TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 between a woman playing hard to get, actually being hard to get, and not intersted in sexual/romance relations? From reading on here and from my massive experience, I know that women often times play hard to get. Even with all my experience and success with women, I still sometimes question which of the 3 it is I'm dealing with in a particular woman. But from reading on here for awhile I'm seeing that playing hard to get is so common, so now I'm starting to wonder maybe even more women were interested in me (maybe all?) than I thought. It just seems like if women would stop playing hard to get, it would eliminate all the confusion and problems that go along with that. Wishful thinking right? Why do women play hard to get anyway? What are the signs and differences for each of, playing hard to get, actually being hard to get, and not interested, so that I'll always know which one I'm dealing with?
Curmudgeon Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 From reading on here and from my massive experience... What are the signs and differences for each of, playing hard to get, actually being hard to get, and not interested, so that I'll always know which one I'm dealing with? If you had all that experience and were such a practiced and successful lothario you'd know that you can never tell for sure. I think there's more of Richie and Ralph about you than the Fonz!
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 If you had all that experience and were such a practiced and successful lothario you'd know that you can never tell for sure. This is what I said basically even I can't always tell. No harm in asking for advice even if your great with women is there? There's always room for improvement. But if there is no way to tell the difference? Then what should one do? Does anyone have advice that is on topic?
FormerNiceGuy Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 between a woman playing hard to get, actually being hard to get, and not intersted in sexual/romance relations? From reading on here and from my massive experience, I know that women often times play hard to get. Even with all my experience and success with women, I still sometimes question which of the 3 it is I'm dealing with in a particular woman. But from reading on here for awhile I'm seeing that playing hard to get is so common, so now I'm starting to wonder maybe even more women were interested in me (maybe all?) than I thought. It just seems like if women would stop playing hard to get, it would eliminate all the confusion and problems that go along with that. Wishful thinking right? Why do women play hard to get anyway? What are the signs and differences for each of, playing hard to get, actually being hard to get, and not interested, so that I'll always know which one I'm dealing with? You can't. BA HA HA No. really, you can't. if we men could tell, we would have so many damn questions about women. Men are direct.. women are not. This is because a woman is more reactive rather than proactive. Do you know all these posts of "Is she just a friend?" or "Does she like me?" or "She says let's just be friends?" or "what does this mean!" It's because the girl wasn't direct. For example. Whenever I'm with a girl and she's upset, she tells me, "It's OK! i'M FINE." Any dumb guy knows something AIN'T right...but WHY does she say that things are OK! This and other things in life...show that women are such a mystery... So my best advice to all men...is to LEAD. Go for her and take action because she won't make that first step. The NICE CHUMP follows behind a woman. The JERK abuses and CONTROLS a woman. The GOOD MAN leads his girl.
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 1. between a woman playing hard to get, 2. actually being hard to get, and 3. not intersted in sexual/romance relations? I'll use a fun 'playground' metaphor: 1. She flirts, smiles, touches you, texts you from time to time, etc. Body language says... "take me". She is the kid on the playground who comes up to you and says 'tag, you're it!' and runs away. If you don't chase, she will run up to you and tag you again - as many times as it takes to get you to chase her. She'll run away just fast enough for you to catch her. 2. She acknowledges you, and perhaps spends more than a few seconds listening to what you say. She is receptive, but not reciprocal in your attentions. Body language says "I'm interested" even if her words don't. She is the one on the playground who looks like she might want to play tag, but stands aloofly on the sidelines watching to see if anyone invites her. She will probably say.. 'tag? I don't play tag', but you can tell she wants to, and will give in eventually. 3. She will not make eye contact, looks at her watch, cuts your conversations off, sighs impatiently, crosses her arms across her chest - if she smiles it is the frosty polite variety that does not reach her eyes. Her body language says "I'd rather be anywhere but here." She is the one on the playground doing her own thing, not paying attention to 'tag'. If you approach, she will turn and say "Do I LOOK like I want to play tag? Get lost."
