Narcissist or selfish?

[lexi29]

What is the difference between a narcissist and just a very selfish person? I've read some threads here on narcissism as well as info on the internet and I'm starting to recognize narcisstic traits in the men around me -my fiance, my father, my boss. Mainly the lack of empathy for others and the sort of self centeredness. For example, my dad is a very charming guy. To strangers he's always the "nice guy" but if you are close to him-watch out! He's not a horrible person just has some very close minded, critical views of his own family members. ANd he has NO lack of empathy for others. Once I was thrown off a horse and broke both legs and I was at my house when this happened and was in so much pain I was crying (didn't know I"d broken both legs) and I hobbled to the door and my dad opened the door, asked what happened, screamed at me that I deserved it and slammed the door in my face. I was in so much pain I was trying desperately not to pass out (everything kept going black) and if I had passed out I would have fallen on our concrete porch.

 

Also he is in a fight over my grandmother's estate with his sister and he's done everything underhanded to upset his sister. He called the police on her and threatened to have her arrested.

 

My fiance basically will let people do things for him and doesn't seem to appreciate it. He can also be very cold to those who no longer mean anythign to him (exes). his last ex he was only with for 3 weeks but they had become friends first and he seemed to genuinely like her. But the way he treated her at the end (and beginning he cheated) of their relationship was horrible. He just cut her out and was done with her. He seemed to delight in the fact that she was so upset/hurt over him and said that she will probably never talk to him again because she wanted to marry him (yes, after two weeks of dating she suggested they get married) and now she knows he is marrying me so he thinks she is probably very depressed at losing him.

 

My boss seems to lack empathy for others as he is always "pretending" to act concerned about things but for example my grandmother died and I told him I'd be off for a few days and instead of offering his sympathy he laughed, patted me on the back and told me to enjoy my vacation! Also we always do nice things for him- cakes for his birthday, boss' day, cards etc, bake him cookies. And he NEVER does anything for any of his employees. Doesn't even acknowledge our birthday or anything but EXPECTS us to celebrate his.

 

Are these examples of selfish individuals or possibly narcissist behaviors? Has anyone dated a narcissist? what was your experience?

[daphne]

Your boss sounds like a selfish prick.

 

Your father sounds closer to a sociopath. He could just be a really cold bastard. Yikes. I can't believe he did that to you when you broke your legs. I hope you aren't close. Angelina set a good example by keeping her father at a distance to keep unhealthy out.

 

Your fiancé concerns me the most, because you're in an intimate relationship with him and he can hurt you. The way he's acted towards his ex is pretty terrible. You must know that if things don't work between the two of you, he's going to treat you exactly the same way he treated her. He is not a good guy. Unless she has done something really damaging to her, his pettiness and mean spiritedness is a huge red flag.

 

Can you live with knowing that if it doesn't work out, you'll be discarded and ridiculed for hurting? I know I can't.

[Trialbyfire]

Here's a link to symptoms of NPD.

http://psychologytoday.com/conditions/narcissistic.html

 

Before you start trying to diagnose someone with it, better for the person to get a psychological examination.

 

Most people are selfish to a degree, some worse than others. NPD is not only the ultimate in selfishness, it's a complete inability to empathize with anyone. They can also be hypersensitive to criticism aka "everyone is against me".

[Cherry Blossom 35]

This is so bizarre, because I just looked up "narcissistic parent" about 15 minutes ago. I'm no psychiatrist, but I am pretty darned sure my mother has this personality disorder.

 

I have a very similar story to your broken legs. I fell off a swingset and CRAWLED half a mile home with a sprained ankle. I was six years old and in terrific pain. She did not even believe me and would not listen to me tell her how much pain I was in. I was pretty sure something was very wrong. It was.

 

I have mountains of examples of her narcissism, but since this is not about me (wink, wink) I won't go any further.

 

1. Extremely self-absorbed

2. Lack of empathy is a HALLMARK of the disorder, and some believe that the difference between healthy narcissism and the disorder is this trait.

3. Very low self-esteem.

4. Has to be right.

5. Cannot tolerate criticism

6. Easily offended

 

It goes on...your dad definitely sounds like a narcissist. Children who grow up with a parent like this accomodate themselves to the parents needs. They learn this adaptive behavior and tend to find situations as adults that mirror this relationship. i.e. your fiance, boss. I know I have done this many times.

 

This article is interesting and insightful.

