CallMeCrazy Posted April 6, 2008 Posted April 6, 2008 It's been a couple months since I've logged on, and sooo much has changed. My MM left his W on Dec. 31, but has gone back for "the kids" twice since then for a week each time. Talk about heart-wrenching for everyone involved... I had been so confident in our love and our relationship only to have that crushed... I've caught him in a couple lies ("only trying to not hurt me") and now I'm just not sure about anything anymore. My trust in him has definitely changed ~ I'd say I'm 85% confident in what he says now vs. 100+% before.... Clearly not a good thing... I honestly believe that things between MM and me were BETTER before he seperated from his W. Once he admitted everything to her, it re-kindled something and they started talking again. All of the sudden I went from getting 100% of him, to 60% of him... he wasn't as open about what was going on with them and seemed to be less honest and open with me period. So much drama has gone down I swear I could be on an episode of Maury or Jerry Springer. Maybe one day I will write a book... I can't believe some of the things that have happened... things I've done (I think I'm a little crazy ~ it's embarrassing), things he has done, and things his W have done are all insane. And this is coming from an intelligent, classy, woman who would have ridiculed someone for behaving like this in the past... The whole thing has turned me into someone I've never been! I'm trying to understand if it's true love that is driving me to this or if it's competition...?? I don't like admitting this either, btw, so please be nice. I'm just writing honestly about what's going on inside my crazy mind. Anyway, just curious to know if this has happened with anyone else...?? Or what happened when it came down to it and the MM or MW had to really step up and do whatever it was they'd been telling OW/OM. I know that my love with MM is STRONG but I underestimated his 20 years with the W and how hard it really was for him to leave his children and whatever life they had ~ regardless of how unhappy he was in his relationship with her. I also underestimated all of the other issues that come along with leaving a long relationship. My MM has been a freaking wreck since all of this happened.... he started taking anti-depressents and has mood swings that he never had before. I never what he is going to be like or if he will turn half way through the night and end up upset. He is truly one of those men who had been sticking it out for the sake of his girls, to the point where he was willing to live in misery to be in the same house as them. I honestly do not know what will happen from this point forward.... I hope that things work out, but I'm not going to allow myself to be hurt over and over again while he makes up his mind about whatever it is he wants. I also can't fix MM's problems (as much as I'd like to...) and can't be his emotional crutch right now. I know he always feels good when he's with me and whatever problems he has seem less... but that isn't healthy for our relationship either... This whole thing is such a mess.... I would advise anyone considering an A or who has just begun an A to end it now. You'll save yourself a TON of heartache and pain....
UnusuallyUnusual Posted April 6, 2008 Posted April 6, 2008 I am someone that is new to this forum because I was slowly getting involved in an A. After talking to you all and seeing the way it can destroy a life, I am hoping to not get involved any more than I am. Just Friday my MM and I ended the A on terms that it will eventually end anyway and we will just get more hurt the longer it goes on. I wish you luck and I hope I never find myself in your shoes (or the shoes of so many other OW out there). Take care and keep us posted!
OldEurope Posted April 6, 2008 Posted April 6, 2008 C-M-C, End this pronto. Just stop. 85% trust will be 40% trust and then 15% trust and then 0% and...so on. He did not process this mentally or emotionally enough before leaving and now he is into the horrible throws of self questioning. You will continue to suffer because you will never know which way the wind is blowing. So you stop. Like that. *snap* You say to him, "Darling, you need to go and work this out because obviously it is destroying you. Once you are fully decided that you cannot remain in this marriage, look me up, and perhaps I will be available. I love you but I am not waiting, however, for you" You tuuuuurn the tables and rise above the situation and knock him for a loop. He will totally admire your self worth and self respect. It will make him look twice. But if you don't do this, and your self esteem puddles down around your ankles like yesterday's rain, you will destroy yourself. He has to go and you have to allow that risk that he return home. But you will find someone else. You will be very pleased with yourself and very strong if you do this. xo OE
OWoman Posted April 6, 2008 Posted April 6, 2008 (((hugs))) CMC! It is tough in the aftermath of leaving. Although my MM has never for a second considered going back, he does worry about the kids when they are with W - she refuses to progress on the D unless she gets to see enough of the kids, so they're being used as pawns and they're hating it too. So yes, ups and downs. If your MM is oscillating between leaving and returning, it must be all the rougher. You're right that you can't fix things for him, and you need to set those boundaries and take care of yourself. Support him by all means, the way you would any friend, but not at your own expense. I hope things settle soon!