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 You can't. BA HA HA No. really, you can't. if we men could tell, we would have so many damn questions about women. Men are direct.. women are not. This is because a woman is more reactive rather than proactive. Do you know all these posts of "Is she just a friend?" or "Does she like me?" or "She says let's just be friends?" or "what does this mean!" It's because the girl wasn't direct. For example. Whenever I'm with a girl and she's upset, she tells me, "It's OK! i'M FINE." Any dumb guy knows something AIN'T right...but WHY does she say that things are OK! This and other things in life...show that women are such a mystery... So my best advice to all men...is to LEAD. Go for her and take action because she won't make that first step. The NICE CHUMP follows behind a woman. The JERK abuses and CONTROLS a woman. The GOOD MAN leads his girl. Yes I think your conclusion is correct, just lead on your tems and if she doesn't follow there's your answer. This is what works good for me. The problem is I'm a fast worker, sometimes too fast. Would that we could either always tell the difference between the 3, or women just didn't play hard to get. We'd basically solve all of our women probelms right there. I gues it's natures way of weeding out the less cool guys and leaving more for me.
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 I'll use a fun 'playground' metaphor: 1. She flirts, smiles, touches you, texts you from time to time, etc. Body language says... "take me". She is the kid on the playground who comes up to you and says 'tag, you're it!' and runs away. If you don't chase, she will run up to you and tag you again - as many times as it takes to get you to chase her. She'll run away just fast enough for you to catch her. 2. She acknowledges you, and perhaps spends more than a few seconds listening to what you say. She is receptive, but not reciprocal in your attentions. Body language says "I'm interested" even if her words don't. She is the one on the playground who looks like she might want to play tag, but stands aloofly on the sidelines watching to see if anyone invites her. She will probably say.. 'tag? I don't play tag', but you can tell she wants to, and will give in eventually. 3. She will not make eye contact, looks at her watch, cuts your conversations off, sighs impatiently, crosses her arms across her chest - if she smiles it is the frosty polite variety that does not reach her eyes. Her body language says "I'd rather be anywhere but here." She is the one on the playground doing her own thing, not paying attention to 'tag'. If you approach, she will turn and say "Do I LOOK like I want to play tag? Get lost." This is all true and valid when a woman is being fairly blatant about her intentions. The problem is many women play games or even act interested when they're not really. If they would not play games at all and always acted interested if even subtley when they were and the same when they're not really interested it would be fairly easily and there would be no miscommunication. In reality they usually don't. It seems the more skilled I get at correctly reading their true interest, the more they play hard to get games. Well thanks for that list anyway.
Curmudgeon Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 But if there is no way to tell the difference? Then what should one do? Find a woman you truly believe you can trust who has proven herself to be open and honest over an extended period of time, then hope and pray that you're right! Bottom line -- rush to relationship bad -- friends first good.
Milan721 Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Because when you cut out the "playing hard to get" you end up with a girl who is just EASY. And we all know what happens to the easy girls... tossed aside like yesterday's trash. Dropping subtle hints lets us find out where you are in this flirtation. Is he looking for a relationship or just trying to get laid? Of course some women love the attention and love to flirt and have no intention of hooking up with you whatsoever. They just love to provide "the chase". Those types are a little obvious because they're like that with everyone.
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Do some research on body language and non-verbal cues. A person can fake whatever they like with words, but body language is hard to fake - much of it is subconscious. If you can familiarize yourself very well with it you will have an easier time telling the difference.
BlueHaiku Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Fonz, You ask why girls do this. I personally don't do it, but I know why many do. My girlfriends have endlessly given me the advice to do so, though I don't take it. Some girls do this because many believe that guys are only interested in hard-to-get girls. They believe that if they are too available, they won't be perceived as valuable and will therefore get used and tossed aside, as Milan says, or not even get any guy's attention at all. Basically, many girls play hard-to-get just as guys do who practice some of those PUA tactics. To increase their "value." I think it's ironic that both guys and girls play the same games, given that both sides are constantly bitching about the games the other side plays. I hate when people play games with me, so I refuse to play games with others. That said, I sometimes don't get the hints guys give off that they're interested in me, so from their perspective, I may be seeming to be hard-to-get. However, if they were to direcly approach me about their interest in me, they would get a clear and honest answer in return.
Star Gazer Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 If you had all that experience and were such a practiced and successful lothario you'd know that you can never tell for sure. So true! You can't tell, that's the point in "playing" hard to get.
