guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Have you ever dated someone who you think has lied to you on a number of occasions but you can't prove it? I am not talking about cheating but rather everyday stuff. How do you deal with this? When do you say "enough is enough"?
nicki Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Yes, I have and it's so hard if you can't PROVE they are lying. When you ask a liar if they have lied, they lie about lying. As long as there is any hope that they are telling the truth, I will hang on. And if I catch them in one or two (small lies), I'll also let it go until it becomes a pattern, although I will ask why they lied and try to fix the reason for the lying. I'll usually try to catch someone in a lie by having proof of the truth before asking them. If they come clean, they get points. If they lie, then I know they have lied. Enough is enough when they are caught in lies, especially after promising to be truthful. That's it. Then there is no trust. So I guess it's over when the trust runs out. My mom always told me, "When someone lies about the little stuff, they will lie about the big stuff." Great post! It's something I have struggled with in the past, but now I don't suffer liars very well....but I have to know they are lying to get there....
norajane Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 If you think someone is lying to you, then I can't imagine why you would stay with that person regardless of whether you have proof. Clearly, trust is not solid, so what's the point of staying?
nicki Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Because we think it might be US, that we are just worrying about nothing, or paranoid because of past hurts, or we are untrusting souls.. I don't act in deceitful ways so I have a hard time thinking someone else might. I give them the benefit of the doubt until there is relatively no doubt. I wish I could just leave someone because I think they are lying but didn't have any proof. For me, in the absence of any proof to the contrary, I will believe someone I love. But, if it what they tell me doesn't make any sense at all, or I see something weird with my own two eyes, I'll usually assume they are lying anyway.
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 Nicki, you have a good point here. The usual reaction when faced with doubt is "oh it's probably me". Some liars are pretty smart and they know when it's impossible for their partner to gather any evidence. On numerous times I've caught my partner in a silly situation where I think there are 99% chances that she's lying. Statistically speaking, if I encounter three of those situations, the odds are 1 for 1 million that she's actually telling the truth. You give so much benefit of the doubt that after a while you're the one going nuts. As for why you would stay with someone like that, well it's not them, it's us, it's their mental condition, etc. In the end though, it IS them. And if you dare bringing this up, even very gently, they start yelling and making such a fuss that the next time you think twice about confronting them with it. Really, one cannot win in this situation.
D-Lish Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 And if you dare bringing this up, even very gently, they start yelling and making such a fuss that the next time you think twice about confronting them with it. Really, one cannot win in this situation. I always see it as a red flag when someone protests too much. I've dated liars and the usual method of denial was always "kick up a huge fuss" and then turn it around to make me feel like it's my fault. I've also had friends that were chronic liars- and they do the same thing.... put the guilt trip on me upon confronting them. Always pay attention to your instincts. If your gut tells you something is off, don't deny your intuition.
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 Always pay attention to your instincts. If your gut tells you something is off, don't deny your intuition. That's what my dad has been telling me... This is much easier to do when feelings are not involved though. When you're in love with someone, you tend to forgive a lot of things... Some liars are pretty easy to figure out. It is the smarter ones that can be quite challenging...
cutegirl Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 I have dated someone who lied A LOT and even when I HAD proof they would ALWAYS turn it around and made it seem like I was crazy, they were always able to refute and invalidate my proof somehow, and they were so convincing that they made me doubt myself beyond all reason. For example, I found a list of like 50 girls numbers that my ex had. It was girls that he picked up at random places and he even made notes next to the names of where he met them etc so he would remember them. And when I confronted him with it he said it was for mortgage leads! He claimed I wasn't giving him enough money so he was compiling names for a guy he met in the mortgage business and he showed me the guys business card and all. I wanted to believe him so much that I forced myself to believe it even though I knew it was unlikely. I msg'ed one of the girls on Myspace and she told me that he did hit on her and that it had nothing to do with mortgage leads. Another time I found condoms and phone numbers of hookers from Craigslist in his bag before he went to a trip to San Diego (later I found out it was Vegas). The proof was the condoms and the numbers, but he told me that it was actually his cousins, and that his cousins was in a hurry and left all that stuff in his bag. That same time he told me he was going to San Diego, but when I looked at his phone bill it said that on that EXACT date he made calls to me from Las Vegas. When I confronted him with that proof at first he kicked me out of his house for daring to interrupt him late at night with that info, but later he claimed that the "cell phone towers" got mixed up and had "messed up signals" and that it was really rare but that was what happened to him. There were at least 50 more lies like that but when I am in love with someome I feel sometimes that I am SO DESPERATE to keep them and be with them at all costs that I lose all reason and logic because I want to hang on so bad, I would even put myself at risk. It's pretty sad.
