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Posted
I think you're right, but although a couple of posters did refer to him as her "H" or "husband," those references were pretty much incidental to the content of their posts.

 

After being with him for 4 years, and planning to "celebrate our anniversary together" (her words), they are effectively functioning as a kind of a family, so it seems like most of the comments are appropriately in that context.

 

Unless they married after August 2, he is her BF. She's 31.

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Posted

Hey...

 

I know many of you think I bailed out on this because I wasn't getting what I wanted. Not the truth. Beleive it or not, i can't be around my cokmputer 24/7 if you know what i mean. ;)

 

I agree, my attitude was bad yesterday when I posted this. I was not in a good space at all, and basically had a rough day. I apologize to you all for my behavior, specifically ubarred.

 

Anyway, we are not married. He is about 25 years older than me. It's also very difficult to explain the dynamics he and I (and his son) share via posts on LS. A lot of the time, things are misconstrued.

 

there is no way to have sex in the lakehouse. It is teeny tiny, and basically has no walls other than the exterior of the house. There is very little privacy.

 

Ever since we came out, by that i mean to the public about our realationship, I have had shame and anxiety over how "to be" around people. We have a LDR as well, so the time we spend together is somewhat limited. this all started in a tiny small town, and when i thought it was never going to end (the affair), I took it upon myself to move to a big city, get a job and move on. Turns out that separation nearly broke his heart and that is when "we came out". However, I continue to live in this city, which is about 5 hours away from where he lives. There was just so much more opportunity for me down here, plus...it is hard for me to show off our relationship in a town that is soooo small and very judgemental.

 

Anyway, I still dont know what to do. I know you all think i should suck it up. Maybe I should. I'm scared. Its not easy being the "homewrecker" and I understand that this is the karmic retribution I deserve. I dont know how to be me when I'm not so pround of who me is, you know. ESPECIALLY around the son who thinks family is the most improtant thing in the world.

 

sometimes I wish i could just address it straight on, like say Hey John, I know this must be awkward, and I am truly sorry about the pain i may have caused but we are really happy together. Your dad feels lucky to have me, and vice versa.

 

One other point to add is that his relationship with his ex is wonderful. No hard feelings!!! At first it was rough, but she understands that she too, was unhappy and that life is meant to be lived. they remain great friends, and partners in their business and parents to their kids. By the way, his son is 23 and i am 31.

 

I mentioned in the original post that i understand i have major insecurities about this. i just feel bad throwing in his sons face, how happy we are. Its liek, sorry to have wrecked your family, but look at us!!!

 

Its an odd place for me to be in and one I dont quite know how to handle.

Posted

You don't owe me any apologies at all. I went back and read my first post and it did sound harsh. I meant for it to sound more "matter of fact" like, and to tell you what you MUST do if you don't want a huge blowup.

 

BTW... you WERE a "homewrecker", but now you have to get past that title and become a home builder... if that makes any sense.

 

Good luck.

Posted
sometimes I wish i could just address it straight on, like say Hey John, I know this must be awkward, and I am truly sorry about the pain i may have caused but we are really happy together. Your dad feels lucky to have me, and vice versa.

 

So, do it. Address it. Talk to his son and tell him exactly what you said here. I think you need to be the one to reach out to him, even if he rejects you, atleast you tried - And for that, your partner WILL appreciate that effort!

Posted

GEL said everything I was going to say. Go, make the best of it and you never know, you may even have a good time.:D

Posted
Anyway, we are not married. He is about 25 years older than me.

 

there is no way to have sex in the lakehouse. It is teeny tiny, and basically has no walls other than the exterior of the house. There is very little privacy.

 

Ever since we came out, by that i mean to the public about our realationship, I have had shame and anxiety over how "to be" around people. We have a LDR as well, so the time we spend together is somewhat limited.

 

However, I continue to live in this city, which is about 5 hours away from where he lives. There was just so much more opportunity for me down here, plus...it is hard for me to show off our relationship in a town that is soooo small and very judgemental.

 

Anyway, I still dont know what to do. I know you all think i should suck it up. Maybe I should. I'm scared. Its not easy being the "homewrecker" and I understand that this is the karmic retribution I deserve.

