Trialbyfire Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 The best policy is to limit (unnecessarily) risky situations. I do it all the time. Most people do. My question would be why your g/f doesn't. While she may say she's too trusting, this goes beyond trusting. She's enjoying the ego stroking far too much. If you choose to remain with her, you'll be paying a big price in the future. I found a text from her to this coworker-guy friend which said "You're the brightest light in my sky."
thrustrebel Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 My gf is exactly the same. She actually met a guy in a club whilst out with friends the other day and they've met up for coffee since. I checked her phone when she came to visit me and he'd text her to ask to meet again. When she'd said she was visiting me, he had replied "Oh why do you hurt me so". When I confronted her about feeling uncomfortable about this, she gave me the 'we're just friends, I need more friends' speech. I know that she isn't cheating on me, she is just a commitmentphobe and needs to feel like she has an entirely independent collection of friends. I know this, but there's also the same amount of element of naivety about the way she reacts around men. She's extremely attractive and accuses me of being nothing more then jealous every single time until they eventually (and inevitably) ask her out. Truth is, I envy you. It sounds like she's suddenly realised that she can't be so naive about these things and won't keep giving you the 'they're just friends' line from now on. I am an optimist but perhaps that's because of my situation, I don't know. Matey, I would suggest you have a long serious think about whether this is going to be a lasting epiphamy she's had, or whether next time a guy starts being overly friendly, she'll deny it again. The attention from others interested in us is never easy to ignore whether we love our partner or not. And be careful not to end up with the type of girl that just gets better at hiding it after something like this ;-) Hope something in there helps, TR
jon01 Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Yes man, yes of course she is having an emotional affair! Good gf and wives do not flirt and develop interest in other men, and don't text guys with messages like that. Doesn't this make you want to kick the ever lovin sh*t out of this guy? What a SOB, guy already has a wife and kid but he needs your gf too. In a way it's good you found the text message, at least now you know what you're dealing with.
taylor Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Thrustrebel and clean slate - You two gentlemen are naive to think your girlfriends are naive. Neither one is naive. They know exactly what they are doing. Women, from very early ages, have well-tuned radar devices when it comes to men. Women pick up on a man's sexual or romantic interest in an instant. And women know how to nurture that interest. Don't be fooled. Your girlfriends love the attention they are getting from these other men. They will not put an end to it because it feels just too darn good. Single women, like men, are always weighing their options as well. Don't be fooled.
Owl Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Taylor, these women may well enjoy the attention that they're getting. However, its these POOR BOUNDARIES that get them into trouble. Often they're NOT "looking for something" more than just the compliments and such...but because they don't have a clear "line to stop" at, they don't recognize when they've gone from getting compliments into cheating. They may or may not be "looking to cheat". Not every person goes out "looking"...some cross that line because they never learned good boundaries in the first place. They didn't learn what was appropriate for friends vs what was appropriate for a committed partner. Make sense? In your situation...did it START with you going out looking for someone to cheat on your husband with? Or did it ESCALATE from what you THOUGHT (at the time) was a harmless situation?
jon01 Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Taylor, these women may well enjoy the attention that they're getting. However, its these POOR BOUNDARIES that get them into trouble. Often they're NOT "looking for something" more than just the compliments and such...but because they don't have a clear "line to stop" at, they don't recognize when they've gone from getting compliments into cheating. They may or may not be "looking to cheat". Not every person goes out "looking"...some cross that line because they never learned good boundaries in the first place. They didn't learn what was appropriate for friends vs what was appropriate for a committed partner. Make sense? In your situation...did it START with you going out looking for someone to cheat on your husband with? Or did it ESCALATE from what you THOUGHT (at the time) was a harmless situation? Yeah whatever.. let's just stop analyzing and apologizing and trying to figure out why these poor little women like do the things they do. For me, they are just messed up retards, end of story.
taylor Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 OWL - In my case, poor boundaries led to the affair. You are spot on. No, I was not looking because I was married. Mine was a friendship that led to a strong emotional attachment followed by mutual sexual attraction and a mutual acknowledged desire to cross the line into a physical affair. The PA, of course, never happened, as you well know. I will be honest, though, I KNEW when I crossed the line, to the day. I made a decision to allow myself to cross the line. The boundaries I set were clear, but drawn in the wrong place. I thought that as long as the flirting remained in the workplace and we did not get physical - not even hand holding - everything was safe and innocent. I convinced myself that the emotional investment in the OM was strictly out of friendship. I FOOLED MYSELF. I WAS SO WRONG. Not only were the boundaries in the wrong place, they were also weak. I crashed right thru them like a freight train...all the while trying to convince myself I could handle it. It was a choice. A terribly misguided choice. I let it happen, underestimating the consequences. I did not realize how far over the line I had stepped emotioinally until the EA was over and I lost the OM. These women are dating these men. They are not married to them. Their boundaries may be poorly defined or weak based on the fact they have no ring on their finger. And even a ring does not guarantee boundaries will be maintained as anyone who had an affair will admit.
