my body is a cage Posted July 28, 2008 Posted July 28, 2008 Lately I've been wondering if active participation on loveshack is actually detrimental to our love lives rather than helpful. I in no way mean this as an attack on loveshack or the people who regularly contribute to it; in theory, loveshack is a great outlet, and its participants are helpful and have good intentions. I love posting on loveshack, and I appreciate all the advice that people have offered me. However, I can't help but wonder if posting threads encourages people to overanalyze things to a damaging extent. Overanalyzing relationships leads to trouble, and usually leads people to act in a way that reveals sensitivity and insecurity. If someone posts a thread and receives many different responses, this will encourage a sensitive person to carefully examine each possible course of action, and in general to overthink everything. Not good for people who already suffer from having obsessive tendencies. Also, I've noticed that a lot of the advice follows very black and white rules of dating. I feel like in real life, relationships are complex, and the answer isn't always "give up and move on." It seems to me that people who have the most success are the people who don't follow anyone's rules but their own. Its especially hard to convey the subtle intricacies of a relationship in the real world to strangers in cyberspace. Aren't most of the people on loveshack on loveshack because they are having trouble with relationships? What position are we in to help other people with their relationships? Lastly, don't you think that if someone found out that we had posted a thread about them in a forum when we just began dating them, or whatever the situation is, they would be really creeped out? I mean, its a possibility that they could find this website... should we really be engaging in activities that have to be kept on the sly for fear of seeming stalkeresque? Don't get me wrong; in some ways I'm just trying to play devil's advocate. I don't post on here THAT often, as I've always felt that it would be unhealthy thing to have too much of my time consumed by a relationship forum. I will still continue posting on here the same amount that I have before, but as before, I will also take things on here with a grain of salt.
Keridan Posted July 28, 2008 Posted July 28, 2008 I understand the points you are trying to make. However, I disagree. We all need a place to vent. We need to be able to ask advice whether or not we will take it. Sometimes there isn't anyone who is uninvolved enough to ask in real life. This board gives folks a place to do those things while holding on to a sense of anonimity. They may take the advice to the letter or throw it away. It's up to them, but at least they can get the advice without dragging friends/family into a problem. If someone is prone to over-analyzing a situation, they are going to do it with or without our help. It's a personality trait. There is always the chance we will offer them a better outlook to spend their time analyzing. You ask if people having relationship problems are the best place to seek advice. That goes both ways. You learn from experience. Many of the folks on here learned what the wrong answer was the hard way. Some got lucky. Either way, they may want to pass on what they have learned. They say the best drug counselors are ex-druggies. Speaking from experience, that's very true. I don't think it comes up very often that someone finds a thread started about them unless the SO tells them it's there or they find it on the puter. There really isn't enough information in most posts to figure out if someone is talking about you. This site also doesn't get that much traffic. It's unlikely the SO would find it here. This is just a counter-point post. You play devil's advocate. Someone should take the other side
Dark-N-Romantic Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Loveshack is a great place and many people come here for varying reasons and just as many people give valid or invalid advice. Some are here to joke around. Others are honest. But this is the fact about all advice, it does not matter where it comes from, it is always about analyzing. Sometimes it will right on the nose and sometimes it will be off center. But remember advice is based not on a set rule of the universe, well at least not in most cases anyway... But, it is based on the giver's thoughts and experiences and is more like this is what happen to me along a similar situation or how I feel it should be handled if I were in your shoes. Now it can be damaging if you are trying to take advice that intensionally tells you to do something that is wrong. You talk about black and white and complexities. Life is simple. Love is simple. We just have to do it. You either love someone or you don't and that is shown by your words and actions. Its that simple, no place for gray. Now the complexities come in when we apply our personal beliefs and feelings and experiences and what have you to something that is black and white. It is like trying to give degrees to the wrongful act of lying. Lying is bad, it does not matter if it was for a good cause or not... Lying is lying. The same is with a lot of things. Something is either right or wrong, but howso is based on varying factors and this is why people might be confused with there being areas of gray. For example, I am talking to a woman over the phone or a friend is hooking me up with someone... She sounds so hot and lovely, I am dying to meet her... I finally get to see her and she is missing one leg and is a blimp... Now my feelings of love go away, well at least those desirous feelings of love. So, why did it happen? Was there a gray area between rather or this woman is someone I would want an