 

sometimes I wish i could just address it straight on, like say Hey John, I know this must be awkward, and I am truly sorry about the pain i may have caused but we are really happy together. Your dad feels lucky to have me, and vice versa.

 

I mentioned in the original post that i understand i have major insecurities about this. i just feel bad throwing in his sons face, how happy we are. Its liek, sorry to have wrecked your family, but look at us!!!

 

Ok, I thought you were talking about a wedding anniversary. And it's not, so while it's still important to you, you can always celebrate it on another weekend, just the two of you.

 

Maybe no sex in the lakehouse, but hello, what about the woods? ;)

 

People play off your emotions, so if you act ashamed, then they'll act accordingly. You have to get over it as much as they do. The more you two are at ease, the more that people will accept you as a couple. Just be yourself. That's the only way to get through it. If you show your personality, then people will see the person he fell in love with.

 

Now get the Karmic revenge out of your head. It's just YOU punishing yourself. Alot of what you said in your post is going to sabotage your R. You are ashamed of it, you ran away from your hometown because of it and now you're in a LDR. You have limited time so no one is going to get to know you. Is he thinking of moving toward you?

 

Another part i don't get is that you talk of "showing off your R." It's not "showing off." That is the reality, is it not? Are you planning on tiptoeing around life so you don't "show off?" Again, If you treat yourself like less than, others around you will too. I know from experience. It is awkward in the beginning, but it doesn't take long for it to become natural. People will wonder why he chose you if you act like you're so uncomfortable around him. Just be yourself and act natural. It's ok when you're in love to hold hands etc.

 

Have you talked to your man about this? It seems like he could take the lead here and talk to his son about it. Maybe his son wants to spend the weekend getting to know you. He knows you're in his father's life and his father loves you enough that he chose you. He might be curious.

 

Finally, you two are together. That means that you and he must make the effort on both sides to get to know family etc. The age difference between you and his son is a big deal to YOU. Alot of what you say I think shows anxiety. This is the path you've chosen so you need to toughen up if you want to stay in this man's life. R's are about compromise. And when someone has kids, they are in their lives forever. One day when you have kids, you'll realize the committment and bond between parent and child.

 

Good luck!

 

GEL

Posted

KB is in kind of a double pickle here.

 

Not only is she "the homewrecker" in the son's eyes, but she's also not old enough to be his 'step-mom'...or any other kind of authority figure in his life. She'd be an older sister at best. There's no basis for respect for her in this situation.

 

If he's harboring bad feelings for her based on the whole situation, I'd be surprised if he'd have any interest at all in trying to sit down with her and work out a comfortable solution with her.

 

I apologize...other than talking with his father, I have no idea what you can do to reconcile this.

Posted

The son isn't ever going to look at her at the step-mom, not at the age he's at now. If anything, it'll be friend status in the future. If he was a young teen then yeah, possibly the roles of stepson/stepmom would take place, but as it is, he's too old for that and besides, he has his mom in his life.

Posted

Agreed, WWIU. But my point was given the ages, he'll also never look at her as any kind of authority figure or person of respect in his life either. Which he probably WOULD do had his father been with someone closer to his father's age.

Posted
KB is in kind of a double pickle here.

 

Not only is she "the homewrecker" in the son's eyes, but she's also not old enough to be his 'step-mom'...or any other kind of authority figure in his life. She'd be an older sister at best. There's no basis for respect for her in this situation.

 

If he's harboring bad feelings for her based on the whole situation, I'd be surprised if he'd have any interest at all in trying to sit down with her and work out a comfortable solution with her.

 

I apologize...other than talking with his father, I have no idea what you can do to reconcile this.

 

Owl, I disagree with you here.

 

The XW harbors no ill will according to the OP. Usually children are affected adversely when one parent acts as if their life is over and this seems not to be the case.

 

Secondly, this is his adult son. And her being his dad's partner commands a certain amount of respect. His father should demand that his partner be treated with respect. Everyone here is an adult. Do we not respect people simply because they are not decades older than us?

 

We also don't know the son's precise feelings because he is not posting and the OP is projecting what she feels are his feelings. She has not provided specific examples of what he has said or done to make her feel that he dislikes her, other than what she thinks he feels.

