Stockalone Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 Also, I don't believe in a man financially depending on me. I would think lesser of someone who doesn't have an equal drive to succeed. I agree that people with very different career (and financial) ambitions are not a good match. But what about a man who is less ambitious than you but is capable of supporting himself? Would you also think less of such a man because he doesn't share your drive to succeed?
Trialbyfire Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 I agree that people with very different career (and financial) ambitions are not a good match. But what about a man who is less ambitious than you but is capable of supporting himself? Would you also think less of such a man because he doesn't share your drive to succeed? No, as long as he's not an underachiever. I have a thing for intelligent men.
Author MaxManwell Posted June 15, 2008 Author Posted June 15, 2008 Yes and no. It's not a paid requirement, if you get my meaning. I don't believe in financial dependence on a man where I must serve him to accommodate his every need. What I believe in is equality of caring and responsibilities, where both of you want to please each other. Also, I don't believe in a man financially depending on me. I would think lesser of someone who doesn't have an equal drive to succeed. I just looked up the definition of the word and there are no real disrespectful connotations attached to the word in regards to the person providing the service. The term is a verb used to describe an act for the benefit of another person or entity. I think the word has been twisted in the minds of people who have their own issues. I am not so concerned with the financial status of a person but it does make me a little bit sad that Women are so partial to the financial status of a man. With the equal drive to succeed comment we tread into some dangerous territory. I don't consider people who do not have money to be anything other than a person who doesn't have money. I won't make any further speculations about their drive to succeed or any other personal attribute they may or may not have. When we start saying those sorts of things we tread into seriously dangerous ground in terms of generalizations and stereotypes. However at present such generalizations are widespread and what is worse considered acceptable and by some to be factual.
OpenBook Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 With the equal drive to succeed comment we tread into some dangerous territory. Gee I thought we already WERE in dangerous territory, with the "woman should serve her man" thread theme... Are we not reacting outrageously enough for ya there Max??
Trialbyfire Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 Maxmanwell, I live a particular lifestyle, paid for by hardwork, drive and perservance. There were no handouts. I will not lower my standards of living for anyone else. I expect the same to hold true for any man I have a relationship with. You can take that to mean anything you want.
Author MaxManwell Posted June 15, 2008 Author Posted June 15, 2008 Maxmanwell, I live a particular lifestyle, paid for by hardwork, drive and perservance. There were no handouts. I will not lower my standards of living for anyone else. I expect the same to hold true for any man I have a relationship with. You can take that to mean anything you want. If I were to love a woman I would love her in the same way, no matter what her lot in life.
roxy_1980 Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 I think the most important thing that people need to do before moving in together (whether married or not) is have a serious diiscussion about the division of labour in that relationship. If you don't talk about how things are expected, it is going to arise that someone with be disappointed and frustrated. Maybe both. Why are we so afraid to ask our partners what we want from a relationship? Why can't we talk about these things? If a husband expects his new wife to serve him and she doesn't, well, he takes it personally. If a wife expects her new husband to fix the shed, but he doesn't, she thinks he's not taking care of her. But they never said anything. It does not have to the traditional roles, but you do have to talk. Figure out what works best for both of you.
Author MaxManwell Posted June 15, 2008 Author Posted June 15, 2008 Maxmanwell, I live a particular lifestyle, paid for by hardwork, drive and perservance. There were no handouts. I will not lower my standards of living for anyone else. I expect the same to hold true for any man I have a relationship with. You can take that to mean anything you want. I could never think like that. I'm working class it is in my culture and in my blood it will be a part of me until the day I die. I could never turn my back on so many people that I grew up with and that I loved so much. I know some people are born more able than others and that some just have better luck. I wouldn't blame anyone for the path life has given them. Not now and not ever. You work hard and you become the best that you can be; and that is all I would ever ask of someone is that they give it a shot.
Trialbyfire Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 If I were to love a woman I would love her in the same way, no matter what her lot in life. I understand and that's something. I won't negate it because I find it sweet. I'm not so sweet. I have to respect my partner in all ways, as is my expectation that he feel the same. I need someone who can handle me, which means that he needs to be a very strong man. If he's not, I would mow right over him. That is who I am, right or wrong.
Stockalone Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 No, as long as he's not an underachiever. I have a thing for intelligent men. Underachieving how? Financially?
