MsJJ Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Hello, I am new here. I just wanted some input from ppl. I have heard time and time again that I am really intimidating. I am not sure what it is that I do. I have heard that the fact that I am independent is scary to men, and the fact that I am smart. (not trying to be arrogant). I am very outgoing and very much a ppl person, and I am very honest too. And I have heard thats intimidating too. I am not sure why. I am well off, so I am not some gold digger. Yes, I am a single mom, and I worked hard to make sure my son would have a good home and future, so I am not looking for someone to buy me groceries lol. I am looking for companionship with a nice man. But I get the same feed back every time that I am intimidating. Well, that is if the guy bothers to call me back and let me know lol. I welcome third person perspective on this. I am not arrogant, just sure of myself. Sometimes, I feel like if a woman is suffering from low self esteem thats a stumbling factor, but then when a woman is happy with herself then it can be mistaken for arrogance and that becomes another stumbling factor. I just don't get it.
Lucasarts Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 i would have to say the scariest thing about you, based off the info you gave me was that you have a kid. It means a dual responsibility (for the man, supposedly, getting the kid and you to like him) as well as the fact that you were in an unsuccessful relationship/situation that bore a child in the process. Aside from that, I really don't see any red flags. . . maybe you come off too strong by being too honest with who you are and what you want? just a guess
AussieJack Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Hello, I am new here. I just wanted some input from ppl. I have heard time and time again that I am really intimidating. I am not sure what it is that I do. I have heard that the fact that I am independent is scary to men, and the fact that I am smart. (not trying to be arrogant). I am very outgoing and very much a ppl person, and I am very honest too. And I have heard thats intimidating too. I am not sure why. I am well off, so I am not some gold digger. Yes, I am a single mom, and I worked hard to make sure my son would have a good home and future, so I am not looking for someone to buy me groceries lol. I am looking for companionship with a nice man. But I get the same feed back every time that I am intimidating. Well, that is if the guy bothers to call me back and let me know lol. I welcome third person perspective on this. I am not arrogant, just sure of myself. Sometimes, I feel like if a woman is suffering from low self esteem thats a stumbling factor, but then when a woman is happy with herself then it can be mistaken for arrogance and that becomes another stumbling factor. I just don't get it. You are doing something wrong if they ALL do not call you back. IF a man has told you that you are too "intimidating" then you can take that to the bank. IT has f**k all of nothing to do with being "independent" or "too intelligent" or too tall, .. or my favorite giggle "I am a strong woman and men cant handle that ? Where do you girls get this shyte from Cosmo ?? Oprah ? An "intimidating " woman is abrasive, demanding, aggressive, domineering, controlling. overbearing, whiney, annoying , self-centered, "entitled " to be worshiped -- take your pick . I am sure that you are convinced that you are none of these things and guys should just see your "inner beauty" - however based on your results so far I might suggest that you look again at the short list of "intimidating" mannerisms that i listed above. Good hunting, Zena.
Author MsJJ Posted March 20, 2008 Author Posted March 20, 2008 Aussie Jack- LOL I don't want to be worshiped, thats creepy! I don't watch oprah or read cosmo, I am just saying the feed back I have gotten from men. Not from a magazine or some show on the oxygen channel...lol. I was very aggressive at work bc I had to be, was very competitive. The thing is, I don't say things like...I am too strong for a man to handle. I am not out to be like I am woman hear me roar lol. I am just me. Luca- thanks for the input. I am aware that some men don't wanna date women with children. I am upfront and honest and let them know that I have a child before the date, before they ask me out. And I don't bring my kid on a date either lol. (i read a diff post about that). But thank you guys for the input
Shindig Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Inferiority complex is pretty normal especially given traditional gender roles.
carhill Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 OP, your aura will only be attractive to a small subset of males, and that is a good thing. Those men will see through the surfaces to your inner beauty. Men generally are visual creatures, and those sensory inputs form the basis of their perception of you. Your actions and visual aura likely is what is putting off the men you have interacted with. One of my best female friends in the past was a young Asian lady who came from a fairly wealthy family, had a good education and was very self confident and forthright. She was also awesome in a bikini She intimidated the heck out of men. I knew the real her as a friend and she had a heart of gold and was incredibly attentive as a friend. I'm kicking myself for not having developed romantic feelings for her but I was a stupid back then. Anyway, she didn't get married until pretty late (mid-late 30's), because she was very particular about what she wanted in a relationship. I assume you are the same way. For many men, that's too much trouble. So, expect a lot of tire-kickers who shy away from your persona and aura. You'll meet the right person eventually
Author MsJJ Posted March 20, 2008 Author Posted March 20, 2008 Carhill-how sweet and encouraging! Thank you sweety!
