TheFonz Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 As a guy I can sense almost right away if another guy is a guy who is good natured, good hearted, trustworthy or insert similar adjective. Likewise, I can also tell right away if a guy I meet has a bad nature, "evil", devious, untrustworhty or insert similar adjective. And not to brag, experience has shown me that my first impression is never really wrong. I would only assume that women can tell the difference as well if not better than a man can, or if not tell which is which be able to distinquish a difference. Now a lot of guys I've known have said that basically after a lot of experience, observation and trying everything, they have concluded that women are naturally attracted to guys who are fundamentally bad or "evil", and are naturally unattracted to guys who are fundamentally good. And that women are most of all, more than even looks, money and status, attracted or not attracted to a guy based on who he fundamentally is, basically good or bad person. And women, like men can, are able to fairly accurately tell which a person is quickly upon meeting. Almost like it's a 6th sense or intuition that can't really be manipulated. So it doesn't matter what a guy does or doesn't do, you're either born "good" or born "bad". If you're born bad then you will do good attracting women and if not you won't. I think this all sounds kind of dubious and I don't want to think that the real reason I have so much success with women is because I'm fundamentally a bad person, but I don't know. I have actually seen things that would suggest it might be true. I know so many guys who are attractive, successful, and intelligent and I can sense are genuinely good guys. When they approach a girl no matter what they say or how they act the girls are quickly unattracted to them. It's almost like the women are picking up something on some other pathway and get turned off. Now on the other hand, I also know a lot of guys who give me a bad vibe, and the more I know them the more I find out that they really are bad news. But most of these "bad" guys can be less attractive, successful, and intelligent and seems like regardless of what they say or do they in fact attract women more. The only thing they have going for them seems to be a "bad" vibe. They can even act congruent with being bad or they can be phony and act nice, but either way they have more success. I'm not really into spirituality or anything but it's almost like it's not even how the person acts, what they say, or their appearance. Not that those can't be clues, but it's like you can still tell someone is bad even if they do nothing bad. They're just being phony. I'm not trying to say women are universally attracted to bad guys and every guy who does well with women is a bad guy, but I sure know a lot of bad people. Maybe I'm really just a bad person to? I thought this was an unique way of looking at this issue. Has anyone else noticed something like this?
Ocean-Blue Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I think it works both ways. I can usually tell when a woman has a bad vibe about her. Maybe it's b/c you can easily "judge" the same sex b/c you're not dealing with attraction and the rest of it. I am not attracted to "funadmentally bad" guys. They make me go . The guys I've always found myself liking are ones that are good people but with an edge. They are exciting to be around. They take chances and are confident. And yes, I think men have a good gut instinct about loser guys. My ex and my bf have been usually right about the idiots they meet.
Kamille Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I'm not attracted to good or bad guys, I'm attracted to guys who have their own lives and don't need me to validate their self-esteem. I have been in three LTRs and, while current bf gets mixed reviews on the bad/good scale, both my exes were reknown for being well-rounded nice guys. I'll even get comments like: oh Mike's your ex? He is such a great guy! (From both guys and girls). And I'm always glad to agree. I think TBF mentionned somewhere that there's a difference between girls and women, just like there is a difference between guys and men. The rules of DJ bible also apply to women: we need to learn to better ourselves so that we don't keep repeating the same patterns and keep falling for jerks. If what you're interested in is a LTR, what you want to do is learn to be selective: not all women are the same. Some still have a lot of learning to do but some do know what they want. I met my bf when I decided that the only way I was going to take a guy seriously was if he enhanced my life. Love happens when both partners are mature.
FormerNiceGuy Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I've never been wrong on one thing with women. Women with cold eyes. When I say "cold", it's not just being "snobby", it's more than that. it's hard to explain.
Advocate's Devilette Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I actually sort of agree with you. With that guy with a small dick, he kind of treated me like a jerk by not calling and I suddenly started liking him more when he didn't call. I am more interested in him than ever now, and he has nothing to offer me.
witabix Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 We all do it don't we? Within the first few seconds of meeting someone you form an idea of them in your own mind. It is unavoidable. I know the 'cold eyes' thing too with women. I also sense a 'dumb eyes' thing going on with people, but cannot expalin it.
DanielMadr Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I've never been wrong on one thing with women. Women with cold eyes. When I say "cold", it's not just being "snobby", it's more than that. it's hard to explain. Hillary? Does her eyes strike you as cold? For me yes. But I havent met her in person so I can be wrong.
blind_otter Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I don't think there is such a thing as a "fundamentally bad" person. I've known many people who others would think are "fundamentally bad" but on a deeper level they had good and bad traits associated with themselves. I also don't think you can be "born good" or "born bad". Babies are not good or bad, they just are.
