nycgirl110 Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Hi, I sent out a thread yesterday which led me to write this one to give more information and hopefully get more opinions. As I mentioned in the other, I am 25 and my boyfriend is 26 and I brought up our future to him the other day and he and I did not seem to be on the same page about getting married. We have lived together for 1.5 yrs and been together over 3 years. When we started dating he told me that he was looking for someone he could really be with because he always thought the next person he was with would hopefully one day become his wife if he and her worked out, his last relationship was 4.5 years and the only other serious one he has had. NOW, we have worked out clearly because its been three years, but this happened.. He told me the other day he did not know if he wanted to get engaged till he was at least 28, maybe less but did not think it would happen within a year to a year and a half, but that it could be not till he was 29. The fact that he gave me this wishey-washey answer kind of freaked me out. So I said maybe then we should live apart and he said no, if one of us moves out then we will break up, because he does not want to take a step backwards. Although, I kind of felt if we are not going foward now, why can't we go backwards. Then he said that he loved me, wanted me to be his wife, but thought he was too young to get married and that was it. SO, I had another, more calm converstation with him and he said there were a number of reasons he was not ready, money being one, he also wants to be able to have a down payment for at least a condo, three, he did feel we were still young enough to wait, and also that I currently am not working, I left a field that was really not working out for me and I am trying to get a job and maybe go back to school. He said my uncertainty in that area concerns him a bit, (I don't know what exactly I will be able to get a job in since all my experience and my BS degree have been in one field and it seems to be the only kind of job offers I get.) Also, I mentioned I sort of felt like a wife without a ring and he said he never has looked at me like that, he just likes being able to see me everyday SO my question now is, we have always been happy, never had a break or seriously talked about breaking up before this, we live in a tiny apartment but still it seems to work fine most of the time and he does keep it neat, even though I do clean a lot more, (guess that may be part of why it bothers me)... ....SO, Does it seem reasonable for him to want to wait, or does it seem like he has changed his mind and just does not want to get married or possibly just not to me anymore. I don't want to break up with him, but if we are not moving in that direction I would definitly feel like I have wasted the time from now to when it would end.
curiousnycgirl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Wow your details definitely put a different spin on things. The fact that he is supporting you while you are out of work certainly shows a strong committment on his part doesnt it? Having said that - frankly I don't think your b/f is being fair. Either it is his way or the relationship is over. He is not ready to get engaged, therefore no engagement. You are not comfortable continuing to live together - so you want to move out - then he says it is over. Where is the equity in that? My b/f has given me similar excuses about why we can't get married yet. He's been unemployed for a while (has started his own business) - and my personal feeling on that is we can work toward a common goal as a couple - that I do not understand why the financial issues should get in the way of forward progress in the relationship. In your case even more so since you are living together. However if he is concerned about your future income because of your current uncertainty over your career, etc - I think that is fair as well. It is important that you both feel confident that you are heading downt he same path in life before you get married. He may have thought that to be true 3 years ago - but more recently with your job history, he has right to be concerned. In my relationship I am 100% confident in what my b/f is doing and that in time he will knock the ball out of the park - he is the one with less confidence. Does that make any sense? In the end only you can make the decision to stay or go - I'm just trying to help point out different views on the issues.
DanielMadr Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Why the hell should he get married? It is every guys nightmare. Not counting those who fear they might lose the girl (they already lost). Marriage = Kids. There is no reason for a guy to marry besides for the kids and wife to have some kind of security. So, his "I dont want to marry" means "I dont want kids yet". Women obsession with marriage is driving us nuts. We can understand that need to be safe and to show all the world you are not single-loser but managed to pull a husband. He can only lose. Only thing he can gain by marriage is you to stop nagging about it
DanielMadr Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 ...in time he will knock the ball out of the park - he is the one with less confidence. I dont get it. Please elaborate.
AussieJack Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Having said that - frankly I don't think your b/f is being fair. Either it is his way or the relationship is over. . It is not a matter of being "fair " - he does not want to get married YET for his own reasons . He has NOT said that he does not want to marry the OP - just not right now. That is how he feels and that is the way it is going to be - End of story.
curiousnycgirl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 I dont get it. Please elaborate. What I meant was that I am confident my b/f's company will take off, and in time he will reap the rewards. My point when I said that was that her b/f may be questioning if their long term income goals are the same - when they met he thought she was heading down a specific path, which she did pursue, but found out did not work for her. Now she is umemployed etc. So perhaps this is causing some concern for him, which I would understand. Make sense?