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 That same time he told me he was going to San Diego, but when I looked at his phone bill it said that on that EXACT date he made calls to me from Las Vegas. When I confronted him with that proof at first he kicked me out of his house for daring to interrupt him late at night with that info, but later he claimed that the "cell phone towers" got mixed up and had "messed up signals" and that it was really rare but that was what happened to him. Thanks for sharing... The above situation was quite creative indeed!
dreamergrl Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Chances are if you get the feeling that you're constantly getting lied to, you are. My last ex lied a lot - and when I confronted him about it, it ended up being my fault - and I let it go. I eventually said it was too much, and ended it, but I was left feeling crappy for it, you know like doing the "what if's" in my head. It's hard to walk away sometimes, but you'll be better for it, as you wont get dragged down by the person. You'll never get a person who is lying all the time to admit to it, they are so used to covering lies with more lies.
D-Lish Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 That's what my dad has been telling me... This is much easier to do when feelings are not involved though. When you're in love with someone, you tend to forgive a lot of things... Some liars are pretty easy to figure out. It is the smarter ones that can be quite challenging... It's because human beings experience "feelings" that inhibits our ability to trust our instincts. I think you KNOW your partner lies.... that's not the problem.... it's wrapping your head around the fact that you love her, but wish she wasn't a liar. The bottom line is that you don't have trust present in your relationship. You have to have that in order to feel safe with someone.
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 Chances are if you get the feeling that you're constantly getting lied to, you are. My last ex lied a lot - and when I confronted him about it, it ended up being my fault - and I let it go. I eventually said it was too much, and ended it, but I was left feeling crappy for it, you know like doing the "what if's" in my head. It's hard to walk away sometimes, but you'll be better for it, as you wont get dragged down by the person. You'll never get a person who is lying all the time to admit to it, they are so used to covering lies with more lies. Thanks for this. I've been with my GF for a while now. Every so often I'd notice a white lie but then when a more important lie comes to the surface, it makes me wonder about all the rest. This is a draining exercise and I'm getting really tired of it...
Star Gazer Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Thanks for this. I've been with my GF for a while now. Every so often I'd notice a white lie but then when a more important lie comes to the surface, it makes me wonder about all the rest. This is a draining exercise and I'm getting really tired of it... Can you give us an example?
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 It's because human beings experience "feelings" that inhibits our ability to trust our instincts. I think you KNOW your partner lies.... that's not the problem.... it's wrapping your head around the fact that you love her, but wish she wasn't a liar. The bottom line is that you don't have trust present in your relationship. You have to have that in order to feel safe with someone. Thanks for the advice. I guess my view is often "well it's not really her fault" but ultimately if she isn't responsible then who is... My relationship might be over soon so who knows...
dreamergrl Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Thanks for this. I've been with my GF for a while now. Every so often I'd notice a white lie but then when a more important lie comes to the surface, it makes me wonder about all the rest. This is a draining exercise and I'm getting really tired of it... It is very draining! You spend so much time and emotion into trying to figure out what's going on. If you're becoming so bothered by it, do yourself a favor, and move on before it gets to be too much for you. You can try talking to her about it. Chances are if she is lying, she'll be extremely defensive and that'll give you your answer right there.
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 Can you give us an example? It's a bit complicated but I'll try... A few years ago we were working on a paper together. It was Friday afternoon and she was going to visit her parents for the weekend (they live out of town). Before she left, I asked her whether she needs my help with any of this (I'm a much quicker writer) and she said she'll let me know by 5 pm whether she needs help or not. I don't hear a thing from her and then comes Monday morning. She asks me whether I did her part. Of course I did not (since she did not let me know on the previous Friday). Turns out she was a bit overwhelmed and asked me to help her out a bit. She said she had done the first three questions. Here's the twist. As I reviewed her part, I noticed that one of the questions was invalid (I won't go into technical details here). It simply could not be answered. I questioned her about it, she cried and yelled at me. Then she said she accidentally deleted the document because I stressed her out. Is it me?