intimate relationshp with? I mean she has all the qualities that a good woman should have (at least all that is worthwhile and defines a true woman), however, the complexities that came up to alter that white feeling, thus turning it black, would be my physical expectations being meet. The fact is also, we have to discern from all this information. It is the same if going to various friends to with an issue (rather or not they have been in the same situation) and listening to varying points of view and then find the one that might best fit you. The one that you find more workable to your liking. If it works or not is not based on the advice giver, but the many variables seen and unseen in the situation. Sometimes it is wiser to cut your losses and leave, than stay in a situation that has a high probably of getting worst. Imagine how many women are dead and in the ground because they chose to believe things could change with an abusive spouse or lover. How many men are in financial ruin because they thought they could change a gold digging stripper into a housewife. Sometimes it is wiser not to run and to stay even if your partner has cheated. This is the fact, we don't know the future and thus every thing is a chance and a hope. Some abusers do change their abusive ways and live happy lives with their wives. Some gold digging strippers turned out to be the best woman in the world once she changed her greed into love. And a lot more cheaters than not wind up cheating even after a second, third, fourth, tenth chance was given. There are no absolutes for something a unpredictable as human interactions. So, now, I think Loveshack itself is not a ruiner to a person. It is how one exercise that words they gleem from here and facing the fact that the other individual(s) is (are) their own being and they may work with or go contrary to any and all the advice you my bring into your library of skills and techniques. DNR
Leoni Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Everyone has free will. If they don't want to listen to the advice given, they can sign off LS or ignore the advice. To me, LS provides a myriad of differing perspectives. Some of the perspectives are ones that never occurred to me, all can swing from the sheer ridiculous to the most concrete, hard-core common sense advice aka tough love possible. I lean towards listening to common sense advice. It wraps together practicality and pragmatism, into one package. I'm not much of a fluffy or pity party person when it comes to the dissolution of a relationship. It's also the type of advice I refuel LS with.
Art_Critic Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 I can't think of a way it would be detrimental.. I was on LS before I met my wife.. and still am after getting married and having a child.. How is that detrimental ? Without LS it is possible that I would never have gotten over the crap I went thru in the relationship that brought me to LS and therefore would never have found the love of my life and gotten married
Krytie TV Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Lately I've been wondering if active participation on loveshack is actually detrimental to our love lives rather than helpful. I absolutely and completely agree with you. I know for me there has been times where I have been sucked in to the overall negative tone that this site carries and have since distanced myself from it. I have also seen others go to great extent to overanalyze their lives to a point that I can't imagine being beneficial. I think it depends how much one relies on the site to guide their choices. Some use it as an avenue for most aspects of their personal lives and I feel that to be very dangerous and detrimental. Some use it for random questions which they simply need some insight or opinions, and I find that to be the only useful aspect of this site.
LoveLace Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 I absolutely and completely agree with you. I know for me there has been times where I have been sucked in to the overall negative tone that this site carries and have since distanced myself from it. I have also seen others go to great extent to overanalyze their lives to a point that I can't imagine being beneficial. I think it depends how much one relies on the site to guide their choices. Some use it as an avenue for most aspects of their personal lives and I feel that to be very dangerous and detrimental. Some use it for random questions which they simply need some insight or opinions, and I find that to be the only useful aspect of this site. I agree here for the most part. It's complicated though. Opinions can come from many angles, to the point where it's total confusion and overwhelming. At times you end up going with your own perspective anyhow, just to avoid chaotic advice. I've seen results go both ways, "they were right...", or "now this will surprise them..." It all depends on if we post based on personal experience, or just based on what we read. Either way, it's impossible to predict thoughts/feelings/actions about someone we only know about from reading a post. We can only get a general idea of people and situations, therefore opinions could stand to be a little more general sometimes, too. I could sit here and say, "leave him"....but we all know it's easier said than done, and none of us really there to witness every small detail...
whichwayisup Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Maybe if one isn't secure in their relationship, they could look for red flags or signs that aren't there and make issues that really don't exist. Honestly, I think if one is stable and happy in their lives, what gets posted in various threads shouldn't affect a person offline. If it does, then that is a sign to log off LS and take a break.