 

I think much of it is just the OP feeling uncomfortable as the R has changed and is on completely new territory. From her posts she feels she is the homewrecker (something I have never felt) and that people are judging her, her BF's son is a brat etc. Everything about her posts put her in a negative, almost too cliche, light.

 

The OP needs to just be herself. We cannot force anyone to like or accept us. But who needs the world? Do we not need the people who love us no matter what? They are the ones who matter; They are the ones who will stand by us when times are rough. Who cares what the gossips and miserable people in the world think. Do they pay your bills?

 

I say live and let live.

 

GEL

Posted

GEL, I get your point.

 

I know that the OP feels that she's the homewrecker. She may be 'projecting' that his son feels the same way. Or he may truly feel that same way...there's no way for us to know which it is for sure.

 

I agree that he should treat her with respect. But, he very well may not FEEL that respect for her, given the ages and the situation. Since they ARE all adults, his son may well have drawn his own conclusions about the situation and the roles in it that are seperate from the XW's...you see what I mean?

 

She needs to talk with his dad and ask him to get the son to treat her with respect.

 

She shouldn't expect him to FEEL that respect for her, however. Given the ages, she'll have to EARN it, rather than be given it as a 'due'. And given the circumstances, if HE feels like she's a homewrecker, then she may never be able to earn it from him. He won't give her the chance.

Posted

A couple of these last discussions make me think it's quite possible that the son is more confused than you may realize on the inside. Perhaps this partly explains his utter neutrality toward you, at the same time as his ability to remain civil and neutral is pretty impressive, you have to admit.

 

First, you guys are not married, so your status in the son's eyes is that of "Dad's girlfriend." You and BF certainly have your own understanding of your relationship, and I'm not casting doubt on that, I'm only pointing out what the son's perceptions are likely to be, and that's that you are "just" dad's girlfriend. Based on the fact that his parents' relationship broke up, he may not see any advantage at all in investing his heart even a little into a relationship with you, as he may be confused about what the long-term situation is likely to be, and why would he want to risk getting hurt again. Better to just stay out of it. Thus, neutrality.

 

Secondly, the age difference does come into play. Believe me, at 23, he looks at other women from his age all the way up to your age, sometimes with romantic and/or sexual interest. He's a 23 year old male. Not to say that he can't behave respectfully toward you (which it sounds like he is, generally?), and I'm not saying he's looking at you that way (although you can't help but wonder; I was 23 myself once...), but you have to imagine that this adds another confusing element to the situation.

 

So, given the separation of his parents, apparently catalyzed by you, your presence in his dad's life (long distance? long term? what can he really trust or understand about that?), and the further blurring of the lines that might otherwise help define a "parental" role (the age difference and your not being married...) I wouldn't be surprised at all if a young man like that dealt with it by not dealing with it. He's just getting by, trying to have a family life after the split, and maintain a relationship with his dad, in spite of you. It could well be that he might be capable of establishing some kind of familial relationship with you, but these confusing elements make it impossible for him to navigate... Hey it's hard to blame him - you are having just as much trouble navigating these waters from the other side of the ocean, aren't you?

 

All I can say is that empathy (which is not to say pity...) can go a long way to understanding someone else, and that can help to open up whatever kind of common ground the two of you may eventually reach.

 

PS - just to reiterate, all these things I'm saying are not knocks from me on you or your relationship, but an attempt to help you see the son's perspective, and how confusing it may be for him.

Posted
Secondly, this is his adult son. And her being his dad's partner commands a certain amount of respect. His father should demand that his partner be treated with respect.....

I'm not seeing where she said that he disrespects her....

 

She has not provided specific examples of what he has said or done to make her feel that he dislikes her, other than what she thinks he feels.

Actually, her one specific example was "I was the woman (the much younger woman) who his dad left his mom for. I know if I were him, I would not like the other woman," which seems a safe starting point. She is empathizing here, probably accurately.

 

What she does say specifically about his behavior towards her is:

However, we seem to be civil and manange just fine when we do have to spend time together....

 

Its not that his son does anything mean to me, or treats me differently, but usually his son rambles on and on and on...

 

The worst that she had to say about his specific behavior towards her was that he "never tries to engage me," and the worst general impression she related was:

I also think his son is a spoiled brat, and I have no respect for him since, at 23, he has never worked a day in his life (this is another story, but I had to throw it in here)

...which is not related to any behavior toward her, but completely based on her perception of his life and perhaps his upbringing ("spoiled," by whom?)

