mixwell Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Okay I had made a post about 2-3 weeks ago on a girl I have been seeing and was reading into her actions a little too early. I'm 25 and is 19 by the way.(Basically after the 1st date I paid for everything and didn't receive a thank you and felt like I was being used) This was my first post/curiosity.. Anyways forward to currently and we have hung out about 8 times and I am still paying for everything... With every other girl I've dated the girl has offered to pay 1/2 and/or drive to hang out. This girl wants me to pick her up and pay for everything all the time basically. She says once the dating phase is over and you are in a relationship then its different as far as the guy putting in all the effort and said something to the effect like thats when she would be expected to drive and pay for things etc.. Up until now I have sucked it up and picked her up and paid for everything. We have became intimate and she has said things on the phone like "I like talking to you" and "I'm glad we met" Well lately what I have been getting annoyed by (this is really lame) was that I wear some shoes that she doesn't like (white reebok) and she has said that she feels like I don't even try when we hang out. The other night, after the movies we were going to eat and I had suggested places that were open (Thursday night @ 11pm by the way) and she turned down every place and then proceeded to get annoyed (I didn't grow up where I live now so I don't know the area too well as far as restaurants etc.) We basically drove around for a while and she said it bothered her that I didn't "plan" where to go eat after the movies since I knew we were hanging out. Seriously she says I don't seem to put in effort but if she really knew me she would know because I NEVER pickup a girl all the time and pay for everything all the time and I have really comprimised by picking her up all the time and paying for everything.. The other night when we hung out she wanted me to order her food for her (while she was still at the table) and I didn't really know but she ended up ordering her food and asked why I didn't. I simply said "You're capable of doing it and every other time you've done so" Like I said I KNOW for sure that she is really into me (signs and verbal she has said so) but it kinda seems like she is trying to test/push me to mold me into something I'm not. Anyways I know this is a long post and I tried to not make it one but too much to type out to explain my thoughts. Basically I'm at the point where I want to tell her that I have comprimised a lot (picking her up and paying for everything) and tried to make her happy (even tho she disagrees because in her mind thats how things should be in the stages of dating.) At this point I am really dissapointed that I have even put in this much effort only to feel like I am expected to do these things. I am willing to let her know how I feel even if it means we will stop seeing each other because thats not how I am and I HATE when i go outta my way to do nice things and feel like I am not appreciated.. I really like this girl and we get along great when hanging out and she is really cute and honestly (even tho not a good excuse) she is probably top 3 girls in bed just because she gets way into it and seems to do everything right that turns me on...... I would hate to stop seeing her because of this but it is kind of a big issue but I'd rather find out now this is a sign of things to come rather than end up in a more serious relationship and be unhappy. So I'd like to know what you all thing and I appreciate any advice. I look forward to checking back in once I wake up and hope someone has some input on this matter. Thanks ! PS> As far as contact goes I usually let her initiate.. (I do text her but most of the time she will call or text me even sometimes early morning before I go to work) I've kinda been thinking about a little of the NC rule and I think if I make her chase me more she will compromise and give in some (stupid logic I know) but as far as telling her how I feel I was thinking about letting her bring up the next time we hang out and then proceed to ask her to drive etc...By the way I did this on the 2nd date and we didn't hang out because I refused to drive but the next day I gave in and picked her up /paid for everything. Peace
saraispiel19 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 okay BINGO! she's 19 and your 25 not a big age difference but it is in the head! Wow if she annoys you that bad why are you even with her-- she sounds like a nagging mother to me- i'd ditch her if i were you and find somoene else. Its early in the relationship and your already having problems- not a good sign. If you happen to want to still be with her (wouldn't see why) try talking to her and tell her how you feel (my expectation is that since as immature as she sounds she'll burst into rage or into tears). umm goodluck to ya. p.s. not implying that 19 y/o are immature and brain dead, there are mature ones out there. p.s.s does she have a job? (if not how can you expect her to pay?) does she live on her own (she has to pay rent an or utilities) or still with her parents? (she's still 19 and might not be ready to be "on her own" so she expects you to pay for everything like her parents are now)- did she just come out of a ugly relationship (maybe thats why she's being 'annoying') or has she never had a boyfriend before. just because someone is good in bed doesn't mean you can make things work out- there are far more important things in a relationship other than sex.
xpaperxcutx Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Yes mixwell I remember your last post about the so- called "princess". After reading what you wrote this time around, I admit I was a bit hard on you the last time. It's been 2-3 weeks, and she doesnt seem to be putting in the effort. You have to consider several things, do you want to be with her because she looks like she's gonna be good in bed, or do you want a long term relationship with her? If you want a long term relationship with her, then you better have a bit of talk with her to get to some understanding. Because you're not even official yet and you're already feeling bitter about her.
