Trialbyfire Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 How can you consider becoming a single mother deliberately, as being selfish, when you know you can provide a better home and more love, than many, many dysfunctional, abusive, neglectful two parent families? Is it selfish to divorce, thus creating a single parent family unit, when your spouse is physically or verbally abusive? Should you just take it across the head, regularly, for the benefit of the children? What happens when your spouse becomes a heavy drug addict? Should you hold the family intact, watching him shoot up everything you've worked for, including the food from your childrens' mouths, so you aren't being selfish?
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 How can you consider becoming a single mother deliberately, as being selfish, when you know you can provide a better home and more love, than many, many dysfunctional, abusive, neglectful two parent families? Why not adopt then? I think two-parent neglectful families are just as bad as a person who deliberately chooses to bring a child into the world having only one parent. They're no better. Is it selfish to divorce, thus creating a single parent family unit, when your spouse is physically or verbally abusive? Should you just take it across the head, regularly, for the benefit of the children? Of course not. Another bad choice made by a woman...marrying an abuser. Thank god I had no children with my first H. I don't get women who bring children into such an environment either. That's also just as bad. What happens when your spouse becomes a heavy drug addict? Should you hold the family intact, watching him shoot up everything you've worked for, including the food from your childrens' mouths, so you aren't being selfish? Of course not. You leave. At least the child has a father..as imperfect as he may be. At least there's still hope of a relationship as long as a father actually exists and is named and recognized. The other way, there's NO chance of such a relationship.
ProudMumOf2 Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 It's pretty easy to say that you were "prepared" to give up your dream when you didn't have to. Busybodies that think they know best, you gotta love them
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 It's pretty easy to say that you were "prepared" to give up your dream when you didn't have to. Busybodies that think they know best, you gotta love them Oh no. I was giving up the dream. That's why I was so very depressed at the time. No WAY in hell was I going to have a child on my own with no father. No way. Never would have happened. Busybodies? Uhm..no. I'm giving my opinion just like every one else on this PUBLIC forum. (Keep it up!)
Author MarieD Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 Hello ProudMumof 2! Thanks so much for your post! It made me smile Your picture on your profile even made me smile even more!! You are right, some choose to give up on the dream of becoming a mom! NOT ME!! I am thankful that women still have a choice to have them even if they haven't found mr. right. I can't live with myself if i ever gave up on my dream of becoming a mom!!! Touche - hopefully i will find Mr. Right before I have the babies, but I may not be so lucky as some. I always have a lifetime to find him though, but not a lifetime to have my babies!!
ProudMumOf2 Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Touche - an opinon isn't correct or worth giving just because someone holds it. It may be a public forum for opinions but that doesn't mean you have to offend single mothers all over the world just because you think it's better to have a 2 parent unit. I think we can all agree that's better, but to label women "selfish" for having children is just uncalled for.
Trialbyfire Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Of course not. You leave. At least the child has a father..as imperfect as he may be. At least there's still hope of a relationship as long as a father actually exists and is named and recognized. The other way, there's NO chance of such a relationship. Touche, you can never predict how a marriage will turn out, regardless if anyone believes the man is the right. Check out all the pedophiles, physical abusers, etc, etc. At least when you go it alone, you know who you are. I can guarantee you something. If for some strange reason I end up with someone who's abusive or dysfunctional, I'll be suing for sole custody and a restraining order, to ensure for no contact. No child of mine will needlessly be exposed to a life like that, if I have to leave the country.
Author MarieD Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 Trial u r right. I know many women who married & their husbands became alcoholics or drug users as time went on, but they didn't use when they got married. So they left, is that being selfish?? I have a friend in work who just had a baby & her husband took her last $100 for the baby's food & went to the bar & drank it away!! My child WILL have an option to meet his/her father at the age of 18. I will choose a donor with OPEN identity. And I don't think i'm being selfish. All women are made to have kids, I just unfortunately haven't found the one yet. Its human nature for women to have kids!!
Author MarieD Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 I also have a friend who got pregnant by her boyfriend, after dating just 2 months, they got married, & 4 months later got divorced. He started physically abusing her & he even signed away his rights to the baby. So her baby had a dad, & is now never allowed to see the baby. She got restraining orders against him & everything. That baby had a DAD too, but what good is he????