Trialbyfire Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Find a woman you truly believe you can trust who has proven herself to be open and honest over an extended period of time, then hope and pray that you're right! Bottom line -- rush to relationship bad -- friends first good. Excellent advice! If you're only interested in getting into her pants, I doubt you'd have the patience. I don't play hard to get. I am hard to get, since I see sex as a natural extension of deeper emotions. If I'm not convinced you're interested in me as a person, where we share deeper mutual emotions, you'll be sitting, twiddling your thumbs forever.
FormerNiceGuy Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Excellent advice! If you're only interested in getting into her pants, I doubt you'd have the patience. I don't play hard to get. I am hard to get, since I see sex as a natural extension of deeper emotions. If I'm not convinced you're interested in me as a person, where we share deeper mutual emotions, you'll be sitting, twiddling your thumbs forever. As a guy..I respectfully disagree. If you just be all friendly and not really make a move, you're just setting yourself up to be thrown in the friends box. My philosophy is this. Make a move. you'll never ever run into problems of women being "just friends" because you never gave her that option. I've saved years of heart-ache by doing it this way. A lot of of guys think.... DOES SHE LIKE ME? A lot of guys ask this question. They hypothesize and analyze and question themselves. I used to think this question as well. I used to think, “Does she like me?" "Was that a sign that she liked me?" The truth is, you won’t ever know for sure unless you get some courage and ask her out! No one could ever tell me whether she liked me or not. But the best way I found out was to muster some courage and ask her out. And I realized something. You WILL FIND out! Asking her out will delete all doubts in your mind. You will NEVER EVER ASK THAT QUESTION AGAIN BECAUSE YOU WILL KNOW! Just go up to her and ask her out. If you get rejected, YOU'LL KNOW. And if you don't get rejected, YOU'LL KNOW. Stop overanalyzing. Stop hypothesizing. Stop wondering. Just be a man and ask her out.
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 Fonz, You ask why girls do this. I personally don't do it, but I know why many do. My girlfriends have endlessly given me the advice to do so, though I don't take it. Some girls do this because many believe that guys are only interested in hard-to-get girls. They believe that if they are too available, they won't be perceived as valuable and will therefore get used and tossed aside, as Milan says, or not even get any guy's attention at all. Basically, many girls play hard-to-get just as guys do who practice some of those PUA tactics. To increase their "value." I think it's ironic that both guys and girls play the same games, given that both sides are constantly bitching about the games the other side plays. I hate when people play games with me, so I refuse to play games with others. That said, I sometimes don't get the hints guys give off that they're interested in me, so from their perspective, I may be seeming to be hard-to-get. However, if they were to direcly approach me about their interest in me, they would get a clear and honest answer in return. I agree with your answer and that's my kind of girl. You saved me the trouble of explaining my postion.
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 Find a woman you truly believe you can trust who has proven herself to be open and honest over an extended period of time, then hope and pray that you're right! Bottom line -- rush to relationship bad -- friends first good. But why couldn't you have sex first and then see if the other person is open and honest over an extended period of time? And how does a guy know friends first isn't time wasted on someone who never had intentions of being more than friends? How much time should a guy invest in friends first before? A week, a month, or even longer? Then when they get intimate what's the guarantee that I won't like her sexuality or vice versa and it all unravels anyway? Your way waste a lot of time and is left to a lot of uncertainty. My way, makes two people happy and satisfied in the least amount of time and with the least amount of uncertainty, does it not? You see, having sex the first day is not make or break for me, it's what else she does or doesn't do. And games are easy for me to spot and high on the list of deal breakers. But that's just me.
Trialbyfire Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 But why couldn't you have sex first and then see if the other person is open and honest over an extended period of time? And how does a guy know friends first isn't time wasted on someone who never had intentions of being more than friends? How much time should a guy invest in friends first before? A week, a month, or even longer? Then when they get intimate what's the guarantee that I won't like her sexuality or vice versa and it all unravels anyway? Your way waste a lot of time and is left to a lot of uncertainty. My way, makes two people happy and satisfied in the least amount of time and and the least amount of uncertainty, does it not? You see, having sex the first day is not make or break for me, it's what else she does or doesn't do. And games are easy for me to spot and high on the list of deal breakers. But that's just me. Conceptually, from this perspective, not a PUA perspective, you're supposed to be interested in the girl for more than sex. While no doubt there's the initial attraction, getting to know her will provide you some insight into her personality type. It can only be beneficial, if you're looking for a long-term relationship. It's a good time to find out if the two of you have compatible personalities. If all you're interested in, is her physical attributes, I agree you would be wasting time. Why not hit and run to the next girl, huh?