 

It still sounds to me like the son is a behaviorally neutral irritant in all of this. He pretty much leaves her alone, and "doesn't engage her," but his presence does irritate her - he's a spoiled brat because he doesn't work (doesn't affect her,) he blabs on and on about things she doesn't relate to (doesn't interest her.) Perhaps worst, he diverts attention away from her relationship with her BF to the point where she threw down the gauntlet and made the BF choose: as far as this weekend goes, it's him or me...

 

In summary, I still think she is harboring resentments toward her BF (how he raised his son to be "spoiled," how he allows his son to interfere with their time together, and by implication, how he prioritizes his relationship with his son relative to hers) which she is understandably mis-directing toward the son. Additionally, it make everything harder, because all of these perceived problems with the son just exacerbate all of her insecurities - if he weren't there, they could circle the wagons and move on, but he's a constant reminder of the genesis of their relationship, and the turbulence that swirled around it.

 

In order for the son's presence to become "normalized", she'll have to get over her own guilt and insecurity about the relationship to find a place of confidence, and also work out her resentments with her BF.

Posted
I'm not seeing where she said that he disrespects her....

 

I was responding to Owl's assertion that he won't respect her, not what the OP actually said.

 

Actually, her one specific example was "I was the woman (the much younger woman) who his dad left his mom for. I know if I were him, I would not like the other woman," which seems a safe starting point. She is empathizing here, probably accurately.

 

Actually, who knows? No one knows how his parents interacted with each other. If there was alot of strife in the household, he may feel the split was perhaps a good idea for both his parents. We don't know the whole story.

 

What she does say specifically about his behavior towards her is:

The worst that she had to say about his specific behavior towards her was that he "never tries to engage me,"

 

I know. Which, he doesn't have to engage her, perhaps she should try engaging him.

 

 

It still sounds to me like the son is a behaviorally neutral irritant in all of this. He pretty much leaves her alone, and "doesn't engage her," but his presence does irritate her - he's a spoiled brat because he doesn't work (doesn't affect her,) he blabs on and on about things she doesn't relate to (doesn't interest her.) Perhaps worst, he diverts attention away from her relationship with her BF to the point where she threw down the gauntlet and made the BF choose: as far as this weekend goes, it's him or me...

 

Being neutral here is not such a bad thing to hope for. It leaves the door open for some type of R. Of course she wouldn't be his stepmom in the true sense of the word, but is that even a role she wants to take?

 

In summary, I still think she is harboring resentments toward her BF (how he raised his son to be "spoiled," how he allows his son to interfere with their time together, and by implication, how he prioritizes his relationship with his son relative to hers) which she is understandably mis-directing toward the son. Additionally, it make everything harder, because all of these perceived problems with the son just exacerbate all of her insecurities - if he weren't there, they could circle the wagons and move on, but he's a constant reminder of the genesis of their relationship, and the turbulence that swirled around it.

 

I think it's more that she doesn't understand what being a parent is and how to be a partner to a parent. If you've never done it, you have no idea what it is all about.

 

In order for the son's presence to become "normalized", she'll have to get over her own guilt and insecurity about the relationship to find a place of confidence, and also work out her resentments with her BF.

 

I agree about letting go of her own guilt and insecurity. And I think that the OP needs to act with maturity and realize the world is about more than what we want all the time. Sometimes we make sacrifices for the ones we love. What is one weekend out of a lifetime? And is this the hill to die on? What does it show the one we love most in the world if we stamp our foot on the floor and demand our way?

 

KWIM?

 

Sorry I don't know how to do multiple quotes so mine is all in bold. :o

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Posted

The son...he is never mean to me. Never has been. Matter of fact, he is usually pretty friendly. We hug when we see each other.

 

However, I do think that when he is around, he would prefer i wasn't, which is why I think he doesn't engage me or talk about things that i can relate to. It does bother me the every time he is around, he makes certain to take all of the attention, leaving me with none. I know it sounds bratty, but its almost like we are fighting for his dad's attention.

 

he spends the entire summer with his mom and dad. as i've mentioned, we have a LDR, so while i see my man every weekend, he is with mom and dad mon-fri, until he goes back to school.

