vonerik012 Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 I think with some women, being together transcends money. They are a bit higher on Maslow's hierarchy of needs. They are seeking a man who they feel is funny, attractive, fun, intelligent, interesting, etc. Some women, no matter what, ALWAYS expect you to pay for everything, and are not even nice about it. They don't appreciate it, they just feel it is your duty. These are the women that call men cheap when they do not get their way. While many women may post "it should be 50-50", or "Men shouldn't always pay", that doesn't mean that this is not a very common mindset amongst many women today. And I can't stress enough that it is not the money that is the problem, it is the expectation that it is just your job, and their own money is for saving.
LovehateLove Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 Yes what you say is true VonErik, me and my girlfriend had a discussion about this before. She believes these women want the best of modern feminism but also want the best bits of a traditional relationship, the courtship, the male chasing them, the male paying for dates, the male proposing, male chivalry etc. There’s no compromise with these women, they are not prepared to at least let one thing slide and therefore most sane men will avoid them at all costs and settle with a woman who isn’t as self righteous and demanding. That’s what I meant when I said these demanding and self righteous women who believe men should treat them like a Goddess are usually single well into their thirties and forties and if they aren’t, they’re more than likely settled with a doormat who will meet their demands and expectations.
vonerik012 Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 Exactly.. I would even be open to paying for EVERYTHING, if there was some sort of balance. Cook for me, do my laundry, clean, etc. I had a relationship like this in the past, and it was great. I paid for everything, and she helped me in ways that I needed . And you are right. Now, some women expect you to pay for everything, yet look at you like a caveman if you suggest they cook once in a while.
LovehateLove Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 Me and my Girlfriend usually split the house hold chores down the middle, or we do them together. If she washes the dishes, I dry the dishes. If I dust, she hoovers. If she puts the clothes in the washing machine, I’ll iron them and she’ll hang them out to dry. The only thing we argue about is how much of the bed I take up, me whinging like a child about not wanting to visit her parents and who is watching what on the television.
Trialbyfire Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 This forum sure likes generalizations doesn’t it? I’m very cautious with my money, for instance I won’t pay more than $150 for a date and even then I expect the woman to at least pay for her half of the date. Now, I don’t mind paying for a woman, but if a woman keeps expecting me to pay for dates, then she’ll find herself in for a shock when I take her to a small diner, somewhere quiet and lethargic. I’m fortunate to be in a relationship with a woman with the same view point as me, when we started dating, we’d split everything down the middle, from the tickets, to the bill to the petrol money and you know, we had such a great time together. We didn’t need to spend $500 on a meal to impress each other; we impressed each other by discussing the things we had in a common, making each other laugh and enjoying our time together. A lot of women expect and demand too much from men and ironically it is these women who remain single well into their thirties and forties. There's cheap/stingy and there's fiscally responsible. It's a fine line between the two. I'm fiscally responsible in that I pay upfront for everything I buy and find sales, regardless of financial condition. IMO, people should always live below their means and have a nest egg for bad times to hit. When it comes to gifts, it's given freely, no strings attached. I can be overly-generous to close friends, family and love interests. This includes paying for going out. On the otherhand, if I'm always the one giving and the other person doesn't return this same treatment, he/she's cut off from any further generosity. While I may be overly-generous to people I care about/love, I'm also not a sucker. If you bothered reading more of this thread and the balance of my posts, you'll see that I never date non-fiscally responsible men. The last thing I need is a debt-ridden dependent. The same holds true for expectation, from anyone who dates me.
vonerik012 Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 YES TBF, but you are a female. Different dynamic. If you simply pay 50-50 with a mate, you are a saint. If you are a man, you are usually dating women that make less money. The present day entitlement attitude is common amongst females. "He makes 2,500 a week. I make 800. So he should be taking me on vacations since he makes more. It would be so easy for him." And if you don't or suggest splitting it, then you are labeled cheap. Even if she supported her ex who made 300 a week. Since you make more, you are expected to spend it how they wish.
Trialbyfire Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 YES TBF, but you are a female. Different dynamic. If you simply pay 50-50 with a mate, you are a saint. If you are a man, you are usually dating women that make less money. The present day entitlement attitude is common amongst females. "He makes 2,500 a week. I make 800. So he should be taking me on vacations since he makes more. It would be so easy for him." And if you don't or suggest splitting it, then you are labeled cheap. Even if she supported her ex who made 300 a week. Since you make more, you are expected to spend it how they wish. No one's forcing anyone to do anything they don't want to or are willing to do. If you fall for a trap of being sucked dry, that's your problem and you have only yourself to blame for it. Choose your partners wisely and stop playing the victim. It gets old fast.
vonerik012 Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 I can't say i feel like a victim, lol. Take them out, pay, sleep with them a few times, then find a new one. It's not that bad considering how easy women are these days. Finding one that is worth keeping is more difficult.