 

http://www.alanrappoport.com/Co-Narcissism%20Article.pdf

[imbewildered]

This is so bizarre, because I just looked up "narcissistic parent" about 15 minutes ago. I'm no psychiatrist, but I am pretty darned sure my mother has this personality disorder.

 

I have a very similar story to your broken legs. I fell off a swingset and CRAWLED half a mile home with a sprained ankle. I was six years old and in terrific pain. She did not even believe me and would not listen to me tell her how much pain I was in. I was pretty sure something was very wrong. It was.

 

I have mountains of examples of her narcissism, but since this is not about me (wink, wink) I won't go any further.

 

1. Extremely self-absorbed

2. Lack of empathy is a HALLMARK of the disorder, and some believe that the difference between healthy narcissism and the disorder is this trait.

3. Very low self-esteem.

4. Has to be right.

5. Cannot tolerate criticism

6. Easily offended

 

It goes on...your dad definitely sounds like a narcissist. Children who grow up with a parent like this accomodate themselves to the parents needs. They learn this adaptive behavior and tend to find situations as adults that mirror this relationship. i.e. your fiance, boss. I know I have done this many times.

 

This article is interesting and insightful.

 

http://www.alanrappoport.com/Co-Narcissism%20Article.pdf

 

Another danger sign of an NPD is their total terror at the prospect of being exposed as "not perfect ". They will insult, belittle and abuse and brutalize anyone, including any member their own family, who threatens to look behing their facade and expose their "flaws".

[Nevermind]

But the way he treated her at the end (and beginning he cheated) of their relationship was horrible. He just cut her out and was done with her. He seemed to delight in the fact that she was so upset/hurt over him and said that she will probably never talk to him again because she wanted to marry him (yes, after two weeks of dating she suggested they get married) and now she knows he is marrying me so he thinks she is probably very depressed at losing him.

 

I just marked some of the things that should make you run. But, you insist to marry despite all the red flags. Personally, I think he is using you because you will be able to provide him and his son for a home. Harsh? Yes. But your reality might very well turn out like this and worse.

[Cherry Blossom 35]

Another danger sign of an NPD is their total terror at the prospect of being exposed as "not perfect ". They will insult, belittle and abuse and brutalize anyone, including any member their own family, who threatens to look behing their facade and expose their "flaws".

 

Very very very very true. Their personality and orientation towards the world is a very carefully constructed facade. This faced is very fragile, though, and any threats of exposure may result on bouts of rage and blame.

 

My mother lives in a somewhat upscale area in the midwest. It is a nice place to live but has its own set of problems. If I ever mention any kind of criticism of the place, she guilts me. So you must have had a terrible childhood, huh? Guilt is a big motivator of some people with NPD.

 

If anyone says anything slightly negative about the midwest, she gets really upset and takes it very personally. Don't even think about calling it fly-over country!

 

Her MO is to use rage, guilt, and blame to control others (especially me) view of her. If you disagree or have your own opinion on something that lies a little too close to her concept of herself, she will get extremely angry within seconds, try to make you feel like a horrible person for making her feel this way, then storm off. The person left behind feels as though they need to "make everything okay".

 

I have struggled throughout my life to become a whole person in the face of this. I have had massive problems with anxiety and sometimes depression. I didn't even fully understand where some of my anxieties came from until recently.

 

Your fiance is not someone who is going to be there for you when you're feeling down. He will most likely not understand, and in turn will make you feel bad about it. You may have already experienced this. I urge you to examine your relationship with your father and see if you are not playing some of this out with the fiance.

[lexi29]

Your boss sounds like a selfish prick.

 

Your father sounds closer to a sociopath. He could just be a really cold bastard. Yikes. I can't believe he did that to you when you broke your legs. I hope you aren't close. Angelina set a good example by keeping her father at a distance to keep unhealthy out.

 

Your fiancé concerns me the most, because you're in an intimate relationship with him and he can hurt you. The way he's acted towards his ex is pretty terrible. You must know that if things don't work between the two of you, he's going to treat you exactly the same way he treated her. He is not a good guy. Unless she has done something really damaging to her, his pettiness and mean spiritedness is a huge red flag.

 

Can you live with knowing that if it doesn't work out, you'll be discarded and ridiculed for hurting? I know I can't.

 

 

I know and I am wary of my fiance acting like that (I've never heard him talk about any of his other exes that way when they broke up) so I dont' know if maybe he is laying it on thick to show me she means nothing to him (because he knows it hurt me when he left me to be with her) and he wants to insult her and show she didn't mean anything to him so that I feel better about the situation, if that makes any sense. He never really said anything horrible to her face, other than it was moving too fast and he didn't have feelings for her that he thought he did and that she wasn't the same person he remembered. He never (that I know of) verbalized to her that he thought she was a little off the deep end (her proposing marriage after two weeks of dating him and this was after he cheated on her).

