jon01 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Do you think I should apologize to her for the way I have been acting or should I just completely leave the subject alone altogether? Just leave it alone. If she can't already see how much you love her, and she doesn't understand where your efforts are coming from, then she is blinder than Stevie Wonder wearing blindfolds in a dark cave. Your wife is just so messed up and unloving at this point, that nothing you say or do will be positive. That's her problem though, let her sort through her pathetic jungle of misery instead of taking you into it all the time whenever you try to show your love.
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 True - there is likely emotional blackmail by our spouses. Our spouses have come to believe in some fantasy life should exist in their marriage. They will likely find that that life will never exist no matter how many times they marry trying to find it. We can either allow ourselves to be emotionally blackmailed (if that is truly the case) or we can let the divorce happen and live with the result of having our one and two year old children only 42% of the time. Frankly - I do not like either outcome... But I can admit that I wasn't the best husband or father I could be or my W wanted. But I want to be the best Father and Best Husband I can be. I love having a family - family is more important than my job. I let my Job take over my life and lost touch with what was really important - my daughter, my wife and my family. That is all my Wife really wanted - She has always told me that she needs to be my most important client - and I agree.
jon01 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 just be the closest friend she cannot be without... (then love will sneak its way back in...without her suspecting it... Ha Ha). Do you really believe this, or is it a recipe for feeling like a sucker in the end when you find out your wife was moving on and planning her life with some other jagoff? I like to be hopeful, but it's hard to be so "nice" in the face of utter rejection.
Author Maladjusted Posted August 1, 2008 Author Posted August 1, 2008 See, but you are right there. We are always works in progress. What does that say about our wives if we are working towards being better husbands and fathers and they aren't willing to play ball? That means that there must be another reason. I recognized my mistakes and am taking corrective action to fix them. I just don't get why that isn't enough. I told her it will take time for the love to come back, but if she still loves me or had ever loved me there is a chance. I think that went in one ear and out the other though. I believe that she is talking with someone that is giving her negative information.
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Mal - You can't put a restriction of the duration of a separation. You cannot control her. The only thing you can do is control yourself, what you say and what you do. I do not agree with showing or escorting her to the door... she will see that as you not loving her enough to fight for her... But if she needs to be let go then you must let her go - but let her know that you love her so much that you want her to do what is best for her even if you don't agree. - you will be strong and win her over in time - not because you need her but because you love her and want her in your life.
jon01 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 That Bullcrap SD!!! You can be co-parents without being friends. You can be coridal to your ex without being their friend why be all up under them when they just gonna crap all over you again and again. Mal listen your relationships didnt work out, mines didnt either. but I got alot of self esteem to deal with any woman, why because I focused on making myself better and came to a place where I was happy within myself. I could not go back to a relationship or even trying to be with a woman that hurt me like this woman hurt you. SD wants to start from scratch? For what? Only you SD would want to reconsider reconsiling with an emotional abusive woman. not knowing that inner confidence attracts women to you. You wont have inner confidence if your self esteem is constantly stepped on! Screw that! Yu gave up your friends and family for what? You can be co-parents without being friends. Friendly yes. friends, hell no!!! I completely agree with that guy. Well said.
Ladyjane14 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 I'm sorry my posts are sporadic and I've not taken time to address questions one by one. Truth is.. I've got more to do than I can say grace over today, with an extensive plumbing emergency to boot. So, I'll try to take more time later. But for now.... SD's situation is further along, with the separation well underway. He's doing the only thing he can, with one exception... and that is 'letting go of the fear'. He's got to learn to be "self-fruitful" at happiness with or without her. The harder he holds on, the greater the fear. It's like one of those Star Trek episodes where the ship is getting pulled into the vortex and the more energy expended at stopping it only pulls it in harder. Instead, fly on through and the fear dissipates. For Mal and guys like RSM... know this. If my husband had allowed me to leave him, back when I was going through the stress of young children. and work. and family management, back when he could do NOTHING right because I blamed him for ALL of life's hardships.... we would NOT be married now. The ONLY reason I didn't leave back then is because I knew the decision would be permanent. He would NOT have taken me back, and I would NOT have wanted to come back. I'd have gotten away with making it all about him and not about me. People don't grow and learn when they run away from their problems and failings. They grow and learn by DEALING with them straight on. If she uses the exit door as a means of dealing with her stress, do you honestly think she'll never have cause to be stressed again? It's do or die when it comes to learning how to successfully manage your own angst, guys. IOW, if she can't learn it now, she's NOT going to learn it out there on her own or in time to save your marriage. Because, believe it or not, it's going to be YOU who eventually 'runs out of gas'. You protect yourself, you protect your marriage... when you don't allow your spouse to hurt you past your ability to forgive and tolerate.