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Touche, you can never predict how a marriage will turn out, regardless if anyone believes the man is the right. Check out all the pedophiles, physical abusers, etc, etc. Come on. Not being able to predict how a marriage will turn out is one thing. Marrying a pedophile, physical abuser, etc. and having kids with him is another. At least when you go it alone, you know who you are. [/b]And the kids knows who he/she is too. [/b] I can guarantee you something. If for some strange reason I end up with someone who's abusive or dysfunctional, I'll be suing for sole custody and a restraining order, to ensure for no contact. No child of mine will needlessly be exposed to a life like that, if I have to leave the country. I agree with that. But come on! Like you'd ever marry someone like that. See my point? It's a matter of good vs. bad choices. You'd never marry a person like that to begin with. As for our "new" poster here. If people are offended, so be it. That's not my fault. People can choose to react to what I say however they want to. I don't get the impression that the OP is "offended." Sorry. If you are that's not my problem. I could choose to be offended on LS all the time if I was that sensitive. I mean hell, around here (LS) women my age are "old hags". I've been labeled everything under the sun. So what? People are entitled to their opinion. I mean you already called me "evil" and a "busybody." Am I offended? Not in the least. (P.S. name-calling will get you banned. )
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 I also have a friend who got pregnant by her boyfriend, after dating just 2 months, they got married, & 4 months later got divorced. He started physically abusing her & he even signed away his rights to the baby. So her baby had a dad, & is now never allowed to see the baby. She got restraining orders against him & everything. That baby had a DAD too, but what good is he???? That's not a "DAD." That's a sperm donor. Two entirely different things. Again, this is a matter of bad choices.
Trialbyfire Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 I agree with that. But come on! Like you'd ever marry someone like that. See my point? It's a matter of good vs. bad choices. You'd never marry a person like that to begin with. But Touche, look at my ex-H. He turned into a cheater. While there were red flags for his NPD, there's no "C" brand on his forehead for anyone to know for certain whether he would or wouldn't cheat. Everyone turns blind eyes to the person they love, especially if positive qualities outweigh the negative qualities. Does this mean that any woman who remains in a marriage where she loves her spouse completely, but he isn't the best father, is unselfish for holding the two parent family unit together? I would beg to differ from this conclusion.
Ariadne Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 My whole point is I think it's wrong and selfish to have a child that has no father...to do that deliberately. Look, I wouldn't say women who do it are the worst people or anything. But I would have never done it because I know what it's like not having a dad around and I couldn't deliberately do that to a child. Some women can. Some women can justify it. Great. To each his own, right? Ok, I have a question for you now. Imagine you have your son exactly like he is now, with his same face, the same kid, but you didn't have your husband. And you right now, just as you are, without your son. Would you go back in time and make it not happen and not have your son? (Now that you know what it is to have him and to love him, before, you didn't know). Btw, I believe women are not realized before they become mothers. It is just a primitive instinct that all women become mothers, imo. Men come and go, but nothing compares to the bond between a mother and a child.
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 But Touche, look at my ex-H. He turned into a cheater. While there were red flags for his NPD, there's no "C" brand on his forehead for anyone to know for certain whether he would or wouldn't cheat. Everyone turns blind eyes to the person they love, especially if positive qualities outweigh the negative qualities. Does this mean that any woman who remains in a marriage where she loves her spouse completely, but he isn't the best father, is unselfish for holding the two parent family unit together? I would beg to differ from this conclusion. Well he might have been a cheater, but that doesn't mean he couldn't have been a good dad. Mr. T was/is an exceptional father to his son...had joint custody of their son since my stepson was 5. The point being that not every failed marriage results in children not having two good parents to raise them. We're mixing apples and oranges here.
lovestruck818 Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Trial u r right. I know many women who married & their husbands became alcoholics or drug users as time went on, but they didn't use when they got married. So they left, is that being selfish?? I have a friend in work who just had a baby & her husband took her last $100 for the baby's food & went to the bar & drank it away!! My child WILL have an option to meet his/her father at the age of 18. I will choose a donor with OPEN identity. And I don't think i'm being selfish. All women are made to have kids, I just unfortunately haven't found the one yet. Its human nature for women to have kids!! I believe there are many women who want kids but there are also some who don't. I want kids, but by the same token, I would not want "any old sperm" just for the sake of having a kid. A kid is a big deal. I have no doubt you will love & take care of this child, but a kid is part of both you and the father- and would you want really want a kid who is part of someone you don't even know?
Trialbyfire Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Well he might have been a cheater, but that doesn't mean he couldn't have been a good dad. Mr. T was/is an exceptional father to his son...had joint custody of their son since my stepson was 5. The point being that not every failed marriage results in children not having two good parents to raise them. We're mixing apples and oranges here. As a matter of fact, my ex would have made an excellent father. He loved children and got along with them very well. My nephews adored him with the reverse holding true. We were going to have a family soon. Imagine having a family with a man like this, holding the family unit together, while he went off and did his thing. I would have left him in a heartbeat, children or not. The more I think of this type of situation, the more attractive a single mother situation sounds to me.
