Trialbyfire Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 While starting a family maybe important to some men, not all want or care to have a family. Also, there's fertility clinics or adoption, as options. Realistically speaking, in looking at D-Lish's situation, from a fertility perspective, she's better off looking towards younger men, since they generally have a higher, more healthy sperm count, than an older male.
rod_in_gtown Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 While starting a family maybe important to some men, not all want or care to have a family. Also, there's fertility clinics or adoption, as options. Realistically speaking, in looking at D-Lish's situation, from a fertility perspective, she's better off looking towards younger men, since they generally have a higher, more healthy sperm count, than an older male. Not to sound harsh but the problem of trying to have a baby at D-Lish's age (38?) is not generally an issue with Sperm count. I've heard from many sources (professionals in the health industry) that for a woman to have children beyond 35 is considered a high-risk pregnancy. I'm not saying run out and get pregnant, but if you do want a family, your risk is getting higher by the passing year. Don't settle (specially for the rich, comb-over-wearing, gut-toting, chicken-legged type) but do start looking in a place where you haven't looked before. I've found speed-dating to be fun and interesting, and they have all age ranges there. I don't know where you meet your past men but it's certainly not bringing you the kind of man you're looking for.
Balthazar Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 As I stated in my first post, all advice is given under the assumption that D wants a family and children. If she doesn't want children, matters change. However, I feel the existence of children is the mortar that keeps a relationship strong. Children are a blessing; we forget how important they are(possibly because we have let important years go by and feel our opportunities have slipped out of our reach...) I think the chances of finding a younger guy and actually keeping him over a significant period of time(without giving him kids) is even worse! Sperm count decreases with age, but is still significantly high in the 40's. If the guy is healthy, his age is not a hindrance.
Trialbyfire Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Not to sound harsh but the problem of trying to have a baby at D-Lish's age (38?) is not generally an issue with Sperm count. I've heard from many sources (professionals in the health industry) that for a woman to have children beyond 35 is considered a high-risk pregnancy. I'm not saying run out and get pregnant, but if you do want a family, your risk is getting higher by the passing year. Don't settle (specially for the rich, comb-over-wearing, gut-toting, chicken-legged type) but do start looking in a place where you haven't looked before. I've found speed-dating to be fun and interesting, and they have all age ranges there. I don't know where you meet your past men but it's certainly not bringing you the kind of man you're looking for. The risk factor generally applies to babies who have the simian crease. If I recall correctly, this is less than 1%, at 38.
Trialbyfire Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 As I stated in my first post, all advice is given under the assumption that D wants a family and children. If she doesn't want children, matters change. However, I feel the existence of children is the mortar that keeps a relationship strong. Children are a blessing; we forget how important they are(possibly because we have let important years go by and feel our opportunities have slipped out of our reach...) I think the chances of finding a younger guy and actually keeping him over a significant period of time(without giving him kids) is even worse! Sperm count decreases with age, but is still significantly high in the 40's. If the guy is healthy, his age is not a hindrance. When men age, it's not only sperm count. DNA is found to fragment with age, within sperm, thus increasing the possibility for birth defects. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13164718/
rod_in_gtown Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 The risk factor generally applies to babies who have the simian crease. If I recall correctly, this is less than 1%, at 38. Actually the risk implies more than just that, from infertility, multiple pregnancies, miscarriages, gestational diabetes, down syndrome etc. http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/pregnancy/PR00115
Balthazar Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 When men age, it's not only sperm count. DNA is found to fragment with age, within sperm, thus increasing the possibility for birth defects. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13164718/ So let's say a 45 year old man marries a 38 year old woman(which is realistic IMO). Is it your belief that the risk lies mostly in the man's sperm or the woman's ovum?
rod_in_gtown Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 The risk factor generally applies to babies who have the simian crease. If I recall correctly, this is less than 1%, at 38. Yes, the actual percentages seem quite low, but they grow exponentially, more than 90% of post-35 will be normal, but you don't want to be in that 1% or 2%. When you're talking about your child, that percentage is still very high. Plus genetic-related defects in normal couples are 2%-3%, cousins are 4%-6% so if the percentage increase after 35 is 1%, then at the age 38 (5%-6%) would theoretically be the same as having a child with a first cousin. (not a scientific fact, just an extrapolation based on the discussion above) http://www.cousincouples.com/?page=facts
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 I can't imagine becoming legally entwined with someone with whom I do not share an overwhelming sense of love and affection. I would just not go there, period. I feel fortunate that I do not have a grand desire for children, because I think I would feel a lot more pressure to get married if I did. I still wouldn't do it, though. I would feel trapped. I guess I don't really understand what people mean when they use the word settle. Are they talking about opening up your mind to different men than the type one might ordinarily choose? Say, if I'm a woman who only likes tall men, opening myself up to the possibility of love with a shorter one? I don't find fault with that. I think it is good to date different people and give people a shot. However, it sounds like that is exactly what D-Lish has been doing. So it sounds like people are telling her to settle for someone she may not really find to be all that great for her. This makes no sense to me at all.