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Far too much negative energy by Chrome, jon, and cta for that matter. Mal - you can either fight for what you think is right in you heart and soul. Or you can throw in the towel by assuming the situation is hopeless - and thereby make self fulfilling. I have had days where I felt like throwing in the towel and giving up on my nuclear family. And maybe I will end up doing that some day. The naysayers do have some very good advice though - you need to take care of yourself and be strong and build yourself up, and be the kind of person your W would want... It will help you in your fight. But I do not believe in dating others while I am married - it would just throw another wrench in the works. And frankly it would just mask my own problem and issues will re-appear with another woman anyway.
jon01 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Hey Mal, I'm just curious. How old is your wife? Where is she/her family from? (you mentioned spanish speaking) Is the the pretty/petite latina type which lots of guys find attractive? Is she materialistic? (ie likes spending money, you buying her gifts, etc) Has she had a serious relationship or marriage before you? I'm just trying to get a little glimpse into the woman you/we are dealing with here. From what I have heard so far, I hope I never run into this kind of female!
jon01 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Far too much negative energy by Chrome, jon, and cta for that matter. Nonsense. It's just other advice coming from stronger men. I find in most all of your posts you sound very weak and are always trying to kiss your wife's ass. That's probably why she is walking all over you and why you are so sad and depressed that you come here and post for hours a day. Sorry, but that's just how I see it.
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 I agree with LadyJane - Even her point about me that I have to not fear being alone (which she is right, I do - and will have to come to grips with that). One other thing to point out Mal - is that whether or not your marriage can survive - your son's mother will be in your life for decades to come. If you think it will be easier after divorce, you would be wrong. The arguing, spite, hurtful feelings will still be there every interaction. That's why building up friendship with your W is so important - its a step toward reconciliation and better relations with her to co-parent better whether or not the marraige can be saved. If the friendship is too much then at least cordial is required.
Ladyjane14 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 So if I am correct LadyJane I should give her a period of say, six months of seperation to see if she wants to come back or not? That's really up to you. That's kind of my point. You DO get a say in all this. She can't have a "trial separation" unless you agree to it. The only thing she can get without your agreement is a divorce. I'm not trying to talk you guys into anything. I'm just trying to give you perspective from a woman who, once upon a time, would have been only too happy to have a go at making it on my own without first having to give up my safety net.
TrustInYourself Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 I am wasted. It's been 9 hours since my last drink and I still feel 6 beers under. Hahaha.
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Nonsense. It's just other advice coming from stronger men. I find in most all of your posts you sound very weak and are always trying to kiss your wife's ass. That's probably why she is walking all over you and why you are so sad and depressed that you come here and post for hours a day. Sorry, but that's just how I see it. Stonger men who gave up their love for their wife, broke their committment to their marriage, and gave up half of their time with their children. All women really want is to be loved by their husbands and them to be their best freinds. Many men, including myself, are just on auto-pilot during their marriages and don't wake up until its too late. Then don't put enough energy into it to save it. I am at least going to put in the effort - so I can know years from now that I did the right thing and did not give up. Why is that weak ?
Ladyjane14 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 All women really want is to be loved by their husbands and them to be their best freinds. Many men, including myself, are just on auto-pilot during their marriages and don't wake up until its too late. Then don't put enough energy into it to save it. Which reminds me... Guys, type into your browser, "why women leave men, harley"... and read the article you find there. It's going to explain ALOT.
TrustInYourself Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 It's not weak. It's the strongest thing you can do.
TrustInYourself Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Which reminds me... Guys, type into your browser, "why women leave men, harley"... and read the article you find there. It's going to explain ALOT. Reading it now. It's blowing my mind particles into subatomic dust.
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 It's not weak. It's the strongest thing you can do. Thanks TIY for coming to my rescue...
Ladyjane14 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Reading it now. It's blowing my mind particles into subatomic dust. Strong black coffee, bubby. It cures all ills.
TrustInYourself Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Kiss me on the lips later! I'm scared of coffee right now, LJ. You rock. FYI.
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Which reminds me... Guys, type into your browser, "why women leave men, harley"... and read the article you find there. It's going to explain ALOT. Thank you Lady Jane and Dr. Harley for also coming to my rescue... great article - thanks
TrustInYourself Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 Thank you Lady Jane and Dr. Harley for also coming to my rescue... great article - thanks SD, when are you going to come rescue me?
SingleDad Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 TIY - you haven't been getting attacked on several fronts... But I will be there to support you.
TrustInYourself Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 I know these guys avoid me like the plague. They like to hammer your ass though. I think it's cause you are a nice guy. Me on the other hand..HAH! Thanks for being my hero.
Ladyjane14 Posted August 1, 2008 Posted August 1, 2008 It's not weak. It's the strongest thing you can do. This is true. And in terms of recovering a marriage some of what's required of us seems very contrary to what our instinct would tell us. We do have to take emotional risks and really extend ourselves. I've never opened up my own thread, but I told a good bit of my story (all in one place) to Fyrwyfe. The rest of my story is spread out all over the forum. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t58996/?highlight=fyrwyfe I understand what you guys are talking about first hand. BUT... and this is a big "but", what we're talking about is a high-wire walk over hot coals. It takes balance and there are times when you can't take the lead from the person who has their head screwed on backwards. For these guys who have NOT begun a physical separation... they really would do well to think about where the line in the sand is going to be drawn. For you other guys... there's nothing to lose that's not already lost. And as TIY is wont to remind us, once we realize that it's over... there's nothing in our way from starting anew. The OLD relationship failed. It's gone. But that doesn't mean you can't strive toward something new and better.
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