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Ok, I have a question for you now. Imagine you have your son exactly like he is now, with his same face, the same kid, but you didn't have your husband. And you right now, just as you are, without your son. Would you go back in time and make it not happen and not have your son? (Now that you know what it is to have him and to love him, before, you didn't know). Btw, I believe women are not realized before they become mothers. It is just a primitive instinct that all women become mothers, imo. Men come and go, but nothing compares to the bond between a mother and a child. Wow, Ariadne. This is a no-brainer for me. Nope. I would not have him. I would not go back in time and have him without a father. Our son is who he IS because he has a mom and a dad to help raise him. We've both put our "stamp" on him. He wouldn't be the same child if it were just me raising him alone. No way. I see your point but I just see this differently. I often wonder how differently my life would have turned out if I didn't have just a mother raising me. One who got stressed out trying to be BOTH parents and the sole provider all at the same time. I know I'd be a different person had my dad not died. I know it. So no. I wouldn't go back and change anything. I'd be sad that I wouldn't be a parent..or maybe I would have adopted. But no.
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 As a matter of fact, my ex would have made an excellent father. He loved children and got along with them very well. My nephews adored him with the reverse holding true. We were going to have a family soon. Imagine having a family with a man like this, holding the family unit together, while he went off and did his thing. I would have left him in a heartbeat, children or not. The more I think of this type of situation, the more attractive a single mother situation sounds to me. Well, it doesn't have to be either a choice of having a child with a cheater or being a single mother. There ARE other options.
lovestruck818 Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 And Marie- I have another question for you...suppose you go ahead and have this baby from the sperm bank...then either while you are pregnant or after you have the baby, "Mr. Right" finally comes a long. How are you going to feel if he decides he doesn't want to have anything to do with your child? I mean after all, it's NOT his kid, so technically he doesn't have to care about it. Or...maybe someone would not want to date you b/c you are carrying/carried someone else's kid- some men are weird about those things. I don't know that I would want to date a man who had a kid from a previous marriage or whatever.
Trialbyfire Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Well, it doesn't have to be either a choice of having a child with a cheater or being a single mother. There ARE other options. I understand that but my previous marriage has given me the realistic view that there are no guarantees in life, regardless of how perfect a marriage anyone has. I would never in a million years have predicted the outcome. We had the perfect marriage, as far as I and all other third parties were concerned. According to my ex, he believed we had a perfect marriage. Huh...no kidding...for him... In becoming a single mother, I know who I am, exactly how I want to raise my child/children and have no financial worries, to a reasonable level. I have a great family and friends support system. While it would be nice to have someone to share it with, most definitely a marriage is not the be all or end all of my existence.
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 I understand that TBF. Marriage wasn't the be all end all for me either. Well, it was in the sense of having a family. In that sense yes. Because that was the only way I was going to bring a child into this world. It was that or nothing. Anyway, it's a personal choice. Just like abortion is a personal choice. Some people think that having an abortion is "murder." Others don't believe that. So I'll leave it there. Interesting discussion though.
Trialbyfire Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 I agree that it was an interesting discussion. Always a pleasure when people don't get their panties in a twist over differing opinions.
Touche Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 I agree that it was an interesting discussion. Always a pleasure when people don't get their panties in a twist over differing opinions. Well most of us didn't, anyway. Good luck, OP!
Author MarieD Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 And Marie- I have another question for you...suppose you go ahead and have this baby from the sperm bank...then either while you are pregnant or after you have the baby, "Mr. Right" finally comes a long. How are you going to feel if he decides he doesn't want to have anything to do with your child? I mean after all, it's NOT his kid, so technically he doesn't have to care about it. Or...maybe someone would not want to date you b/c you are carrying/carried someone else's kid- some men are weird about those things. I don't know that I would want to date a man who had a kid from a previous marriage or whatever. ok this answer is simple!! If I met a man that didn't accept my baby, than he IS NOT the one for me! My Mr. Right, will accept me AND my baby, no matter how I he/she was conceived.
Author MarieD Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 I understand that but my previous marriage has given me the realistic view that there are no guarantees in life, regardless of how perfect a marriage anyone has. I would never in a million years have predicted the outcome. We had the perfect marriage, as far as I and all other third parties were concerned. According to my ex, he believed we had a perfect marriage. Huh...no kidding...for him... In becoming a single mother, I know who I am, exactly how I want to raise my child/children and have no financial worries, to a reasonable level. I have a great family and friends support system. While it would be nice to have someone to share it with, most definitely a marriage is not the be all or end all of my existence. I have to agree with you here!! We know exactly who we are, no one telling us how to raise our kids, no financial worries, family & friends who support & will love the little bundle of joys to no end!!! Touche - sorry but i can accept never getting married, but can't accept never having kids. Marriage is not MY determining factor of reaching my dream as a mom!! Everyone has their own opinion right?? I went to school with some girls that got 2, 3 or 4 abortions. Some do consider that murder, is right. Its their lives though, they have to live with it every day. This is my life & bringing up a child in a 1 parent home is my choice rather than have no kids at all!! NO WAY, NO HOW can i accept that!
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