Star Gazer Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 It's a bit complicated but I'll try... A few years ago we were working on a paper together. It was Friday afternoon and she was going to visit her parents for the weekend (they live out of town). Before she left, I asked her whether she needs my help with any of this (I'm a much quicker writer) and she said she'll let me know by 5 pm whether she needs help or not. I don't hear a thing from her and then comes Monday morning. She asks me whether I did her part. Of course I did not (since she did not let me know on the previous Friday). Turns out she was a bit overwhelmed and asked me to help her out a bit. She said she had done the first three questions. Here's the twist. As I reviewed her part, I noticed that one of the questions was invalid (I won't go into technical details here). It simply could not be answered. I questioned her about it, she cried and yelled at me. Then she said she accidentally deleted the document because I stressed her out. Is it me? Perhaps I'm just tired, but I don't quite understand where the lie is?
whichwayisup Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 Is it possible she has a disorder of some kind? Sounds too abit like she is a compulsive liar.
dreamergrl Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 It's a bit complicated but I'll try... A few years ago we were working on a paper together. It was Friday afternoon and she was going to visit her parents for the weekend (they live out of town). Before she left, I asked her whether she needs my help with any of this (I'm a much quicker writer) and she said she'll let me know by 5 pm whether she needs help or not. I don't hear a thing from her and then comes Monday morning. She asks me whether I did her part. Of course I did not (since she did not let me know on the previous Friday). Turns out she was a bit overwhelmed and asked me to help her out a bit. She said she had done the first three questions. Here's the twist. As I reviewed her part, I noticed that one of the questions was invalid (I won't go into technical details here). It simply could not be answered. I questioned her about it, she cried and yelled at me. Then she said she accidentally deleted the document because I stressed her out. Is it me? Maybe a more recent example?
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 Perhaps I'm just tired, but I don't quite understand where the lie is? The lie is in the part where she tells me she answered question 3 while that particular question was impossible to answer. When I confronted her with it, she yelled at me. And before I get a chance to ask her to send me her part, she tells me she accidentally permanently deleted the file (and we all know this is difficult to do in Windows unless you are truly trying to permanently delete it). This indicates to me she hadn't done anything at all.
whichwayisup Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 So she either is a white liar or she has some disability that she may not get the comprehension part of the work? Could you give another example of her white lies?
Little Shy Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 The unfortunate repercussion of the being lied to in a relationship for me, was that I now DOUBT my intuition. I know it would serve that if you felt something in your gut was wrong, then it proved to be wrong, regardless of what your partner told you, that you would think, "I will never doubt my instinct again!" Oh that this was the case! It makes you feel like you re going crazy! You think you are being paranoid, etc. It only took me one serious tailspin of a situation like this to throw my whole intuitive balance off. I still work to regain it everyday! Am I just paranoid now? Or did I always know, and should never doubt my instinct again? Hence! My relying on forums such as this, for outside opinion, on what I now perceive to be a damaged, paranoid little mind! I feel for you OP, and can relate.
Star Gazer Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 The lie is in the part where she tells me she answered question 3 while that particular question was impossible to answer. When I confronted her with it, she yelled at me. And before I get a chance to ask her to send me her part, she tells me she accidentally permanently deleted the file (and we all know this is difficult to do in Windows unless you are truly trying to permanently delete it). This indicates to me she hadn't done anything at all. Okay, I see now. Do you have any recent examples? That sounds like an isolated, stress-induced, non-relationship related issue for her (the paper) that was quite a while ago...
dreamergrl Posted March 31, 2008 Posted March 31, 2008 The lie is in the part where she tells me she answered question 3 while that particular question was impossible to answer. When I confronted her with it, she yelled at me. And before I get a chance to ask her to send me her part, she tells me she accidentally permanently deleted the file (and we all know this is difficult to do in Windows unless you are truly trying to permanently delete it). This indicates to me she hadn't done anything at all. This doesn't seem like a horrible lie, and it's an old lie. I thought maybe you were talking about something that would have to do with like if she's cheating on you or what not... or something that would have a large impact to your relationship
Author guy.lepage Posted March 31, 2008 Author Posted March 31, 2008 Maybe a more recent example? Last month she went to her grandmother's house on a Saturday. On Saturday night she e-mails me to let me know she'll spend the night there, which is fine by me. Later on she accidentally tells me about something she did at home on Sunday morning (she was supposed to be at her grandma's). When I casually asked her "so when did you leave your grandma's house?", she stumbled and hesitated quite a bit before giving what should've been a simple answer. When we did some of our assignments together, she was often late with her parts and would blame it on her e-mail problems. How often do e-mail problems occur, really? More than once a year and I think you're a liar...
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