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March 24, 2008

That's why HE couldn't shake it. Because SHE never got it. She never understood how he felt... or why.

Extreme selfishness blocks the ability to empathize or even sympathize.

OH, Ok.. I don't get any of this SH*T

March 24, 2008

That's why HE couldn't shake it. Because SHE never got it. She never understood how he felt... or why.

Extreme selfishness blocks the ability to empathize or even sympathize.

thankfully my wife got it.

and to addd to your last sentence

Pride blocks Gods grace.....I remember the day I finally let my pride go and let Him in. That was the first step for me being able to forgive her. "Forgive those who have done wrong against you so that you too can be forgiven" I had to let go of freewill and my pride so that God could help me get thru this. And that was the best decision I every made.

March 25, 2008

you wanna have some anyway???

Are you stalking me, Stamp?

March 25, 2008

Twiceshy, you don't get it.

I guess I don't.

March 25, 2008

I have been there brother. There was a time during recovery that I was just disgusted with her.

But I endured all of that. I forgiveness takes time

with all due respect, WWIU is right. You dont get it.

People divorce far too quickly in this world. I choose to forgive and see if we could make it work and make it better. And IMO, we are doing just that. It may not work for other people. But like I said, I wanted to stay and she wanted to stay so we stayed together and are enduring.

some people commend me for staying and some people still think I should have left.

I understand both sides, but I am gald I choose to stay. If I stayed and it didnt get any better, I wouldnt be here, I would be gone. But it has gotten better and I am still here.

take Dazed for instants. He stayed for 3 years too, then one day he couldnt discount his GUT feelings that he still hasnt happy, so he left his wife. And it worked for him better to leave.

But I dont have those feelings anymore and I dont plan on leaving. After all the work we have done, it has taken us to the better.

I understand all that you are saying, really I do. But I fail to see "all the work [you two] have done" if she is still lying to you and says things like you say she has. That, to me, doesn't sound like alot of progress.

I just hope you aren't believing that progress has been made because you simply want to believe it and don't want to get divorced for whatever reason, and she isn't still playing you for a fool.

If I had decided to stay and thought that progress was made, and then my wife would say things like that to me, I'd think to myself, "she hasn't changed and hasn't learned a damn thing from her affair".

March 25, 2008

I'd think to myself, "she hasn't changed and hasn't learned a damn thing from her affair".

everyone interprets things in there own way.

this one single question was the only question I had left. it was not asked buy maybe 3 times in the last 3 years. Mostly because was it something I realy needed to know.

She had been forth coming on all my other questions in these 3 years.

But you have to understand the context of this one quesition from my side VS her side. She did not want to give anymore details by advice from IC years ago. I viewed this as a YES or NO. She viewed it as a detail. We even talked about this last night. I said this is not a detail, it was yes or no. How many times, when , where, those are details and those I didnt need.

And I disagree that she has not chaged. Your not here wiht her, you dont see the things I see. I only post the the things that concern me, which when people read them, thats all they see. They dont see all the good that has taken place.

You can believe what you want and have your opinion on my matter. But I know whats going since I am in it and my wife has made huge changes.

The issue with this one question is. For her its in the past and she dont want to keep the affiar issues in the present. She wants us to move past it. For me this issue was a lingering doubt in my mind. And when I asked her, it was said in a joking manner, but she responed to it. So I cant say she is lieing about it, becuase it never came up but a few times in 3 years.

It was pretty much just a lingering doubt in my mind. but I choose to let it go but did bring it up the few times. Now for what ever reason she responed to the off the cuff comment.

So to me, its over and my next post describes our conversation last night on the residual questions I had realted to the sex issue. Again these were doubts I needed clarified again...reinforced to help me let go.

March 25, 2008

Well

sometimes I cant help myself.

I decided to ask some more questions and some old ones again

I started by saying thank you for finally admiting YES about the intercourse sex question I had. I then stated its been over 3 years and we are at a good place right now and we have no reason to lie anymore and I had a few more questions.