JackJack Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 JMO, but I think maybe it can depend on the person. If someone is here mainly to give advice and help others and things in their life are going pretty good, its probably less likley to effect them in a negative way. If someone is here for advive and things are not going well in their life it may have a different kind of impact. good or not so good.
MaxManwell Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 I'm pretty much an emotional retard so no degree of over analyzing can make my love life any worse. I am obsessive by nature and the only question I can ask of this forum is: Why doesn't she love me !!!???
grogster Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 An interesting Brief against, not so much LoveShack, but public social/advice message boards. My problems with LS: 1. Avoidance. LS becomes a refuge, a shelter, an avoidance mechanism. Instead of dealing with, that is, interacting with the problem spouse or lover, people vent here. Advice is useless if never acted upon IRL. LS becomes an end in itself as opposed to a means to surmount obstacles IRL. Posting is not doing. Venting soothes the ego, not the problem. 2. False Consciousness. People believe that by pecking on their keyboards they're dealing effectively with the issue du jour. They're not. Many would rather pound their keyboard than confront face-to-face awkward, difficult issues. Posting about an issues is not the same as confronting and resolving the issue. 3. Alienation. LS is a virtual community that draws many way from their real communities and social groups. It saps energy and attention from flesh and blood issues and reduces real world problems to one of virtual text. LS can distract, divide and depress. It can sap the will to cope IRL.
EnigmasMuse Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 When I first came here, I was also seeing a counselor. I had told him about me being on here, and that I got alot of different advice from different people. He told me one problem he saw with forums, is that even though you might get alot of "different" advice, from "different" people, SOMETIMES if one is already confused it can make things worse and confuse them even more, in not being sure what to do. With one person giving advice you can focus better on just that, that a hundred different ones which can sometimes confuse people even more.
Adunaphel Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Among the ways in which LS could affect out love lives (all of them excellent points) no one yet mentioned that we could take away time and attention from our partners by chosing to post here instead of spending time with them or on the relationship. I also regard LS as a very likely place to get many EA started or to develop friedships with the opposite sex which might at one point become inappropriate. I am quite sure it keeps happening all the time. Has already happened, for sure.
Angel1111 Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 I'm not sure if LS is damaging or not. But I do know that it has opened my eyes to a lot of things - particularly with how much crap women put up with and how dumb that really is. It especially helps to hear guys say things about this because it's different than hearing a woman say it. I think that any time we focus on the negative, we'll give that too much energy. But I see it as helping others and helping myself grow and learn. I think it depends on your focus.
Els Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 I agree with the TS to a certain extent. When I post here, I already know that I will be getting replies that are skewed in a certain way... there do seem to be black-and-white principles here, and everyone will tout it, sometimes not even bothering to see how applicable it is to your case. I am prepared to take everything with a pinch of salt, because I believe that in the end it is MY relationship, MY responsibility, and hence noone's decision but mine. However, it IS helpful in a way, that some replies will bring up points that you've never thought of before. Hence, like a counsellor, if you treat replies with the right attitude, they will help you sort out and broaden your CHOICES, as long as you don't allow them to be the sole dictator in your course of action. I think it's all in the way we each take it.
grogster Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Among the ways in which LS could affect out love lives (all of them excellent points) no one yet mentioned that we could take away time and attention from our partners by chosing to post here instead of spending time with them or on the relationship. I also regard LS as a very likely place to get many EA started or to develop friedships with the opposite sex which might at one point become inappropriate. I am quite sure it keeps happening all the time. Has already happened, for sure. Good points, Adunaphel. Yes, an Internet-based relationship advice site can, and does, interfere with real life relationships by perpetually distracting the Shacker or creating the opening for a competing emotional relationship with another Shacker. The irony is too much.
Mustang Sally Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Grogster - Thank you for these posts. I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think what you state basically all boils down to one concept: DENIAL. LS can be used as a haven for denial of many things in real life. I should know. I, myself, have used it in this way in the past. Fortunately, I've moved on from that now. It behooves every one of us to be very careful and honest with ourselves about our true motivations for using this site (especially if it is used in place of real life interactions).