taylor Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Yeah whatever.. let's just stop analyzing and apologizing and trying to figure out why these poor little women like do the things they do. For me, they are just messed up retards, end of story. Jon, shouldn't we also just stop analyzing, apologizing and trying to figure out why poor little MEN do the things they do. They are just messed up retards, too. Wouldn't you agree?
Trialbyfire Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 I think both genders are messed up when they can't maintain the hard boundaries in a committed relationship. Why bother committing?
Owl Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Well...for me at least...dating isn't marriage. Its a trial run for marriage at best. If they cheat when you're dating...they failed the 'test drive" and its time to move on to a newer, better model. My thought at least...LOL.
ThumbingMyWay Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 OWL - In my case, poor boundaries led to the affair. You are spot on. No, I was not looking because I was married. Mine was a friendship that led to a strong emotional attachment followed by mutual sexual attraction and a mutual acknowledged desire to cross the line into a physical affair. The PA, of course, never happened, as you well know. I will be honest, though, I KNEW when I crossed the line, to the day. I made a decision to allow myself to cross the line. The boundaries I set were clear, but drawn in the wrong place. I thought that as long as the flirting remained in the workplace and we did not get physical - not even hand holding - everything was safe and innocent. I convinced myself that the emotional investment in the OM was strictly out of friendship. I FOOLED MYSELF. I WAS SO WRONG. Not only were the boundaries in the wrong place, they were also weak. I crashed right thru them like a freight train...all the while trying to convince myself I could handle it. It was a choice. A terribly misguided choice. I let it happen, underestimating the consequences. I did not realize how far over the line I had stepped emotioinally until the EA was over and I lost the OM. These women are dating these men. They are not married to them. Their boundaries may be poorly defined or weak based on the fact they have no ring on their finger. And even a ring does not guarantee boundaries will be maintained as anyone who had an affair will admit. Just my take on Bounderies in a relationship.... I know when my wife and I set our bounderies (post wifes affair). I was adament that not only are these bounderies to be met while we were together. But most importantly, they must be kept when we were separate or away from each. Wether that be out with friends or just out and about by ourselves. Character is: How you behave when you are in a group Integrity is: How you behave when you are all alone
jon01 Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Jon, shouldn't we also just stop analyzing, apologizing and trying to figure out why poor little MEN do the things they do. They are just messed up retards, too. Wouldn't you agree? Yeah, if this thread were about a chating bf I would say stop alnalysing and just accept the fact he is a jerk, period. But you have to admit, reading all the crap on this board, that there are more screwed up women and women cheaters out there than men!
Owl Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 I don't agree, Jon. There's no way to base that off what you read here. Men are less likely to come to a forum and ADMIT that they cheated than most women would be. Men work things out internally, women do so externally. So you would EXPECT to see fewer male posters admitting to cheating. Why make this a gender thing at all? I don't get the value in placing blame like that...
Trialbyfire Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Unless all the OWs are lesbians, which I know they're not, for every OW, there's an MM...
taylor Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Yeah, if this thread were about a chating bf I would say stop alnalysing and just accept the fact he is a jerk, period. But you have to admit, reading all the crap on this board, that there are more screwed up women and women cheaters out there than men! OK, let's see. All women cheaters are retards and all men cheaters are jerks. I guess that sums it all up. LS moderators might as well delete this entire forum from the website cuz there's nothing more to be said...unless Twice Shy would like to have one last opportunity to tell ALL cheaters to go to hell.
jon01 Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Why make this a gender thing at all? I don't get the value in placing blame like that... That's fine.. getting back to my point a few messages up, I think the OP's gf is messed up. Are you ok with that?
taylor Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 Integrity is: How you behave when you are all alone I agree with you here, ThumbingMyWay, as you put it very eloquently. Crossing boundaries into an affair definitely reflects a loss of integrity on the part of the cheater. This is a demon that haunts me every day. I have always considered myself a person with integrity and have always had alot of respect for myself. I have never given anyone any reason to doubt this...until last year. My integrity was tested and I failed. I am still trying to understand my lapse in judgement and the reasons why I compromised my integrity and value system like I did. Very out of character.
