AussieJack Posted March 27, 2008 Posted March 27, 2008 Keeping attraction level up is actually my biggest challenge with nice guys. I really wish I could understand why this is because no, I'm not perticular prone to liking being treate like **** either. "NIce guys" create too much COMFORT' and not enough ATTRACTION. Comfort leads to affection, but not attraction .This is why women who date nice guys frequently say that they like him like a "friend ". BY attraction, I mean what you gals call "chemistry"-that mysterious gut level, churning, lusty feeling that defies logic and cannot be fully described. It is just FELT and it is powerful. "Bad boys" create too much ATTRACTION and no COMFORT and so you live on an emotional rollercoaster. You want to get off but the addiction to a powerful "feelings" state keeps you onboard against your will and many times in to being mistreated..
AussieJack Posted March 27, 2008 Posted March 27, 2008 thebackstabber put it very well. Yep- excellent treatise.
AussieJack Posted March 27, 2008 Posted March 27, 2008 Thats why the Bad boy and Nice guy are so close to each other. Motivation is the same but display different. One is passive, other is aggressive. One is arrogant, other is supplicant. Its like commies and nazis. They are on opposite sides of political spectre line but they are actually the same point on circle. Balance is the key. And I can tell you the balance is far more then you imagine it should be. Because in our time Equality aka Sameness is the word. So the balance is viewed as 50 of masculine and 50 of feminine in one person. But the truth is it should be 80 or even more of masculine for a man. The rest will be deployed by your SO. THis guy is SMART. Hey Daniel, can I quote you ?
Lookingforward Posted March 27, 2008 Posted March 27, 2008 JUst FWIW - I find too MUCH "niceness" kinda creepy. Maybe I feel it's not genuine, not sure. I think some guys have the wrong impression of what constitutes "nice" and overdo it. I like a guy who's confident in himself and who he is without having to stress on it.
Covonia Posted March 27, 2008 Posted March 27, 2008 Don't talk to me, no About people who are "nice" 'Cause I have spent my WHOLE LIFE in RUINS Because of people who are "nice" It's amazing how true this is.
DanielMadr Posted March 27, 2008 Posted March 27, 2008 THis guy is SMART. Hey Daniel, can I quote you ? Sure, mate. I will be honoured.
Author dreamergrl Posted March 28, 2008 Author Posted March 28, 2008 Major issue: Assertiveness the several issues: 1. Majority of nice guys were raised by women (a high amount from dysfunctional families, with this I don't only mean parents who were psychotic or druggies) who conditioned these boys based on a woman's point of view on how to treat women i.e- the women are not seen as people but are either put on a pedestal, adulated and objectified with the boy thinking that to get women the boy needs to be "nice", groveling, agreeing, care-taking, "sensitive" and the what not to keep the relationship stable. A stable (not necessarily absent) father figure was not usually present. He has mentioned that he isn't very close to his father, however he's not absent either. 2. This behavior caused autonomic suppression on the boys part as he thinks that only his partners emotions, decisions, opinions etc matter and to break this by expressing his own would spell doom on his part. Like I've stated previously - I ask and ask and ask his thoughts on stuff, and it's always "well what do you think" 3. The boy instead uses care-taking behavior (gift giving, doing errands etc mostly unnecessary or minor) patterns to fix things (fights, quarrels or to prevent these from happening) in a relationship to keep it stable and fit. The last time we got together, we just hung out at his place, watched movies, and he felt I was bored - regardless of how many times I told him I was fine - he was like well let me think of what we can do to fix that. He told me he was short on money that week, I offered to pay for us to do something, but he told me no as always. It was like he was trying to fix a problem that wasn't even there. 4. Instead of doing number 3, theres always the option of passive aggressiveness. This is the most frustrating tactic and also the most efficient behavior for nice guys as its very covert and sublime. It makes them keep the nice guy persona but lets them vent out their autonomy (by preventing quarrels and disputes). "You think that he's nice but theres something about him that annoys the sh*t out of you". This really didn't come to mind till it was mentioned. There's been times where I felt rather annoyed, but I just chalked it up to that kind of day. 5. Since 1-4 outlines the loss of autonomy, the boys partner thinks that the boy is a pushover ( and boring because his life revolves around the relationship only) and cannot stand on his own. How then, can he stand for his partner when the situation calls for it? (I know that women today are on equal par with men, but I would love my partner even more when she's there for me when called upon). This shifts a heavy burden on the partner's part. Leaving them to make the decisions. This hasn't come into play 6.The relationship is one way=the boys way. "Leave the decisions to the partner, sit back and relax" (there is also fear in the boys head that if he expresses autonomy, he's doomed) . Manipulate the situation using passive aggressiveness and care-taking (usually to get the boys needs met). Everytime we do something... it's always what I want. And this last weekend I had tried to make it more about what he wanted, but it didn't work very well. 7. Normal women are naturally repelled by this as they feel objectified but cant seem to pick it out. Dysfunctional women cannot pick this out and will play out the dance with this person long enough until they drain each other dry. I don't want to get to draining one another! 