Chinook Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 I think the points raised are pretty good regarding how useful advice is. However, what we must also remember is that advice (whether black, white or grey) is usually only given framed within the context it was asked. Sometimes OPs aren't always as clear or as truthful with the original posting as it seems and so advice can be skewed to direct a clear viewpoint from the moment the first OP appears. As for relationship issues, I don't have any - I'm not in a relationship, by choice at the moment. That said, Loveshack has taught me many things about myself and my attitudes towards relationships and made me think about issues and behaviours which I wouldn't have normally seen until too late in a potential partner... saving myself any hassle in the long term. I think as someone suggested, if a poster is using this site to hold up and get through a relationship, problem by problem, day by day, then that's a pretty bad thing... one off advisory threads about issues is a different matter entirely.
grogster Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Grogster - Thank you for these posts. I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think what you state basically all boils down to one concept: DENIAL. LS can be used as a haven for denial of many things in real life. I should know. I, myself, have used it in this way in the past. Fortunately, I've moved on from that now. It behooves every one of us to be very careful and honest with ourselves about our true motivations for using this site (especially if it is used in place of real life interactions). Great advice, Mustang Sally. Right now, work is slow and I'm between "real life interactions" (girlfriends) so I'm here. But once work picks-up or Cupid's arrow strikes, my Shack time will plummet like the sub-prime mortgage market.
Krytie TV Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 However, what we must also remember is that advice (whether black, white or grey) is usually only given framed within the context it was asked. Sometimes OPs aren't always as clear or as truthful with the original posting as it seems and so advice can be skewed to direct a clear viewpoint from the moment the first OP appears. This is also a very good point. So many times, maybe 75%, I read posts and numerous bells go off telling me that this is a "one side of the story" post. I don't know how many times I have been absolutely convinced that what is being portrayed is generously manipulated to make the OP look innocent. So much so that I think that makes the consequent advice given on LS is even more erroneous or ineffective, even though everyone has the best of intentions. I guess what I'm saying is LS is more often a place where people are overly supported (based on inaccurate info) to the detriment of the relationship in question.
Chinook Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Great advice, Mustang Sally. Right now, work is slow and I'm between "real life interactions" (girlfriends) so I'm here. But once work picks-up or Cupid's arrow strikes, my Shack time will plummet like the sub-prime mortgage market. Yep, that's the same for me too. I come and go here so infrequently. This is also a very good point. So many times, maybe 75%, I read posts and numerous bells go off telling me that this is a "one side of the story" post. I don't know how many times I have been absolutely convinced that what is being portrayed is generously manipulated to make the OP look innocent. So much so that I think that makes the consequent advice given on LS is even more erroneous or ineffective, even though everyone has the best of intentions. I guess what I'm saying is LS is more often a place where people are overly supported (based on inaccurate info) to the detriment of the relationship in question.Yes, I agree completely. I read quite a number of posts/threads like that recently and simply didn't bother offering any words to help because I felt it was pointless. I think OPs in some cases really need to re-think how a post is framed, what's the point in asking advice if you already want a pre-determined outcome..?! I myself posted a thread recently where I wanted to keep/save a friendship - so I posted accordingly. But subsequent events unfolded and it became clear my original intention was scuppered. The posts I received were very clearly advising me in every step along the way and I found very helpful and supportive... even though my desired outcome wasn't achieved.