thrustrebel Posted July 11, 2008 Posted July 11, 2008 Taylor: "Thrustrebel and clean slate - You two gentlemen are naive to think your girlfriends are naive. Neither one is naive. They know exactly what they are doing." Nah, I don't think we're naive. Though you're right that they know what they're doing and they enjoy the attention, I argue that they lack the foresight to see where it's going and are naive to believe they are going to be able to stop it when it starts picking up speed. They're happy to enjoy the ride on the skateboard down a steep hill, but it hasn't crossed their mind they are going too fast to stop gracefully as they approach the bottom! "I thought that as long as the flirting remained in the workplace and we did not get physical - not even hand holding - everything was safe and innocent. I convinced myself that the emotional investment in the OM was strictly out of friendship. I FOOLED MYSELF." Naive: "Showing or characterized by a lack of critical judgment" Yep, I'm going to stick with my original advice. It depends on if the OP thinks her new found boundaries are going to be permanent or temporary until this has all blown over and been forgiven!
taylor Posted July 11, 2008 Posted July 11, 2008 This guy recently invited her on vacation with him to Europe. I just found out about it Monday. And I kinda stated the fact that I don't appreciate other men encroaching on my territory. Though, in not-so-nice words. I also just found out that this guy has been leaving little yellow flowers with dvd boxsets that he lends her. She said she thought it was just friendly because of the yellow color. She now realizes otherwise. No woman who is dating one man (you) would consider an invitation by another man to vacation in Europe as just a friendly gesture. Nor would she consider receiving flowers from the same man as just a friendly gesture. She's trying to gloss things over with you. Playing dumb with you. She knows this man has romantic interest. She knew immediately. She didn't have to realize anything. Not sure what to make of all this. Part of me wants to forgive her and try to build our relationship again, but another part of me just wants to . My relationship is being assaulted from multiple fronts, and I'm not sure I have the energy or will to defend it anymore. My girlfriend is way too quick to "trust" guys. I understand it's just her personality, but it's a dangerous trait to have. She wants to be "friends" with everyone. YOU shouldn't have to defend it. Your girlfriend should be doing that. But she isn't. She is giving these men green lights to pursue her and she isn't stopping their pursuit. Your girlfriend isn't too trusting. She is well aware these men are pursuing her and she likes it or she would stop it. She is well aware these men want more than friendship. She obviously doesn't mind getting pursued by them or she would stop it. It has nothing to do with her personality. She can still be friendly and still say NO, I ALREADY HAVE A BOYFRIEND. My only chance of survival is to make sure my girlfriend sees things with that same cynical perspective. This isn't going to happen if she continues to enjoy their attention and company above your objections.
lolobear Posted July 12, 2008 Posted July 12, 2008 It does sound like an emotional affair, and I think your best bet is to confront her. Just talk to her about the reasons you believe it to be an emotional affair and tell her that if she wants to continue to be with you, the other affairs have to stop now.
Author clean_slate Posted July 13, 2008 Author Posted July 13, 2008 A bit of an update. I am not sure what to think now. A mutual friend/mediator spoke with my girlfriend and I today (separately), and she has given me a lot to think about. My girlfriend is now claiming to want some time to think things through and get herself sorted out so she can be a better partner to me. I found out that she has already spoken to the emotional affair guy and made it clear to him that no hanging out or talking about his marriage can occur anymore. She apparently told him that while she wants to be his friend, she needs to focus on what is most important to her- our relationship. She also told him (and still insists to me) that she never intended to lead him on, and that she was only trying to be a good friend by lending her ear, and she is sorry he took it the wrong way. She also said she talked to the guy who invited her on the trip and told him the same type of thing. Part of me has always believed that none of this was intentional. However, there is still part of me that thinks she must have some interest in these guys. What do you all think? The reason I haven't broken things off yet is because I have given her the benefit of the doubt. Am I naive (or even stupid) for doing so?
jon01 Posted July 13, 2008 Posted July 13, 2008 It's hard to break free of a girl like this when you really love her. Even if she did worse to you, you would still be torn up. But yea, I definitely think she must of had some interest in these guys. Especially mr.di*khead gift man.