mistresswchildren Posted April 6, 2008 Posted April 6, 2008 Realize that I am being nice when I say this, but I am also being realistic. He cheated on the W. He lied to her. His word is as good as the toilet paper he wipes with. He is a liar. He will most likely always be a liar. You knew that when you got into this, just like most of us here. I am not sure how you even give him 85%. I believe almost none of what the MM says. If he lied to a woman that he took vows with, why would I deserve more? I have said this before to a lot of people and I will say it again, move on with your life. You will not get anywhere with this guy. There is only one person in this forum that has had a happy ending. She was lucky. The rest of us are in you shoes. We feel love for the MM, but we know in our heads that he will never leave his W entirely. Even if the D happens officially, he will always be tied to his W. There are YEARS between them. They will never have no contact because of his children. You will always wonder. You will become the same woman that he complained about when he started seeing you. You will become suspicious and untrusting. You will be unhappy. Life is too short to continue playing games based on his rules. Set your own rules and move on.
Lookingforward Posted April 6, 2008 Posted April 6, 2008 I know that my love with MM is STRONG but I underestimated his 20 years with the W and how hard it really was for him to leave his children and whatever life they had ~ regardless of how unhappy he was in his relationship with her. I also underestimated all of the other issues that come along with leaving a long relationship. He is truly one of those men who had been sticking it out for the sake of his girls, to the point where he was willing to live in misery to be in the same house as them. Same for mine Crazy... he has gone back to a situation that made him miserable enough to leave in the first place to "be there" for his kids. Whether he can stick that out long term or not I don't know. And as he went back his W has no reason to change the situation any. That said, I can't hang about waiting to see if he leaves again, I have to move on with MY life without him, but I send you {{hugs}}}, it's a hard place to be.
Lookingforward Posted April 6, 2008 Posted April 6, 2008 Even if the D happens officially, he will always be tied to his W. There are YEARS between them. They will never have no contact because of his children. MwC, that is true for ANY divorced person with kids. Heck, it's even true for those that have children OUT of wedlock. If you can't handle that they will always be connected through the children you should avoid a relationship with them.
mistresswchildren Posted April 7, 2008 Posted April 7, 2008 MwC, that is true for ANY divorced person with kids. Heck, it's even true for those that have children OUT of wedlock. If you can't handle that they will always be connected through the children you should avoid a relationship with them. Agreed. (except in certain rare cases)
whichwayisup Posted April 7, 2008 Posted April 7, 2008 I know that my love with MM is STRONG but I underestimated his 20 years with the W and how hard it really was for him to leave his children and whatever life they had ~ regardless of how unhappy he was in his relationship with her. I also underestimated all of the other issues that come along with leaving a long relationship. And the thing is, that obligation and history makes a difference. Even though he's been a real sh*t to his wife and left his kids, then came back, left again, came back, he still obviously is torn up in what to do. His wife also feels obligation to him, has loyality to him otherwise she wouldn't be taking him back. Question you need to think about - What is your obligation to him and what is his to you. Does his love for you match what he has had with his wife and kids? Do you want to compete? Or do you want to back off, tell him goodbye and give him 6 months to decide and go full on NC. Him bouncing back and forth isn't going to do anything. Just read Stampdaddy's threads. The longer you hang onto him in hopes that he'll choose you, the more you will hurt. His actions are all over the place so if you want your pain to stop, YOU take control and walk away. If you stay, then you choose to play on the rollercoaster ride.
LakesideDream Posted April 7, 2008 Posted April 7, 2008 I'm beginning to lose focus completely. What I'm hearing is that people (women on this post) should never get into a relationship with a man who has children... except in rare cases. How can this have any merit. This is the 21st Century. I can hardly imagine anyone over the age of 35 that hasn't been the father or, or mother of at least one child. 60% of first marriages end in divorce. 35% of children are born unto unmarried households. What exactly is left? I am sure that I would not meet one woman, 35 years or older in the next year who hasnt had a child, unless I advertised to meet one. The vast magority of people out there have ex's and kids unless you are still college age. The who premis that LoveShack operates on is that communication brings advantage. How many of us in the "mature" forums here come without ex's and kids?
