onmyownagain Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 Been thinking about this a lot recently, are long term relationships now a thing of the past? Contantly seem to have people around me who don't want to be in their relationship or have just got out of it. A friend of mine split yesterday after being with someone for 15 years. My marriage was 12 years, split at the beginning of the year. Are we all just more selfish these days and not prepared to compromise to make things work? People change so much over the years, the person you are with is not the person you first met and neither are you. Why would anyone want to be in a situation like that?
mr_han Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 I have problem defining compromise. My relationship faltered because of how I defined it. I told her in a relationship compromise is important but it doesnt mean complete surrender of our individuality. She resented my being stubborn on some things but I emphasized to her that I respected her position but I could not be swayed by her stance. Some women want us to change. That is so wrong. Men can give in but they should not be forced to give in.
Lishy Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 I have a personal view on relationships. I believe that no 2 people are meant to be together forever. I think that people change and they grow and their aims change with maturity. I think relationships can hold you back as we unwittingly try to change the other into what we want and do not appreciate them for what they are! Resentment builds and the love dies slowly What do you talk about after 20 years together? Every stone has been turned and it gets boring! Friends last longer because we do not spend so much time together I know it is not a very romantic thought but I really do believe that 2 years is enough time to spend with one person! Most people stay together due to circumstance (money,kids, property,fear) rather than desire
Tripper Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 Are we all just more selfish these days and not prepared to compromise to make things work? People change so much over the years, the person you are with is not the person you first met and neither are you. Why would anyone want to be in a situation like that? Good question! I've been thinking about this myself. When I look at my parents generation (married in '47) it was pretty much the norm. You certainly couldn't live together or have children outside the institution of marriage. Divorce was rare and socially unacceptable. The economic and social climate prevented most women from having a well paying career. Nursing and teaching were the professions. So , like my parents, they stayed in a marriage even if unhappy or antagonistic towards each other. Today women have much more opportunity for a career be it a profession or a trade. Society's views as to what's acceptable has changed and divorced women or single mothers are no longer stigmatized. And to your point, we are more selfish. That couple with the the disposable economy we enjoy allow us to have it all on our own terms. When something is broken, be it a TV or a marriage, it's easier to dispose and replace than repair. Of course people change over the course of their lifetime. The issue is do those in a relationship change divergently or in a convergent fashion? Grow together or grow apart? I sure as heck don't have all the answers but I've figured out 2 things. The first is that marrying for love isn't enough. You need a common value system and need to be able to agree on issues such as how to spend/save money, how to raise children, who does which domestic chores etc. You also need a foundation of trust and open communication. Secondly while compromise is necessary in any relationship, we get hung up on the importance of many issues. Most of the stuff that causes strife is really small stuff that while irritating is really pretty inconsequential. Lastly I think we, as a relatively prosperous global society had caused us to have a sense of entitlement - to a good career, a good standard of living, a perfect marriage. JMHO for what it's worth.
Woggle Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 Most people in our society are not built to make a relationship work. They look for perfection that only exists in movies and grow resentful when this can't be acheived.
luvstarved Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 Most people in our society are not built to make a relationship work. They look for perfection that only exists in movies and grow resentful when this can't be acheived. There is a lot of truth in this....when you see people married 20 years with 6 kids onscreen acting as hot for each other as the day they were married, you wonder, hmmm, why don't I have that? Or, when there is some interpersonal issue in a movie marriage, it is presented as cosmically wrong and dysfunctional, rather than just their little version of "screwed up" which I believe all relationships to have one way or another. Still, I do believe very much in the value of a LTR and it is still what I want to have had when I am old and on my deathbed... I do have an "ideal" in my head that I admit I am unable to achieve but it is not about never fighting, always agreeing, staying madly hot for each other, not having any undesirable traits or habits, etc... A lot of what I value in a LTR is the shared history and knowing more or less who you are dealing with. It has been my experience that moving on to another relationship has some good newness aspects (ok the sex and learning about someone new) but after the thrill is gone, you are left with someone whose notion of you is shorter than you would like. I LIKE to be able to talk to my H about something that happened 10 years ago and have him really know what I am talking about... The part that I think would make my R ideal would be the intimacy part which I seem unable to attain. I do not mean sex, although admittedly that is part of it, but rather an openness and honesty that makes you feel not only trusting and secure, but also free to be your genuine self. It seems to me that if you have that, then the relationship does not get boring - or not any more boring than the two people involved are in the first place...because you are exposed to each other in all your complexity and accepted for it. Of course, I also just said that I have been unable to get that in a R so maybe the whole unrealistic angle is the pertinent one. However, I still personally find more value in being with someone who has been there with me for a long time vs trading in for a few months or years of newness. I have had 5 live in relationships though so maybe I am just jaded!!