theobserver Posted July 13, 2008 Posted July 13, 2008 I think she's a lost cause who doesn't get it or is most likely playing dumb. So she still wants to remain friends with him. Isn't that what they were supposed to be technically now nothings really changed just her saying we can't talk about this or do that or you'll get mad. I know she works with him but she should of cut him off as a "friend" he's toxic any woman in her sane mine knows no man should be showering her in gifts it's inappropriate she knows how he felt from the start. I can't count the times similar stories like this have come up, and of course she's going to cancel the trip plans with the seperate other man the fact she even considered it though tells me she's not for you my friend. This girl is just not worth it and I sense trouble down the road. Why didn't she tell you she's done these things to "set them straight" to your face, why did you need to hear from a third party. Who's to say she only told that person half truths to pass it on to you and she didn't actually follow through she might decide to just be more discrete and not tell you what the other men do now. Oh well and a message to Thrustrebel; keep a damn eye on your girlfriend it's understandable to be a bad judge of character but the way you typed your message she's had temp male "friends" who turn out they want to date her several times. Now with the most recent one met at the bar I highly doubt when they introduced that it was for friendship, come now. Has he even introduced himself to you, his texts suggest he has no concern on her spending time with him then you ( but atleast she seems to know her priorities to spend more with you) Now she may be a "commitmentphobe" but if she wants to make friends theres better ways then picking up guys from the bar to be a new buddy. Considering you've been on and off with this girlfriend who's to say she isn't window shopping especially with the accuse of jealousy on a perfectly good suspicion. Guilty parties love to reflect the issue rather then admit you make a good point and engage in a compromise for the situation to satisfy both partners. Anyway good luck to the OP whatever you decide. If you are confirming to give her another chance keep an eye well open and drop her like a hat if the behaviour is the same.
taylor Posted July 13, 2008 Posted July 13, 2008 A bit of an update. I am not sure what to think now. A mutual friend/mediator spoke with my girlfriend and I today (separately), and she has given me a lot to think about. My girlfriend is now claiming to want some time to think things through and get herself sorted out so she can be a better partner to me. I found out that she has already spoken to the emotional affair guy and made it clear to him that no hanging out or talking about his marriage can occur anymore. She apparently told him that while she wants to be his friend, she needs to focus on what is most important to her- our relationship. She also told him (and still insists to me) that she never intended to lead him on, and that she was only trying to be a good friend by lending her ear, and she is sorry he took it the wrong way. She also said she talked to the guy who invited her on the trip and told him the same type of thing. Part of me has always believed that none of this was intentional. However, there is still part of me that thinks she must have some interest in these guys. What do you all think? The reason I haven't broken things off yet is because I have given her the benefit of the doubt. Am I naive (or even stupid) for doing so? Clean Slate, I think I understand what may be going on here..only because I have been in your girlfriend's shoes, so to speak. Your girlfriend is in the decision making step. These guys had interest in her and were pursuing her. She knew it. Didn't stop it. You have called her on it. You told her you want it stopped. You told her you want her to turn her focus from them BACK on to you. You want her to recommit to your relationship. For her, the "game" is over. You ended it when you called her on it. Now she has to look at reality for what it is. Does she love you enough to recommit to you and your relationship? Is that what she REALLY wants? Or does she want something..or someone else..out there? This is a turning point for her. These are decisions she needs to make by examining what's really in her heart. By telling these guys to back off and telling you she wants to work on your relationship she has decided to do the "RIGHT" thing. It's what her head is telling her. That could be a good sign. But not necessarily because her heart may still be conflicted. It needs time to catch up. She needs to shove these other men out, close the door, and open her heart back up to you 100 percent, like when you first started dating. This takes time. The question is whether you are willing to give her this time. You also have some decisions to make. Are you willing to be with a person who is obviously conflicted? Are you willing to stay in a relationship with someone who is wobbling with her feelings? Are you willing to give 100 percent to a person who isn't giving you the same? Is she or will she ever be able to, in your mind? You are not stupid by any means. You communicated your expectations to her regarding her behavior and your relationship. Good for you. Communication is key, but only if the communication is honest and open. But you also need to keep a discerning eye on her behavior. Her actions must match her words. If they don't, you can only rely on her actions. They always speak louder than words. By watching what she does you will know in your heart if she is "with" you or not. You will "feel" it. Good luck to you and keep posting.
jon01 Posted July 13, 2008 Posted July 13, 2008 Taylor, you're good. I'd like to hire you for a personal therapy session! How much do you charge?
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