Trialbyfire Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 So let's say a 45 year old man marries a 38 year old woman(which is realistic IMO). Is it your belief that the risk lies mostly in the man's sperm or the woman's ovum? It's both. For men, it's decreased sperm count, DNA fragmentation which can result in Dwarfism and other birth/genetic defects and also the lack of swimming strength for the boys. If they dog paddle, it's not the same torpedo strength. http://pt.wkhealth.com/pt/re/andr/abstract.00000536-200704000-00001.htm;jsessionid=L3LbqvbF8BygLBM19mMHhgCq1PvNcVn5B94nB9gyTbhhCvfzmph6!231517226!181195629!8091!-1 For women, it's primarily Down Syndrome and greater problems during pregnancy and birth. With birthing difficulties, this can be circumvented through a C-section.
vonerik012 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 YAWN... TBF, why don't you tell us how often the "dwarfism" occurs? 1 out of how many older men have dwarfs? TBF.. Did you even read the article? It says much of nothing...They surveyed men 22 to 80? lol Yes I am sure 80 year olds have fragmented sperm. Women trying to make the claim that men and women have nearly identical biological clocks are just plain ridiculous. Risk of genetic problems Women’s biological time clock has long been known, with older women having an increased risk of miscarriage and of producing children with genetic defects such as Down Syndrome. “Our research suggests that men, too, have a biological time clock — only it is different,” Eskenazi said in a statement. “Men seem to have a gradual rather than an abrupt change in fertility and in the potential ability to produce viable, healthy offspring.” The new report looked at 97 men aged 22 to 80 and found increased fragmentation of the DNA in sperm as men age.“This study shows that men who wait until they’re older to have children are not only risking difficulties conceiving, they could also be increasing the risk of having children with genetic problems,” said Wyrobek. Unlike older women, the changes in sperm did not increase the chance of producing a child with Down Syndrome, they found. But some older fathers did have an increased risk of having children with dwarfism and “a small fraction of men are at increased risks for transmitting multiple genetic and chromosomal defects.” The study was primarily funded by several grants from the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences, part of the National Institutes of Health, and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency.
vonerik012 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Top sperm parameters were observed at age >=30 to <35 years, while the most significant reduction in sperm parameters occurred after the age of 55 years. This is the overall conclusion of the article.
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 I wonder if actual people have these stats running through their heads while they are on a date enjoying a nice glass of wine and conversation? LOL doubt it
vonerik012 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Stats no, Common sense yes. If you are a 40 yr old guy who wants a family, you need a younger woman.
shadowplay Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 I never thought my attitude was negative. I actually think of it as positive and realistic. D is attractive(I like her at least), but she is 38, not 33 or 28. Her biological clock is ticking(I am sure women are more aware of this than I am). 38 is not an old age, but it is no longer a young age. That doesn't mean she doesn't have options;she has many. Furthermore, I understand why D(and many women) would want the younger guys. Heck, it is well known I want the young chicks. My response to her was with the idea of "settling down" in mind. Don't tell me I'm being negative, because I will readily accept 38 is not the best age for a guy to settle down either. But guys are not the issue here, D is. Anyway, 38 is a better age than 43; and 43 is better than 48. Can you imagine a 43 year old single woman who wants to start a family? How much more pressure will be on her than D? Won't she have to "settle" for even less than she wanted? You can't compare D to other women who date younger guys(Lizzie springs to mind). Lizzie has had her children(I think); she has fulfilled her desire to be a mother. The pressure is off. Concerning the issue of men, I am not sure about the States, but where I presently live there is no shortage of early to mid 40's men who have not married and want to start a family. Are they attractive? Most women find these men attractive(I don't think men peak until their early to mid 30's), and there are usually no problems when they seek to settle down with women in their 30's. However, if D likes em young,well.... she likes em young. Again, I don't know the situation in the states, but here it is difficult for late 30's women to find mid to late 20's guys for marriage. You mustn't forget the huge influx of Eastern European women who are mostly 18-25 and marry with very few conditions in mind. In conclusion, I am trying to give what I perceive as realistic advice, not start age arguments; so let's not start another 40 page thread on it. Cheers, Where do you live? I live in the states and mail order brides are nonexistant around here. There must be a lot of desperate guys where you live. I also don't think D would have a problem finding a late twenties early thirties guy to marry her given that she's beautiful. Her only problem may be finding guys who interest her. Also, she seems to choose men who she knows aren't marriage material to protect her heart. I also disagree with you that men peak in their mid thirties. I'd say they peak in their twenties, but that's kind of moot because if somebody is beautiful they are beautiful regardless of when they happened to look their best. Let's say D is in the top 2% of attractive people (she's a former lingerie model after all). The average younger guy who D dates will be hard-pressed to find a woman who is both younger and as attractive as D unless he limits his dating pool to models. Then within that kiddie pool of gorgeous young women he will have trouble finding a woman who has the same substance as D. It's true there are some men who will always prefer younger women (like you), but there are also a large percentage who don't mind a slightly older woman if she is just as attractive as her younger counterparts. In fact some find slightly older woman refreshing for their drama-free maturity.