Woggle Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 Relationships are like anything else. There will be bumps along the way and it will not be a 24/7 rush. There will be great moments along the way and there will be moments of ecstacy but nothing is ever perfect.
General Jack Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 Been thinking about this a lot recently, are long term relationships now a thing of the past? Contantly seem to have people around me who don't want to be in their relationship or have just got out of it. A friend of mine split yesterday after being with someone for 15 years. My marriage was 12 years, split at the beginning of the year. Are we all just more selfish these days and not prepared to compromise to make things work? People change so much over the years, the person you are with is not the person you first met and neither are you. Why would anyone want to be in a situation like that? Very interesting question, I've thought about it myself quite a bit. I think that today's instant gratification society as pushed by the media & retail marketing is a huge part of the problem. We are a very "me" and "live for today" society in this age, much different than in our grandparents generation which was more of a "we" generation that valued hard working and soldiering on through the tough times. Its all about "you deserve it," or "reward yourself," and the really disturbing thing about that is it has people overextended on credit, no savings, etc. from an economic standpoint, and chasing the impossible dream from a relationship standpoint. People in general are very spoiled these days, want their cake and to eat it to. And I really get aggrevated at the media, sex sells and its selling well. I think its especially hard for men... we get constantly bombarded with sexual innuendo at every turn, from print advertising to prime time TV. You see it and think, "man, I'm missing out!" The promise of easy sex and instant gratification sure is more appealing then heading home to a screaming wife and kid. You know what is right morally, and even if you believe in commitment you get worn down.
Mr. Lucky Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 Very interesting question, I've thought about it myself quite a bit. I think that today's instant gratification society as pushed by the media & retail marketing is a huge part of the problem. We are a very "me" and "live for today" society in this age, much different than in our grandparents generation which was more of a "we" generation that valued hard working and soldiering on through the tough times. Its all about "you deserve it," or "reward yourself," and the really disturbing thing about that is it has people overextended on credit, no savings, etc. from an economic standpoint, and chasing the impossible dream from a relationship standpoint. Your post pretty much summarizes my thoughts. I'm also struck by how little we do to prepare couples starting out for the realities of a LTR. Certainly, the media's fascination with romantic love downplays the effort and hard work required to successfully sustain a 20+ year marriage. As a result, when confronted with the first real set of problems, many ill-equipped folks simply walk away from what might otherwise be a salvagable relationship. And they miss out on the shared bond that comes from the history of having survived and surmounted those challenges as a couple... Mr. Lucky
JerseyShortie Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 People in general are very spoiled these days, want their cake and to eat it to. And I really get aggrevated at the media, sex sells and its selling well. I completely agree. I think its especially hard for men... The sexual innuendos might be especially hard for men, but in turn it effects women as well. Most men do nothing to curb themselves from it. And when you have men always wishing, looking for something else; something younger, bigger and better; you leave alot of women out there that take a hit to their own feminity. Never being able to live up to the ideals that apparently most men seem to want. And it forms alot of disconnect between the sexes.