I told her I didnt believe it was just 4 times. See said, again it wasnt about the sex, at least not the way I as a male would think it was. She reiterated that this A was more EA than anything for her. She again stated it was 4 times they tried and it worked once, the first time. Which is the 1 time she did admit they tried and it worked ok, but because of him being drunk and the ED issue, it still took effort. Now this one time I knew about, but she did now say it was tried more than that, she said they tried a few times but it didnt work so well. So this is consistant with 4 times total.

I then asked if his ED issue was real or just a lie to minimize the sex part. She said, NO, it was a huge issue for HIM, not her. He had a big complex about it and often said to her, just go to your husband. He wanted the sex more than her. She did give in at times, but it wasnt everytime they were togheter. Again, this was about attention for her. And for him it was about having a hot woman on his arm. Sex was mostly oral, again for her. He got pleasure out of that since he didnt work all the time. She also said before any sex ever took place, he bragged about how good he was and how big he was. She laughed and told me, he was the same size as me and it wasnt anything specail since he hardly could get it up. She again said when he did, it wasnt hot and heavy, it was awkward becuase of the ED issue. Again, this is all consistant with what she has already told me in the past.

I then asked if there were any other affairs and if she had any sex with any other men besides me. She said NO. The OM was the only affair, they did try intercourse the few times and she did get oral sex from him on occausion. Again she said it wasnt about the sex, again consistant.

I asked if she had sex with the guy she cheated on me with before we were married. She said no, that she only gave him a BJ. This I knew about. She said they did not have sex and she did not have oral from him. Again consistant.

I asked if she did anything with these 2 guys on that girls weekend in the mid 90's. Again she said it was a group of women dancing wiht a few guys, one guy kissed her on the neck and she kissed him back. And another guy slapped her butt while dancing. Nothing more. Again consistant with what I was already told.

So

knowing that we have nothing to hide anymore and I felt genuinely satisfied with her answers, meaning my GUT told me she was telling the truth and her body actions and demeanor while answering were consistant with telling the truth. It felt right.

I am happy to say, that all my doubts about these issue are answered. I have no more what if thoughts about the truthfulness of previous answers.

I believe this is a good day, another turning point for me. 3 years and 8 months later, I feel like I can finaly put all of this behind me....ALL OF IT.

again thanks to everyone that has helped me along the way and to everyone who was genuienly concerned for my well being.

thanks

March 25, 2008

everyone interprets things in there own way.

this one single question was the only question I had left. it was not asked buy maybe 3 times in the last 3 years. Mostly because was it something I realy needed to know.

She had been forth coming on all my other questions in these 3 years.

But you have to understand the context of this one quesition from my side VS her side. She did not want to give anymore details by advice from IC years ago. I viewed this as a YES or NO. She viewed it as a detail. We even talked about this last night. I said this is not a detail, it was yes or no. How many times, when , where, those are details and those I didnt need.

And I disagree that she has not chaged. Your not here wiht her, you dont see the things I see. I only post the the things that concern me, which when people read them, thats all they see. They dont see all the good that has taken place.

You can believe what you want and have your opinion on my matter. But I know whats going since I am in it and my wife has made huge changes.

The issue with this one question is. For her its in the past and she dont want to keep the affiar issues in the present. She wants us to move past it. For me this issue was a lingering doubt in my mind. And when I asked her, it was said in a joking manner, but she responed to it. So I cant say she is lieing about it, becuase it never came up but a few times in 3 years.

It was pretty much just a lingering doubt in my mind. but I choose to let it go but did bring it up the few times. Now for what ever reason she responed to the off the cuff comment.

So to me, its over and my next post describes our conversation last night on the residual questions I had realted to the sex issue. Again these were doubts I needed clarified again...reinforced to help me let go.

Ok, so that being the case, you are never EVER gonna bring this up with her again, right?