Phateless Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Lately I've been wondering if active participation on loveshack is actually detrimental to our love lives rather than helpful. I in no way mean this as an attack on loveshack or the people who regularly contribute to it; in theory, loveshack is a great outlet, and its participants are helpful and have good intentions. I love posting on loveshack, and I appreciate all the advice that people have offered me. However, I can't help but wonder if posting threads encourages people to overanalyze things to a damaging extent. Overanalyzing relationships leads to trouble, and usually leads people to act in a way that reveals sensitivity and insecurity. If someone posts a thread and receives many different responses, this will encourage a sensitive person to carefully examine each possible course of action, and in general to overthink everything. Not good for people who already suffer from having obsessive tendencies. Also, I've noticed that a lot of the advice follows very black and white rules of dating. I feel like in real life, relationships are complex, and the answer isn't always "give up and move on." It seems to me that people who have the most success are the people who don't follow anyone's rules but their own. Its especially hard to convey the subtle intricacies of a relationship in the real world to strangers in cyberspace. Aren't most of the people on loveshack on loveshack because they are having trouble with relationships? What position are we in to help other people with their relationships? Lastly, don't you think that if someone found out that we had posted a thread about them in a forum when we just began dating them, or whatever the situation is, they would be really creeped out? I mean, its a possibility that they could find this website... should we really be engaging in activities that have to be kept on the sly for fear of seeming stalkeresque? Don't get me wrong; in some ways I'm just trying to play devil's advocate. I don't post on here THAT often, as I've always felt that it would be unhealthy thing to have too much of my time consumed by a relationship forum. I will still continue posting on here the same amount that I have before, but as before, I will also take things on here with a grain of salt. I totally agree with you on a lot of fronts, but I think the answer is moderation. You guys may have noticed I dropped off of this board for a bit. It's because I was frustrated with a lot of the misguided advice, black and white opinions, over analysis, and rash generalizations that i saw being passed off as advice. The flipside is that when you have something that really stumps you, you can get a multitude of perspectives very quickly, and sometimes find very helpful advice. There are a few certain posters who, time and again, offer me food for thought that I really value. (TBF) I think what it comes down to is comparable to cell-phones and frivolous calls. You don't need to call me from across the parking lot, only when we're in different cities. I think posting for every little thing can be detrimental, and at times can encourage the over analytical mindscrew process. Other times we can get advice for things we can't talk about with anyone else.
Lizzie60 Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 Among the ways in which LS could affect out love lives (all of them excellent points) no one yet mentioned that we could take away time and attention from our partners by chosing to post here instead of spending time with them or on the relationship. I also regard LS as a very likely place to get many EA started or to develop friedships with the opposite sex which might at one point become inappropriate. I am quite sure it keeps happening all the time. Has already happened, for sure. I very much agree with this... Some people who swears they are in 'very happy' relationships/M... are on different boards most of the time.. how can they give attention to their partners.. how can they be in a loving relationship.. I know, for a fact, that some of the 'holier than thou' posters DO have EA with other posters here.. I won't name anyone.. don't worry... T..... LS could be detrimental to 'weak' people who cannot 'think' for themselves, let me explain.. For example: Someone comes here and ask what they should do.. they are 'weak' and have no clue what they should do about their partner.. some will say : dump the jerk.. others will say.. sit down with your azzH and have a serious talk... each and everyone gives their piece of advice.. (negative)... the poster (weak) takes it home and have a huge fight with her partner... they can't handle the 'face to face' confrontation in RL... they still don't know how to face the problem.. they constantly need 'advices' but they get what they get.. and in some cases, the advices do the more wrong than good.. I don't know if that makes sense.. I know what I mean.. I think that every advice should be taken with a grain of salt..
Art_Critic Posted July 29, 2008 Posted July 29, 2008 I don't think LS creates something that isn't already there in someones life.. LS is just a web forum for gosh sakes.. If a person isn't spending time with their SO and they are on LS posting about it instead it isn't LS that created the dynamic. The dynamic was already there.. if it wasn't LS they were using to avoid contact with their SO it would be working on the car in the garage or going out with the guys or girls... All that being said : I have walked away from LS before though only because I got so wrapped up in a thread that my blood pressure was being affected.. and to haphazardly quote one of the mods here.. certain forums require that a poster have a thicker skin than others and if you don't have thick skin then don't post in those forums ( OW/MM type of forums ). You have to let things rolls off your back like water on a duck sometimes and not let yourself get all riled up.. sometimes it isn't so easy to not hit the reply button and open up a can of whop ass on some poster taking pot shots at you.. but you have to do it.. I sometimes get flustered and have to put the keyboard down in those instances.. There are posters here that never let LS get to them no matter how much heat I have seen come down on her ( Lizzie ).. I never see her get her feathers ruffled.. I have always admired that about her.. since I don't have the same ability she does:)
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