PandaStillLovesBunny Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 In her book, <i>The Virtue of Selfishness,</i> Ayn Rand writes (http://www.aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/love.html) Like any other value, love is not a static quantity to be divided, but an unlimited response to be earned. The love for one friend is not a threat to the love for another, and neither is the love for the various members of one’s family, assuming they have earned it. The most exclusive form —romantic love—is not an issue of competition. If two men are in love with the same woman, what she feels for either of them is not determined by what she feels for the other and is not taken away from him. If she chooses one of them, the “loser” could not have had what the “winner” has earned. It is only among the irrational, emotion-motivated persons, whose love is divorced from any standards of value, that chance rivalries, accidental conflicts and blind choices prevail. But then, whoever wins does not win much. Among the emotion-driven, neither love nor any other emotion has any meaning. Do you agree or disagree, and why or why not? Please state your reasons for either as pertaining to the quote above, I'd like to see this avoid devolving into "I never liked <i>The Fountainhead</i>, so I'm going to disagree." I'm going to add as an aside that Ayn Rand's ideas about love have really helped me to get over my ex. Why would I want someone like my ex? Hell, why would she want someone like me if she didn't value honesty and ethical integrity? When you start to THINK about things, you come to see exactly why things are the way they are.
Trialbyfire Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 Firstly, I would like to state that I adore The Fountainhead! As for her statements on love, they're based on her predisposed concepts of reality, integrity, etc., which I don't necessarily agree with. Her views on integrity are solely focused on being true to selfishness v. being true to a broader spectrum of potentially communal good. As for earning love, that's a crock. If you have to earn someone's love, you might as well walk away from someone who loves to navel-gaze. p.s. Yes, I'm avoiding an essay style response in case this is someone trying to get their homework done on LS.
sally4sara Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 I don't think the concept of love being earned is a crock when it comes to romantic love. You don't conduct your life with much regard for someone you just met. Only after time spent can they earn a place in your heart. And not everyone you go out with will get this kind of consideration. Only the ones who proved themselves to be worthy to you. If we went out 3 times and I told you I loved you and you could trust me with your life, would you believe me?
Trialbyfire Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 People don't earn each other's love. They earn each other's respect which helps to create one of the foundations for a healthy, lasting relationship. You can fall in love with all the wrong people. You can also fall in love with all the right people.
Taramere Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 Do you agree or disagree, and why or why not? Please state your reasons for either as pertaining to the quote above, I'd like to see this avoid devolving into "I never liked <i>The Fountainhead</i>, so I'm going to disagree." I'm going to add as an aside that Ayn Rand's ideas about love have really helped me to get over my ex. Why would I want someone like my ex? Hell, why would she want someone like me if she didn't value honesty and ethical integrity? When you start to THINK about things, you come to see exactly why things are the way they are. Allegedly Rand told one lover, when he left her, that if he had a shred of morality he would be forever impotent. I'm not sure what thought process a statement like that would stem from. I can only guess that she was touting herself as being so evidently superior to the woman he chose over her, that there could be no reason for her (Rand) being ditched other than that her former lover was a moral coward. If so, would that truth, or would it be rationalisation to protect herself from something that could be emotionally painful? I think the degree to which we admire a person for being honest and ethical correlates to how much we identify with their intellect and personal values - and whether we think they regard us as honest and ethical. Mutual trust and respect, in other words. If that's the case, then we might become loved by people because we a) look and act like the lover they believe they are entitled to b) conform to their notions of intelligence and ethics c) are available to them d) ignite some tender emotion in them Ayn Rand would presumably reject (d). With regard to (b) - how do we do that? By feeding people what they want to hear. Figuring out what it is they aspire to being, and affirming for them that they either are - or could be - those things. Doing that in language they respect and relate to. That's surely the quickest way to convince a person that you're "smart enough" for them. We might do that by chance, if we are on the same wavelength, philosophically and intellectually, as the object of our affections - and genuinely believe they are/could be all those things they aspire to. If people fall in love through a combination of physical desire and intellectual respect (and what else does Ayn Rand suggest?) then to earn someone's love would suggest doing those things by design. Would that be honest and ethical? I guarantee your ex regards herself as being as honest and ethical as you see yourself.
Trialbyfire Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 It's a form of control, to make someone earn your love.
Trialbyfire Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 It's a form of control, to make someone earn your love. Expansion on this thought. In making someone earn your love, you put yourself into the driver's seat and on a higher platform. Don't you think this is self-defeating for anyone trying to earn your respect? How much do you respect someone who you've elevated yourself over?
sally4sara Posted July 2, 2008 Posted July 2, 2008 It's a form of control, to make someone earn your love. I guess it could be looked at that way. It doesn't mean I control the person in question to treat me a certain way; I cannot control their actions. I look at it as control over the one thing I do have and that is me and my willingness to stay in the relationship. I don't see how having standards is the same as being controlling. Time spent can tell you if the treatment you receive meets your standards. If it does, you can let your guard down enough to begin to love. This works both ways and that is what I call earning love. It isn't a monetary thing and its certainly not forced, but it is the difference between the love you naturally have for your family and the romantic love that can grow between two people. It is also the difference between love of a friend and romantic love.
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