Proof that God exists (for agnostics/athiests)

[andysw]

That's a bold claim. References please.

 

http://freehovind.com/watch-4308235066145651150

http://www.creationism.org/heinze/SciEvidGodLife.htm

 

What good an information will do to you if someone gives you reference to their argument that's contrary to your (athiestic) belief where you won't take any of it?

[Enema]

Like I stated, you get frustrated because it can't be explain through human "logic" and "evidence" and "rationale," concepts which we as humans have created ourselves.

Just because something can't be explained through science or "references," or documentation doesn't mean it's not true. You have to reach beyond your normal, human-created pattern of thinking and justification and need for concrete proof.

 

If you are making an assertion like "life was created by a higher power" based on no evidence... you should preface it with, "I believe", rather than present it as fact.

 

But I'm a nice guy. I accept your apology.

[Enema]

Genesis 1:11 "And God went on to shoot fourth, vegetation bearing seed, fruit trees yielding fruit according to their kinds, the seed of which is in it, upon the earth. And it came to be so".

 

 

How is a bible verse evidence? This proves nothing, it's merely another empty assertion in an older format.

[Enema]

http://freehovind.com/watch-4308235066145651150

 

Hovind is possibly the biggest creationist joke out there. Though, Venomfangx is giving him a decent run lately.

 

I'm not going to bother to go into the specific refutations of all of his junk. You seem pretty handy at searching youtube for videos... so just look for "Kent Hovind Stupid" There's a great series that explains all the PRATT's you keep ripping out that might save some time in future. Kent Hovind is famous for his lies.

 

Ironically, even the IRS know about Kent's lies. He recently went to jail for not paying taxes. Good christian.

 

http://www.creationism.org/heinze/SciEvidGodLife.htm

 

This site doesn't prove god that god created life at all... It's a long winded version of "Goddidit".

 

They start off by pointing out a (supposed) problem with current abiogenesis theory and then proudly spout that since there's a problem there, life must have been created by god. Utter bull.

 

What good an information will do to you if someone gives you reference to their argument that's contrary to your (athiestic) belief where you won't take any of it?

 

Everything you've provided so far is junk and we've dismembered. You seem to lap up everything you read that's creation-slanted to feed your confirmation bias.

 

We can keep showing you what's wrong with everything you post, but I can't fix gullible.

[andysw]

How is a bible verse evidence? This proves nothing, it's merely another empty assertion in an older format.

 

I was just playing ya.

[lemony fresh]

If you are making an assertion like "life was created by a higher power" based on no evidence... you should preface it with, "I believe", rather than present it as fact.

 

But I'm a nice guy. I accept your apology.

 

 

Uh, no, they're my posts and I "shouldn't" do anything just because you tell me to. Also, what I am stating still isn't sinking in because you are still looking at "evidence" as necessary to "prove" there is a God and I already stated that those are human-created concepts. The existence of a higher power goes beyond human-created concepts. (I am now stating this for like the 4th time, so please use your reading comprehension skills this time.) That's why it's a higher power - it's beyond what humans can "prove" or "imagine" or give "evidence" for.

[disgracian]

Like I stated, you get frustrated because it can't be explain through human "logic" and "evidence" and "rationale,"

I can't speak for others, but I personally get bored with religious people repeatedly making claims they can't back up. Their only recourse is to put quote-marks around words like "logic" and "evidence" as if these are somehow petty or insignificant. Laughable, really.

Just because something can't be explained through science or "references," or documentation doesn't mean it's not true.

You are right; it's just that without some form of verification there is no good reason to believe such things. One is just as justified in holding any number of arbitrary beliefs, such as those in the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

You have to reach beyond your normal, human-created pattern of thinking and justification and need for concrete proof.

And only then can you believe in the healing powers of His Noodly Appendage. Only now can we see clearly, right?

 

Cheers,

D.

[FleshNBones]

I can't speak for others, but I personally get bored with religious people repeatedly making claims they can't back up. Their only recourse is to put quote-marks around words like "logic" and "evidence" as if these are somehow petty or insignificant. Laughable, really.