Trialbyfire Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 I can't say i feel like a victim, lol. Take them out, pay, sleep with them a few times, then find a new one. It's not that bad considering how easy women are these days. Finding one that is worth keeping is more difficult. You get what you pay for. If you're happy with it, quit whining and complaining about the type of women you buy. This is your choice in life.
vonerik012 Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 LOL Many men marry these money hungry career women, get divorced, and then whine. I would rather rent them. Pointing out my perceptions is not whining or playing the victim.
Trialbyfire Posted August 8, 2008 Posted August 8, 2008 LOL Many men marry these money hungry career women, get divorced, and then whine. I would rather rent them. Pointing out my perceptions is not whining or playing the victim. Methinks you hate women in general. For certain you do whine about them a lot and play the victim. Just providing you my perception...
openingup Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 I like someone who's fiscally responsible, living below their means but I can't stand cheapness. As another member has expressed, cheapness extends out to many other behaviours beyond cash. I've noticed a consistency in that when people are cheap, they tend also to be selfish in their ability to give emotionally. I tend to give more than receive. Something for me to work on. I need to adopt far more selfish behaviours, for my own well-being. Amen, TBF. Cheap (usually) = selfish. If someone is selfish with his/her money, my experience has also been that they are also selfish with their time, love, etc. "How can I keep more of fill-in-the-blank for ME?" seems to be the overriding factor. Also, IMO cheap people tend to be smug, "See, I'm better than you, I own ___ shares of stock. We're going to Denny's again, but that's because I'm a superior human being." LMAO.
LovehateLove Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 Lets be realistic and put things into perspective here. There is credit crunch in my country, the price of fuel and food has gone through the roof. My gas and electric bills are also going up by 20%. I haven't got enough money to spend on lavish dates with princesses of this world who want a man to succumb to their every whim and desire. Me and my girlfriend can't even afford to fix the leaking roof on my gargabe because we are being hit so hard and it must be worse for singletons who haven't got another incoming coming into their home every month. So, is it stingy and selfish to want to eat good food, have the basic essentials like shelter, gas, electricity and water instead of spending $500 on a single date with a woman who will clearly grate on you and see you appear in court on a homocide charge?
vonerik012 Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 Amen, TBF. Cheap (usually) = selfish. If someone is selfish with his/her money, my experience has also been that they are also selfish with their time, love, etc. "How can I keep more of fill-in-the-blank for ME?" seems to be the overriding factor. LMAO. LOL So now if someone is selfish with THEIR OWN MONEY, they are also selfish with time, love etc. What? Who decides what "being selfish with their own money" is? In the case of the OP, is the man selfish for paying his existing mortgages,instead of treating his new girlfriend to 400 dollar meals? Person A. Has not only wealthy parents, but wealthy parents who subsidize his lifestyle. Bought him a new car, pay his mortgage etc. So, he spends money as if it means nothing. Person B. Has the same things as person A, yet he did it all by himself. He has no safety net, and realizes the value of money. He thinks before he spends, and simply must be more frugal. So, person A is now also a more giving person with his time, more loving etc, than person B? What a joke.
LovehateLove Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 I've also found the best dates to be the ones that do not cost a lot of money. My favourite date will always be bowling at an alley, or a nice quiet walk and picnic. These are not expensive dates, but they are enjoyable dates and enjoyment should overwrite cost each and everytime. If you have chemistry with that person, get on with them and are into them, then shouldn't the most important factor be spending time with that person instead of the expenses of dates? I treat my girlfriend sometime, I paid for her ticket when her and her friends went to Paris to "shop until they dropped" for the weekend. I always take her out to nice restaurants (usually on her birthday, my birthday, christmas, easter and our "anniversary"). I even surprise her sometimes by taking her away for weekend trips or taking her to the theatre as she likes her theatre. I don't do often and she doesn't expect me to. So when I do, of course she is delighted and I get the "you're the greatest boyfriend in the world" sentence. But I do it, because I love her and because it is my way of showing her that I appreciate her in my own little way.
vonerik012 Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 I think that if spending money is a huge issue to have a good time, then perhaps something is missing in the chemistry between the 2 people. I dated one woman, in which every night we drove to a certain truck stop, had cappuccinos, and talked from around 8 until 3 am. We probably spent 4 dollars. I still talk to this girl, and we have reminisced about how wonderful those times were. I dated another girl who I definitely liked, but something was off with the chemistry. We ALWAYS had to be going somewhere new, on a vacation, out at an expensive restaurant, etc just to pass the time. If me and her sat and had coffee it would last about 5 minutes before we ran out of things to say. So we needed the external environment to always be new, exciting, nice, etc.