March 25, 2008

Well
sometimes I cant help myself.
I decided to ask some more questions and some old ones again

I started by saying thank you for finally admiting YES about the intercourse sex question I had. I then stated its been over 3 years and we are at a good place right now and we have no reason to lie anymore and I had a few more questions.

I told her I didnt believe it was just 4 times. See said, again it wasnt about the sex, at least not the way I as a male would think it was. She reiterated that this A was more EA than anything for her. She again stated it was 4 times they tried and it worked once, the first time. Which is the 1 time she did admit they tried and it worked ok, but because of him being drunk and the ED issue, it still took effort. Now this one time I knew about, but she did now say it was tried more than that, she said they tried a few times but it didnt work so well. So this is consistant with 4 times total.

I then asked if his ED issue was real or just a lie to minimize the sex part. She said, NO, it was a huge issue for HIM, not her. He had a big complex about it and often said to her, just go to your husband. He wanted the sex more than her. She did give in at times, but it wasnt everytime they were togheter. Again, this was about attention for her. And for him it was about having a hot woman on his arm. Sex was mostly oral, again for her. He got pleasure out of that since he didnt work all the time. She also said before any sex ever took place, he bragged about how good he was and how big he was. She laughed and told me, he was the same size as me and it wasnt anything specail since he hardly could get it up. She again said when he did, it wasnt hot and heavy, it was awkward becuase of the ED issue. Again, this is all consistant with what she has already told me in the past.

I then asked if there were any other affairs and if she had any sex with any other men besides me. She said NO. The OM was the only affair, they did try intercourse the few times and she did get oral sex from him on occausion. Again she said it wasnt about the sex, again consistant.

I asked if she had sex with the guy she cheated on me with before we were married. She said no, that she only gave him a BJ. This I knew about. She said they did not have sex and she did not have oral from him. Again consistant.

I asked if she did anything with these 2 guys on that girls weekend in the mid 90's. Again she said it was a group of women dancing wiht a few guys, one guy kissed her on the neck and she kissed him back. And another guy slapped her butt while dancing. Nothing more. Again consistant with what I was already told.

So
knowing that we have nothing to hide anymore and I felt genuinely satisfied with her answers, meaning my GUT told me she was telling the truth and her body actions and demeanor while answering were consistant with telling the truth. It felt right.

I am happy to say, that all my doubts about these issue are answered. I have no more what if thoughts about the truthfulness of previous answers.

I believe this is a good day, another turning point for me. 3 years and 8 months later, I feel like I can finaly put all of this behind me....ALL OF IT.
again thanks to everyone that has helped me along the way and to everyone who was genuienly concerned for my well being.

thanks

Ok, you say you two have moved past this and you see the change in her, yet you keep grilling her. why do you keep grilling her? Because you don't believe her. Hence, you think she is lying.

So here you are, you say she has changed and you see all the good things about her and things are great, right? Ok, I'll take your word for it and give you the benefit of the doubt. And if all that is true, then I wish you luck and hope you find happiness because I have been in your shoes too.

But, if that all is true, why then are you still grilling her?

March 25, 2008

...if you can accept all that. i sure couldn't, and I would still wonder if she was being honest. But hey, more power to you.

Ok, so that being the case, you are never EVER gonna bring this up with her again, right?

Ok, you say you two have moved past this and you see the change in her, yet you keep grilling her. why do you keep grilling her? Because you don't believe her. Hence, you think she is lying.

So here you are, you say she has changed and you see all the good things about her and things are great, right? Ok, I'll take your word for it and give you the benefit of the doubt. And if all that is true, then I wish you luck and hope you find happiness because I have been in your shoes too.

But, if that all is true, why then are you still grilling her?

not sure how else to explain it or even why I feel the need to explain it.