m101882471 Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Wow you sound exactly like my woman and I definately would not be intimidated what so ever. Smart woman are HOT. I have been attracted to your type my whole life. These woman can be intimidating because of the fact that they have so many things going for them that they are not dependent on men. Men who also have so many things going on for them dont need woman as bad because they are seen as higher social beings with more attractiveness. So search for your type, smart and independent with alot going for them. A smart man will find you attractive and want to go out of his way to get you. A weaker man, not so smart, will be threatened by your dominance and intelligence and perhaps even be worried if what he says is "dumb" or looked down upon by you. Depends how you convey yourself...
Green Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Its going to be hard to know what your problem is by just hearing your side of the story on this msg board. It may be that all the men you've dated recently just wernt good for you, or it could be that your not in touch with your problem to the point where you can even identify it so you wouldn't be able to tell us about it in the first place. I sugest talking to a therapist or maybe your girlfriends for advice on men and relationships
AussieJack Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 I am not out to be like I am woman hear me roar lol. I am just me. I appreciate your desire to be "just me" however is appears that a lot of men are intimidated by your being " just me " ... Let me be blunt with you - when a man says, " You are intimidating ", he is really saying "You are a pain in the ass and no fun. I do not want to see you again "... That is the mildest way that I word the translation.
allina Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 I don't really believe that men are intimidated by a strong, confident, smart woman. I'm all of that, even a bit arrogant at times and I never have issues with not getting called or invited for a second date. I have never ever heard a man say "I'm really in to her but she's so great and together that I'm intimidated by her so I won't be calling her again" I just don't believe this happens. Do you think that maybe you try too hard? Do you maybe go on and on about how you're a strong woman/single mom? You're doing something to turn these guys off.
Author MsJJ Posted March 20, 2008 Author Posted March 20, 2008 I think..I am just, hmm how can I put it. I am the kind of person to give ppl chances. I can share this story, I know its gonna sound so bad but hey..whatever lol. I went on one date with a man, and he flat out told me later on that he was scared of me, because he likes women who are dumber than a bat. I was shocked and in that situation, afterwards I felt pretty stupid lol. AussieJack-Thank you for taking the time to give me some input and a very honest one at that. Maybe I am assuming but you seem pretty angry with women. (seeing some other comments you left on other entries). Regardless if you appreciate it or not, I am still who I am. Oh, and about the comment you made if none are calling me back. I never stated that none call me back. I am only speaking of those who called me back and gave me feedback. Sometimes, they don't call, sometimes they do. And yes, they also call back for a second date as well and a third. But most of the time, I would say about 80% of the time I get told I am intimidating. Also, my family members say that too. (not just the guys I dated or went on one date with) And better yet! lol. I have had some women tell me to purposely act dumb, because guys will like me more. lololol! Clearly, I don't take the "advice" on that part. Allina-Well, I simply just tell them that I have a child. I do not see the need to explain myself and say I am a strong woman and this and that and the other. When I am asked a question, I simply answer. So I don't think its trying too hard. I am very honest and I have nothing hide. And to me, if they were not into me at all, I just don't even understand why they would bother asking me on a date then. Why waste the time? I don't call them. I have never asked a man out on a date before. They always ask me...and then they get scared lol. I don't bite..I promise lol.
