Touche Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 I guess the next question is, what do you feel would be a compatible person? If you're aware you're a cold, selfish person, who would be a good significant other for you? Or do you feel you should continue to dine and dash? A good match would be someone who wouldn't mind that that the OP is only available on his terms. There's really no right or wrong here. Some couples need more "together time" than others in order to make it work. This is where the OP and his ex are incompatible. Jalapeno, I'm sorry but it does appear to be a case of "too little, too late." Learn from this. The tough thing is that you probably wouldn't appreciate being with a woman who is happy with things solely on your terms. Or one who is available only when SHE feels like it. If you don't figure this out soon, you'll be alone for a long time. Next time, go for a happy medium. Give her some of what she's looking for, willingly and wholeheartedly, and look for the same in return. Negotiating what we want/need in a relationship, needn't be so complicated or hard to attain. If it is, it's a big mismatch and you'll know you're simply incompatible.
dreamergrl Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 I don't think it's just a case of being "a mismatch". OP is only willing to share conversations over the phone. He makes promises just so he can have sex - then leaves. I would feel so used. It's a poor way to treat a woman. I think if OP is going to be set in his ways, he needs to find a woman who just wants a sex buddy - no relationship can work this way. OP - you're unwilling to give. I'm surprised she stuck around as long as she did. Maybe it's harsh - but you're actions do show you as a "jerk". You can't be so selfish in a relationship. If you truly want to change - quit making excuses why you can't (ex I travel for work, can't go to counseling) because if you wanted to achieve it you would. You have no problems doing what you need to in order to supply your life with money to get everything you want - so it's obvious you're not wanting to make a change at this point.
Walk Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 My bf acted a lot like you before I met him. He told me his past ex's never came to his place, some never even knew where he lived, when they had problems with the way the relationship was he would leave. A couple of them never knew his last name even though he dated them for 6-8 months. He dislikes spending time with other people, enjoys his solitude greatly, and although he comes off as an ego-manic with a god complex he's insecure. I'm not sure if his problems reflect yours, but what I've learned is that deep down he is scared that other people will hurt him if he allows them inside his shell. And I think he has legitimate reasons to believe that since his past has reinforced that belief on many occasions. It seems as though you want something you can't have - which is full control over your heart while in a relationship. Unfortunately, you can't have a real relationship without allowing the other person to share control. However, you risk being hurt greatly if the other person wants to cause you pain. But no real relationship exists without it. The other person has to feel invested in the relationship, feel ownership of it. You never allowed that to occur in your relationship. You held kept tight control over what would occur or what wouldn't, and couldn't trust her enough to believe she would do what was best for both of you. Your actions were saying that you believed if she was given a little control she would use it for selfish gains, and/or she would wield that power to hurt you. You need to talk to someone who has the experience and knowledge to help you confront your fears, and release the faulty negative thinking your holding onto. You really need to talk to a therapist or counselor, and make that a priority in your life. You work very hard to attain the material things in life... why not devote even half that effort in attaining the more meaningful things in life? Because honestly, when you're lying on your death bed looking back at life are you going to be blissfully happy that you were able to purchase the best couch money could buy, or are you going to be kicking yourself for letting your fear stop you from having a great relationship with a beautiful, intelligent woman who loves you? p.s. the difference between you and my bf is that my bf communicated his problems with me. We worked together at his comfort level to create a relationship. Sometimes I pushed him past his comfort level, and he grew as a result of it. Sometimes I pushed too hard and we fought and he'd withdraw. But he communicated, and we comprimised, so both of us could be happy. Your woman only has your actions telling her she's just an object used for sex. If you don't feel that way, then TELL HER what's going on in your head. Communicate.