 

I've mentioned to my man that i think his son is spoiled, and he agrees. He told me one of the issues in his relationship with his ex is that she has always usurped parental control. his father thought he should've had a job a long long time ago, but his mother tells him its okay not to until he finished college....that she will fully support him. they have another son who is a hard worker, but has his own troubles. he is 29 and still lives at home with his mom.

 

For me, if i were 23, and see all of my friends working FT jobs, i would be sort of embarrassed to admit that my mommy and daddy still pay for everything. Wouldnt he want that independence? I've been working since I was 16, and worked full time through college. This is all beside the point. i'm just stating that in some ways (although I am not a mother) my BF understands and agrees with me. I'm certain his son has no idea how i feel.

 

Its really hard to explain online. I wish i could get into his sons head and know what his thoughts were about me. It would make it easier to go to the lake knowing these things. When i mentioned that maybe I would drive home before his son got there, my BF said, well, that could be a good idea. then we all get what we want (meaning that his son wouldn't have to spend time with me either). So i dont know if his son likes me or not, but according to my man, it seems he'd rather I not be there.

 

Ugghh, its all so uncomfortable. Reap what you sow though.

Posted
T

 

I've mentioned to my man that i think his son is spoiled, and he agrees. He told me one of the issues in his relationship with his ex is that she has always usurped parental control. his father thought he should've had a job a long long time ago, but his mother tells him its okay not to until he finished college....that she will fully support him. they have another son who is a hard worker, but has his own troubles. he is 29 and still lives at home with his mom.

 

For me, if i were 23, and see all of my friends working FT jobs, i would be sort of embarrassed to admit that my mommy and daddy still pay for everything. Wouldnt he want that independence? I've been working since I was 16, and worked full time through college. This is all beside the point. i'm just stating that in some ways (although I am not a mother) my BF understands and agrees with me. I'm certain his son has no idea how i feel.

 

 

Just because you and your man believe that the son is spoiled because he isn't working while attending school, doesn't mean that he should be embarrassed by it. I never worked at a paying while I was away at college. I worked my butt off studying so that I could have the best chance at a successful career when I graduated. I have a much better career now because my parents allowed me to focus on school instead of work.

 

Your views about what his son should be obviously differ from his mother's. Sounds like she is respectful of you and your decisions, you can at least respect her and her son for who they are and not who you want them to be.

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Posted
Just because you and your man believe that the son is spoiled because he isn't working while attending school, doesn't mean that he should be embarrassed by it. I never worked at a paying while I was away at college. I worked my butt off studying so that I could have the best chance at a successful career when I graduated. I have a much better career now because my parents allowed me to focus on school instead of work.

 

Your views about what his son should be obviously differ from his mother's. Sounds like she is respectful of you and your decisions, you can at least respect her and her son for who they are and not who you want them to be.

 

Haa haa...

 

the funny thing is...he is going to inherit the business his mom and dad built. So his going to college has no real benefit to his future other than having the piece of paper. He is not about to have a better career. He is spoonfed everything, including his future.

Posted
Haa haa...

 

the funny thing is...he is going to inherit the business his mom and dad built. So his going to college has no real benefit to his future other than having the piece of paper. He is not about to have a better career. He is spoonfed everything, including his future.

 

Well then I think the fact that he is going to college should be admired. IMO an education is so much more than a piece of paper no matter how you look at it.

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Posted
Well then I think the fact that he is going to college should be admired. IMO an education is so much more than a piece of paper no matter how you look at it.

 

 

i agree with you that education is more than a piece of paper, but in this case, that is all it is. I totally admire those who work hard in school. Been there, done that...i know how intense it can be. But when you are just given a lucrative career, without REALLY having to work for it, it kind of defeats the purpose. My thought is, how can he expect to know how to run a business if he has never worked for anyone before? I think it would behoove him to get some experience in the real world workforce.

Posted
i agree with you that education is more than a piece of paper, but in this case, that is all it is. I totally admire those who work hard in school. Been there, done that...i know how intense it can be. But when you are just given a lucrative career, without REALLY having to work for it, it kind of defeats the purpose. My thought is, how can he expect to know how to run a business if he has never worked for anyone before? I think it would behoove him to get some experience in the real world workforce.