Shygirl15 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Small things such as the ones you mentioned can be very annoying actually, and will always get in the way of your relationship. She sounds insensitive to me, or maybe she's just young. At 19, she may not have (steady) income just yet, however she should have at least been grateful to you for covering all that expenses. Sometimes, it's the small gestures that matters. Do yourself a favor and get away from that situation before it goes any further.
Jilly Bean Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Why is this still coming up, Mix? You whined about how fed up with her you were weeks ago, and here it is, all over again. Hit play, rewind, hit play. If you have this much disdain for her, then PLEASE stop seeing her. I think you are behaving like a 17-year old, rather than a 25-year old man. My current bf is 26, and the thought processes and actions of he and you are night and day. BUT, I do think a lot of guys your age are no longer interested in treating women properly, and expect this 50/50 scene from the get-go. Thing is, you're dating a traditional girl who isn't going there. FWIW, I TOTALLY agree with her. I NEVER pay for any dates, nor do I pick up my date or drive myself while I am being courted. If a guy isn't willing to put in the effort during courtship, then I can't be bothered with his lazy, cheap ass. I still vote you stop dating her, as I am struck by the fact that you keep dating her, yet you harbor this massive growing resentment towards her. Im curious - are you generally like this with women you date? See, most people would stop dating someone they were so annoyed with, yet you keep on dating her, and keep on complaining. I wonder if this is just your dating MO, and perhaps its your way of keeping yourself from getting carried away emotionally.
Stockalone Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Mixwell, I agree with Jilly Bean that you shouldn't date her if you don't accept her rules. She wants to be courted, you expect her to pay her share. BUT, I do think a lot of guys your age are no longer interested in treating women properly, and expect this 50/50 scene from the get-go. Thing is, you're dating a traditional girl who isn't going there. If I court a woman, I pay for the dates. But I would also be pissed if I didn't get at least a simple thank you at the end of the day. But that isn't the real issue here. Mixwell insists on 50/50 from the get go. It's not like all women treat a man properly these days. So I can also understand the guys who don't want to do all the courting and pay for everything. Im curious - are you generally like this with women you date? See, most people would stop dating someone they were so annoyed with, yet you keep on dating her, and keep on complaining. I wonder if this is just your dating MO, and perhaps its your way of keeping yourself from getting carried away emotionally. He likes the sex.
imbewildered Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 For f**ks sake get yourself another G/f who is not such a princess. This chick is a royal pain in the aZZ. Date another chick and stop expecting this brat to act like a woman. She is not going to do that until YOU show her that she can be replaced. Give her some competition. Set up YOUR rules and watch her come whimping back . Grow a pair and get started today.
shadowplay Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Unless you're broke, I don't see what the big deal is about you paying for her while you guys are still in the dating phase. I usually go 50-50 on dates, but it annoys me when a guy expecst that a girl will just because he's cheap. I even had a guy ask once if I could split for gas. Plus she's still a teenager and probably doesn't have much money to spend.
Trialbyfire Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 You can't force someone to change. You went into this with full knowledge of her expectations and have agreed to her conditions. Now you're unhappy with them. Have you discussed your unhappiness or laid out your expectations of her? If not, it's pretty passive-aggressive to withdraw without some serious communication. If she won't meet your expectations, then get outta' Dodge!
Tomcat33 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Gees I can't believe people are blaming you for this, as if after two dates you were supposed to know what this girl was all about because of some signs she showed on two measely dates!?!? I think you did the right thing in giving this a shot you needed to try out the relationship with her otherwise you would have kicked yourself for walking away after a couple of dates since you had no idea what this girl was really like. Anyone would kick themselves so early on and in fact I personally think it would have been acting too abruptly over very minimal factual evidence. You owed it to yourself to give it a shot. Now you have given her a fair timelapse to show you what she is about and it seems pretty fair to say she is a princess. I had mentioned that in your other thread weeks ago, and that was on first impressions given that she was not saying "thanks" after dates etc. and what you told us. But of course it is much easier to see something like this from the outside than when you are looking at your object of interest. You need to decide if you can keep this up with someone who clearly needs you hopping through hoops at every turn to please her, and it seems it will only get worse with time. You have the facts now and they are only getting worse so I suppose you to need make some decision now.
daphne Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 I'm with Jilly on this. If you're not interested in what she's asking for, find someone else. She wants to be courted. I don't think she sounds like a princess. Is she asking you to take her for expensive dinners and outings? Where I live, what you're doing is the minimal. It does sound like she hasn't been taught the manners to show appreciation for your efforts, however. If you even want to try to see if you can work something out, you need to communicate to her that you feel taken for granted. That may be the major sticking point. If you felt she truly appreciated what you do, as opposed to feeling like she expects it because she's entitled, you might be happier to make her happy instead of resentful. But she's young and probably hasn't been brought up that way. So let her know that you need it. If she doesn't, move on.