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 Excellent advice! If you're only interested in getting into her pants, I doubt you'd have the patience. An overly broad conclusion. See my previous explanation why this isn't always the case. I am hard to get, since I see sex as a natural extension of deeper emotions. And I'm hard to get too. But as a man I see sex as a door to deeper emotions. This is the difference that you're not appreciating. If I'm not convinced you're interested in me as a person, where we share deeper mutual emotions, you'll be sitting, twiddling your thumbs forever. Fair enough but I won't be twiddling my thumbs, I'll be spending time with other girls who don't make things overly difficult. It's no more my job as a man to convince you of something any more than it's your job as a woman to convince me that you are willing to give me what I want. Fair is fair, right?
FormerNiceGuy Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Do NOT ask, "Is she interested in me?". Find out. Do NOT wait for a sign of interest. Assume she is interested. Do NOT wait for the right moment. MAKE it.
Trialbyfire Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Fair enough but I won't be twiddling my thumbs, I'll be spending time with other girls who don't make things overly difficult. It's no more my job as a man to convince you of something any more than it's your job as a woman to convince me that you are willing to give me what I want. Fair is fair, right? Trust me, I have no issues with that at all...
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 Conceptually, from this perspective, not a PUA perspective, you're supposed to be interested in the girl for more than sex. While no doubt there's the initial attraction, getting to know her will provide you some insight into her personality type. It can only be beneficial, if you're looking for a long-term relationship. It's a good time to find out if the two of you have compatible personalities. If all you're interested in, is her physical attributes, I agree you would be wasting time. Why not hit and run to the next girl, huh? See you assume that every guy wants to hit and run and the only way to stop this is to play hard to get. But what you don't take into account is, a guy is going to run or notfor far more reason than depending on if you slept with him on night one. Your hard to get stance is going to make as many genuinely interested guys run away than it keeps around. Mot girls are having sex with guys they're interested in right awhile or they never do. So this discusion is more theoretical than real world anyway.
FormerNiceGuy Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Fair enough but I won't be twiddling my thumbs, I'll be spending time with other girls who don't make things overly difficult. It's no more my job as a man to convince you of something any more than it's your job as a woman to convince me that you are willing to give me what I want. Fair is fair, right? Exactly! If a girl likes you, don’t play games. She’s yours. There are a lot less mind-games with secure girls. Insecure girls can get flaky, they crave attention, then when they get it they back off and it's all one big hassle. So even though it's easier to "game" insecure girls, the more secure ones are much less of a headache to deal with. Secure girls know what they want and know what they are worth. They don't give a crap about some guy ignoring them, so the ideal way to deal with them is to drop the games altogether. Make your interest known, then ask her out. The most important thing is that you need to be secure in yourself and have something genuine to offer her so that she can respect you.
Trialbyfire Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 See you assume that every guy wants to hit and run and the only way to stop this is to play hard to get. But what you don't take into account is, a guy is going to run or notfor far more reason than depending on if you slept with him on night one. Your hard to get stance is going to make as many genuinely interested guys run away than it keeps around. Mot girls are having sex with guys they're interested in right awhile or they never do. So this discusion is more theoretical than real world anyway. What you fail to see is that it's not playing hard to get. I am hard to get. If a guy has no patience, that's his choice. There's never a shortage of men in my life.
Author TheFonz Posted March 30, 2008 Author Posted March 30, 2008 Do NOT ask, "Is she interested in me?". Find out. Do NOT wait for a sign of interest. Assume she is interested. Do NOT wait for the right moment. MAKE it. I agree with you. But my point is hard to get games only get in the way. I'm not totally sure women sucessfully play hard to get games with a guy they're really interested in anyway. Most girls give into me pretty fast. And then ones that don't, never do. So I never waste too much time on a girl that's "hard to get".
BlueEyedGirl Posted March 30, 2008 Posted March 30, 2008 Body language and the way she looks at you. I can always tell if a guy is interested in me.
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