Star Gazer Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Wow your details definitely put a different spin on things. The fact that he is supporting you while you are out of work certainly shows a strong committment on his part doesnt it? It changes the story entirely. There's a strong commitment there on his part... Having said that - frankly I don't think your b/f is being fair. Either it is his way or the relationship is over. He is not ready to get engaged, therefore no engagement. You are not comfortable continuing to live together - so you want to move out - then he says it is over. Where is the equity in that? There's never equity when one person wants to get married and the other doesn't. She's backing him into a corner just as much as he's putting up his hands in defense.
curiousnycgirl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 It is not a matter of being "fair " - he does not want to get married YET for his own reasons . He has NOT said that he does not want to marry the OP - just not right now. That is how he feels and that is the way it is going to be - End of story. It absolutely is a matter of being fair or if you prefer the term equity. You are not accurately reading my response. They BOTH have a right to input here - we are long past the days here women do not have a vote. I agree that he is not ready for marriage and therefore they will not get married. However he ONLY wants things his way - and there is no consideration for her feelings at all. She is no longer comfortable living together, is happy to continue the relationship, but from separate homes. He will not accept that and if she leaves they are over. While I agree it is completely valid that they cannot get married until they are both ready for marriage, I also believe that if one of them is no longer comfortable living together then they should be able to live apart. That is what I find to be unfair.
curiousnycgirl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 There's never equity when one person wants to get married and the other doesn't. She's backing him into a corner just as much as he's putting up his hands in defense. See I don't agree - she has offered an alternative and he refused to accept any change. The lack of equity is that it is his way, or it is his way.
Star Gazer Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 See I don't agree - she has offered an alternative and he refused to accept any change. The lack of equity is that it is his way, or it is his way. I'm missing something then - what alternative has SHE proposed?
curiousnycgirl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 So I said maybe then we should live apart and he said no, if one of us moves out then we will break up, because he does not want to take a step backwards. Although, I kind of felt if we are not going foward now, why can't we go backwards. She offered the alternative above
blind_otter Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Personally I would be royally pissed if my SO was telling me that we had to get married, or else he would move out and we could "date". That would feel like emotional blackmail to me. Eventually, yeah, we WILL get married - mostly because he wants to. But for him to try to force my hand by threatening to move out would make me feel a lot of resentment towards him, and if I did relent and get married because I didn't want him to move out, well -- that would be a nightmare. Totally the wrong reason to get married, IMHO. Personally I think the reasons the OP's BF gave for not wanting to get married right now are pretty valid. He wants to put a down payment on someplace that they can buy together. Good idea, IMO. He wants the OP to have a job and be more stabilized in her life before they get hitched. I think that at the very least she should know whether she is going to go back to school or take another job. Hell, if this were a girl posting about how she wanted her BF to have a job and be settled in his personal life before they got married, everyone would be all for that. I dunno. It seems to me like he's giving this a lot of consideration and thought, instead of just rushing into a marriage out of lovey-dovey reasons, which in the long run, tend to peter out relatively quickly.
dreamergrl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 She is no longer comfortable living together, is happy to continue the relationship, but from separate homes. He will not accept that and if she leaves they are over. That is what I find to be unfair. But is OP genuinely uncomfortable in the house - or is she just trying move along the marriage road closer to her liking? Maybe her bf doesn't feel they will be able to move forward eventually if she moves out - so maybe he's not comfortable with the relationship that way. OP - why do you want to move out if you can't get married sooner?
Pocky Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 His reasons sound fairly typical from what I understand; I've heard that men need to feel that the can support the family before the venture into marriage. I don't think he's being unreasonable and, in my opinion, I think it's best to wait to get married until your late 20's early 30's.
Kamille Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Personally I would be royally pissed if my SO was telling me that we had to get married, or else he would move out and we could "date". That would feel like emotional blackmail to me. Eventually, yeah, we WILL get married - mostly because he wants to. But for him to try to force my hand by threatening to move out would make me feel a lot of resentment towards him, and if I did relent and get married because I didn't want him to move out, well -- that would be a nightmare. Totally the wrong reason to get married, IMHO. Personally I think the reasons the OP's BF gave for not wanting to get married right now are pretty valid. He wants to put a down payment on someplace that they can buy together. Good idea, IMO. He wants the OP to have a job and be more stabilized in her life before they get hitched. I think that at the very least she should know whether she is going to go back to school or take another job. Hell, if this were a girl posting about how she wanted her BF to have a job and be settled in his personal life before they got married, everyone would be all for that. I dunno. It seems to me like he's giving this a lot of consideration and thought, instead of just rushing into a marriage out of lovey-dovey reasons, which in the long run, tend to peter out relatively quickly. Exactly my pov. It's not like either of them are actually at a standstill and everything but the marriage has fallen into place. They have a lot of things to set in place before marriage crowns their relationship. It's not like he's holding off because he's comfortable with the relationship as is, he's holding off because he wants them to be better established economically before they make that step.
curiousnycgirl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Personally I would be royally pissed if my SO was telling me that we had to get married, or else he would move out and we could "date". That would feel like emotional blackmail to me. Eventually, yeah, we WILL get married - mostly because he wants to. But for him to try to force my hand by threatening to move out would make me feel a lot of resentment towards him, and if I did relent and get married because I didn't want him to move out, well -- that would be a nightmare. Totally the wrong reason to get married, IMHO.. BO - I understand your position, but your situation is more the exception than a norm. Not many people are willing to truly move forward (such as having children) without being married. I do understand the position that moving out is emotional blackmail, but frankly this woman needs to figure out her next steps. When she and her b/f met - they communicated that they had the same goals and intentions, now things have changed and there is a possibility that they are not in sync. Personally I will not move in with my b/f unless we are at least engaged. Sure we spend weeks together, basically we are a couple with two houses, but I will not make the real move until the commitment is there. Perhaps the OP thought they were on the same page about this - but clearly they weren't.