DanielMadr Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Nice post FonZ. Try this:http://ezinearticles.com/?Why-Women-Say-They-Want-A-Good-Guy-But-Sleep-With-A-Bad-Boy&id=1061462 btw the author is really good. Read some of her other articles as well and see for yourself. I agree with you. There is that vibe and the eyes. But I think you need to differentiate between bad guy and an evil azzhole. Evil Azzholes are that guys with the first sight bad vibe. I dont mind girls going for bad guys that much but I hate when some normal girl is touched by this evil spitting azzhole. Bad guys are like kids. Immature but not deliberatly bad. You can talk with them and have fun with them, eventhough they are capable of couging someones eyes out the next minute for some stupid shyt. They are actually quite submissive and really good puppies when they come accross someone who they respect - and it doesnt have to be because you can kisk their azz. The Evil Ones its another story. Basically they are more intelligent. More like psychopaths really. And they dont like or respect anyone. You can scare them easier then those bad guys though. They are pussies in nature. Why girls go for bad guys? Beside things already mentioned elsewhere such as emotional rollecoster, loud confidence, sexual thrill. I think girls like to date them because they dont feel they deserve any better (being insecure themselves) or because they can use them and dump them more easily then Lets-get-married boring guy.
DanielMadr Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Oh and, Ocean-Blue had some good point. Guys can tell better the character of another guy. I know I have more difficulties reading girls. And the same probably goes for girls. They just cant recognize healthy confidence.
Woggle Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Men can read women if they stop thinking with the wrong head. I actually have quite good instincts with women and I have been right about most my observations. The type of women to avoid just give off this vibe and strangely enough most of them have men surrounding them.
DanielMadr Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Men can read women if they stop thinking with the wrong head. True. But I would say we lack experience most not being in close proximity with them all day. To form some defence for guys - girls are perfect actresses. Guys cant fool you that much with body language or verbal language. Eyes are the best spot.
DanielMadr Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I suddenly started to feel sorry for women. I really did. This thead probably has something to do with it. Or they sneaked something to my lunch, goddamit:) Last time I felt sorry for women I was quite put straight back in a very unpleasant manner. Oh man, Im turning soft or what. I know what it is, Im bloody angry at the world and I probably feel sorry for myself or what. I saved at least 5 women from severe beating from exactly these evil stupid MaFackrs and you know what? Those girls said thanks and started to treat their "SO" broken nose. I think this memory and shock is deep inside me. How you can treat someone's bloody nose when he was kicking you all over on a street just seconds ago?????? And these were not some white trash trailer park girls who doesnt know any beter!!! What makes people be so bloody stupid????!!!!! It had to go out, sorry.
Jilly Bean Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Fonz - a lot of women in their 20s are attracted to the bad boy. I think that's because as young women, we (erroneously) think we can change a man, and love the challenge of doing so. We grow out of it when we hit our 30s, however, and get tired of the abuse and drama, and realize we can't change anyone but ourselves. That's when we seek out the "nice guy" in earnest.
GoodOnPaper Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Fonz - a lot of women in their 20s are attracted to the bad boy. I think that's because as young women, we (erroneously) think we can change a man, and love the challenge of doing so. We grow out of it when we hit our 30s, however, and get tired of the abuse and drama, and realize we can't change anyone but ourselves. That's when we seek out the "nice guy" in earnest. Hopefully, younger "nice guys" won't read this to mean that they should wait around doing nothing for 10 years. Bad boys simply know what they want (which includes a lot of sex) and are pursuing it. If younger "nice guys" adapt this approach to what they want -- and it's OK if sex is a large part of it -- then they have a shot at outgrowing the women who wouldn't give them the time of day 10 years earlier.
Elemental Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 There are a few things going on here. One is the tendency in the human brain to look for patterns, whether they really exist or not. Even genuine randomness, like the fall of raindrops, looks like a pattern to the human eye, and what we think is random is often a deliberate pattern. It takes some real effort to get that under control. Knowing that the tendency is there is the first step toward getting it under control. It's not actually a bad tendency. It helps us make sense of the world we live in. It does, however, have potential pitfalls, and this is one of them. The second tendency is for people to be somewhat blind to people or things they're not attracted to. If a woman you're not attracted to is attracted to you, do you care? Or do you just want to get away from the warpig? Do you care who she's attracted to? Or do you just want her out of your face? The interaction between these two tendencies works in this situation like this: Your brain will narrow down which women you find attractive, then look for patterns in their behavior so as to increase your chances with them. Do the conclusions have any merit? Yes, only if you apply them to the population actually being studied: women who are attractive to you, personally. To generalize from there to the remaining 3 billion women in the world is absurd. Heck, some of us are attracted to women, which means every conclusion about what women like in men doesn't apply at all. When I hear statements like this from men, it tells me more about them than it does about women in general. And yes, it's something I listen for. What I can tell you about the fact that some truly nasty men have women in their lives is that these women are in a subset of their own, just like the men are. Frankly, to me, they read as being just as evil, and in my list of turn-offs, I probably should have added men who report being cheated on or otherwise screwed over by women on a consistent basis, because in my own mind I keep wondering why the heck he didn't figure this out about her earlier. I meet his ex and think, "duh!" Being attractive isn't something a woman is, it's something she does, and there are different ways of doing it. Being attractive to @ssholes is an active process for the most part, even if it's engaged in subconsciously or simply out of habit. Look into these women's childhoods, and you'll probably find more @ssholes. It's a holdover from a time when women had little choice as to whether or not they married, and from a time when being a good provider excused a man from drunkenness, violence, or simply being a d1ck. I also know that some men are better people toward other men than they are toward women. A man who treats other men well might treat women with contempt, which is going to make him unattractive to any woman who doesn't like being treated with contempt. I don't think most of you would find me attractive. I'm healthy, but I don't put any effort into my looks besides being neat and clean. I gave my hair care regimen in another thread, and my face, body and clothes get about the same level of attention. I'd fly right under your radar, which means who or what I'm attracted to isn't going to matter to you.