 

You are right; it's just that without some form of verification there is no good reason to believe such things. One is just as justified in holding any number of arbitrary beliefs, such as those in the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

 

And only then can you believe in the healing powers of His Noodly Appendage. Only now can we see clearly, right?

 

Cheers,

D.

You sure like to make a lot of thoughtless remarks. Who else can ignore the plagues, contributions from important historical figures, the existence of ancient empires, and other noteworthy events to support a bias against Christianity. You really sacrificed a lot, the truth, for your political POV.

 

In you zeal, I think you lost sight of what you were trying to do assuming it had something to do with the truth.

[reservoirdog1]

I'll start with a simple question, if I promise to give you a chocolate bar after an infinite amount of time will I ever give you the chocolate bar? No. Another question, could there be an infinite amount of time before right now? No, because we would never of reached this moment of time.

 

Just because there may have been an infinite amount of time before this moment, that doesn't stop time from passing. It wouldn't stop us from reaching this very moment. The best scientific data available suggests that the universe is infinite. We know that it's at least billions upon billions of light-years in diameter. So in the absence of better info, the theory that it's infinite is a good theory. And if the universe is infinite, by your logic, earth could not exist. But we do seem to exist.

 

Your view is one of those that sounds good in theory but doesn't mesh with reality. In theory, if you drop a basketball, it should never reach the ground -- because no matter how far it falls, no matter how close to the ground it gets, it still has to travel "half" the remaining distance. No matter how infinitessimal that distance, the ball must still cover it in order to hit the ground. There's no "stopping point" at which we can't divide space any further -- there's simply a limit to how small a distance we can measure. And yet, eventually, the basketball evidently hits the ground, and bounces back up.

[disgracian]

You sure like to make a lot of thoughtless remarks.

You sure like to make a lot of petty ad homs.

Who else can ignore the plagues, contributions from important historical figures, the existence of ancient empires, and other noteworthy events to support a bias against Christianity.

WTF?

You really sacrificed a lot, the truth, for your political POV.

Again, WTF?

In you zeal, I think you lost sight of what you were trying to do assuming it had something to do with the truth.

Looks like you got to the end of your post and realised that there weren't quite enough personal comments, so you threw this one in for good measure. GG.

 

Cheers,

D.

[andysw]

Just because there may have been an infinite amount of time before this moment, that doesn't stop time from passing. It wouldn't stop us from reaching this very moment. The best scientific data available suggests that the universe is infinite. We know that it's at least billions upon billions of light-years in diameter. So in the absence of better info, the theory that it's infinite is a good theory. And if the universe is infinite, by your logic, earth could not exist. But we do seem to exist.

 

There couldn't have been an infinite (never ending) amount of time before right now. Because it's agreed that the universe had a beginning and it is not eternal (no beginning and no end). Before that there was no time, which means time had a beginning.

 

If time was infinite before right now, if you move earth backwards to a point where it could've been created you'll still have an infinity to pass before it. You can't have finite things in eternity. That proves that the universe is not eternal. And yes you're right, the universe is infinite (like time).

[FleshNBones]

Just because there may have been an infinite amount of time before this moment, that doesn't stop time from passing. It wouldn't stop us from reaching this very moment. The best scientific data available suggests that the universe is infinite. We know that it's at least billions upon billions of light-years in diameter. So in the absence of better info, the theory that it's infinite is a good theory. And if the universe is infinite, by your logic, earth could not exist. But we do seem to exist.

 

Your view is one of those that sounds good in theory but doesn't mesh with reality. In theory, if you drop a basketball, it should never reach the ground -- because no matter how far it falls, no matter how close to the ground it gets, it still has to travel "half" the remaining distance. No matter how infinitessimal that distance, the ball must still cover it in order to hit the ground. There's no "stopping point" at which we can't divide space any further -- there's simply a limit to how small a distance we can measure. And yet, eventually, the basketball evidently hits the ground, and bounces back up.

Imagine a two-dimensional universe represented as a balloon. The two-dimensional universe forms the surface of the balloon, and it is curved with respect to time. Imagine this balloon is constantly being inflated, and the abberations on its surface are spreading appart.

 

An infinitely large universe wouldn't be expanding would it. An infinitely large universe would have infinite space so all of the stars would be too far to see.

 

I wonder if the universe can slow down to a stop.