Star Gazer Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 She offered the alternative above Oh. I don't see that as a compromise or an alternative at all. Like OB said, that's emotional blackmail.
curiousnycgirl Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Oh. I don't see that as a compromise or an alternative at all. Like OB said, that's emotional blackmail. Very interesting - did you think that when norajane suggested she do it? Not attacking, but I didn't see it the same way you did and I am curious.
Jasmine8719 Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 why are you rushing to get married? He is obviously not ready so why push it??? He gave you the reasons and they are good reasons, money, jobs. Just just be patient. -Jasmine
Kamille Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 I do understand the position that moving out is emotional blackmail, but frankly this woman needs to figure out her next steps. When she and her b/f met - they communicated that they had the same goals and intentions, now things have changed and there is a possibility that they are not in sync. No, the goals haven't changed. The only thing that is going on is that she is now coming to the realization that they hadn't talked about how they envisionned that plan unfolding. He wants a certain amount of things set into place, she feels like she needs the commitment right now to be satisfied with the relationship. Her situation is not like yours Curiousnycgirl: this guy does see them moving foward and is in fact supporting her financially through it right now. I mean, 29 years old is only three years from now and sounds to me like a reasonnable deadline to set a downpayment, for her to figure out what she wants as a career, etc. I have an easier time understanding his point of view: to me, marriage happens when you are at a point in your life when you can buy the house, have your careers on track, etc. What I am having a hard time grasping is her sudden need for affirmation of his love.
Star Gazer Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 Very interesting - did you think that when norajane suggested she do it? Not attacking, but I didn't see it the same way you did and I am curious. Please recall her new facts change the backdrop of her situation entirely. Whereas before he seemed to just be coasting along in a comfortable relationship, it's now been pointed out that he's supporting her financially. Previously, I agreed with NJ's statement that "maybe [they] both need to live separately and be independent for as long as it takes to actually want to be married and create a lifetime together." I do, however, still agree with that statement to the extent they need to come together as two independent people - not one relying on the other (which is what's happening now). Now that we know his reasons for wanting to wait - which, IMO are perfectly reasonable and very typical for guys in their early- to mid-20's - saying "marry me or I'm moving out" is akin to emotional blackmail. He's not ready to be married, period. Convincing him to marry her when he's not ready, particularly given his reasons for wanting to wait, will only have disastrous results.
Star Gazer Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 He wants a certain amount of things set into place, she feels like she needs the commitment right now to be satisfied with the relationship. Her situation is not like yours Curiousnycgirl: this guy does see them moving forward and is in fact supporting her financially through it right now. I mean, 29 years old is only three years from now and sounds to me like a reasonable deadline to set a down payment, for her to figure out what she wants as a career, etc. I have an easier time understanding his point of view: to me, marriage happens when you are at a point in your life when you can buy the house, have your careers on track, etc. What I am having a hard time grasping is her sudden need for affirmation of his love. I agree with all of this as well.
Jasmine8719 Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 (edited) curiousnygirl...If she's uncomfortable living there because she can't get married to him yet...I don't have words to describe how rediculous that is...I totally agree with her boyfriend it is taking a step back he just wants to move forward without getting married yet...I think theres an underlying issue that isn't being explained..This is probably one reason the divorce rate is so high...no offense -Jasmine Edited March 21, 2008 by Jasmine8719
blind_otter Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 BO - I understand your position, but your situation is more the exception than a norm. Not many people are willing to truly move forward (such as having children) without being married. Yah, well, even in the event that I wasn't preggers, I would still be royally pissed if my SO were to try to force my hand in terms of marriage. I am eternally grateful that he doesn't pressure me, even though I know he would drive me to the courthouse this afternoon if I were to say the word. I do understand the position that moving out is emotional blackmail, but frankly this woman needs to figure out her next steps. When she and her b/f met - they communicated that they had the same goals and intentions, now things have changed and there is a possibility that they are not in sync. Eh, come on. She doesn't need to figure out her next steps, like, immediately - she's only 25! Pluswhich, I think that her logical next steps to figure out should be: should I go back to college, or get a new job. Planning a wedding is stressful enough without adding starting a new job/going back to school into the mix!
stillafool Posted March 21, 2008 Posted March 21, 2008 I haven't read this whole thread so forgive me if I repeat someone else. I think the reason he doesn't want to get married is because he is afraid he is going to end up supporting you. You don't have a job and that scares him. Maybe you should get a job out of your field so you will at least have a job and show him you are pulling your weight. You could get a job as an Adminstrative Assistant, secretary, etc. and move up in the company. I think when you get a job and start showing that you are saving money towards a future he will look at this situation differently. I don't think most men want to marry unless they are ready for kids. That doesn't say much for us women does it? But that's the way it seems. Good luck.
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