Ms. Red Posted June 25, 2008 Posted June 25, 2008 NVM Bish & Twice Shy. They always play the Devil's Advocate disguised as disdain and/or disgust. While I can relate to your feelings of desire for human touch, I do wonder about your daughters & that your wife may be putting them through how she was raised. Does she lack the personal touch with them the same as she does you? Even if you are giving them the much needed human touch all of us desire/need, they may still feel rejection from their mother that may effect them in their future. You've all ready mentioned your wife & children don't have a great relationship but in regards to her temperament. Maybe in future counseling you could bring up the children and the effect on them your wife has. Also, I despise divorce unless there's abuse etc. I ended up kicking my husband out after he betrayed me. I felt such guilt for breaking up our sons family. I was determined to stay intact until he was grown. I since then realized that we were showing our son a sad picture of marriage. No loving caresses, hugs, kisses between us. We slept in separate rooms for so long that my son can't even remember when we did share a room. I've realized that isn't a healthy view of marriage & feel better about my choice now. I still have guilt from time to time. Just think about what your daughters are learning about marriage from what they see in their parents relationship. I'm telling you all this so you can see that your wife's issues may go beyond just your marriage. I wish you well. =^-^=
bish Posted June 26, 2008 Posted June 26, 2008 NVM Bish & Twice Shy. They always play the Devil's Advocate disguised as disdain and/or disgust. Who is playing Devil's Advocate? I told him straight up what I thought. I think you need to learn what playing DA is before using it in a sentence. So what was so far off of my assessment about putting his wife in the bathroom to puke, only to close the door, and feel the need to touch this woman while talking to her. And why not a friendly punch in the shoulder rather than putting his hands on her waist as if to pull her in for a kiss or something. Oh wait, he changed his mind about that didn't he. it was one hand on the small of the back. Methinks TS was right. He changed his story.
angie2443 Posted June 26, 2008 Posted June 26, 2008 Obviously, as in any marriage, there are a ton of things missing from a brief synopsis, and neither of us (my wife and I) is perfect by any stretch, so, in that sense, I can empathize with the OP. He's likely leaving out a number of things as well, perhaps some of which could support his W's perspective. Again, this is why I was pushing MC, so he could come to "accept" his and his W's incompatibility (if applicable) even if he can't "live" with it. Such education has taught me a lot about myself and I hope that for him. Me? No worries about me. I'm FUBAR Carhill, I've always admired the fact that you can see that you played a part in some of the marriage problems you've had. So many of can't, or at least find it hard to admit that we are partly at fault. I'm in this category but I work on it. I'm glad that MC has at least helped you grow as an individual.
carhill Posted June 26, 2008 Posted June 26, 2008 IMO, MC has furthered the reality that I suspected prior.....that I'm not perfect Seriously, the open discussion of flaws, psychological history and childhood has been an amazing catharsis for someone of my introspective bent. I've learned things about myself that I never thought to exist. I still wish this for my wife. If she could find the avenue to that emotional center I know she has, our M would have a chance. I just can't run on empty forever. That's what I'm hearing from the OP. He's running on empty I hope he can learn some healthy coping tools
Chrome Barracuda Posted June 26, 2008 Posted June 26, 2008 I think your wife needs some help. Dont cheat. it aint worth it.
MrsHellnofires Posted June 27, 2008 Posted June 27, 2008 you cannot change who she is as a person. you either accept it or move on
MrsHellnofires Posted June 27, 2008 Posted June 27, 2008 Wow, thanks for the blanket generalization. Maybe I should rephrase that. The open plm of my right hand was on the left side of the small of her back. I have placed my hand in the same place on male friends, female friends, my daughters, my wife, my brothers, and even my mother in law. I can with great certainty tell you that I was never looking to score with any of them, or "see how far it would go". If you knew me, you'd know that behavior is not in my makeup. what? the waist is a sensitive area... that's where the man grabs during copulation. i think you need to delve deeper into your intentions.
Author mendoman Posted June 27, 2008 Author Posted June 27, 2008 So... this forum has its trolls too! I guess I need to now call my brothers, my mom, and everyone else for trying to copulate with them.For what its worth, my wife and I have talked about this over the last couple of days and she knows that I meant no harm. She's been much more attentive to me than she has in a long time and it's greatly appreciative and well received by me. I'm not sure who it was that posted it earlier, but they were dead on about how much you learn about yourself, why I act and react the way I do, and what I can do to better support my wife's needs. MC was long overdue and I'm so happy we're going there together.
MrsHellnofires Posted June 27, 2008 Posted June 27, 2008 Trolls? If you are not mature enough to handle "advice" or constructive criticism, maybe it's a better idea not to post at all on a message board. You touch your brother's and mother's waist? Maybe you are just an oddball or don't know any better because that is a sexual gesture. Furthermore this is supported by her reaction afterwards.. but you are still in denial about your intentions when it looks like you were tempted to go further. Yes she told you to not kiss her because it would hurt your wife. AT LEAST SOMEONE WAS THINKING ABOUT YOUR WIFE.
Chrome Barracuda Posted June 27, 2008 Posted June 27, 2008 Mendon, people here have been in your wife's position and they have been in yours. it truly is constructive critisim. If she was sleeping around on you and you felt you wasnt getting your needs met, then i might tell you to bounce. But your wifes intimacy problem could be worked out, dont be so denfensive.