Trialbyfire Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Anyways Forward To Currently And We Have Hung Out About 8 Times gees I Can't Believe People Are Blaming You For This, As If After Two Dates You Were Supposed To Know What This Girl Was All About Because Of Some Signs She Showed On Two Measely Dates!?!? Fyi.......
Tomcat33 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Originally Posted by op Anyways Forward To Currently And We Have Hung Out About 8 Times Quote: Originally Posted by tomcat33 gees I Can't Believe People Are Blaming You For This, As If After Two Dates You Were Supposed To Know What This Girl Was All About Because Of Some Signs She Showed On Two Measely Dates!?!? Fyi....... I was talking about his originals thread where he complained about this girl, and some are claiming now that he should have known THEN what he was getting himself into. I know he now went out with her 8 times I can read thanks, and I think that is what you do, you give someone a chance and you go out with someone many times to see if your initial instincts about them are right. He gave her a fair go I see nothing wrong in that, why tell him now "you knew what you were getting into"? He didn't actually, he doesn't have a crystal ball he can only go on gut feeling and sometimes our "gut feeling" is clouded by our on negative thoughts and that is what he had to figure out what was real and what was not and I see nothing wrong with that. fyi
Trialbyfire Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 I was talking about his originals thread where he complained about this girl, and some are claiming now that he should have known THEN what he was getting himself into. I know he now went out with her 8 times I can read thanks, and I think that is what you do, you give someone a chance and you go out with someone many times to see if your initial instincts about them are right. He gave her a fair go I see nothing wrong in that, why tell him now "you knew what you were getting into"? He didn't actually, he doesn't have a crystal ball he can only go on gut feeling and sometimes our "gut feeling" is clouded by our on negative thoughts and that is what he had to figure out what was real and what was not and I see nothing wrong with that. fyi If you read the original post in this thread, he knows her expectations. He's no victim. You enable someone, when you put up with bad behaviours. Worse yet, you play games without saying anything to her.
Tomcat33 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 You went into this with full knowledge of her expectations and have agreed to her conditions. Now you're unhappy with them. Can you explain what her full expectations were as of two or three weeks ago when Maxwell posted his initial thread? Because I don't remember ever reading anything about what this girl had laid out infront of him in terms of giving him direct evidence of what she would expect from him? Sure she showed signs of what she "could" be like, but there was no clear picture of what to be expected of her. A lot of people even blamed him because if she didn't say thanks after the dates it was no big deal and it was he who was being cheap for complaining of having to pay for the dates!? So clearly she fooled a lot of people not just Max.
Trialbyfire Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 Can you explain what her full expectations were as of two or three weeks ago when Maxwell posted his initial thread? Because I don't remember ever reading anything about what this girl had laid out infront of him in terms of giving him direct evidence of what she would expect from him? Sure she showed signs of what she "could" be like, but there was no clear picture of what to be expected of her. A lot of people even blamed him because if she didn't say thanks after the dates it was no big deal and it was he who was being cheap for complaining of having to pay for the dates!? So clearly she fooled a lot of people not just Max. I don't particularly care what happened in previous threads. My responses are based on the information provided in this thread. If you're interested in providing input into previous threads, bump those up and respond accordingly.
Tomcat33 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 If you read the original post in this thread, he knows her expectations. He's no victim. You enable someone, when you put up with bad behaviours. Worse yet, you play games without saying anything to her. Wow, I think you are being a really harsh on this guy TBF "victim?"?? He knew nothing, people know nothing after two or three dates. In the early stages of dating all we have our perceptions and gut instincts we either go with those feelings or ignore them in the hopes that we are off, and guess what? Sometimes we ARE completely off and wrong about other people, only time tells and I think this is why he was right in giving her time to see if she was as she portrayed herself or if it was all in his head and misreading things. That is what dating is for, personally I wouldn't blame two people for trying and furthermore I would never accuse him of "knowing what they are getting into" when people rarely do when they first start dating, that is what dating is about, getting to know each other.