mistresswchildren Posted April 7, 2008 Posted April 7, 2008 I'm beginning to lose focus completely. What I'm hearing is that people (women on this post) should never get into a relationship with a man who has children... except in rare cases. How can this have any merit. This is the 21st Century. I can hardly imagine anyone over the age of 35 that hasn't been the father or, or mother of at least one child. 60% of first marriages end in divorce. 35% of children are born unto unmarried households. What exactly is left? I am sure that I would not meet one woman, 35 years or older in the next year who hasnt had a child, unless I advertised to meet one. The vast magority of people out there have ex's and kids unless you are still college age. The who premis that LoveShack operates on is that communication brings advantage. How many of us in the "mature" forums here come without ex's and kids? She was just saying that there will always be a connection because of the kids, not that there couldn't be another relationship in the end. Any couple (unless the guy walked away before birth) is connected by children. I don't feel that is true in my case (hence the only in rare cases), but for most people with kids that is how it goes. Even if they shared an adopted child this would be the outcome. A child typically irreversibly bonds two people. There will always be some kind of relationship.
Lookingforward Posted April 7, 2008 Posted April 7, 2008 I'm beginning to lose focus completely. What I'm hearing is that people (women on this post) should never get into a relationship with a man who has children... except in rare cases. How can this have any merit. This is the 21st Century. I can hardly imagine anyone over the age of 35 that hasn't been the father or, or mother of at least one child. 60% of first marriages end in divorce. 35% of children are born unto unmarried households. What exactly is left? I am sure that I would not meet one woman, 35 years or older in the next year who hasnt had a child, unless I advertised to meet one. The vast magority of people out there have ex's and kids unless you are still college age. The who premis that LoveShack operates on is that communication brings advantage. How many of us in the "mature" forums here come without ex's and kids? Yes but at our age(s) they are not likely to be young children. Even so, that connection to the ex (the co-parent of your children) will always be there and it's something you have to accept if you are going to be in a relationship with someone who has children. What I was saying was that if you find that hard to deal with then you should avoid those relationships, not that everyone should avoid them.
SoxPrincess Posted April 7, 2008 Posted April 7, 2008 C-M-C, End this pronto. Just stop. 85% trust will be 40% trust and then 15% trust and then 0% and...so on. He did not process this mentally or emotionally enough before leaving and now he is into the horrible throws of self questioning. You will continue to suffer because you will never know which way the wind is blowing. So you stop. Like that. *snap* You say to him, "Darling, you need to go and work this out because obviously it is destroying you. Once you are fully decided that you cannot remain in this marriage, look me up, and perhaps I will be available. I love you but I am not waiting, however, for you" You tuuuuurn the tables and rise above the situation and knock him for a loop. He will totally admire your self worth and self respect. It will make him look twice. But if you don't do this, and your self esteem puddles down around your ankles like yesterday's rain, you will destroy yourself. He has to go and you have to allow that risk that he return home. But you will find someone else. You will be very pleased with yourself and very strong if you do this. xo OE ITA 100%. CMC...I've been exactly where you are, the only difference is that I am married and was married during the entire length of my A. I had nothing but complete trust in xMM, trusted him with my life and trusted him more than I've ever trusted anyone in my life. I took his word as his bond and never even considered for a moment that he was being dishonest with me or "playing" me. I believe we had a love like no other, that we were soul mates..yada yada yada and in the end; he made me look like a complete and total fool. xMM & I were both members of a message board and before we ever knew one another, he would post about how awful his M was, how he couldn't wait to leave and how he was only staying for his children. When we eventually met and he told me the, what I now know are usual MM lines, I thought he was different because of all the messages I had read previously about how miserable he was. As months passed, he talked of us moving in together, we even looked at apartments, etc; but there was ALWAYS an excuse. He would sometimes say the time wasn't right or that he needed more time to tell his W the "right" way; he needed to stay for financial reasons, he needed to stay for the kids...something always came up without fail. After 8 months (I had already confessed to my H), I told him that was it, he either needed to get out for his own reasons (meaning not just for me) or I was walking away because it was too stressful. He ended up telling his W (he told me that he told her he wanted a divorce, but this isn't what happened...I'll get to that) and he did move out; we didn't move in together but I spent weekends and some weekdays at his new apartment and things were going swimmingly for a brief time. After awhile, things weren't adding up for me; there were times when I didn't stay with him that I'd call & he wouldn't answer (he'd tell me he was spending time with the kids..which of course is fine..but my gut told me something else was