First Darknight - In order to forgive I have to learn to trust her again. This took a long time to do. It was a progression. Now your comment of not being able to live with what she did. yeah I know this was tuff to do, most men wouldnt have stuck around, but I choose to forgive and repair. If I kept on doubting everything and not beliveing any thing, i would never be able to forgive or trust and I cant imagine were I would be today if i lived in the box of fear always wondering what if. as Owl said, at some point you need to say, OK this is waht happened wheter I got all the details in the utmost trueness, I can never tell. But I can no longer doubt it and worry about it. I need to focus on the future and look to new experiences wiht my wife. I cant let the past consume me or I will never be able to move on.

Twice Shy - I dont plan to bring this (intercourse sex) up again unless a situation warrants me doing so. But I cant see why I would need to. At the beginning (3 years ago) She told me they tried in once and it didnt work very well. Over three years I asked that same question 3 times, telling her I dont believe her. THis last time was a joking off the cuff comment about how affair people dont have intercourse, just oral just like her and her OM. I actually said with a chuckle, it was not serious. But she for what ever reason finaly just said, you know we did.

So to say I keep grilling her is not true. Because of her comment, it prompted me to ask these other questions again, hoping that if she had anything else to hide or anything she didnt tell me truthfully in the begining and that we are secure enough now and should be able to share it now.

So I asked the question about the ED and the number of times. The answers she gave me satisfied my doubts. as for the other questions, those were just me again giving her the chance to come clean on anything else. And she assured me she has told me everything.

So I have not kept grilled her, nor did I grill her last night. it was a very constructive conversation. And I believe her. The only new things I got out of this were that it wasnt just one time it was several. And those several times didnt go to well due to ED.

There was no smoking gun there was no new lies being told. I heard everything I already new. and I can finaly get rid of all this doubt i still harbored way back in my mind.

We have come along way in 3 some years

March 25, 2008

not sure how else to explain it or even why I feel the need to explain it.
First Darknight - In order to forgive I have to learn to trust her again. This took a long time to do. It was a progression. Now your comment of not being able to live with what she did. yeah I know this was tuff to do, most men wouldnt have stuck around, but I choose to forgive and repair. If I kept on doubting everything and not beliveing any thing, i would never be able to forgive or trust and I cant imagine were I would be today if i lived in the box of fear always wondering what if. as Owl said, at some point you need to say, OK this is waht happened wheter I got all the details in the utmost trueness, I can never tell. But I can no longer doubt it and worry about it. I need to focus on the future and look to new experiences wiht my wife. I cant let the past consume me or I will never be able to move on.

Just a little clarification on why I was grilling you yesterday.

I don't care so much about a BS learning to trust again. To me that's the WS's problem. To my thinking trust works like a credit score, and trustworthy actions are the currency. Adultery is like declaring bankruptcy.

No, what I'm more interested in is Respect. I can trust anyone, it's my choice, I control that. I can't MAKE someone respect me.

It sounds to me like your wife respects you now... and that's the missing piece of the puzzle.

March 25, 2008

Twice Shy - I dont plan to bring this (intercourse sex) up again unless a situation warrants me doing so. But I cant see why I would need to.

Thats my point, you already have it set in your mind that she has changed, is making a good effort, and you see the great things she is doing. yet you still felt the need to grill her as evidenced in your last post.

So you say you can't see why you would need to, but you did anyway.

At the beginning (3 years ago) She told me they tried in once and it didnt work very well. Over three years I asked that same question 3 times, telling her I dont believe her. THis last time was a joking off the cuff comment about how affair people dont have intercourse, just oral just like her and her OM.

But if you are working on your R, and things are going great, why did you even bring it up?

I actually said with a chuckle, it was not serious. But she for what ever reason finaly just said, you know we did.

Oh come on now, you wouldn't have brought up her cheating just jokingly.

Even if that were true, it is a damn bad joke.

Admit it, you said it to take a poke at her while trying to make it look as if you were joking. Am I bashing you for that? Not at all. As an X-BS, I understand the feelings of taking a poke at the betrayer here and there and throwing it back in their face.

But you said things are on the up and up and everything is beautiful, so why take that stab at her?