Tomcat33 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 I don't particularly care what happened in previous threads. My responses are based on the information provided in this thread. If you're interested in providing input into previous threads, bump those up and respond accordingly. Well the information provided here is that he went out with her 8 times and nothing changed, so again what exactly did you see in this thread that lead you to believe he knew full well what he was getting into as you are accusing him? I am really curious to see that.... Because given what he has explianed here and in his past threads I don't see how this guy was expected to know exactly what this girl was about? They are dating it's not like she said to him "look I am a princess and will expect you to jumpe through hoops for me to please me so if you want to proceed with taking me out do so at your own risk" and he said "oooooh well okkk maybe I will try to change you.." if that were the case then I could see why he should be "blamed" for playing the victim.
Trialbyfire Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 As usual TC, you're always right! Anyways OP, you can try to manipulate her to amend her behaviour or you can have a discussion with her, state your boundaries and see if things change. Also, I noticed that she stated that things would change when the two of you entered a relationship. Are you currently in a relationship or is this something that you're also withholding? Food for thought 'cause it takes two to tango! You're no victim so remember that!
Cov Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 I can understand someone wanting to be courted, but her attitude is disgusting and I'd have throw her out of my car for her persistant petulance. She is ill-mannered, offensive and has her head stuck up her rectum. Mixwell, you have done more than enough, you are trying your best and she isn't showing any gratitude, I'd ditch her, she is over-demanding and uncompromising. Dating is supposed to be fun and it doesn't seem like you are having too much of that with this petulant child. I'd find someone worthy of your time. Let her go and demand to some doormat.
Tomcat33 Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 That was a really mature comeback TBF. I see you ran out of facts to backup your argument so resort to lowblows... Technically that would make me right then. Nonsense a girl like this one doesn't stop at ever getting what she wants, when the relationship is formed she may pay for the odd date or drive but then her expectations and unreasonable demands will take on a whole new life, it will be much worse because her demands will become emotional. It will become this monster of needs that won't stop at anything to be satisfied and her expectations will surpass anything this guy could ever imagine or provide. Only a self proclaimed princess can justfy what this manipulative chick is doing and expects. She is a spoiled brat that thinks men should worship the ground she walks on because she has learned a good trick or two in bed, and she looks quite good. A guy will put up with that at first and enter into a relationship while the sex is fun and exciting and then once they are in a full on relationship she will drive him up the wall with her unreasonable demands. A good guy would even be inclined to cheat on a woman like this.... Max get out now before you become something you don't like and you can't repair. Actually I would talk to her before you walk see if she comes around and give her the chance to meet you half way now not later not when you are in a relationship, NOW, she needs to show appreciation now and if she can't see what she is doing then I say walk.
Author mixwell Posted June 21, 2008 Author Posted June 21, 2008 Unless you're broke, I don't see what the big deal is about you paying for her while you guys are still in the dating phase. I usually go 50-50 on dates, but it annoys me when a guy expecst that a girl will just because he's cheap. I even had a guy ask once if I could split for gas. Plus she's still a teenager and probably doesn't have much money to spend. I'm not broke but EVERY girl I have dated will offer to cover her share and drive sometimes. Its not even that I'm cheap, I've seriously at times gone broke hanging out with a girl but I didn't mind because I knew she appreciated it and she would pay for me if she was in that situation. As far as her being a teen and not having money, she actually has a full time job and basically she makes pretty decent money for a 19 yr old.
Author mixwell Posted June 21, 2008 Author Posted June 21, 2008 That was a really mature comeback TBF. I see you ran out of facts to backup your argument so resort to lowblows... Technically that would make me right then. Nonsense a girl like this one doesn't stop at ever getting what she wants, when the relationship is formed she may pay for the odd date or drive but then her expectations and unreasonable demands will take on a whole new life, it will be much worse because her demands will become emotional. It will become this monster of needs that won't stop at anything to be satisfied and her expectations will surpass anything this guy could ever imagine or provide. Only a self proclaimed princess can justfy what this manipulative chick is doing and expects. She is a spoiled brat that thinks men should worship the ground she walks on because she has learned a good trick or two in bed, and she looks quite good. A guy will put up with that at first and enter into a relationship while the sex is fun and exciting and then once they are in a full on relationship she will drive him up the wall with her unreasonable demands. A good guy would even be inclined to cheat on a woman like this.... Max get out now before you become something you don't like and you can't repair. Actually I would talk to her before you walk see if she comes around and give her the chance to meet you half way now not later not when you are in a relationship, NOW, she needs to show appreciation now and if she can't see what she is doing then I say walk. I kinda feel like what you posted. You're right as far as after the 1st thread I decided that I would suck it up and give it some more dates to see if she would offer to put in some of the effort. As far as putting in effort I have done a 180 in my actions just to continue seeing her to feel her out more. What I have decided is that the next time SHE brings up hanging out I am going to tell her that I have tried it under her expectations for the sake of getting to know each other more and that if she doesn't feel like putting in some more effort that I can't see this working out. I in no way put woman on pedistals or act needy and for the most part I am a challenge but I gave into her to feel her out and that is out of character for me. She has made other suggestions that were kinda lame in my opinion (putting her on my tops friends on myspace) and I said uhhhh no.. Anyways I'm going to have a talk with her but I will when she brings up the next hang out and see what she says. I have brought up to her how I feel that I feel she should put in effort and she responds with "thats the guys role".. Anyways yea. Thanks for the input.