Trialbyfire Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 I could never think like that. I'm working class it is in my culture and in my blood it will be a part of me until the day I die. I could never turn my back on so many people that I grew up with and that I loved so much. I know some people are born more able than others and that some just have better luck. I wouldn't blame anyone for the path life has given them. Not now and not ever. You work hard and you become the best that you can be; and that is all I would ever ask of someone is that they give it a shot. I have friends in different places in life, although most come from similar backgrounds and are of similar drives and beliefs. I've yet to turn my back on anyone due to their lot in life. But... I've yet to date a man who doesn't have drive and the need to succeed.
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 I could never think like that. I'm working class it is in my culture and in my blood it will be a part of me until the day I die. I could never turn my back on so many people that I grew up with and that I loved so much. I know some people are born more able than others and that some just have better luck. I wouldn't blame anyone for the path life has given them. Not now and not ever. You work hard and you become the best that you can be; and that is all I would ever ask of someone is that they give it a shot. Max, do you mind telling us what country you live in?
Trialbyfire Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 Underachieving how? Financially? In all ways. I can't imagine being with someone who lives from pay cheque to pay cheque, not being fiscally responsible, spending beyond his means.
Author MaxManwell Posted June 15, 2008 Author Posted June 15, 2008 Max, do you mind telling us what country you live in? You should have figured out by now that I do not answer specific questions about myself on this forum. I do not want to be identified.
Author MaxManwell Posted June 15, 2008 Author Posted June 15, 2008 In all ways. I can't imagine being with someone who lives from pay cheque to pay cheque, not being fiscally responsible, spending beyond his means. Well that is different and I agree with you there I would not want to date someone who could not herself either.
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 You should have figured out by now that I do not answer specific questions about myself on this forum. I do not want to be identified. No need to talk to me that way, Max. I'm just trying to get a handle on your life situation so I can respond accordingly.
Author MaxManwell Posted June 15, 2008 Author Posted June 15, 2008 No need to talk to me that way, Max. I'm just trying to get a handle on your life situation so I can respond accordingly. You are right I am sorry and I did over react.
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 You are right I am sorry and I did over react. Not a problem. Thanks.
Stockalone Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 In all ways. I can't imagine being with someone who lives from pay cheque to pay cheque, not being fiscally responsible, spending beyond his means. Now I am even more confused. I don't think that I understand what you mean with "drive to succeed" then.
Trialbyfire Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 Now I am even more confused. I don't think that I understand what you mean with "drive to succeed" then. Self-supporting, fiscally responsible and utilizing his God given intellect to a high level.
carhill Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 That could mean a doctor who uses his skills to live in impoverished nations and give of his intellect and education to help those in need, while living within his means Or, it could mean what I think it does, that being measuring one's drive and intellect by the size of their income and retirement and financial independence. That's valuable too. It's the American way. Capitalism at its best
J2FT1 Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 Self-supporting, fiscally responsible and utilizing his God given intellect to a high level. Basically you like rich, successful guys...
carrotgirl Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 Max, I take it you mean serve in the sense of waiting on, taking care of, doing for and so on. No, I don't do things for my man past the point of being considerate. For example, if I get to the door first, I hold it open for him. If I'm making myself a snack, I ask if he would like to share. Carrot
Trialbyfire Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 That could mean a doctor who uses his skills to live in impoverished nations and give of his intellect and education to help those in need, while living within his means Or, it could mean what I think it does, that being measuring one's drive and intellect by the size of their income and retirement and financial independence. That's valuable too. It's the American way. Capitalism at its best I won't live in an impoverished nation or support someone who isn't around to fuel the relationship. The relationship has to take precedence over making a difference. Basically you like rich, successful guys... I like equally successful, driven, intelligent men. My bar for myself is higher than any I put on a prospective mate.
Stockalone Posted June 15, 2008 Posted June 15, 2008 Self-supporting, fiscally responsible and utilizing his God given intellect to a high level. The bolded part can mean many things. And one can be self-supporting, fiscally responsible at various income levels. Maxmanwell, I live a particular lifestyle, paid for by hardwork, drive and perservance. There were no handouts. There is nothing wrong with wanting somebody who shares your ideals and appreciates the same lifestyle. What I didn't and still don't understand is what intelligence has to do with that. That is what confused me. It's not like all intelligent people are driven by monetary motives. At the very least, ambition and financial success don't always go hand in hand. I consider intelligence and financial success to be two different things.
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