So to say I keep grilling her is not true. Because of her comment, it prompted me to ask these other questions again

the comment she made before you decided to chuckle that question out had nothing to do with her cheating.

So I have not kept grilled her, nor did I grill her last night. it was a very constructive conversation.

But you had already said that you have moved past it and she has changed. If so, why ask any questions like that? My guess is because you haven't gotten past it as much as you'd like to have us believe.

Don't get me wrong, I understand the emotions that run through your body. I don't want to see you played for a fool again.

And I believe her. The only new things I got out of this were that it wasnt just one time it was several. And those several times didnt go to well due to ED.

There was no smoking gun there was no new lies being told. I heard everything I already new. and I can finaly get rid of all this doubt i still harbored way back in my mind.

We have come along way in 3 some years

Ok, so its over now? You aren't going to ask her any more about her screwing around any longer, right??

March 25, 2008

It sounds to me like your wife respects you now... and that's the missing piece of the puzzle.

exactly. Respect was one of the emotional needs I needed from her, along with admiration. These were the things I was missing pre-affair and into post affair. For her, it was loving attention and affection. The things I didnt do and the things she seeked from OM. Through counseling and many many many talks between us we now know how to meet these needs for each. And its awesome.

March 25, 2008

I will respond as best I can

Thats my point, you already have it set in your mind that she has changed, is making a good effort, and you see the great things she is doing. yet you still felt the need to grill her as evidenced in your last post.

So you say you can't see why you would need to, but you did anyway.

OK. With the joking comment and her respones of YES, brought back some doubt I still had lingering. I choose to ask or in your words grill her again on quesitons I already asked wiht the exception of asking if the ED was minimized, I never asked that before. So in a sense I did grill her again on things I already asked. I guess I felt if, if there was any truth to my doubt, she had this opp to come totally clean on these same questions. Hoping that IF, IF, IF there was more to the story, she would feel comfortable and safe enought to tell me. And what I heard was consistant with what she already told me except for the number of times they tried. Which in her mind she didnt feel she wanted to tell me.

But if you are working on your R, and things are going great, why did you even bring it up?

Oh come on now, you wouldn't have brought up her cheating just jokingly.
Even if that were true, it is a damn bad joke.

During the conversation when she made the comment about seeing the aquintance we both know (MM) with another (MW) we both know, she made the comment of "maybe there just friends". Now in my mind, I thought yeah right, and they dont have sex either, just oral sex. I guess my mind produced a sarcastic response to her niave assumption that they are just friends and are cheating. So in a sense that comment from her made me comment about her affair, but the context of assumption and my comment was not serious, it was in a joking manner.

Admit it, you said it to take a poke at her while trying to make it look as if you were joking. Am I bashing you for that? Not at all. As an X-BS, I understand the feelings of taking a poke at the betrayer here and there and throwing it back in their face.

But you said things are on the up and up and everything is beautiful, so why take that stab at her?

Honestly I dont bring it up much anymore. She does more now than I do. but when she does its at times like these, when she sees other people cheating, it brings back remorse on her part and she reitterates her appologies to me. (see my other thread called My Wife had an A-HA momment). That was another time just recently that she witnessed cheating and came home to me sad for what she did to me.

BUT, for this instants, yes I admit, it could be considered a poke at her. But you have to understand our relationship NOW. We are kinda at a point where we CAN talk about the affair and its civil talk on obht parts. In fact we BOTH even joke about it sometimes....I know it sounds wierd, but we are "safe" enough that we can talk about it and sometimes its in a joking manner, not poking at all. Sometimes we find humor in it all. I know that sounds strange, but sometimes when the affair comes up its during serious talks or comedic conversations too.

the comment she made before you decided to chuckle that question out had nothing to do with her cheating.

no it had nothing to do wiht her cheating. her comment was a "trigger" that sparked my comment back about cheaters only have oral sex. Yes it was a poke, but in a joking manner.

But you had already said that you have moved past it and she has changed. If so, why ask any questions like that? My guess is because you haven't gotten past it as much as you'd like to have us believe.

