really all about it's not like you have a million options with women anyway....:laugh: Be selective and you won't have to worry about about being used.
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 So if I want the man to pay, I am now a prostitute? Give me a break. The first few dates, I believe the man should pay. If we go to dinner and then follow that with drinks somewhere, I will offer to pay for the drinks after dinner. Most guys do not accept my offer. After we have been dating for a while, we then start splitting the tab. Usually he will pay for a night out, and then I will grab the next one, since it is sort of cheesy to whip out the calculator at the dinner table.
OpenBook Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 The only reason men used to pay is because women did not work. Women were also far more submissive, had better morals, and more feminine. They were ladies. :lmao::lmao: Let me guess - you're one of those guys who says "It all started going downhill when we gave women the right to vote." For the record I have no problem paying..But I also have plenty of money.. If I did not, I would have a problem paying. And I tend to stay away from the feminists anyway..So I do not mind paying for a lady. You have no idea how relieved I am to hear that!! By all means, keep doing what you're doing... and continue to steer clear of us horrible modern feminists. Please, I insist.
The Collector Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 So if I want the man to pay, I am now a prostitute? Yeah kinda, but without the return on your buck.
vonerik012 Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 Well the modern feminists seem to be pretty easy, as they view sex like men, so they do serve one purpose. Tomcat, so when does the man stop paying for everything, and you start chipping in? After 3 dates? 100 dates? Never? Maybe if you were selective you would not be worried if a man can afford a cheap dinner for you to impress you..
Green Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 I hate paying for women any time. Heck most of the hottest best girls have spent a ton of money on me and I find its usualy the more anoying girls that always want you to pay for stuff. Especialy in the begining I don't like paying for a girl but maybe as time goes by I'll treat her. I buy my good friends who are guys lunch or a drink but I hate paying for girls .BOOO. I do know how to do a cheap date, I know resteraunts where a two person bill stays under 10 and theatres where two movie tickes total around 5. The best date is to just invtie a girl to hang out at your place, watch a movie or a show and have good food at a fraction of the cost of resteraunt.
D-Lish Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 I don't ask guys out- so normally on a first date I have no problem splitting the bill. If I don't plan on seeing someone again- I'll always insist on splitting the bill.... I don't wish to lead them on. If I like someone, and he's insistent about paying, I'll agree to it- put I'll make sure to pick up the tab soon enough.
Tomcat33 Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 Well the modern feminists seem to be pretty easy, as they view sex like men, so they do serve one purpose. Tomcat, so when does the man stop paying for everything, and you start chipping in? After 3 dates? 100 dates? Never? Maybe if you were selective you would not be worried if a man can afford a cheap dinner for you to impress you.. Whaaat? A dinner cheap OR expensive does not impress me, THE MAN DOES. But on the same token, a man that would expect me to go dutch on the first few dates would turn me RIGHT OFF. After 300 dates I'll consider buying him one drink.
JoeNewbie Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 Beyond the financial aspects, there is a very good practical reason why men end up paying of the time. That's because everybody does it and it's an unwritten rule. Why? What happens when the girl you go out with insists on going dutch? Because she's not interested in seeing you again (99% of the time) or she's a post-modern dater (1% of the time). On the first few dates, I always pay when I invite the girl out for dinner. One can choose not to pay and that's their prerogative - as long as they can live with the consequences.
The Collector Posted September 13, 2008 Posted September 13, 2008 I should also add - don't do dinner dates, they suck.
Tomcat33 Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 Beyond the financial aspects, there is a very good practical reason why men end up paying of the time. That's because everybody does it and it's an unwritten rule. Why? Good question. I would also like to ask, why is it that if a woman sleeps with a man right away she is a slutty whore not worth dating again but if a man does he is a stud? It's an unwritten rule, why? Let's face it, we subconsciously attach a label of worth to those things that don't come easy to us. It's as simple as that really.