 

I think he just said all that to me to make me feel better or something. As for him cheating on her, he started dating her a week or so after he left me so it was more of a rebound than anything. He didn't have any time to get me out of his system or to get over me and I just happened to stop over and he had the opportunity (I didnt' know they were dating) While he shouldn't have cheated on her I dont think he felt connected to her yet, he still had feelings (lust obviously) for me. While cheating is wrong in any situation, I would be much more concerned (and would never give him another chance) if he cheated on someone in a long term relationship. And when he told me about his ex and how she was probably "crying her eyes out" because he dumped her it sounded more like he was bragging that someone fell for him so quickly. Which isn't good either but I don't care for the girl so it does make me feel better when he says not-flattering things about her (maybe I"m the sociopath here lol). He doesnt' talk about her anymore this was just when we got back together.

[lexi29]

Very very very very true. Their personality and orientation towards the world is a very carefully constructed facade. This faced is very fragile, though, and any threats of exposure may result on bouts of rage and blame.

 

My mother lives in a somewhat upscale area in the midwest. It is a nice place to live but has its own set of problems. If I ever mention any kind of criticism of the place, she guilts me. So you must have had a terrible childhood, huh? Guilt is a big motivator of some people with NPD.

 

If anyone says anything slightly negative about the midwest, she gets really upset and takes it very personally. Don't even think about calling it fly-over country!

 

Her MO is to use rage, guilt, and blame to control others (especially me) view of her. If you disagree or have your own opinion on something that lies a little too close to her concept of herself, she will get extremely angry within seconds, try to make you feel like a horrible person for making her feel this way, then storm off. The person left behind feels as though they need to "make everything okay".

 

I have struggled throughout my life to become a whole person in the face of this. I have had massive problems with anxiety and sometimes depression. I didn't even fully understand where some of my anxieties came from until recently.

 

Your fiance is not someone who is going to be there for you when you're feeling down. He will most likely not understand, and in turn will make you feel bad about it. You may have already experienced this. I urge you to examine your relationship with your father and see if you are not playing some of this out with the fiance.

 

 

OMG you have described my father to a tee. I am not very close to him but its hard because when he does show any kind of affection or appreciation I just suck it up and it makes me so happy. And I think its actually "safe" to have a close relationship with him and then I'm slapped in the face with the reality of the situation when he acts like his "normal" self again.

 

When I look into my past, I think my ex had narcissistic tendencies as well. He wasn't overly cruel to people but he was very self involved. He was an only child and thought the world revolved around him. He had no empathy for other people I realized after a time. He was very upset when his grandfather passed away (they were very close) but for example when my grandfather died and I had to go to the funeral (and the cause of death was very sudden so its not as though it was expected) my ex went thru the motions of "are you ok?" and hugging me, but a few days after the funeral I was still upset and he was just like ok he's dead, get over it. Because my greiving was interfering in HIS life (not making him happy).

 

My dad handled this very badly as well. The cause of death was suicide and of course it was a closed casket but the family members (my mom and her siblings) were allowed to view the body the night before the funeral. My mom was hesitant to do so but she wanted to support her siblings so she went and she asked my dad to stay at home (she was afraid of the extent of the damage the bullet had caused sorry to be graphic) and didn't want anyone else (other than her sister and brothers) to see their father like this). Well instead of respecting my mom's wishes my dad was outraged that HE was being asked to stay behind and refused to try to understand that it was a private time for my mom and she needed him to respect that. My dad made it all about HIM and fought with my mom (who was already distraught) about how she was making him feel unwanted etc) So while my mom was already stunned and grieving the loss of her dad, my father was laying this huge guilt trip on her about how HIS feelings were disregarded and she ended up appologizing to HIM.

 

 

If I am feeling down, my fiance does not make me feel bad about it. he will try to cheer me up by making me laugh, tickling me (if its just a bad day) or asking me to talk about what's wrong. He is usually very loving toward me its just sometimes he's not very appreciative of things that people do for him that makes me wonder.

[Nevermind]

I think he just said all that to me to make me feel better or something. As for him cheating on her, he started dating her a week or so after he left me so it was more of a rebound than anything. He didn't have any time to get me out of his system or to get over me and I just happened to stop over and he had the opportunity (I didnt' know they were dating) While he shouldn't have cheated on her I dont think he felt connected to her yet, he still had feelings (lust obviously) for me. While cheating is wrong in any situation, I would be much more concerned (and would never give him another chance) if he cheated on someone in a long term relationship.