 

I considered school to be as hard if not sometimes harder than work. My education gave me the skills to be good at my job. How do you know what he intends to get out of his education? Not every one looks at an education as a means to pay the bills. How about people who go back to school after they retire? Some people just love learning.

 

Sounds like a smart kid. Maybe he has no desire to be like his father. Are you a bit jealous that his son seems to have a better life than you had or have? Is it possible that you feel uncomfortable around the son because he intimidates you?

 

This line from your OP speaks volumes:

 

"I would be totally miserable listening to his son ramble on and on for 24 hours".

 

Maybe the son really doesn't care about the fact that you are with his dad, and just like his mom has moved on with his life. What is the real reason you don't like being around him?

Posted

It sounds to me like you resent the fact that he's not got a job more than anything else.

 

It doesn't sound as though he's got an issue with you. It sounds like you don't like him.

 

I'm not sure what you'd like to see change here, other than him getting a job?

 

And at the end of the day...its not your call as to whether or not he SHOULD have a job. That's between him, and his parents.

 

What does it matter to you one way or another?

Posted
It sounds to me like you resent the fact that he's not got a job more than anything else.

 

It doesn't sound as though he's got an issue with you. It sounds like you don't like him.

 

I'm not sure what you'd like to see change here, other than him getting a job?

 

And at the end of the day...its not your call as to whether or not he SHOULD have a job. That's between him, and his parents.

 

What does it matter to you one way or another?

 

I agree with you Owl.

 

If you consider going to college work, then he does have a job. I don't think it's about what he does or doesn't do. I think it's about what he has and she doesn't have.

 

Maybe it's that he has a good relationship with his parents. Maybe it's that he is smart. Maybe it's that he doesn't have to work because he will inherit the family business. IMO, it's plain and simple jealously that the OP has for the son.

  • Author
Posted

I'm not too concerned about whether or not he has a job...but IMO, its one of the reasons i feel he is a spoiled brat, thats all. I'm in no way any type of authority figure to him, and would never tell him what he should or shouldnt do.

 

I guess i'm uncomfortable around him because I'm uncomfortable with myself. Anytime we are around him, I get all stressed out. Maybe i am intimidated, but there is no way I am jealous. I have a killer work ethic and that would never be the case if I didnt work hard my whole life.

 

These are good points to bring up. i never thought about if I was intimidated around him. In a way i guess i am, because I feel that he has the abiulity to wreck me in the face of his mother or brother, or friends if I step outside of the line in any way. I might say/do something he doesnt agree with, and then feel like he is going to badmouth me to others. I know his feeling towards me DO effect his Dad, my man. And i'm scared that if his son finds some reason to hate me, he could wreck us.

Posted
I'm not too concerned about whether or not he has a job...but IMO, its one of the reasons i feel he is a spoiled brat, thats all. I'm in no way any type of authority figure to him, and would never tell him what he should or shouldnt do.

 

I guess i'm uncomfortable around him because I'm uncomfortable with myself. Anytime we are around him, I get all stressed out. Maybe i am intimidated, but there is no way I am jealous. I have a killer work ethic and that would never be the case if I didnt work hard my whole life.

 

These are good points to bring up. i never thought about if I was intimidated around him. In a way i guess i am, because I feel that he has the abiulity to wreck me in the face of his mother or brother, or friends if I step outside of the line in any way. I might say/do something he doesnt agree with, and then feel like he is going to badmouth me to others. I know his feeling towards me DO effect his Dad, my man. And i'm scared that if his son finds some reason to hate me, he could wreck us.

 

Your attitude about you man's son could wreck you. He was his sons father before he was "your" man.

 

and, anyone who goes to college for no reason, other than because they want to, has pretty darn good work ethics IMO.

Posted

Again...none of this has anything to do with HIM...or with HIS actions.

 

Its all about YOUR fears/insecurities/feelings.

 

You're worried that he'll do something to destroy your relationship with his dad.

 

He's treated you fine, according to what you've posted. YOU have the issue with how he perceives you and what he might do about it.

 

The only thing to be done here is to change how you feel about him...change how you react to him.

 

Make sense?

 

He's not doing ANYTHING to you...so stop worrying about what he might do and simply accept him for who he is as a new part of your life.

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