Don't get me wrong, I understand the emotions that run through your body. I don't want to see you played for a fool again.

The pain is still there YES, probably always will be. But I have it stored in a place in my mind that I work very hard on not letting take control of me. Sometimes things trigger the pain out and sometimes I deal wiht it internally and sometimes I make comments to her. My counseler told me that my thoughts are just that, thoughts, they are not reality. I cant let my obsessive, doubtfull thoughts control me. Reality is, she is still my wife, we are making great progress and things NOW are great. I cant let old thoughts come back to affect where we are now.

Ok, so its over now? You aren't going to ask her any more about her screwing around any longer, right??

I cant answer that yes or no. My goal would be to not ask her specific questions again, unless something comes up that contridicts what I have been told. My goal is to not poke at her anymore about it.

I dont now, this was just a happenstance where something triggered me to ask these quesitons again. I guess to finally reaffirm that I got the whole truth. To put the "stored" doubt to bed for good.

And right now, I feel that I have. I dont need to wonder anymore, I needed this reaafirmation to turn the doubt off and move forward.

Someone once said it takes 2 years to get over an affair. One of our counselers said 10 years and for some they never get over it. Its been almost 4 years for us and I can say I am over the hump and I see the light at the end of the tunnel.

and thankyou for your geniune concern for me. I really do appreciate it.

But I look at it this way. As Ladyjane once told me, what she gonna do, hurt my feelings again? Been there done that, she cant hurt me again. if my wife does anything to jepordized this marriage, its on her, not me. I will be strong, while she would have to live with the guilt again. You see she cant hurt me agan, I wont feel hurt, it would be a little anger and pity towrds her, but it wouldnt hurt me like it did the first time.

I am empowered so to speak. And as WWIU has said, if she ever f'ed up agian, its her loss, not mine

March 25, 2008

WOW.. man, I just don't see howyou do it. I RESPECT it, but I couldnt do it... You said that at first she admitted that they tried ONLY ONCE, and it wasnt good, right?? NOW she is saying the FIRST time it was good, and the next 3 times, not so good... I am telling you, I SEE THE PATTERN as bright as day.. And it makes me sick (in my situation)... But YES, I see the pattern.. Again, you state that at this point, what does it really matter.. But what I see is that she just got by AGAIN with lies covering up other lies... sorry, not trying to stir the pot, but it is EXACTLY what she has done...

March 25, 2008

WOW.. man, I just don't see howyou do it. I RESPECT it, but I couldnt do it... You said that at first she admitted that they tried ONLY ONCE, and it wasnt good, right?? NOW she is saying the FIRST time it was good, and the next 3 times, not so good... I am telling you, I SEE THE PATTERN as bright as day.. And it makes me sick (in my situation)... But YES, I see the pattern.. Again, you state that at this point, what does it really matter.. But what I see is that she just got by AGAIN with lies covering up other lies... sorry, not trying to stir the pot, but it is EXACTLY what she has done...

dam dude, I understand your side, I do

But to reitterate.

When she told me (3 years ago). She said they did it once but it didnt go to well becuase of ED and alcohol. I dont recall exactly...but she also said they tried again but it didnt work, meaning the intercourse didnt work. Now the oral he did, of course worked fine and of course it was good. Yes she said it was good (oral), but it wasnt any better than me, it was just different, exciting, heat of the momment good, you know, affiar sex. And yes that was very painfull to hear and it took along time to accept it.

fast forward to now.

She stated the same thing about the first time. And then when I asked, she stated they tried again like 4 times, but each time it didnt work to satisfaction, due to same issues with ED. Like I said, this was more EA than PA. She also said, it wasnt sex all the time, they just hung out alot and texted alot and I believe she is honest that way. So knowing that intercourse sex was difficult on his part, they didnt try it but a few times. maybe everynow and then they felt hot enought to try again, but according to her she said it was awkard due to him not being able to perform. it was more frustrating for him. And I believe her.