 

You are giving out reasons for his behaviour. Imho not very sound reasons. he left you for her. Read this sentence. Understand it. He cheated on her with you. That wasn't your fault, but very much his. He cheated on someone in the first days of their relationship. That is wrong, and it is not made better by the fact that they had not been going out for a long time. It's actually worse.

 

 

And when he told me about his ex and how she was probably "crying her eyes out" because he dumped her it sounded more like he was bragging that someone fell for him so quickly. Which isn't good either but I don't care for the girl so it does make me feel better when he says not-flattering things about her (maybe I"m the sociopath here lol). He doesnt' talk about her anymore this was just when we got back together.

He is feeling good about hurting someone? Uh, sorry. Red flag. You don't need to feel for the girl, but realize what you are seeing here: a heartless, smug loser.

[lexi29]

You are giving out reasons for his behaviour. Imho not very sound reasons. he left you for her. Read this sentence. Understand it. He cheated on her with you. That wasn't your fault, but very much his. He cheated on someone in the first days of their relationship. That is wrong, and it is not made better by the fact that they had not been going out for a long time. It's actually worse.

 

 

He is feeling good about hurting someone? Uh, sorry. Red flag. You don't need to feel for the girl, but realize what you are seeing here: a heartless, smug loser.

 

 

Here I go defending his again, I know I will get jumped on for this but I guess my reasoning for doing so is that I love this guy. I need him in my life and he makes me happy. (and if he's nothing more than a piece of sh*t then that means there is something terribly wrong with me and I dont' want that to be the case so I defend him). Obviously if I thought he was perfect I wouldn't be posting here. I'm not saying he is Mr. Wonderful to everyone, yes he has faults. In a perfect world no one would ever say anything bad about anyone. I'm not sure if he was saying the bad things about her (that she was probably hurt which was true) and that he didn't miss her at all because he was trying to prove to me that she meant nothing to him (to make me feel better) or because he honestly enjoyed hurting her (hope thats not the case) He broke up with her because she told him not to have any contact with me, because she wanted to marry him after only a few weeks, because he had fallen for the girl (she was an ex) that she was when she was 18- ten years ago. She was still stuck in the past (she even gave him her senior pictures from high school even though now she looks nothing like that at all!) and he realized that he was too and didn't like the person she actually was now. She had been crowing about how he left her for me and how she screwed me over and maybe he thougth it would make me feel better to hear him say how badly she was probably hurting now (realistically she shouldnt' have been that torn up as she only dated him for 3 weeks and his son couldn't stand her) As for the cheating, yes that worries me (see my many posts about trust issues). We never had an incident where he cheated on me (some will say that the way he left me to date her was almost considered cheating) but I've been cheated on and if he really wanted to he could have secretly dated her or slept with her behind my back (and I"m sure she would have gone for it as she is now dating a married man) to "try her out" to see if a relationship would work out between them before he cut ties with me. But he didn't. Now I"m not going to give him a medal for that or anything because it was still wrong but instead of sneaking around or cheating on me he ended things and then started dating her. As for cheating on her, I know that was wrong. Of course I secretly take great joy in that fact (because she betrayed me as well) it does worry me because now I know what he is capable of. I think it was more circumstances than anything else as well as he wasn't over me (doesn't make it right) but just a contributing factor. I'm not excusing it, in fact that incident is where most of my trust issues come from.

 

Also I honestly don't think he is heartless. He has a 9 year old son who lives with him. If he was heartless he wouldn't have sought out custody of his son, he wouldn't have taken care of him since he was a year old (when he wasn't even sure if he was biologically his son), he wouldn't have fought the child's mother for custody. He gets no monetary gain from the arrangement (the mother doesn't pay any child support or do anything financially for her son). If my fiance didn't have his son living with him he would be able to live in a smaller apartment, wouldn't have to spend his money on things for his son and could instead have money to buy himself things he wants- a new truck, a boat, going out with friends etc. he wouldnt' have to have the responsibilities of caring for his son, finding babysitters etc. He would have a lot more $ than he has now and his life would be much more convenient if he'd just let his son's mother keep him full time and he would just send a check and see him on weekends or something. Or not at all if he was heartless. If he was all about himself, I dont' see why he would do all this for his son. He FOUGHT the mother for custody she didn't give up her son (she wanted the child support payments to continue) if he was only thinking of himself he would have saved money (by only having to pay child support) and just have been an occassional weekend dad or not at all.