Trialbyfire Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Top sperm parameters were observed at age >=30 to <35 years, while the most significant reduction in sperm parameters occurred after the age of 55 years. This is the overall conclusion of the article. As usual von, you're a selective reader. Keep reading.
loveinlife Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Hi D, listen to your heart. Im very proud of you to not settle for less. You have lots of knowledge of who you might want to date. You deserve the best for yourself. Keep up the good work! Hope the man of your dreams shows up soon. -Love
rod_in_gtown Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Where do you live? I live in the states and mail order brides are nonexistant around here. There must be a lot of desperate guys where you live. I live in the states as well and I have looked into eastern european brides. I just don't tell people let alone girls mostly because of the very reaction you're displaying (lots of desperate men?). I'm not bad looking or socially inept, or even financially challenged. I have seen that many of the women that I meet in a large city such as Washington DC, lack MAJOR family values and tend to look at things like divorce as an actual option when going into a marriage (they seem to over trivialize it). Say what you will about foreign women (gold-diggers, green-card chasers or whatever) I have met several men who have married women from over seas and are blisfully happy, from young marriages to lifetime marriages. Why? mostly because the oportunities here are better and most people are just looking to be happy. Now, I'm not saying that there are no problems with the phenomenom of "mail order brides" (there aren't any catalogs anymore, all internet based), there are many cases of abuse and some times what's called as "sex slave trading" but that's another whole different issue that's beyond the scope of this thread.
vonerik012 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 I had a conversation with an employee of mine today is who is 25.. Out of nowhere he said "There are lots of hot looking older woman around here" This reminded me of these threads and i said "Would you date one?" His reaction was "OMG no way" His girlfriend is 21. Shadow, so you feel men peak in their 20's. So when do women peak? 40? You are asking a young guy to.. 1. Limit the amount of children he can have to 1 or none. 2. Be with someone older, that will hit menopause in a few years, when he can be with a woman that much younger. Example? Well if she is 38, and he is 29, he can be with a 22 yr old. That is a 16 yr difference. Men think of this. Or he can just wait until he wants to settle down AT HIS LEISURE, and then marry a younger woman of 28-33. 3. So, Lets say a 38 yr old woman is single. She then has to meet the man, and have kids IMMEDIATELY. Not all men want to do this. Especially not a YOUNGER MAN. Men might want to date a woman for a year or 2 to get to know her, before tying the not. ESPECIALLY a younger man. At this point it is too late for that younger man to have kids, in most cases.
Lizzie60 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 D-Lish... you are old enough to know what's good for you.. nevermind what your friends think.. they're not living YOUR life.. I don't care how much of an Adonis a guy is.. if he's dumb.. IMO he loses all his physical attraction... ewww... who wants an idiotic hottie.. anyway.. listen to your own 'little voice' you don't find anyone good enough for you.. your internal clock is ticking.. then get pregnant .. have a child.. you're old enough to be independant with a child... (of course, you need to be financial secure, and have a good support system around you) .. but if you have all that.. who needs a man to have a child? We (women) are the lucky ones.. we can have a child all for ourselves and we do not need a man for that.. men can't do that.. oh well... we got to have something..
rod_in_gtown Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 We (women) are the lucky ones.. we can have a child all for ourselves and we do not need a man for that.. men can't do that.. oh well... we got to have something.. What? and ruin my figure? You can keep the pregnancy!
Lizzie60 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 What? and ruin my figure? You can keep the pregnancy! ...... well I had two kids.. and they didn't ruin anything
vonerik012 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Yeah great advice.. Purposely bring a child into the world that will never have a father, because you are selfish and want one. If she can't find a man up to her standards now, how will she being a single mom? And Rod good post.
Lizzie60 Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Yeah great advice.. Purposely bring a child into the world that will never have a father, because you are selfish and want one. If she can't find a man up to her standards now, how will she being a single mom? And Rod good post. the bank.. honey.. the bank..
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