sally4sara Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 This is a subject that I think about all the time. Especially now that I'm getting married again. Is it realistic at all to believe that two people who love each other today will love each other 50 years from now (depending on age and health)? I read a great book that had nothing at all to do with romantic relationships and discovered what kind of relationship I think works best; at least for me anyway. The book is The Hagakure - The way of the samurai. This book can be applied to any kind of relationship, personal and professional. Which is great since we don't go around solving our problems with swords anymore. It talked about being a Retainer. To be asked to be someone's retainer was a huge honor and a very serious undertaking. Basically you are being asked to live your life as you will, but while you are at it you also see to the best interests of a particular other whenever you see the need or opportunity. This book helped me stop looking at other people's actions as the only measure of my importance to them. It also made me examine my own motives when it came to the way I behave and react to the actions of others. I think too many times relationships fail because we look at everything our partner does with a heavier judgment and justify our own actions even when they are largely selfish. We hold each other back from opportunities out of fear that the core of the relationship will change and not benefit us as it once did. Instead of trying to help the person you love try to reach their goals, we hinder them. But what if while you are focusing on how you can help them, they were doing the same for you? It is the mentality of "am I my brother's keeper; yes I am". No romantic relationship can grow simply on sexual attraction and hyper-focus of affection (do I get enough affection? Do they wish they had someone else?). All that energy gets wasted wondering when the love will go away and for what reason and which direction it will leave. It is normal to worry, but I try very hard to focus on more productive ways to love. I try to think of my partner as my arm when I am feeling selfish or insecure with no grounds. It sounds dumb, but it works.
General Jack Posted June 4, 2008 Posted June 4, 2008 I completely agree. The sexual innuendos might be especially hard for men, but in turn it effects women as well. Most men do nothing to curb themselves from it. And when you have men always wishing, looking for something else; something younger, bigger and better; you leave alot of women out there that take a hit to their own feminity. Never being able to live up to the ideals that apparently most men seem to want. And it forms alot of disconnect between the sexes. I can see that definitely, no doubt it has a direct impact on women's self esteem.
Ruby Slippers Posted June 5, 2008 Posted June 5, 2008 Well said, General Jack. I agree completely. I have recently begun to regard advertising and the media as really sleazy. Ads are engineered to make people feel bad about what they don't have (stuff, perfect bodies, wrinkle-free face, new car, iPhone, whatever) and encourage a constant drive to acquire more and take part in the upgrading frenzy that is so pervasive. I think this gets translated to people and relationships, too. My generation and those subsequent are the first to be presented (and bombarded) with heavily airbrushed, non-human, unattainable images of women (and men) and "beauty" in print, video, and film, and I think it has distorted everyone's perception of what is normal and healthy. I read a while back that the rate of divorce is now HIGHER than 50%. That means marriages that fail are now the majority. It's pretty sad, and I have to admit that I am starting to feel a bit cynical about the prospect of a lasting relationship.
Ruby Slippers Posted June 5, 2008 Posted June 5, 2008 However, I still personally find more value in being with someone who has been there with me for a long time vs trading in for a few months or years of newness. I know exactly what you mean. I am in the midst of my 4th serious relationship, and I find the lack of continuity and shared history really sad. Two of my exes were raised by single mothers, and I think some of our problems had to do with the fact that those men did not have good male role models in their lives and were not really socialized as men -- the result of the breakdown of the family structure.
Lookingforward Posted June 8, 2008 Posted June 8, 2008 I know exactly what you mean. I am in the midst of my 4th serious relationship, and I find the lack of continuity and shared history really sad. Two of my exes were raised by single mothers, and I think some of our problems had to do with the fact that those men did not have good male role models in their lives and were not really socialized as men -- the result of the breakdown of the family structure. Yes, I also have had several LTR and find the lack of continuity and shared history sad. I guess I still have time to find a partner I can share 20 plus years with, but the history with any children will always be an experience that only can be shared with ex partners.
Walk Posted June 8, 2008 Posted June 8, 2008 I read a great book that had nothing at all to do with romantic relationships and discovered what kind of relationship I think works best; at least for me anyway. The book is The Hagakure - The way of the samurai. It talked about being a Retainer. To be asked to be someone's retainer was a huge honor and a very serious undertaking. Basically you are being asked to live your life as you will, but while you are at it you also see to the best interests of a particular other whenever you see the need or opportunity. Sounds like a good book to read. I'll have to find a copy of it.
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