Author mendoman Posted June 28, 2008 Author Posted June 28, 2008 Mendon, people here have been in your wife's position and they have been in yours. it truly is constructive critisim. If she was sleeping around on you and you felt you wasnt getting your needs met, then i might tell you to bounce. But your wifes intimacy problem could be worked out, dont be so denfensive. Point well taken. I didn't even think about those who have gone through the hell of being cheated on. Only I know my intentions and I don't need to convince anyone of that to know the truth.As for my troll comment, it was out of line, and I apologize to Mrs. for that.
bish Posted July 8, 2008 Posted July 8, 2008 So... this forum has its trolls too! I guess I need to now call my brothers. You mean you want us to believe that you put your hands on your brother's waists and small of the back?
Chrome Barracuda Posted July 10, 2008 Posted July 10, 2008 You mean you want us to believe that you put your hands on your brother's waists and small of the back? I put my hands around my brother's neck and squeeze and he loves it!!! Especially when he pisses me off. LOL.
blondiepants Posted July 11, 2008 Posted July 11, 2008 So, your wife was throwing up... and you went over to her BEST FRIEND, put your hands on her HIPS, and WHISPERED to her in DIM light? Umm, I'm sorry, but that is highly inappropriate. Is that the way you talk with your guy friends? There is NO way that your intentions were innocent there, I'm sorry. Look dude, it sucks that your marriage is bad. But to hit on another woman while your wife was 2 feet away and SICK (which is exactly what you were doing whether you want to own up to it or not) is f*cked up. I don't buy into this whole "I'm an innocent victim" act. What you did was messed up, and your wife has a right to be pissed about it. If you don't want to be in the marriage, don't be. But disrespecting your wife isn't cool.
Author mendoman Posted July 11, 2008 Author Posted July 11, 2008 Wow, some of you crack me up. Yes, as you read, I did place a hand on the small of her back. Was I looking to get lucky, no. Was it inappropriate? In hindsight, apparently so, but again I'm not wired that way. I don't hit on people that aren't my wife, but I will be very careful where I touch anyone from now on. My wife understands what happened here (was she happy when I told her about it or brought it up in MC? Hardly.), and after hearing from her some other comments that her friend has made directly to my wife without me being around ("You better treat your hubby right or I'm gonna f*** him all night long" - said previous to the hugging incident and was one of several), she has cut off her friendship with her. Our counseling is going really well, and we are communicating better than we have in a long time. It's still rough seas around here, but I think I'm starting to see land in the distance.
whichwayisup Posted July 11, 2008 Posted July 11, 2008 and after hearing from her some other comments that her friend has made directly to my wife without me being around ("You better treat your hubby right or I'm gonna f*** him all night long Wow! That's crazy! Glad that your wife has cut that friend out of her life. She's no friend at all.
blondiepants Posted July 11, 2008 Posted July 11, 2008 You shouldn't have posted. Everyone who thinks that YOU are the problem has been ignored and name-called (trolls). Everyone who blames it on your wife you have responded to kindly. Honestly, it sounds like this is just a very trashy scenario, given what the BF said to your wife. Not my terrain. Good luck with the counseling.
Author mendoman Posted July 11, 2008 Author Posted July 11, 2008 You shouldn't have posted. Everyone who thinks that YOU are the problem has been ignored and name-called (trolls). Everyone who blames it on your wife you have responded to kindly. Honestly, it sounds like this is just a very trashy scenario, given what the BF said to your wife. Not my terrain. Good luck with the counseling. I don't mind the advice, or I wouldn't have posted. The only problem I have is the problem that you have if you post anything about any subject online, and that is some people post just to stir up ****e or to get a rise out of you and others make blanket assumptions that have nothing to do with the original post. I was completely honest with the situation, how it unfolded, what went through my mind, etc..., but some insist that I had some fiendish plan to fool around my wife's (ex-)friend when that didn't even enter my mind. I admitted that what was an innocent touch may have been interpreted far differently than what it meant to me, and I'll be careful from now on. I'll gladly post here again, it's truly been a great help. I'll also gladly call out comments that have an agenda.
guinnessdraft Posted July 12, 2008 Posted July 12, 2008 Hey mendoman, I read most of your post and skip over a few so excuse me if this has already been address. I just wanted to chime in to share my own experience coming from a "silent..stoic..loveless family..." (something along those lines right?). I completely understand the feeling but I have decided to take the complete opposite path from your wife's. I came from a loveless family so I decided at a very young age that I would grow up to be the opposite of my parents. Why has she decided to be just like parents? Some might say that if you didn't come from a loving family how would learn to be affectionate? I don't think being compassionate to another human being is learned though. Everyone has the capacity to be affectionate. Something must have happened to a person to close them off. Even her loveless parents must traumatized by something to close off their natural human instinct to be affectionate. How did I "learn" to be affectionate? By watching others in public and in movies and, for me, reading philosophical books that pinpointed our unaffectionate religion as the cause of my loveless family... In response to the negative comments, I think most people do not read all the posts and the replies. They just want to post something. Don't mind them.
Angel1111 Posted July 13, 2008 Posted July 13, 2008 I suppose, but no amount of MC is going to help if his wife is maintaining a non-negotiable stance on the matter. I mean, it's been 23 years! She is who she is. That's not at all likely to change tomorrow, or 10 years from now. 10 more years....that would make it....33 years. Hmmm.... wanna still be talking about this in the year 2018? I'm guessing she was feeling pretty affectionate when she had her EAs...? Honestly, I don't know what either of you are holding on to. Your lifestyle, having your own bedrooms....what? Just my opinion, but I think you're just wasting your precious time. This marriage is comparable to a one-night stand that should've ended 23 years ago.
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