I guess it come down to this.

She is either very truthful about the sex part.

OR she has feed me lies 3 years ago and still sticking to the same story now and maybe they did have hot monkey sex every time the met during the A.

I mean is there a middle ground. You see, I have choice to either believe or not believe. So I made the decision to stay and we are doing quite well. So if all the sex parts were minimized, whats the difference? I aint leaving NOW.

what else can I do, besides ask her to tell me if in those 4 times was he hard enough to go all the way to orgasim? But honestly what would that detail do for me? being male, it would just be another vision I have to deal with in my head.

or I could go ask him these same quesitons and see what he says? but like I would be able to do that.

comes down to this.

I take her answers on faith that they are true and move on and keep this behind me

or I harbor them as lies and live with doubt and be angry and bitter in my marriage.

or I say I dont believe you I want a dirvorce, all over my doubt of her answers.

Honestly, I believe she has told me the truth(minized) 3 years ago and has told me the maximized truth NOW.

March 25, 2008

OK... I am NOT on a mission to fill your head with doubt or anything, just following along, but the similarites are striking to me, and quite bothersome to ME.. But, what the hell can I do about it, NOTHING.. Just a part of this stupid F***ing triangle.. and I hate it. The feeling of being "minimized".. All of the "Oh, no Honey, He wasnt bigger than you, the sex, hardly at all, it meant nothing, you know, just caught up in the moment, affair sex, and it was aonly once or twice and it meant nothing, I swear, YOU are better, etc....." I know my MW is laying out lie after lie after F***ing lie to save HER ASS... But at the end of MY day, what does it really matter.. Just hurts now...

Thanks

March 25, 2008

OK... I am NOT on a mission to fill your head with doubt or anything, just following along, but the similarites are striking to me, and quite bothersome to ME.. But, what the hell can I do about it, NOTHING.. Just a part of this stupid F***ing triangle.. and I hate it. The feeling of being "minimized".. All of the "Oh, no Honey, He wasnt bigger than you, the sex, hardly at all, it meant nothing, you know, just caught up in the moment, affair sex, and it was aonly once or twice and it meant nothing, I swear, YOU are better, etc....." I know my MW is laying out lie after lie after F***ing lie to save HER ASS... But at the end of MY day, what does it really matter.. Just hurts now...

Thanks

OK, I see now. I feel some projection on your part and it is understandable.

but I feel she is being honest with me.

there is so muc more to this story than just these issues on the details of the sex parts.

The volume of info she gave me was huge when everything came out. She just decided to keep the sex parts minimized. maybe she knew it wouldhurt real bad and she saved me from that. I dont know, will I ever really know? but it dont matter now.

man some of the things she told me. think aout this, what is more troubling:

knowing she asked him if he would leave his wife?

knowing they actually talked about buyng a house and running away together?

or knowing if he f'ed her 4 times or 40 times?

I tell you right now, knowing she asked him if he would leave his wife took alot more effort for me to accept that the fact she let him pet the kitty.

March 25, 2008

How do you do it... My MW's H knows some of the same things (to recap, now almost 4 years).. He knows she lived a "double life" and there have been 4-5-6 Ddays.. I don't get it.. YOU are helping me see a few things though, and THANK YOU for chatting with ME (the OM).. I am also trying to figure out HIS side a little.. I almost started a post asking for guys like YOU to respond, so thanks again...

March 25, 2008

but I feel she is being honest with me.

That and the A is completely over as she's been in NC with the OM for a long, long time.

SD, Thumbs and his wife have gone to MC together and apart, she's worked on her own issues and dealt with things that have now been cleared up. NOT a justification of her choice to cheat on Thumbs, but due to her frame of mind and some issues going on within herself, she made some real bad choices. The difference though now is thumbs and his wife ARE well past recovery and back together in every way. SD, your MW still has you on string, your A really isn't 'over' over - she won't let go...Though, who knows if she's told her husband you're gone and out of the picture. She may have lapses and slips, and her H may allow more a longer grace period, depends on if HE feels his marriage to her is worth saving. If he is anything likes Thumbs and has faith for BOTH of them, then he won't give up. Sorry, I know you probably don't want to hear that..