going on) and in my heart, I felt he only left because I gave him an ultimatum and not of his own accord. I sat him down one night and questioned him and that night eventually turned into the end of the A. He became very defensive, saying I was crazy & insecure, telling me that he had made his own personal strides in counseling and left his W on his own and no matter what happened with us, he would NEVER go back to that situation. I continued questioning him, he got increasingly annoyed and the A ended. While I was on my way home that night...he moved back home. A few months later, I called his W (at the urging of my H..we were reconciling and are now reconciled) and found out the truth. The day he moved out; the day he told me that he told her he wanted a divorce..in reality he only told her he needed a "break" and when we weren't together, he was living at home. I felt like an idiot, more than an idiot...and it really destroyed me because I had put so much trust & faith in him and every part of it was a lie. I'm rambling but my point is, I could have lost something a million times more special than xMM...my H and I'm eternally grateful that he has given me another chance, however, I also lost parts of myself that I'm still trying to get back. You're single (I'm assuming) and if this doesn't work out and honestly it doesn't sound good, I bet you'll find someone deserving of you but as each day passes, you're losing parts of yourself. *If* he is lying to you or being dishonest, you're placing your faith & trust in someone who doesn't hold the same values and it's JUST NOT WORTH IT. Take the advice of Old Europe above, let him go and see what happens; if it's real..he'll make the choices he needs to make on his own and he'll come back, but please...please, don't keep doing this to yourself. It will hurt to walk away, it will really & truly suck; but keeping you who YOU are is so much more important..I promise you. I wish you lots of luck in whatever path you choose!
GreenEyedLady Posted April 8, 2008 Posted April 8, 2008 It's been a couple months since I've logged on, and sooo much has changed. My MM left his W on Dec. 31, but has gone back for "the kids" twice since then for a week each time. Talk about heart-wrenching for everyone involved... I had been so confident in our love and our relationship only to have that crushed... I've caught him in a couple lies ("only trying to not hurt me") and now I'm just not sure about anything anymore. My trust in him has definitely changed ~ I'd say I'm 85% confident in what he says now vs. 100+% before.... Clearly not a good thing... I honestly believe that things between MM and me were BETTER before he seperated from his W. Once he admitted everything to her, it re-kindled something and they started talking again. All of the sudden I went from getting 100% of him, to 60% of him... he wasn't as open about what was going on with them and seemed to be less honest and open with me period. So much drama has gone down I swear I could be on an episode of Maury or Jerry Springer. Maybe one day I will write a book... I can't believe some of the things that have happened... things I've done (I think I'm a little crazy ~ it's embarrassing), things he has done, and things his W have done are all insane. And this is coming from an intelligent, classy, woman who would have ridiculed someone for behaving like this in the past... The whole thing has turned me into someone I've never been! I'm trying to understand if it's true love that is driving me to this or if it's competition...?? I don't like admitting this either, btw, so please be nice. I'm just writing honestly about what's going on inside my crazy mind. Anyway, just curious to know if this has happened with anyone else...?? Or what happened when it came down to it and the MM or MW had to really step up and do whatever it was they'd been telling OW/OM. I know that my love with MM is STRONG but I underestimated his 20 years with the W and how hard it really was for him to leave his children and whatever life they had ~ regardless of how unhappy he was in his relationship with her. I also underestimated all of the other issues that come along with leaving a long relationship. My MM has been a freaking wreck since all of this happened.... he started taking anti-depressents and has mood swings that he never had before. I never what he is going to be like or if he will turn half way through the night and end up upset. He is truly one of those men who had been sticking it out for the sake of his girls, to the point where he was willing to live in misery to be in the same house as them. I honestly do not know what will happen from this point forward.... I hope that things work out, but I'm not going to allow myself to be hurt over and over again while he makes up his mind about whatever it is he wants. I also can't fix MM's problems (as much as I'd like to...) and can't be his emotional crutch right now. I know he always feels good when he's with me and whatever problems he has seem less... but that isn't healthy for our relationship either... This whole thing is such a mess.... I would advise anyone considering an A or who has just begun an A to end it now. You'll save yourself a TON of heartache and pain.... I'm sorry you are going through what you are going through... Perhaps it is best for you to bow out for now and make sure you are taking care of YOU... If he is giving you only 60% and telling lies, then you are better off without him...It's Bulls*** if he's telling you that's all he can give you right now...That's all he's willing to give you, and you deserve more than that... Walk away while you still have your self-respect and remember the days when it was good... (((HUGS)))
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