LovehateLove Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 We are in strong agreement then Erik. I like each and every date when I am pursuing a girl to be different. Not because the chemistry isn't there. I just like doing different activities. I.e...One date; trip to cinema. Another date; bowling. Another date; wining and dining accompanied with some retail therapy. It's nice to have common place, me and girlfriend enjoy going to same sandwich shop where we first met. But we also like doing different things and going to different places. And believe me there is nothing wrong with our chemistry. A night of passion with her and I go into work struggling to walk the next day, my legs feel like wobbly.
vonerik012 Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 I agree..And of course it is a good idea to do different things. But if you are with a woman that is calling you cheap (as the Op is calling her boyfriend), I am thinking they are lacking true chemistry.
Art_Critic Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 Whilst I admire his dedication to financial security for the future, especially on the reasonably average wage he earns (above the average but not spectacular) shouldn't there be a balance of living life and worrying about what happens when you retire and you are 65???? marry him and in 30 years you will thank your lucky stars that he did invest his money the way he has during his 30's.. That $400.00 dinner was shiot out within 12 hours and gone forever while his mortgage payments are creating wealth for his retirement and it will be there longer than 12 hrs. I personally own more than 3 properties myself.. I own 2 residential and 3 commercial properties. Not all have mortgages and the commercial properties are rented.. I wouldn't consider myself a cheap ass because I own real estate I also wouldn't consider your SO a cheap ass for owning real estate.. good for him...
vonerik012 Posted August 9, 2008 Posted August 9, 2008 Ok, lets say you want to go out for 3 $400 meals a year. At a 6% interest rate, after 30 years, you spent $107,000. At a 3% interest rate you spent $62,000. So, about 6 hours out of the year cost you a pretty large amount of money..
Author rosalie Posted August 22, 2008 Author Posted August 22, 2008 I very much doubt that this guy will all of a sudden become more relaxed about spending money as soon as he begins to make a return on his investments. More likely is that he'll just keep re-investing his profits and die in a crappy retirement home with millions in the bank. Old habits die hard. thanks PP for putting my thoughts so simply and beautifully - been nice to have such an objective POV. Love it I've read alot of good, bad and really awful things said about me in this post and strangely I appreciate them all. I've been accused of being a gold-digger and after a free meal and expecting to be treated like a princess - nothing could be further from the truth I am not materialistic (stupid to do so since my buzz i.e. being a dinner is so disposable) and do not criticise him for being "fiscally responsible" but many have spoken of being cheap with money and being cheap with their emotions. It's proven true, it's lovely to own property (and I own my apartment) but I don't do it at the expense of living a life. I've discussed these things with him over the last month and he is still spending and doing what he wants (he's down at the snow every weekend, it's winter in Australia) that costs him $100's every weekend but my wants and needs are irrelevant. I've finally realised the money thing is the easy target (though he is a tight ass) -- it's the emotional cheapness that really bothers me. Why is what he wants more important than mine. Why am I supposed to run after him every weekend and he has only stayed at my house once in a 6 month relationship?? Whoever said that cheapness with money generally means emotional cheapness is so right. Needless to say the relationship is over now emotional and financial cheapness was too much for me. I may not live in a 6 bedroom house with a plasma and BMW out the front when I'm 60 but at least I would have seen the world, had nights out with my friends and family and enjoyed life.
Mahatma Posted August 22, 2008 Posted August 22, 2008 Drop $400 on a great dinner? That surely is a great dinner + great wine. I think a GREAT dinner is closer to half that with some wine included. If you are expecting your SO to drop $400 on dinner, you need a man who doesn't value money very much.
lovestruck818 Posted August 22, 2008 Posted August 22, 2008 marry him and in 30 years you will thank your lucky stars that he did invest his money the way he has during his 30's.. That $400.00 dinner was shiot out within 12 hours and gone forever while his mortgage payments are creating wealth for his retirement and it will be there longer than 12 hrs. I personally own more than 3 properties myself.. I own 2 residential and 3 commercial properties. Not all have mortgages and the commercial properties are rented.. I wouldn't consider myself a cheap ass because I own real estate I also wouldn't consider your SO a cheap ass for owning real estate.. good for him... I agree 100%, Art! I own real estate too- best thing I ever spent money on!
soserious1 Posted August 22, 2008 Posted August 22, 2008 I've paid for everything around here for so many years that I don't think I'd know how to respond if a man bought me so much as a card that I didn't get a bill for. LOL,one of the biggest fights in my marriage centered around gift giving occasions, as I'd tell my soon to be ex not to bother getting me anything for Christmas, my birthday our anniversary etc as all his gift to me meant was that there would be another bill for me to pay.
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