Vertex Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 (edited) As someone who attends a top business school where money's on everyone's mind, and as someone who has dated after meeting someone online, and who used to think and feel the way you have described, this is what I see from your posts: I would say that somewhere inside you do care for this person and you just don't know how to show it without resorting to sex -- you've stated this yourself, even. However you must understand that much of that relationship has operated on your terms. A relationship that works is one that has communication, and operates with compromise, that is, sometimes on your terms, and sometimes on their terms. This is easy to understand and I am certain you know this. The hard part is knowing how to execute it when your life has centered around personal gain, whether it be monetary or educational or success-oriented. From her perspective she probably felt like a sex object after all was said and done. You'd promise her dinner, have sex, and then leave. You can't make a promise for something and then reap benefit without delivering on that promise, at the VERY least. I am sure you understand that in the business world, this sort of logic and operation is death in many ways. I am also sure you understand this on a social level but for some reason you choose not to abide by the same rule. That reason is because she'd stick around, therefore your behavior, for a while, was acceptable to you. However, this is an illusion, as I've experienced personally -- not all behaviors work for the same duration. After a while, those kind of cold, self-centered behaviors will push people away. So, you understand at least the basics and that there is a problem. This is great because at least you acknowledge there's an issue and you aren't putting blame on *her* for your actions, like many others might do. Cutting to the chase, I used to have this same problem. I'd like staying in and doing my own thing, focusing on my work, occasionally playing video games or reading. However, when my girlfriend would ask me to come hang out with her and her friends to go downtown and do something "fun," I'd see it as something not "fun" but rather something that was taking me away from whatever it was I was doing, and I felt exasperated. It would really irritate her because I had preferred operate on my own terms. I worked when I wanted, played when I wanted, and when I wanted my girlfriend for something, I could get it, and if she complained, I'd usually disregard it but then try to make last-ditch efforts to keep her if she threatened to leave because I liked many things about her. Now, the issue here is that it's impossible to have a relationship where there's no give and take. If the girl here had operated on her own terms, refused sex after promising it, or basically made every decision with the intent of maintaining her own control over the relationship, I'm sure you'd be out of there in an instant. This is probably how she felt. The problem in these kind of relationships is that you absolutely must develop your sense of empathy. You need to not only be able to simply "see from their perspective," but to genuinely try to understand what they must feel like and what you can to do ensure they are happy (and not just yourself). It seems that a big issue is that your priorities are skewed. You prioritize your work and personal life but put your relationships on the back burner and expect them to yield high expected value, giving you a full life that is rich in both financial and social success -- a perfect balance between work and love. However, to achieve that you need to put the same kind of effort into both aspects. You can't expect to succeed financially without putting in the necessary actions, much like you can't expect people to love you and stick around without putting in comparably necessary actions. I would simply advise you to sit down alone sometime in a quiet area and really give your priorities some thought. We always want more in life, but sometimes we pursue this gain at a great expense. At some point, I think it is necessary to calm down and count our blessings. You've obviously already made great gains in your career. How much more financial gain do you need to be fully satisfied? I would argue that those efforts would yield higher added value by applying them to your social life instead. Bottom line: You will need to make some sacrifices, or you will find yourself stuck in the same cycles with the same problems. I'm frankly not surprised that the woman left already. I'm surprised she didn't do it sooner -- she stuck around because she obviously saw something in you. Focus on what that is and emphasize it... there's definitely something there, but you aren't expressing it correctly. You're coming across as someone who is self-centered who uses people, and perhaps this is true to a degree, but I feel that it doesn't have to be and that it's not how you wish to be. I'm sure most of this is obvious, but if you don't act on it, then nothing good will happen from it. If you promise her dinner, for instance, keep that promise at all costs. And, instead, view going places as an opportunity to relax and enjoy someone's company. Don't make excuses anymore. Instead, try to figure out how to incorporate another's desires into your schedule. A hard thing for me to do was to learn to say yes. It was extremely hard, when I've have a thousand deadlines looming ahead, or if there was something I had to prepare for. Just. Say. Yes. Realize you're skilled and smart enough to accomplish your personal tasks later, because you are. Force yourself away from your personal activities and operate on their terms for a change. If necessary, become more time-efficient. This sounds absurd if you've already optimized your time schedule for work, but I assure you, there is always room for further improvement when it comes to this stuff. I guarantee the other person will not only appreciate this, but will see that you're prioritizing them in an environment where you're very busy career-wise. If you want to keep someone around -- if you want a close, intimate, quality relationship with a quality person, then you will need to learn to communicate and reciprocate. This is where seeing a counselor would be immensely useful. You have communicated various things here online. You met this girl online, at that. Perhaps you are more adept at expressing your feelings in word than in person. Perhaps you could write a letter to this woman: Complimenting her and understanding you have some issues -- explaining things with her feelings in mind, being understanding. The most you can do at this point is ask for her patience and then try to make active efforts to change. My point though, is that seeing a counselor helps you learn to express yourself in person. You learn to open up and have someone there, in person, helping you through your issues. It's a great way to develop communication skills if you're otherwise lacking in your relationships. In either case, you must let her know what's going through your head right now. I have a strong feeling that if you let her know of these things, and make true, active efforts to improve yourself and to operate on her terms for a change, then she would be willing to give you another shot. She left because she felt things weren't changing and that you weren't ever putting her first. Show her that you can do these things and she will appreciate it, I guarantee it. Anyways, I think that all should cover most of it. I wish you the best of luck and I hope you're able to make the change you desire. Edited March 13, 2008 by Vertex
City_girl Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 Interesting that your now happy to decide that it's over and you have lost her, bit convenient? Clearly sabotage to me!!. You keep her around when it's safe but you aren't saying what she wants to hear when contacting her now, clearly because she won't come back. Your only 30 and still not sharing any part of yourself, tread carefully because the older the women you date get the less time it will take them to dump you. We aren't young and beautiful forever. very sad when people create such problems to ensure they never take a risk. You will almost certainly end up a lonely man if you don't change now
Trialbyfire Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 There have been some outstanding posts in this thread. Very well put everyone!