fishtaco Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Nice post FonZ. Try this:http://ezinearticles.com/?Why-Women-Say-They-Want-A-Good-Guy-But-Sleep-With-A-Bad-Boy&id=1061462 btw the author is really good. Read some of her other articles as well and see for yourself. Not sure if I liked that article. It's basically saying, hey nice guys, don't worry, women will like you if you behave like a bad boy when when they want a bad boy, and behave like a nice guy when they want a nice guy. Yeah sure, and I want a woman that's intelligent, sane, attractive, wealthy and never has headaches. Having only the right qualities from the bad boy list and the nice guy list is rare enough already, if there's even a man out there like that, AND be psychic enough to use the right mode when women want it?? Hmm... I still stick by what I believe in: Attraction is attraction, has nothing to do with being a good or bad person. An attractive bad person will have the same amount of success in courting a woman as an attractive good person. Just that attractive good person is a lot more rare than the attractive bad person.
Author TheFonz Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 I still stick by what I believe in: Attraction is attraction, has nothing to do with being a good or bad person. An attractive bad person will have the same amount of success in courting a woman as an attractive good person. Just that attractive good person is a lot more rare than the attractive bad person. I'll need to read through some of the other replies, but here is the argument simplified. There's a dark side and a light side. Maybe most women or people are attracting to the dark side. Most people have a little bit of both but you're on or the other. Dark side=attraction. This is the theory very simplified.
Nuguy12 Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Guys can tell better the character of another guy. I know I have more difficulties reading girls. And the same probably goes for girls. They just cant recognize healthy confidence. THis is good. Men are bettrer MUCH better at assessing the CHARACTER of another guy, instinctively. Women are not good at this because the "sizzle" that they feel in the presence of a new bad boy swamps any tinking warrning bells.
Nuguy12 Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Yeah sure, and I want a woman that's intelligent, sane, attractive, wealthy and never has headaches. If you find one ask her if she has a sister for me.
fishtaco Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I'll need to read through some of the other replies, but here is the argument simplified. There's a dark side and a light side. Maybe most women or people are attracting to the dark side. Most people have a little bit of both but you're on or the other. Dark side=attraction. This is the theory very simplified. Well mine is just a theory too, so if I read/hear/experience something different that's convincing, I'll be open to changing my theory. I guess I just don't believe that women are attracted to dark sides. Maybe I'm just being a typical stupid male, hanging on to logic like a life line, when logic has no place in subjects like this... it just doesn't make sense to me to want a guy simply because he's bad. But it makes sense to me for a woman to want a guy because he's attractive, and then cringe that he's bad, but believe that her love can change the bad parts. And we all know how tales like this would end, hence feeding to the perception that women want jerks. But really it's more like woman want guys that are attractive, even if they're bad. At least that's my theory so far.
fishtaco Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 If you find one ask her if she has a sister for me. No way, if that were the case, I'd be taking the sister too, and moving to Utah, to a mansion/compound that she bought for me, get a lot of guns, and defend the rights of polygamists.
Trialbyfire Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 The dark side of attraction is comfort. People are attracted to similar dysfunction, that they grew up with, because it "feels like home". If a woman grew up with a father who was abusive or absent, she will attach to someone of similar ilk. Same goes for a guy who grows up with an abusive or absent mother. When people hit adulthood, some break free of the cyle and others perpetuate it. You see both sides of this coin happening all the time, in cyber-space or real life.
Nuguy12 Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 No way, if that were the case, I'd be taking the sister too, and moving to Utah, to a mansion/compound that she bought for me, get a lot of guns, and defend the rights of polygamists. Youre a funny guy - wanna be my wingman ?
Nuguy12 Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 .. it just doesn't make sense to me to want a guy simply because he's bad. But it makes sense to me for a woman to want a guy because he's attractive, and then cringe that he's bad, Womne follow FEELINGS like lemmings. YOur job is to be a Pied Piper. Being BAD per se is not attactive to anyone, however the 'bad boy' elicits certain FEELINGS in women and this is his power. Women follow bad boys to get a supply of the BUZZ and the excitement. It is that simple.
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