[Nevermind]

You need him? For what?

 

He is a father, alright. Very few people are completely rotten to the core. This doesn't mean that he is a good person or will make a good husband. He is decent to his son - good. He has yet to prove that he will be decent to you as well.

[xpaperxcutx]

People has a tendency to treat people differently. Like I would treat my girlfriends better than I would guys ( because I have bad experiences with guys). The same thing could be said of your fiance, he loves his son so he saw the responsibility to raise him. But the whole cheating with you on the ex could mean a total lack of respect for woman. Who knows?

[Trialbyfire]

lexi, in order for your future relationship/marriage to proceed in a reasonable fashion, you have to be willing to understand, accept and live with who your fiancé is. From what you've posted on LS, he's selfish and immature.

[carhill]

People has a tendency to treat people differently. Like I would treat my girlfriends better than I would guys ( because I have bad experiences with guys). The same thing could be said of your fiance, he loves his son so he saw the responsibility to raise him. But the whole cheating with you on the ex could mean a total lack of respect for woman. Who knows?

OP, pay attention to this. I've seen many examples of it throughout my life.

 

Remember, a man who has a successful son brings honor and admiration to himself ("Look how well I did"). You might see a different dynamic with a daughter, in this case.

 

No indictments here, just a voice of caution. I think the issues you've been raising since my joining this forum are valid. Listen to your inner voice. I've seen the "hold" some men have on their women and, frankly, some of the perspectives you've shared make me think of those instances. If you're still getting married in September, I'd be deep in PMC right about now.

[lexi29]

I just finished reading the link that TBF posted (thanks) and most of the symptoms don't fit my fiance other than lack of empathy for others in certain situations. But this part really stuck out to me

 

"People with narcissistic personality disorder are frequently perfectionists and need to be the center of attention, receiving affection and admiration, and controlling the situation. To get the attention he craves, he may try to create crises that return the focus to him"

 

My close guy friend's girlfriend is like this and it drives everyone crazy! She tries to control everything he does for example this weekend he wanted some alone time (they live together) and she wanted to see her dad for father's day and he wanted to go to his niece's birthday party. So he suggested they go their separate ways for the day and she said she was ok with it (after trying to guilt trip him into staying with her for the day) She told him she doesn't like to be alone and wanted him to go to her dad's with her because he is her boyfriend. Well he didnt' give in so practically the whole day she caused drama and set up all these little crisises so that he basically was on the phone with her the entire day and didn't get to enjoy his "alone" time. SHe does this constantly. Once we were supposed to go out to eat (just he and I) and his girlfriend said she was ok with it but then spent the evening calling him and picking fights and crying and finally he just left early because she had ruined our meal anyway and he didnt' feel like hanging out anymore because of her drama.

 

She is a person who thinks she is perfectly "normal" and everyone else is the one with the problem , but she will turn everything around so its all about her constantly!!

I found out I even have some of the symptoms - I over react to criticism at times and I am easily jealous (in romantic relationships). hmmm interesting.

[sunshinegirl]

I have become curious about where 'emotional unavailability' fits into this spectrum between selfish and narcissistic. I suspect it's somewhere in the middle.

 

My ex told me point blank that he couldn't empathize with people. Oddly, I didn't see this as a flag, instead I thought "great! he knows himself and is honest about one of his weaknesses" - after all, he wasn't bragging about it or saying it was a good thing.

 

However, he was absolutely telling me the truth. He is extremely stoic, to the point of showing almost no emotion in any situation. He doesn't let himself feel things deeply, and as a result he has no ability to empathize with what others are feeling. I could list of many, many examples - it is the core reason why I felt lonely even when I was with him. I just never got the sense that he CARED.

 

What really threw me off was that he was totally loving and present to his daughter. So, to the points made above that people are different with different people, I wholeheartedly agree. My ex is definitely a responsible father - he loves his child and she is #1 in his life. But you know what? I am starting to believe he is simply not able to treat the adults in his life with the same care or respect. I suspect this is a biological/evolutionary thing - he is hardwired to love his kid (who, by the way unconditionally loves him back, making it EASY to love her because there is no RISK involved).

 

I got really derailed by thinking he was capable of treating me with the same compassion/presence/emotion that he does his child. I was really, really wrong.

[Trialbyfire]

"Emotional unavailability" can be situational. It depends on his experiences previous to meeting you, such as a bad break up, etc.