Author MsJJ Posted March 20, 2008 Author Posted March 20, 2008 Oh and didn't mean to forget at all, m101, thank you for your input. That was very encouraging
carhill Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Yeah, I remember, when I was a child, I got the message that I should suppress my intelligence to be better accepted socially. What a crock. Perhaps I would've "fit in" better, but at what cost? I think the reverse (gender reversal) of what the OP asserts is often true as well, where a woman's sexual interest in a man is low for exactly the same reasons. Adjectives/descriptions I've heard: "thinks too much", "deep thinker", "too emotional", "whoa, big words", and the AJ classic, PITA. OP, all I can say is be true to yourself. Your life is yours to live; the social microcosm that currently tries to define you is only a miniscule part of the world of culture and people out there. There's a welcoming place and people for everyone. Seek it out. Part of why the friend I told you about and I were friends was because we saw each other as equals and could be ourselves without limitation or "acting dumb". The trick is finding someone like that with whom you have romantic chemistry. This may sound cruel (to intendeds) but don't waste your time with potentials who aren't your equal in the areas where you won't compromise. Trust me, if you do, you'll end up frustrated and that's unsatisfying for both you and the other person. I've been this person and lowered my standards because of lack of potentials or interested females and it is truly very unsatisfying. Don't be me
Shindig Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 I've been in that boat for a while, MsJJ. A big part of it is social conditioning that suggests men should be the bread-winners, should be smarter than women, should be stronger physically and emotionally than women, etc. The men who manage to get past it and then appreciate it are (as Carhill says) a small but very squared away subset. It was easier when I was in college. Where I went to school in the Northeastern US, smart women are more desirable as many of the above archaic sexist social conventions have been appreciated for that they are. After moving to the Southeastern US, I'm exposed to a much more mysogynistic crowd. There is also a large latin American community here and the latin machismo is an inflated version of the above. Obviously these are generalizations; humans generate inferences based on experience and where they fall epistemologically is somewhere between justified true belief (casting the concept of absolute knowledge aside in favor of practical knowledge) and false inference. I've found the best strategy is to stay busy: personally I only ruminate over these things when I'm not doing anything. Also, exploring your hobbies will open you up to more opportunities to meet people with similar interests. Volunteering with special needs children has been a boon to my social life. I meet people who are patient, socially aware, generous, and generally have qualities that I appreciate and who are more likely to appreciate mine.
Angels&Airwaves Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 I don't really believe that men are intimidated by a strong, confident, smart woman. I'm all of that, even a bit arrogant at times and I never have issues with not getting called or invited for a second date. I have never ever heard a man say "I'm really in to her but she's so great and together that I'm intimidated by her so I won't be calling her again" I just don't believe this happens. Do you think that maybe you try too hard? Do you maybe go on and on about how you're a strong woman/single mom? You're doing something to turn these guys off. I like women like you, you seem like someone who doesn't need to be in a relationship and doesn't need to be mothered. If it's one thing I can't stand in anyone be they men or women is neediness and clingyness. It's so off putting, but then so is arrogance and vanity. I don't mind a woman knowing her strengths and being proud of them and I don't mind a woman who takes care of her appearance, but when a woman is so self-righteous and the conversations evolves around her, that's when I slam my head in a door. For what's its worth, I have been told I can be quite intimidating, too, it's probably because I go around like a bear with a sorehead at times.
spookie Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Maybe there's something else going on, but 80% of guys I meet like me a LOT better when I pretend to be dumber than I am. Of course, 100% of them I would never want to date, but IMO there is validity to what you are saying. Good matches are hard to find, and often pop up when you're not looking. I say chill out.
blind_otter Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Huh. Maybe it's just the area where you live? I do have to say this, though....I think the thinking that intelligent women are intimidating to men is rather antiquated and absurd. Maybe because I live in a college town, even the men I have been with who were not well educated demanded an intelligent woman! They often didn't mind if the woman was more educated than they were. I'm downright abrasive to most people and I've never had a problem with dates. But, to balance that, I am tiny and petite (well not right now, I'm pregnant and huge. Blah.) and I admittedly have a voice that sounds like mini mouse with a southern accent, so even when I'm being bitchy people think it's "cute" Maybe it has to do with the way you carry yourself?