8. Nice guys are usually resentful and dishonest. Resentful because autonomy is taken away and dishonest because when autonomy is taken away the needs are not met and the nice guy strives to achieve to meet these needs by using covert tactics. Dishonesty is also in part to keep the nice guy persona. Everything about him has to look squeeky clean to other people. Even if it means lying about certain undesirable traits, flaws imperfections, mistakes he possesses. This illusion of perfection turns women off as the person can be made to feel unattainable and the woman feels resentful and worthless as she herself is human and not perfect in any way. I haven't experienced this with him either 9. Nice guy is not an appropriate term. People who are nice achieve a balance in their life. Meaning they do whats best for them (don't push me over, I can stand on my own) and contribute equally and appropriately when needed (caring not care taking) in a relationship. We only get together once a week (on the weekend), so we do both have our own lives. 10. Nice guys are no different from jerks or bad boys. They both strive for one thing: To get their needs met. Selfishly. I feel like there have been sooo many inflamatary posts lately! Am I alone with this thought?? Is Mercury in retrograde or what? So sorry Dreamergirl that you are suffering from a health issue. I hope that you are able to recover well on the other end of it! I guess there are a number of things, life circumstances handed to us or brought on ourselves that can make us feel some how "less suitable" as a dating partner. Some other things that come to mind might be, unemployed, poor credit or financial issues, failed marriages, single parent, rough pasts, scary family. I think it is sad that one would have to consider that their health being imperfect would make them potentially less desirable! I don't mean to sound really forward, but kind of sounds like something you might want to talk to someone about, have you? Anyhow, on the bad boy subject, I have been a victim to this vein of interest myself. Well, I guess victim is a poor choice of words, as I have made the decisions myself. Hey, maybe that was a Freudian slip! Perhaps we engage in these relationships with these men to remain in the "Victim" role? Anyway, what kind of bad boy is it you like to date? Always the ones that treat you poorly? You know, there are PLENTY of bad boys out there that are "bad" in different sort of ways, but treat their woman like gold. And when I say gold, I mean shower you with attention, and love, are completely reliable, there when you would like or need them to be, very loyal, never cheat, want families, great parents, bread winners, like to pay for you, etc. If this sounds impossible, I swear it is not. I have dated 2 such men in my life. When I look back in retrospect, these "bad boys" treated me better than almost any of my other boyfriends. And, I have also dated the type of bad boy that was bad mostly to WOMEN. In these cases, players & cheaters, not physically abusive. Maybe you should try a recovered ex con so you can get your Prison Break fantasies on, or what have you, but just find the type that has done enough hard time (I'd recommend 5 year plus) that when he has a woman, he is going to make sure he does everything right so he NEVER risks losing you. It's amazing how much a man can come to appreciate a woman when he hasn't had contact with one for 5 years plus! I haven't talked to anyone about these issues, but it's not sounding like a bad idea. Unfortunately, my health issues is something that will most likely stay with me for life. I'm working every day to learn to accept it for what it is, and realize that it's just going to be a part of me. What type of bad boy do I like? Wow... that's a good question. I've only dated the nasty ones lol. Someone mentioned something about it being unattractive when it becomes too easy, and I think that's a big part of the problem. My ex fiance was overly nice (like the points made above) - but it was pretty easy for us to become what I have so much wanted. It was like bam - and there I had it. Although, I loved how he challenged me - I felt pushed, in a good way, to have more drive. He was very supportive and caring, very grounded and stable but took risks too. While his head was on straight and kept to his responsibilites, we had some exciting times as well. It was a great mix. I think what killed it was the fact that it all happened so quick. Maybe he's not as physically attractive as you THINK he is? Have you initiated any physical moves? Has he backed down or pushed away? Is he a virgin? First off, I'm a nice guy. I do nice things. I'm nice to people. I like people. Girls are attracted to me. I'm nice. I'm sexual. BUT.... I'm not SUPPLICATING. Keyword! I don't know if anyone has used that word yet. I don't think you should blame past relationships for feeling how you feel. You yourself said you don't want to be treated like crap again. So there was something else? Confidence? The fact that these"bad" guys had a life of their own and you were a pleasant accessory to it? - You weren't the main focus of it. A woman should never the the main focus of a guy's life. Maybe that's what's bugging you. Do you think maybe he's finding his identity through you? Any man could treat you good. Treating you good isn't the only thing you need. If you're not attracted to your man then you're with him out of pity. You've stated that you're LOSING attraction, not GAINING interest in him. This doesn't look good. It's not your fault. She's not into dating bad boys! THIS ISN'T WHAT THIS THREAD'S ABOUT. I wish people would stop bringing it up. The man seems overly supplicating and willing to give too much too early. I think that's what's making her lose the attraction for him. He does initiate stuff sexually, we just don't have sex. He's been with two people (he says) and whats to really know a girl before having sex (which is respectable). I don't feel like I'm the centered of his life, just the center of everything when we're together. I don't blame my past relationships - as I chose who I was with, but I feel that my choices were a result of what I became used to.
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