March 26, 2008

How do you do it... ...

Faith in Jesus Christ. And strong convictions to my marriage commitment

March 26, 2008

When she confessed about the A I asked if there was others and she told me no other affairs:

but In the mid 90's she kissed up on/danced/was being inappropaite with 2 different guys on 2 separate occasions while on a girls weekend away

Plus she did cheat on me in the very early 90's before we were married. But that I knew about, we broke up and got back together and eventually married 1994.

Now to answer your question. I would say YES. If I found out NOW, that my wife has had multiple affairs I would leave. If she ever has another one, I would leave.

IMO, if I were you, I'd start digging! Just to make darn sure that you're not wasting your time with her! I don't know if you've considered it, but, hey no time like the present! No point to put it off! The way she seems to act though, from what you've stated, I dunno, It's as though she's still not respecting you on some level, I'm refering to the fact that you have to pry or trick things out of her, so from my viewpoint she's continuing to lie to you, but, that's just the way I'm seeing things on this end. The first time she cheated while you two were dating should've ended it forever, IMO! Well that's all for now.

March 26, 2008

She admits she was SOOOO stupid for her actions and she wont do it again and she prays everyday that I dont change my mind, because she has made up hers, SHE WANTS ME and ONLY ME. I know this becasue I genuinely feel it from her and my gut tells me is true.

NOW she does! She didn't then when she was doling out all the hell, I calls em as I sees them! I couldn't just ignor that last statement. Has your wife ever read these posts, to get an idea of other peoples viewpoints, you know, how other people see the situation, do you think it would open her eyes a bit more, or a lot more? She may see from a lot of people on here, this crap don't wash!

March 26, 2008

By the way Thumbs, I hope you realize that I don't disrespect you for one second by trying to work things out, just the opposite, however, If it were me, her butt would've been out the door like 4 years ago!

March 27, 2008

NOW she does! She didn't then when she was doling out all the hell, I calls em as I sees them! I couldn't just ignor that last statement. Has your wife ever read these posts, to get an idea of other peoples viewpoints, you know, how other people see the situation, do you think it would open her eyes a bit more, or a lot more? She may see from a lot of people on here, this crap don't wash!

Yes, now she does. Recovery period was very difficult for both of us. This was NOT easy to do. but we did it and I nor she regrets staying together, we are thankfull we did and thankfull we have come closer.

And yes she has read LS some. And she knows all to well, the opinion people have of her and what she did. And she knows she f'ed up big time. Her eyes are wide open now. During affair and post affair, she was how do you say, in a very deep fog. She admits she wasnt HER during that time. She was very selfish, she admits all of this. Believe me she is very remorse NOW, everyone has there own timeline. But as WWIU said, she wasnt in a good place inside her mind and now looking back, she is disgusted with what she did and still hurts to even think about what she did to me, our family and to herself. She lives with it and she is well aware of what she did.

By the way Thumbs, I hope you realize that I don't disrespect you for one second by trying to work things out, just the opposite, however, If it were me, her butt would've been out the door like 4 years ago!

Thank you for the respect. Like I have said. Some people can and some people cant repair a marraige after infidelity. For what ever reason, I could and she could. Cant explain it, everyone has there threshold I guess.

I know some people may think I was a little weak during this whole ordeal, and I admit I was in the beginning. I was scared and very insecure. And it took this betrayl and pain for me to get over my issues.

For what ever reason, God let this happen to us. We both endured the pain and we both have grown stronger because of it.

I have always said, this affair was bittersweet. Bitter becuase of the f'ing pain, dam it sucked, and I wish this on no one. But it was sweet becasue it opened OUR eyes to SEE. And it truely has made us grow stronger and closer.

Some cant comprehend that, but its the truth man.

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