NuTuDating Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 (edited) Date smarter guys? Maybe someone who's financially stable themselves? They say opposites attract, but I don't believe it. I don't think I've ever met a truly intimidating woman. I have met women who were extremely quick witted, which is a LOT of fun. Many guys aren't so quick witted, and maybe that's what "intimidates" them. If a guy is smart, he'll like the fact that you're independent, because it means you won't be a financial drain on him if you make it to the marriage stage. I could possibly see a problem with being too independent if you act like you'd just as soon not be with him. I've dated that type of woman, but it didn't make her intimidating, just a bitch. Especially since she approached me in the beginning. We had about four dates over the course of a couple of months. She'd turn me down for dates, saying she was too busy, wanted to spend time with her daughters, etc., then call at the last minute and want to do something. She tried to make her independence too obvious and for me it was a huge turn-off and I found someone else to date in the meantime (however proud Aussie Jack would have been of this woman). Finally, she called one night to do something and I had made a date with someone else and just flat out told her. She broke down and started crying about it, yet previously she had acted so independent and nonchalant about dating me. Edited March 20, 2008 by NuTuDating
Author MsJJ Posted March 20, 2008 Author Posted March 20, 2008 Wow, lot's of great feed back. About 2 years ago, I had a pretty bad break up. For the next year and a half, I traveled. All over the world and it was fantastic! I spent time volunteering and spent time with myself. I made sure I was completely over and recovered from my last relationship before I began dating again. I have been dating now for the past 3 months. Nothing major, no one super special, just dates. I am not one of those ppl who get attached immediately, and I guess I have not met a person I have had that instant connection with. It usually takes time for me and I have to get to know the person as well. (Personality is super important to me). One thing I will say in my defense, is the fact that many of my friends and family claim that I do not give enough chances to men. I suppose that's why this time around I have been more open to date a range of different ppl. Maybe I am just trying to prove to them that if I am not my usual picky, this is what happens. lol. I am cut down for being me. Seriously, though, most of the input here are so encouraging and it is nice to know I am not alone, and it is nice to know that there are those who appreciate the "type" of person I am. :)
latefragment Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Hi! I've been following your thread and I've had similar experiences as you... I wanted to say that if you've only been dating a few months then you are just getting your feet wet at this point and you're probably getting what I would call "noise". I can come across as intimidating but I don't "dumb myself down." I just get extra flirty. (giggling, hair tossing, etc.) Sounds stupid, but it helps soften the blow of my intellect (just kidding). ... just wondering ... were you able to travel with your son? And also, did you quit your job and were you able to find a job when you returned? I am sorry if this is a slight derailing of the thread ... I've just been VERY interested in embarking on a journey similar to yours, especially because I've been single for a while and would like to 'get away' and I speak many languages too... thanks in advance for your response!
Timberlane Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 How are you going about dating, anyway? Are you using an Internet dating service? I have found that just using a service can put undue pressure on the date outcomes. It's often quite annoying how this creeps into the picture despite one's best efforts to keep dates light. On first dates I would avoid talking at length about what you want in a relationship, for one. That was on your online profile, so it's well known. Dates are for just socializing and hopefully doing something fun together. I have gotten to where I can't stand the stuffy dinner date. It's too much like a job interview. Maybe go on some afternoon hiking dates? You live in Colorado like I do, so take advantage of it. So much nicer than forced conversation over grilled duck at some trendy bistro. Then you won't come across as intimidating.
BentSpine Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 Could "You are intimidating." be code for "You don't laugh at my jokes." ?
reelwoman Posted March 20, 2008 Posted March 20, 2008 I don't think that the men who are intimidated by smart, confident, successful women have enough self-awareness to admit that to themselves...they would probably tell themselves something else. I have had the experience with men who felt they had to somehow one-up me or put me down because I made them feel intimidated, but these were guys who, as I discovered, were very insecure themselves. I work in academia and the arts, so it's easy for me to meet guys that are smart and talented and not freaked out by feminists. But there are a lot of guys out there who do feel uneasy if a woman can't be easily fit into a clear, traditional role. Don't worry about it---ask your friends if you seem abrasive or arrogant and see what they say. I think there are plenty of guys who are happy to meet strong, confident women who are successful, emotionally and financially independent, speak their mind, etc. I do think having a child makes it difficult; my friends with kids say the same thing. Even my having a dog has sometimes been an issue for some guys LOL!
Author MsJJ Posted March 20, 2008 Author Posted March 20, 2008 Latefragment-Yes I took my son with me. Every time he was out of school we traveled. I had the opportunity to go to Sweden, Hong Kong, New Zealand, and then to Seattle. I also went to South Dakota and saw my very first pow wow. It was great! What languages do you speak? Yes I did retire from my job. I am in a position now where I don't have to work. I can't complain . I am available for my son, where as before I couldn't be since I was working 60 plus hours a week. I volunteer my time when my son is at school. I really can't complain, I am happy to "have it all". It's my version of it anyway, I am only missing one thing and thats a companion
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