 

If I recall correctly sunshinegirl, your ex was cheated on. Sometimes this can cause some serious trust issues, enough to not want to ever invest again. It depends on how each individual chooses to address it or as many do, deny it.

[sunshinegirl]

"Emotional unavailability" can be situational. It depends on his experiences previous to meeting you, such as a bad break up, etc.

 

If I recall correctly sunshinegirl, your ex was cheated on. Sometimes this can cause some serious trust issues, enough to not want to ever invest again. It depends on how each individual chooses to address it or as many do, deny it.

 

Yes, good memory, he was cheated on. But keep going back in his life story and his MO is exactly the same. His best friend from college has confirmed to me that he behaved exactly the same way 15 years ago as he did with me... and that his "emotional unavailability / lack of communication" was the primary reason (not excuse) that his wife cheated and left him.

 

So, yeah, situational EU I can understand. But I doubt someone loses all ability to empathize with others in situational EU. From what I know of my ex, any situational EU he has is just on top of what seems to be an ingrained EU pattern of dealing with life and people.

 

I am extremely curious to see how things will play out with the hooch. Of course I am hoping it all blows up, that his trust issues are too big and his unwillingness to address them in any serious way will prohibit him from forming a healthy, trusting attachment to anyone for a long, long time.

 

Wish I weren't so bitter about it right now, but there you have it. I will be really really upset if I learn everything's awesome and wonderful and trusting and happy with the hooch, especially given their...shall we say...inauspicious start.

[Trialbyfire]

Yes, good memory, he was cheated on. But keep going back in his life story and his MO is exactly the same. His best friend from college has confirmed to me that he behaved exactly the same way 15 years ago as he did with me... and that his "emotional unavailability / lack of communication" was the primary reason (not excuse) that his wife cheated and left him.

 

So, yeah, situational EU I can understand. But I doubt someone loses all ability to empathize with others in situational EU. From what I know of my ex, any situational EU he has is just on top of what seems to be an ingrained EU pattern of dealing with life and people.

 

I am extremely curious to see how things will play out with the hooch. Of course I am hoping it all blows up, that his trust issues are too big and his unwillingness to address them in any serious way will prohibit him from forming a healthy, trusting attachment to anyone for a long, long time.

 

Wish I weren't so bitter about it right now, but there you have it. I will be really really upset if I learn everything's awesome and wonderful and trusting and happy with the hooch, especially given their...shall we say...inauspicious start.

He sounds like the kind of person who can only open up to "safe" people such as his daughter.

 

As for cheating, that in itself is entirely an issue within the person who cheats since they weren't strong enough to resist temptation. People with strength walk, they don't cheat.

[imbewildered]

 

"People with narcissistic personality disorder are frequently perfectionists and need to be the center of attention, receiving affection and admiration, and controlling the situation. To get the attention he craves, he may try to create crises that return the focus to him"

 

My close guy friend's girlfriend is like this and it drives everyone crazy!

 

THis behavior also is also common in Borderline Personality Disorder and perhaps a good chunk of Histrionic PD thrown in. These are the usual PDs common in abusive women. Narcissitic PD is predominantly a male disorder.

[imbewildered]

As for cheating, that in itself is entirely an issue within the person who cheats since they weren't strong enough to resist temptation. People with strength walk, they don't cheat.

 

Yes. cheating is a character flaw, a defect in the constitution of the cheater. THis view flies in opposion to the lame, hand wringing view of your neighborhood therapist who will often explain or excuse the cheater's behavior as " not getting their needs met inside the relationship". What a crock of NewAge crud..

Cheating is THE most selfish act in an LTR.

 

Cheating on your SO creates an irreparable breach of loyalty, trust and is a fundamental abandonment of every element which holds a relationship intact.

[Trialbyfire]

Yes. cheating is a character flaw, a defect in the constitution of the cheater. THis view flies in opposion to the lame, hand wringing view of your neighborhood therapist who will often explain or excuse the cheater's behavior as " not getting their needs met inside the relationship". What a crock of NewAge crud..

Cheating is THE most selfish act in an LTR.

 

Cheating on your SO creates an irreparable breach of loyalty, trust and is a fundamental abandonment of every element which holds a relationship intact.

While I find your opinion of therapists a gross generalization, I won't disagree with your analysis of cheaters. It is the ultimate in selfishness. My ex-H committed infidelity and also had NPD. Hmmm...any correlation?

[sunshinegirl]

Interesting article on "empathy deficit disorder":

 

http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/personal/06/18/o.empathy/index.html