The Collector Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 I would also like to ask, why is it that if a woman sleeps with a man right away she is a slutty whore not worth dating again but if a man does he is a stud? It's an unwritten rule, why? Not in my book.
refurb Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 As a guy, I am always prepared to pay for the date. However, if the girl offers to chip in at all, she gets a check in the "+" column. An independent girl who approaches the relationship as a equal is hot in my book. If a chick gives any indication that she expects for me to pay, then I do and never call again. Girls with kind of sense of entitlement tend to be the princess-types in other aspects too. RF
Ruby Slippers Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 I am far from a gold digger, but I still want the guy to pay in the early stages. I have been on dates with guys who spent a lot of money on me and offered to take me on trips, take me shopping, whatever. I turned them down because I didn't feel a real spark with those guys, didn't see it going anywhere, and didn't want to lead them on. Hell, a few of the higher-earners even said if I stuck with them, I could work on my music and creative projects and not have to worry about money. One long-term partner offered to pay the rent and all the bills when we moved in together. Our first vacation together, he invited and offered to treat me and pay for everything. I let him get the plane tickets and hotel, and I paid for all the restaurants and entertainment. I turned all these offers down because I'm not after a free ride -- I want real love, and a relationship that makes me happy on all levels. All that said, experience has taught me that men who don't observe the admittedly traditional custom of paying on the first few dates tend to be cheap, financially and beyond, and not worth my time.
mortensorchid Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 I think a man should pay for a meal or drinks or coffee or whatever it is you're meeting someone for. I've been out on a few dates with guys who do not pay, and they turned out to be real jerks. Fortunately I never heard from them again, but it's a sign of what kind of person they really are. That says "selfish" to me.
Rooster_DAR Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 I don't ask guys out- so normally on a first date I have no problem splitting the bill. If I don't plan on seeing someone again- I'll always insist on splitting the bill.... I don't wish to lead them on. If I like someone, and he's insistent about paying, I'll agree to it- put I'll make sure to pick up the tab soon enough. This is the perfect female reaction to me. Nice!
Lights Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 It's disgustingly hypocritical how such an antiquated concept such as courtship is expected to apply in these modern times, when other concepts of gender roles are conveniently removed. I still believe that the women of my culture expect to have it both ways with regards to which sets of behaviors and roles are to be applied. I'll start taking women's point of view on who pays on first dates and who asks whom on dates remotely seriously when fully half of my interactions with women involve me getting approached, met, and asked out with equal frequency, directness, and risk of rejection that my own such attempts involve. Where the hell are all the finely-honed, routine-frequency, deftly-delivered instances of "Excuse me a minute. My name's Reiko. I was wondering if you'd like to get to know each other over some coffee..." and "Hi. I'm Inga. I thought I would meet you..." anyways? At least in my life they've been missing entirely.
Shygirl15 Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 So if I want the man to pay, I am now a prostitute? Give me a break. The first few dates, I believe the man should pay. If we go to dinner and then follow that with drinks somewhere, I will offer to pay for the drinks after dinner. Most guys do not accept my offer. After we have been dating for a while, we then start splitting the tab. Usually he will pay for a night out, and then I will grab the next one, since it is sort of cheesy to whip out the calculator at the dinner table. Thank you, my fellow Washingtonian. Sorry, but I find men who participated on this thread to be cheap as well. Real guys don't need to brainstorm about paying for a date or not.
Lights Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 Thank you, my fellow Washingtonian. Sorry, but I find men who participated on this thread to be cheap as well. Real guys don't need to brainstorm about paying for a date or not. Too bad you have to be surrounded by us unreal guys. Note that any fool can go around making wild statements about what "real" people are. That doesn't mean those statements have an ounce of truth to them.
Green Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 Please any one who talks about what it is to be a real man especialy if they are a girl needs to suck it.
Balthazar Posted September 14, 2008 Posted September 14, 2008 Putting aside coffee dates, I always pay for the first date because I am the one who asked the lady out. I believe it is unacceptable for a man to ask a woman for a first time out and then expect her to pay her half. Some women do offer to pay at the end of the evening(as a polite gesture), and while I appreciate the offer , I never take them up on it. If a woman insists on paying, it is usually a sign that she has integrity but ,probably, doesn't wish to date me again. However, I have never had a woman actually pay on a first date. What if the woman asks me out on a first date? Well, that has never happened to me. I usually pay on the next few subsequent dates also, especially if I am asking her out. I admit I am old-fashioned in these matters so I more often than not end up paying.
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