Author mixwell Posted June 21, 2008 Author Posted June 21, 2008 Why is this still coming up, Mix? You whined about how fed up with her you were weeks ago, and here it is, all over again. Hit play, rewind, hit play. If you have this much disdain for her, then PLEASE stop seeing her. I think you are behaving like a 17-year old, rather than a 25-year old man. My current bf is 26, and the thought processes and actions of he and you are night and day. BUT, I do think a lot of guys your age are no longer interested in treating women properly, and expect this 50/50 scene from the get-go. Thing is, you're dating a traditional girl who isn't going there. FWIW, I TOTALLY agree with her. I NEVER pay for any dates, nor do I pick up my date or drive myself while I am being courted. If a guy isn't willing to put in the effort during courtship, then I can't be bothered with his lazy, cheap ass. I still vote you stop dating her, as I am struck by the fact that you keep dating her, yet you harbor this massive growing resentment towards her. Im curious - are you generally like this with women you date? See, most people would stop dating someone they were so annoyed with, yet you keep on dating her, and keep on complaining. I wonder if this is just your dating MO, and perhaps its your way of keeping yourself from getting carried away emotionally. Jilly I decided to suck it up for the fact that I wanted to feel her out more. After input on the 1st thread I decided I was being too critical from the 1st few dates and decided I should give it longer to feel it out (which I did) so I'm not whining just trying to get input.. The fact that you think I'm acting like I'm 17 is a biased opinion because you expect the same things she does.. Rather than giving logical input seems like you try to bash me because I don't think like you do.. This day and age it is common for woman and men to pay deutch when they go out and from past experience thats how my dates have been. I didn't know treating a woman properly meant that you should pay for everything I treat woman very well (open doors, compliment them, walk on the outside on sidewalks and in parking lots make sure she is closest to the parked cars and I'm on the outside) My mother actually forced these habits into me when I was growing up by standing in front of a door until I got the clue to open it (when I would wonder what the hell she was doing) Anyways I feel that I have a lot to offer and shouldn't have to pay for everything to make a girl want to hang out. I'm not ignorant when it comes to dating and I pickup on a lot of little signs that woman do and tests they put men through to see what they can get away with. The only confusing thing is that she is genuine in the fact that she is interested so I know (prior to the last thread) that she isn't just using me but I feel like her fantasy expectations are a little far fetched and I'm getting fed up with it. I don't hold any resentment towards her but I'm thinking its time to tell her if she doesn't want to put in more effort to hang out and cover her 1/2 then I cannot continue to see her. I know I'm a good catch and I've been told by a lot of people (men and woman) that I have an awesome personality. If anything I feel like I am lowering my value by paying for everything because I don't put any single female above me because I know she can be replaced. I try to see myself as the catch because I know I stand out from a lot of typical guys that give into woman and kiss their azz all the time which is now kinda how I feel like I'm acting by trying to compromise and feel this chick out some more.
Jilly Bean Posted June 21, 2008 Posted June 21, 2008 No, I gave you logical input. More than once. And that was STOP DATING HER. I am still agog that you are going to continue dating her, even though you have such disdain and bitterness towards her. She's not going to change. She is old-fashioned, and believes in being courted. You do not agree with this dating principle. So, why are you bothering to date her further so you can still complain about what a princess she is? Since you feel she and I think alike on this - take it from me. She will NOT change on this. You feeling that you are worth more than this, or you feeling you don't want to put her on a pedestal, or you thinking she is making you kiss her a**, WILL NOT CHANGE her attitudes on dating. I guess what is so appalling is that you write about her with such underlying venom. It's just chilling to picture you being on a date with her and then thinking and feeling so much hostility towards her. That feels pretty creepy, actually. You also seem to somehow think money spend on a date and who spends it is tied to ones value. Or that you are "devalued" because you are treating her on a date. That is rather twisted logic, no? What I am really starting to get from you is that you are rather insecure, and that you feel that paying for a date is equated with you having to buy her company. I get the vibe that you are not believing she is actually interested in you, but only interested in what you can buy her. THAT is why you keep entwining this money, dating and interest thing.
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