Storyrider Posted March 14, 2008 Posted March 14, 2008 OP, I'm confused about what you were trying to accomplish by posting this thread. Are you just trying to understand the situation after the fact? You show a lot of understanding of your own actions, yet it almost sounds as though you have no ability control them, like you're having an out-of-body experience. Why is that?
lovingheart Posted March 14, 2008 Posted March 14, 2008 My question to you is: Do you really want to change? From what you say you want to have your cake and eat it too. You don't want to go anywhere with her or take her to your place. You don't know how to communicate your feelings other than when you have sex with her. Methinks if you really wanted to do something about the situation, there are many books on communication between the sexes. It took me a while to realise that men and women really do think differently.
Trialbyfire Posted March 14, 2008 Posted March 14, 2008 OP, I'm confused about what you were trying to accomplish by posting this thread. Are you just trying to understand the situation after the fact? You show a lot of understanding of your own actions, yet it almost sounds as though you have no ability control them, like you're having an out-of-body experience. Why is that? A good observation Story. Not something I noticed but yes, I do agree. OP, is this something you've experienced or something you've observed?
Vertex Posted March 14, 2008 Posted March 14, 2008 Knowing the answer to something and being able to do it are totally different things
Mary Shadows Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Honestly, if you really do like her, you need to do more for her. You recognize that you're an ass, you know you need to change, maybe you met that girl who will change you herself. Be open and honest with her, let her know that you do care. Don't be selfish, and don't only think of yourself. Trust me, I was involved with someone like yourself, and he wasn't giving enough, so I basically cut him off. If you do loose her completly, you will be sorry that you didn't stop, and really think about how you can change your atitude, and behavior. Don't be stuborn, and let her know that you really care for her.
Author Jalapeno Posted March 19, 2008 Author Posted March 19, 2008 Wow. There really were a lot of great posts while I've been away. Thank you, everyone. I have decided to give counseling a try and have a consultation with a therapist scheduled early next week. I was surprised to get in so quickly, but I guess in many situations where counseling is needed it's important to provide get the ball rolling ASAP, so it makes sense. I have to admit I'm nervous about it...not sure what to expect. Last night I also received an email from one of her best friends. I was surprised since none of her friends talk to me, and she would have to either asked for the address or snooped around to find it. She informed me that my exgf made partner at her firm, but it will not be announced until a company-wide reception next month. This friend who emailed me, along with some of her family members, are throwing a little surprise congratulations party after the reception. She wanted to let me know about the news, and invited me to the party. I'd like to meet her friend for coffee to sort of discuss why I am invited. I'd hate to show up and feel unwelcome or upset my exgf in any way. It's her time to shine, so I don't want to bring her down. I'm just curious if the invitation is because she thinks exgf would want me there? Or maybe she doesn't know that we are not speaking? I can't imagine that she wouldn't know. Perhaps this is a way for me to make up for things? I suppose time will tell. If anyone still reads this thread, do you think it's a bad idea to offer to pay for the party? So, what are you going to do now? Stay the way you are, or work on yourself, come out of the selfish box and live a little? Maybe prove to her that you're worthy of ONE more chance? I still think if you worked on you, opened up more, tried putting her first, learned how to compromise, you'd be happier in the long run. Like I said in my other reply to you, I think you're afraid of change in every sort of way.. I'm going to see what counseling can do for me. I suppose I am afraid of change on a personal level. I've never really wanted to try a long term relationship, and I've stuck with the familiar. Both of my parents were married 3 times before my 15th birthday, so I never felt like there was much permanence in any relationship. I still don't know. I suppose this is probably something "deep" that will need to be addressed in counseling. Interesting that your now happy to decide that it's over and you have lost her, bit convenient? Clearly sabotage to me!!. You keep her around when it's safe but you aren't saying what she wants to hear when contacting her now, clearly because she won't come back. Ouch. I'm not happy to decide it's over...I was not the one who decided, nor am I happy about the situation. Sabotage? Maybe. At the moment I'm unable to say anything to her. I'm not going to continue to call and harass her when she has not once answered or returned any calls at this point. I'd prefer to stay off of the "Ex-boyfriend turned stalker" list. Great post Vertex. Very insightful. I agree, thank you Vertex. It was good to hear from a man who was similar, understands, and appears to have made some changes himself. OP, I'm confused about what you were trying to accomplish by posting this thread. Are you just trying to understand the situation after the fact? You show a lot of understanding of your own actions, yet it almost sounds as though you have no ability control them, like you're having an out-of-body experience. Why is that? I don't think it's like an out of body experience. As I have done some of these things, I didn't really realize what I was doing or the effect until after it had occurred. I don't know how to really describe it. My exgf is NOT the type to fight about something right away, so sometimes I would do things and just not realize how selfish I was acting until after the fact. I don't usually realize I'm being selfish until someone calls my attention to it. Before posting I had discussed this with a friend, so I have to admit some of my "understanding of my own actions" is from how she interpreted the situation, some of it is also what my exgf would say, and the rest is in retrospect. Knowing the answer to something and being able to do it are totally different things So true.
Recommended Posts